Your performance sucks

LegacyDM

930pm EST week day on a Wednesday night. [snip]





Ping to Dallas 88. Ping to server 360. [snip]

[edited for bashing]

GhostofDatthaw

"Nothing to see here" -ZOS

Turelus

This has nothing to do with internet connections, so you speeds/pings on tests don't matter.

It's because of bottlenecks on calculations and requests to the server during fights. Upgrading hardware might alleviate this a little, but mostly it's not going to be solved until ZOS finds a way to streamline the requested information or have the game just require less requests.

LegacyDM

Turelus wrote: »

This has nothing to do with internet connections, so you speeds/pings on tests don't matter.

It's because of bottlenecks on calculations and requests to the server during fights. Upgrading hardware might alleviate this a little, but mostly it's not going to be solved until ZOS finds a way to streamline the requested information or have the game just require less requests.

Yeah thanks.

Woooosh... Just pointing out, for the 100th upteenth time that the problem is not on our end...

MajBludd

They are working on a fix, OP. They apparently have been working on a fix for 3 maybe 4 years.
Eventually they'll get it, just be patient and buy crowns in the meantime!

Ackwalan

Perhaps ZOS should disable proc sets for a week, see if there is a difference. ZOS tried it with CP and found little difference, see what all those proc set calculation do.

zyk

Ackwalan wrote: »

Perhaps ZOS should disable proc sets for a week, see if there is a difference. ZOS tried it with CP and found little difference, see what all those proc set calculation do.

The issue has always been gameplay design, not the server. If one designs a terrible database that results in performance issues, it's not the fault of the database server. If one writes a power hungry phone app that drains batteries, it's not the fault of the phone.

The problem all along is that ZOS has designed gameplay its server tech can't handle -- and honestly, there's no server tech that could support ESO gameplay 150v150v150 without performance issues. Consider how server intensive constant LA+ability weaving + procs + buffs + etc by each character must be. Especially because the game design encourages AE spam.,

When the problems were exposed in 2014, ZOS should have bit the bullet and designed a ruleset specific to AvA so that players can't break the server.

None of what I'm saying is news to ZOS. This is standard game design. No designer creates gameplay willy-nilly without consideration to the limitations of the engine/server. What happened here, as ZOS admits, is that ESO is not played how the designers envisioned -- because it was pushed out the door unfinished.

Durham

Same this is last product I will buy from this organization. I love this game and its concept but wow is it poorly managed and implimented. Performance should be the #1 priority atm. nothing else.. but that is not the case.

zyk

Morgul667 wrote: »

[snip]

Go further than that. ZOS isn't really an independent studio. It is a fully owned subsidiary of Zenimax Media.

Because of my experiences with ESO, I am done with Fallout, TES and every other Zenimax IP. I bet TES6 will be a microtransaction disaster but their new audience will lap it up anyway.

[edited to remove quote]

ku5h

MajBludd wrote: »

They are working on a fix, OP. They apparently have been working on a fix for 3 maybe 4 years.
Eventually they'll get it, just be patient and buy crowns in the meantime!

For some reason reading the first line made me remember that JF Kennedy's speech "We choose to go to the Moon" and imagine some ZoS big head in some big conference room saying " We choose to fix the ESO lag in the decade to come, not because it's easy, but because it's hard, because that goal will serve all the population of Tamriel...."
....and then they fake it

LegacyDM

zyk wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Perhaps ZOS should disable proc sets for a week, see if there is a difference. ZOS tried it with CP and found little difference, see what all those proc set calculation do.

The issue has always been gameplay design, not the server. If one designs a terrible database that results in performance issues, it's not the fault of the database server. If one writes a power hungry phone app that drains batteries, it's not the fault of the phone.

The problem all along is that ZOS has designed gameplay its server tech can't handle -- and honestly, there's no server tech that could support ESO gameplay 150v150v150 without performance issues. Consider how server intensive constant LA+ability weaving + procs + buffs + etc by each character must be. Especially because the game design encourages AE spam.,

When the problems were exposed in 2014, ZOS should have bit the bullet and designed a ruleset specific to AvA so that players can't break the server.

None of what I'm saying is news to ZOS. This is standard game design. No designer creates gameplay willy-nilly without consideration to the limitations of the engine/server. What happened here, as ZOS admits, is that ESO is not played how the designers envisioned -- because it was pushed out the door unfinished.

