Volendrung needs tweaking

baronzilch

First off, I think Volendrung is one of the worst mechanics I've ever seen introduced into a PvP scheme. It creates more clustered zergs when the thing Cyrodiil really needed was mechanics that spread players out more. It's an OP 'insta win' button, a mechanic which really has no place in PvP in the first place. If it it randomly spawns in the current population leading faction (during off-prime), it pretty much kills PvP altogether for the following 30 minutes as the smaller factions can't compete at all and start logging due to loss of morale.

Unfortunately, despite many missteps, it is likely here to stay. So what can we do to make it better? And I don't mean more OP... it's OP enough, just better.

1. Volendrung only spawns for the current lowest map population AND lowest current map point total (much achieve both conditions).
2. It spawns in the most forward current keep of the losing faction and for 10 minutes can not be picked up by another faction (anywhere); after the 10 mins it reverts to current rules.

My hope is that this would lead to some balancing out of low pops vs. high pops during off-prime and give better overall competition during those times. Might even help scores stay more competitive day to day as the losing factions would be able to gain a little ground or hold off getting smashed for a little while. You could suspend these new rules if all 3 factions are pop-locked, but, really, during triple pop-lock the hammer never gets very far, and the damage it does is quickly reclaimed, so am less concerned about which faction gets it during that time (maybe go to the overall campaign points loser during triple pop-lock?).

What Cyrodiil really needs are mechanics that help balance population issues and spread out the fighting across the map - not do the opposite. These are just my suggestions, they aren't perfect in solving those issues, but hopefully it's a start to the discussion.

jdamuso

'' 1. Volendrung only spawns for the current lowest map population AND lowest current map point total (much achieve both conditions). ''

This is not true at all. ive seen it spawn for pop locked faction while other factions have only two bars. It seems to go in a counter clockwise rotation every few hours.

What clearly needs a nerf is the downing of a door in under 5 seconds. This is unreasonable. The combat capabilities versus other player i find to be acceptable, after all its a magic hammer, not a wheel of cheese.

But yea the PVD needs a serious nerf.

baronzilch

jdamuso wrote: »

'' 1. Volendrung only spawns for the current lowest map population AND lowest current map point total (much achieve both conditions). ''

This is not true at all. ive seen it spawn for pop locked faction while other factions have only two bars. It seems to go in a counter clockwise rotation every few hours.

What clearly needs a nerf is the downing of a door in under 5 seconds. This is unreasonable. The combat capabilities versus other player i find to be acceptable, after all its a magic hammer, not a wheel of cheese.

But yea the PVD needs a serious nerf.

Bud, I was talking about changes to the current implementation.

jdamuso

jdamuso wrote: »

'' 1. Volendrung only spawns for the current lowest map population AND lowest current map point total (much achieve both conditions). ''

This is not true at all. ive seen it spawn for pop locked faction while other factions have only two bars. It seems to go in a counter clockwise rotation every few hours.

What clearly needs a nerf is the downing of a door in under 5 seconds. This is unreasonable. The combat capabilities versus other player i find to be acceptable, after all its a magic hammer, not a wheel of cheese.

But yea the PVD needs a serious nerf.

Oh you are saying this as a option to help balance the hammer. Im sorry, thats not a bad idea. but too unfair. it cant be only for the losing team. A rng roll to where it spawns with a bonus to outnumbered teams may be more viable for fairness in the same kind of idea.

baronzilch

jdamuso wrote: »

Oh you are saying this as a option to help balance the hammer. Im sorry, thats not a bad idea. but too unfair. it cant be only for the losing team. A rng roll to where it spawns with a bonus to outnumbered teams may be more viable for fairness in the same kind of idea.

Yeah, not saying my ideas are perfect, so you suggest a drafted lottery type system, where the rng is weighted to the losing side to keep some "surprise" factor in placement of the hammer. That wouldn't work with the ten minute rule I suggested, but, I don't hate the idea.

My goal is to come up with a way to keep the 'losing' sides opportunities to 'get back into the game'. 30 days is a long time to have no hope and some campaigns are decided after week 1.

