What Happened to ESO?

highkingnm

Look at the Elsweyr overland and crafted sets and tell me they cater every DLC JUST to meta. Sure the trials ones do, because that’s the type of group that runs trials and would want those rewards. The overworld has a stealth set (definitely not for meta), crafted has one with an exploding Bantum Guar. The majority of the DLC content is overworld stuff with one trial for the 10% you claim get all the attention. Of course the trials are focused on players who have meta gear because those likely to play it would melt it otherwise. You can play your own way. Any weapon, any class, any guild skills etc. Not the hard locked skills and weapons of other MMOs. However, you are not owed a viable build with any gear and combinations. Want to do the hardest content, you need an actual build. That’s not unfair, otherwise there would be no hard content for people who do have builds. For most content you can run any build you want. Almost no one will stop you bringing your off meta build into normal Crag trials, normal DLC dungeons or vet regular dungeons.

Zathras

Rampeal wrote: »

Everything was good, then came the DLC that focused on the Meta game.

Don't get me wrong Meta has always been in the game, but ESO never catered to them. They were the 10% of the game player base. Now with every DLC you design it around the Meta, the 10%. Not the 90% of the game. Ask any player and majority will tell you that they prefer to run non DLC dungeons rather than DLC because it is less punishing

For what it is worth, OP, I agree with you. There has been a lot of discussion on this. They are using the top players from the top guilds with the optimal gear and builds as the skill base to design the newest DLC content.

But..that isn't entirely a new thing. In EQ2, if you didn't have a full raid set from the previous content, the toughest encounters are going to wipe your group. WoW was similar. They designed every new dungeon with the assumption that you were geared from what you had to grind from the previous content.

Where ESO deviates, as you went into detail on, is that it isn't entirely a gear problem. It is an attitude problem.

I just don't see it as something that can be fixed, anymore than you could fix the toxicity of WoW. If ZOS can't fix long standing performance issues, do you think they are going to tackle a social problem? The game is too far down that rabbit hole. It is, as you mentioned, only getting worse.

For myself, I just avoid the hot spots. No vet content, no trials, and I stay clear of PvP. While PvP is an entirely different beast from this discussion, it is still a great place to see some of the worst anti-social people, just by the nature of what it is.

The only real fix, if you wanted to run that content, is guild with like-minded people and only run with them.

Inaya

Massacre_Wurm wrote: »

You should try WoW raiding. Nothing is toxic here.

Or play WOW at all for that matter. It gives the word "toxic" a whole new meaning

Gandrhulf_Harbard

Turelus wrote: »

During a recent round table I was at there was an interesting moment where Rich or Rob (forget which) made a comment about "play the way you want".

In short they way they were saying it was not that the phrase means everything should be viable in all conditions, but rather everything is possible if you want to try it, you just might not be as good as more viable options.

So you can play that Heavy Armour S&B DPS if you want (the game won't stop you) but you might not be as good at vMA as a Light Armour Magicka DPS.

Well, that means they are just using weasel words and don't really believe what they are saying, but just saying it because it keeps the money coming in.

I get it, that's how business works.

The description you have given is more akin to "we can't be bothered, or lack the skill, to balance everything properly, but we'll pretend that is part of the game's charm".

Not good IMO.

All The Best

RebornV3x

1. Ever since One Tamriel dropped this game has catered to casuals not the meta not this 10% other than 4 new dungeons, 1 trial a year and a new arena every now and again I would say most content is catering to casuals cause overland questing and bosses are brain dead easy.

2. This game has always had toxic players and that hasn't changed.

I would have quit this game year one if it wasn't an Elder Scrolls MMO ive gotten so much harrasment , put downs, death threats(and not just the you suck kys type stuff like some real psycho stuff)
But since Summerset its actually been good barely any hate mail got into some great guilds that dont require me to have to follow an Alcast build to the letter my build isn't completely unique but I have the dps and that's all that matters.

I agree ZOS has let the meta run wild this game is a balencing nightmare and game performance is horrible

This whole "Play as you want" is a lie and was dead on release you can debate that it was alive before 1.6 but still.

Girl_Number8

L2p

People whining and constantly asking for nerfs, so the ceiling is dropped through the floor is toxic too.