You are correct. However I would submit they did have a rule set and they broke it contributing to the current problem. The engine was designed for Resource Soft caps, no proc sets, animation canceling, and client side validation checks. When they removed soft caps, introduced procs, messed around with animation canceling, and introduced anti-cheat spaghetti code server side checks along with lightning patch crap went to hell.

Now, granted they had to do something about cheating but it caused additional problems that haven’t been fixed. If they had any clue they would have invested in anti cheat during the design of the game. But in their stupidity they left it out. I blame Matt firor for pushing this game beyond its limits, breaking the rule set and not accounting for anti cheat during design.

JTorus

LegacyDM wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Perhaps ZOS should disable proc sets for a week, see if there is a difference. ZOS tried it with CP and found little difference, see what all those proc set calculation do.

The issue has always been gameplay design, not the server. If one designs a terrible database that results in performance issues, it's not the fault of the database server. If one writes a power hungry phone app that drains batteries, it's not the fault of the phone.

The problem all along is that ZOS has designed gameplay its server tech can't handle -- and honestly, there's no server tech that could support ESO gameplay 150v150v150 without performance issues. Consider how server intensive constant LA+ability weaving + procs + buffs + etc by each character must be. Especially because the game design encourages AE spam.,

When the problems were exposed in 2014, ZOS should have bit the bullet and designed a ruleset specific to AvA so that players can't break the server.

None of what I'm saying is news to ZOS. This is standard game design. No designer creates gameplay willy-nilly without consideration to the limitations of the engine/server. What happened here, as ZOS admits, is that ESO is not played how the designers envisioned -- because it was pushed out the door unfinished.

You are correct. However I would submit they did have a rule set and they broke it contributing to the current problem. The engine was designed for Resource Soft caps, no proc sets, animation canceling, and client side validation checks. When they removed soft caps, introduced procs, messed around with animation canceling, and introduced anti-cheat spaghetti code server side checks along with lightning patch crap went to hell.

Now, granted they had to do something about cheating but it caused additional problems that haven’t been fixed. If they had any clue they would have invested in anti cheat during the design of the game. But in their stupidity they left it out. I blame Matt firor for pushing this game beyond its limits, breaking the rule set and not accounting for anti cheat during design.

$20 says the server side code is (still) 32 bit and can't take advantage of multiple CPU threads and larger amounts of memory.

Just like client was upon release.

Easy to say. Hard (expensive) to fix.

Xvorg

Turelus wrote: »

This has nothing to do with internet connections, so you speeds/pings on tests don't matter.

It's because of bottlenecks on calculations and requests to the server during fights. Upgrading hardware might alleviate this a little, but mostly it's not going to be solved until ZOS finds a way to streamline the requested information or have the game just require less requests.

Or stop with the stupid idea of Megaservers and put regular servers around the world

JTorus

Xvorg wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

This has nothing to do with internet connections, so you speeds/pings on tests don't matter.

It's because of bottlenecks on calculations and requests to the server during fights. Upgrading hardware might alleviate this a little, but mostly it's not going to be solved until ZOS finds a way to streamline the requested information or have the game just require less requests.

Or stop with the stupid idea of Megaservers and put regular servers around the world

Location hardly maters anymore as far as internet response time. The Aussies might rejoice, but the bottleneck is on the server, specifically with software. Hardware, and internet tubing is fine... on your end, on ZOS's end, and all the pieces in-between.

Everything else you use these days operates on some sort of clustering services and you're blissfully unaware.

josh.lackey_ESO

The latency reported in-game includes the server lag and the frame render time.

Say you are getting only 40 fps. That means 25ms to render a frame + the 88m of packet round-trip = 113ms. The other 240ms is the server calculating the response to send you.

The way to fix it is to upgrade to faster server hardware or optimize the code.

It has almost nothing to do with the game engine running on your computer or the actual network connection.

Say that improved the game engine to get a solid 60 fps even in big zerg fights, that would only be a difference of maybe 10ms.

The bottom line is that the server can't do the computations in real-time. That is where the lag comes from.

Durham

My group has been down for 2 weeks now. Unplayable .. PVP guild that cant PVP

Turelus

Xvorg wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

This has nothing to do with internet connections, so you speeds/pings on tests don't matter.