J18696

The thing about the hammer is even if it does spawn at the lowest scoring factions area the highest population faction instantly moves to it once it's picked up and zergs it happened every time this last campaign no matter what you do the dominate faction will get it

baronzilch

J18696 wrote: »

The thing about the hammer is even if it does spawn at the lowest scoring factions area the highest population faction instantly moves to it once it's picked up and zergs it happened every time this last campaign no matter what you do the dominate faction will get it

That's why I suggested the ten minute rule. Give that faction some time to organize and not get camped the second it spawns. Do you have a suggestion?

jdamuso

baronzilch wrote: »

jdamuso wrote: »

Oh you are saying this as a option to help balance the hammer. Im sorry, thats not a bad idea. but too unfair. it cant be only for the losing team. A rng roll to where it spawns with a bonus to outnumbered teams may be more viable for fairness in the same kind of idea.

Yeah, not saying my ideas are perfect, so you suggest a drafted lottery type system, where the rng is weighted to the losing side to keep some "surprise" factor in placement of the hammer. That wouldn't work with the ten minute rule I suggested, but, I don't hate the idea.

My goal is to come up with a way to keep the 'losing' sides opportunities to 'get back into the game'. 30 days is a long time to have no hope and some campaigns are decided after week 1.

This is great my friend, please continue to think up and share ideas about how to make cyro better for everyone.

This is exactly the kind of content the forum needs, whether the ideas be good or bad. But having more solutions than complaints is stepping in the right direction. Carry on, GLHF

zyk

I don't get how this is enjoyable to anyone aside from the novelty. But then, I don't enjoy having emp or using broken OP builds either.

I think the basic idea of having an artifact of some kind for players to fight over in a scroll-esque kind of way could have been a useful tool to spread players out if it provided non-combat benefits -- in particular, benefits that might appeal to small scalers more than large groups.

As it has been implemented, it seems to only enhance imbalances and concentrates players even more. This weapon is one of the reasons I won't pay for ESO anymore. It makes everything I dislike worse.

IxSTALKERxI

- Make weapon unable to spawn between hrs of 3am EST 8am EST (weapon still spawns 3 times a day 5-6hrs apart)

- Remove spawn behind alliance gates.
- After 10 minutes of volendrung spawning, DO NOT reveal it to all alliances. Only reveal it to the alliance with the current lowest potential score/hr.
(These changes will encourage people to go look for it before it shows up on map)

-Remove the ability to hold volendrung as emp (yes that's a thing even though they said it's not possible lol)

-Sundering swing - reduce the damage dealt to structures by 50%.

There are other tweaks to skills i mentioned on pts forums that I would of preferred rather than the ignore battle spirit buff... all that did was make squishy people even squishier and tanky people less tanky, introducing an armor pen and an aoe bleed onto the skills would of made it more interesting rather then just doubling damage lol.

echo2omega

I like the idea of Volendrung and the chaos it brings.

But overall it is a failure.

One of the single biggest issues with campaigns in faction stacking. Volendrung only encourages faction stacking even more. The faction that has the hammer wants to protect it. More players = more protection. The faction that opposes it wants to take the hammer. More players = better chance to defend against the hammer. Not to mention there is a massive map icon showing everyone where it is.

More people = more lag.

There are many many many other better ways to fix PVP in Cyrodiil and make it better game experience. This is currently not one of them.

Davadin

Heh. Am I the only one that prefer more zerg vs zerg, rather than being spread out throughout the map?

Y'know, zerg chaos. We used to call that a "battle".

Laggy, but fun.

Seriously? Nobody else loves looking at 100 vs 100 on the screen (disclaimer: i play on onboard laptop graphic, and can still squeeze decent FPS, even if my skills could get sporadic 1-5 sec lag, or infinite loading screen), and EVERYBODY prefer small skirmishes?



On a more serious note: I love Volendong. Kaal PC NA player here, proudly EP. We love it when AD kept getting the hammer, and 3 out of 5 times we managed to meet u in the open, wrestled it, and POW! BACK IN YO FACE!

The other 2 times, AD ramped us up all the way back to the scrolls gate.