ESO is social game

Itzmichi

Rampeal wrote: »

When I first started playing this game it was great. Being able to be a werewolf was one of the biggest draws for me. Dungeons were fun and veteran dungeons were too. You could take any set in the game and play the way you want. "PLAY THE WAY YOU WANT".Players were helpful and the toxicity in the game was low.
Everything was good, then came the DLC that focused on the Meta game.

Don't get me wrong Meta has always been in the game, but ESO never catered to them. They were the 10% of the game player base. Now with every DLC you design it around the Meta, the 10%. Not the 90% of the game. Ask any player and majority will tell you that they prefer to run non DLC dungeons rather than DLC because it is less punishing and more rewarding. Any game/MMO knows this. The Normal is for the Majority while the Vet is for the elite. Most will say "L2P or GiT Gud" but this is just a Toxic response. Which brings me to my next issue.

Toxic Player base. This game as many others has its share of Toxic players, but my god is it worse now. Can't tell you how many times I have run normal Trials and Dungeons just for people to want to kick players for learning the game and not being up to their standards in gear and rotation. It is not that we were not fi finishing the trial or Dungeon it was the fact we were not steam rolling it so the Toxic player can get their instant gratification. PvP is no better. How many times are you in Riften or Wayrest and hit that instant lag of people dueling and insulting each other. Making fun of others gear because they don't run the cookie cutter meta. Or talk about how they are trash and their skill set up is trash for not running the Meta skills. The "Git Gud and L2P" spam and teabags as all over the place. You ZoS have only encouraged it. In one of your interviews you told players to "Git Gud L2P" when they brought up concerns about it. Shame on you.

And I point out that the main issue is with the Meta. You Zos have allowed the Meta to run wild and leave it unchecked for years. "Play as you want" died a long time ago. Now it is run a handful of sets and skills the Meta deem is appropriate or get kicked and berated for playing the way you want to play. ZoS You cater to Meta more than any other Developer I have ever seen. You fuel the fire with unforgiving DLC and refusal to fix Overpowered and broken skill and gear.

It is sad. I have wanted to quit ESO. I have wanted to move on, but I have devoted so much time and money into a game I loved and I don't want to be done with it. I want to fix it and bring it back. But you are making it hard for me to do that.

Thank you all for reading this long post. I know I am probably going to get a bunch of "Git Gud, L2P, you Scrub" post, but this is just one players opinion and you should take it as that.

You expect people to accept the way you want to play, that's all right but you also have to accept the fact that people don't want to play the way you do nor you can expect others to "carry" you just because you want to role play.

disintegr8

I have just accepted that newer vet content is not meant for pugs and don't run them.I also agree with the change in players attitudes and behaviour towards others.

I was near a world boss the other day on a farming toon harvesting survey maps when someone came up and started fighting the boss. I figured I'd jump in because I hadn't completed it on that toon and maybe help out. As soon as I got into the fight, the other player went into sneak and left the fight, presumably not wanting to 'carry' me.

When I died and moved away, he went back in and restarted the fight. I waited until the boss was 3/4 dead and rejoined (nasty of me) only to have him sneak off again. This time I didn't die and finished the boss off. He then whispered me, calling me a noob and telling me my 'roto' needed work. When I tried to whisper him back, it came up player not found.

Once upon a time, people worked together and helped each other out. Now it seems helping is actually 'carrying' and people criticize or abuse anyone who does not meet their standards.

Gilvoth

what happened to eso?
it became free to play, as well as it reaching it's 5 year projection plan.

Siohwenoeht

Gilvoth wrote: »

what happened to eso?
it became free to play, as well as it reaching it's 5 year projection plan.

It's not f2p,. It's b2p. There is still a difference thankfully.

Katahdin

Evito wrote: »

ZOS have done such a terrible with the meta it's obvious they couldn't care less about it... if they did the best possible trial setup would *not* involve stacking 7-8 stam necros...

Working as intended to make as many people buy Elsweyr as possible.

It will eventually get the nerf bat

Deathlord92

Pvp is a brutal place it’s git gud or get rekt 😎

Rampeal

Thank you all for the feed back even the Super critical ones. Again all I was saying was that this is just my opinion. I still love eso and I still play it, but it is not worth my ESO plus payments anymore or Crownstore purchases.

I still run trials and still crafted and hang with guildies, but I have focused my Time and money more or FFXIV. It is worth the P2P cost and many MMOs can learn from them "Especially" ESO. I hope one day it will be back to what it was originally meant to be and not just a meta chase like it is now.