It's because of bottlenecks on calculations and requests to the server during fights. Upgrading hardware might alleviate this a little, but mostly it's not going to be solved until ZOS finds a way to streamline the requested information or have the game just require less requests.

Or stop with the stupid idea of Megaservers and put regular servers around the world

I would be against this. One of the things I love about this game is that when I find another EU PC player I don't have to have the "what server are you on" conversation. I can just exchange info and we can go play together in the game.

GhostofDatthaw

LegacyDM wrote: »

930pm EST week day on a Wednesday night. [snip]





Ping to Dallas 88. Ping to server 360. [snip]

Have you tried checking with your isp? Could be a problem with your internet.

[edited to remove quote]

vamp_emily

yesterday I got a new warning message.

I TP to DC and run towards the outer front door. I noticed it had low health so I was going to repair it.

I click Q and I get the message like "Cannot repair while sprinting"
I click Q and I get the message "Cannot repair while sprinting"
I click Q and I get the message "Cannot repair while sprinting"
I click Q and I get the message "Cannot repair while sprinting"
I click Q and I get the message "Cannot repair while sprinting"
I click Q and I get the message "Cannot repair while sprinting"
I click Q and I get the message "Cannot repair while sprinting"

I'm sure it is my computer.

Minnesinger

Hugely disappointed also how bad the pvp works. Have had my share of problems. Even one requiring help from the customer support. Their reply didn´t satisfy at all but least they acknowledged the issue and apologized. Can´t say the same about performance issues.

Wabu

MajBludd wrote: »

They are working on a fix, OP. They apparently have been working on a fix for 3 maybe 4 years.
Eventually they'll get it, just be patient and buy crowns in the meantime!

Whaat? ZoS made several stress tests before your guesstimate, but they never said they would fix lag. That would be extremely unlikely, for reasons I think we all understand.
This is footage from the first stress test ~1 month after release date. Waaay before your estimate @MajBludd

Different, yet fun, times.

A lot of things in cyrodiil have improved since then. We are not running around with 2k hp, 5 piece sets giving 2 or 3 stat bonuses, bugged combat, and several hundreds of other things addressed by QoL Cyrodiil patches.
We all want to see ZoS in it's current form raise the bar for ESO pvp, and they will. But they have to figure out a better model to keep ESO as: Elder Scrolls Online. And not: "Equipment Stress Operations". Especially when they are "killing it" as an mmo.

Neoealth

Turelus wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

This has nothing to do with internet connections, so you speeds/pings on tests don't matter.

It's because of bottlenecks on calculations and requests to the server during fights. Upgrading hardware might alleviate this a little, but mostly it's not going to be solved until ZOS finds a way to streamline the requested information or have the game just require less requests.

Or stop with the stupid idea of Megaservers and put regular servers around the world

I would be against this. One of the things I love about this game is that when I find another EU PC player I don't have to have the "what server are you on" conversation. I can just exchange info and we can go play together in the game.

Why would you feel the need to have that conversation?

OtarTheMad

I think what some players said here are correct. I agree with what @zyk and @LegacyDM and some others. I believe ZOS knows what is wrong but I am not entirely sure if they know how to fix it. What I mean is they have the knowledge (we bash them but I doubt they're idiots) but might not have the tools, permission, time or money to fixing it. I am going to guess, knowing not a lot about coding and game making, that this isn't an easy fix despite what others say.

At this point I have to start to think maybe it's not ZOS, maybe it's ZMI that is the problem... idk. I am not going to pretend to know what goes on in the gaming studio or in the corporate office but I have worked for a few companies where the issues they had could have been fixed but weren't "in the budget".

Idk, even if some of the ideas that the PvP community has given to ZOS won't fix the issue I believe they might be worth a try. Maybe even as another test week or something? For example for a week lower group caps to 12. Another week try to turn off the que system which would mean if the campaign is locked... too bad go to another one. and etc. they might not totally fix the problem but maybe reduce it? That'd be nice.

UppGRAYxDD

Night of the necro performance threads!!! Yea and it sucks more now!!! Send halp!!!!

Mr_Walker

Worse than ever now. Last weekend I got rubberbanded from the top of roe keep back to the front porch. Skills don't fire, it's truly woeful. It's like they bottled all the lag that MYM should have generated, and are now releasing it.