Another MMO I have played and seen go down the same rabbit hole as ESO is Champions online. It played exactly like eso where you can pick your own skills and "Play as you want". Was P2P, then B2P, now F2P. Now it is nothing more than a cash grab and a game on life support where you can only play freeform as a paid gold member and the F2P are stuck with Limited classes. And what killed this game? The META.

AbysmalGhul

Rampeal wrote: »

When I first started playing this game it was great. Being able to be a werewolf was one of the biggest draws for me. Dungeons were fun and veteran dungeons were too. You could take any set in the game and play the way you want. "PLAY THE WAY YOU WANT".Players were helpful and the toxicity in the game was low.
Everything was good, then came the DLC that focused on the Meta game.

Don't get me wrong Meta has always been in the game, but ESO never catered to them. They were the 10% of the game player base. Now with every DLC you design it around the Meta, the 10%. Not the 90% of the game. Ask any player and majority will tell you that they prefer to run non DLC dungeons rather than DLC because it is less punishing and more rewarding. Any game/MMO knows this. The Normal is for the Majority while the Vet is for the elite. Most will say "L2P or GiT Gud" but this is just a Toxic response. Which brings me to my next issue.

Toxic Player base. This game as many others has its share of Toxic players, but my god is it worse now. Can't tell you how many times I have run normal Trials and Dungeons just for people to want to kick players for learning the game and not being up to their standards in gear and rotation. It is not that we were not fi finishing the trial or Dungeon it was the fact we were not steam rolling it so the Toxic player can get their instant gratification. PvP is no better. How many times are you in Riften or Wayrest and hit that instant lag of people dueling and insulting each other. Making fun of others gear because they don't run the cookie cutter meta. Or talk about how they are trash and their skill set up is trash for not running the Meta skills. The "Git Gud and L2P" spam and teabags as all over the place. You ZoS have only encouraged it. In one of your interviews you told players to "Git Gud L2P" when they brought up concerns about it. Shame on you.

And I point out that the main issue is with the Meta. You Zos have allowed the Meta to run wild and leave it unchecked for years. "Play as you want" died a long time ago. Now it is run a handful of sets and skills the Meta deem is appropriate or get kicked and berated for playing the way you want to play. ZoS You cater to Meta more than any other Developer I have ever seen. You fuel the fire with unforgiving DLC and refusal to fix Overpowered and broken skill and gear.

It is sad. I have wanted to quit ESO. I have wanted to move on, but I have devoted so much time and money into a game I loved and I don't want to be done with it. I want to fix it and bring it back. But you are making it hard for me to do that.

Thank you all for reading this long post. I know I am probably going to get a bunch of "Git Gud, L2P, you Scrub" post, but this is just one players opinion and you should take it as that.

I don't share your sentiments. You don't have to have a "Meta leet" attitude, build, rotation etc etc to complete harder content. If people are bashing your builds or rotation, so what? Move on and go elsewhere and find like minded people such as yourself. You can't let what others think and say determine your worth on this game.

If end game content is a thing you want to pursue, you really have to find like minded people. I've joined guilds where all they want to do is a full team of stamcros. Good for them, but I don't stam, so I move on to find another end game guild that fit my mentality and goals.

leepalmer95

Greed.

Any balance issues, bug fixes, performance updates etc... are put on hold when it comes to money. Crown store takes priority over everything, fixing OP sets, skills, classes from new dlc's is delayed so they can sell well first. Servers not upgrades when they start to fill up and instead when they are full because it costs money etc...

worrallj

Git Gud, L2P, you Scrub

worrallj

worrallj wrote: »

Git Gud, L2P, you Scrub

JK. I kinda agree and kinda not.

I agree that it's stupid how there's hundreds of sets in this game, and with each new dlc they introduce a whole new batch that all turn out to be BiS. I'm a believer that old content shouldn't be made irrelevant by new. There's no sense having 300 sets in the game if only a dozen of them are good.

But I disagree because it seems like the "meta" as you describe it is one of the only tools the game offers for introducing genuine challenges with each new chapter. "Play the way you want" can kinda blend into builds being irrelevant and everything is easy for everyone.

It's a balancing act. I'm not saying they have found the sweet spot, but I'm skeptical that pve could stay interesting without the meta squeeze.