AT ALL TIMES, all factions pop-locked. So don't give me *** about "ooooh boo hoo, they got more numbers, so we lost da hammer.", since I've been a couple times we TRIED to get it and AD zerged steamrolled my ass like cream puffs. In-game name same: Davadin, if that jogs anyone's memory. I'm the *** med-armor DK that dies alot, but also got the Volendong-killer achievement just couple weeks back when the rest of my meow-butthole pact was too scared to take a step forward. (Except Elong, or Agrippa, or Mari who I remember on top of my head)(where's Ahtu?)

So yes, improve it. Use different timers, or cooldown. Buff it. Nerf it. Improve the server while yer at it to fix the lag.

But either way, I for one vote for more chaos and huge battles. On top of the occasional small fights, of course.


Y'know, there's this thing called Battleground, if anyone wants a "better game experience by load balancing clusters of players". They're no-CP too, to boot!

Mayrael

I do agree with locking Volendrung to lowest pop faction, if factions have even numbers anyone can pick it up.

It should help the weakest ones! Currently on PC EU noCP campaign DC is usually the lowest populated, but as soon as they get the Volendrung we (AD) or EP are taking it over because of numbers we have. It is impossible to use the hammer effectively against higher populated faction as the hammer will be intercepted and used against you. This is bad.

Durham

Davadin wrote: »

Heh. Am I the only one that prefer more zerg vs zerg, rather than being spread out throughout the map?

Y'know, zerg chaos. We used to call that a "battle".

Laggy, but fun.

Seriously? Nobody else loves looking at 100 vs 100 on the screen (disclaimer: i play on onboard laptop graphic, and can still squeeze decent FPS, even if my skills could get sporadic 1-5 sec lag, or infinite loading screen), and EVERYBODY prefer small skirmishes?



On a more serious note: I love Volendong. Kaal PC NA player here, proudly EP. We love it when AD kept getting the hammer, and 3 out of 5 times we managed to meet u in the open, wrestled it, and POW! BACK IN YO FACE!

The other 2 times, AD ramped us up all the way back to the scrolls gate.


AT ALL TIMES, all factions pop-locked. So don't give me *** about "ooooh boo hoo, they got more numbers, so we lost da hammer.", since I've been a couple times we TRIED to get it and AD zerged steamrolled my ass like cream puffs. In-game name same: Davadin, if that jogs anyone's memory. I'm the *** med-armor DK that dies alot, but also got the Volendong-killer achievement just couple weeks back when the rest of my meow-butthole pact was too scared to take a step forward. (Except Elong, or Agrippa, or Mari who I remember on top of my head)(where's Ahtu?)

So yes, improve it. Use different timers, or cooldown. Buff it. Nerf it. Improve the server while yer at it to fix the lag.

But either way, I for one vote for more chaos and huge battles. On top of the occasional small fights, of course.


Y'know, there's this thing called Battleground, if anyone wants a "better game experience by load balancing clusters of players". They're no-CP too, to boot!

thank you for the lag that people like you are creating

LuciusOctavio

Hammer adds a different type of dilemma to the field, to use or not to use.

I have had it twice (XBOX NA) just due to dumb luck, but used it the first time to smack walls down and gain a keep.

Great fantastic, let's imagine this scenario, say your DC and you get the hammer, EP is Zerging hard and DC just doesn't have the numbers. AD is around but getting hit hard by EP.

Now if you believe in strategy then you think maybe DC could take the hammer south, have AD get the hammer to use on EP, let the two fight over it while DC can hit other objectives North etc.

Or you simply don't trust DC enough to support your push, you take it with your team and hold it in the scroll gates until it goes back to Oblivion.

It adds strategy to the game, its powerful, but not unstoppable. I like the challenge it adds.

Vlad9425

I've picked it up multiple times and melting zergs with that ultimate is one of the most fun things in this game LOL.

jaime1982

It needs to be deleted.

josh.lackey_ESO

Maybe they should apply faction lock to the hammer.

ruikkarikun

This is very stupid. Who designed it? Emp+all emp keeps, + pop lock and that faction receive volen at their gate.
EVERY SINGLE NIGHT.
HOW CAN YOU SAY IT'S OK?

KillsAllElves

Durham wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

Heh. Am I the only one that prefer more zerg vs zerg, rather than being spread out throughout the map?

Y'know, zerg chaos. We used to call that a "battle".

Laggy, but fun.

Seriously? Nobody else loves looking at 100 vs 100 on the screen (disclaimer: i play on onboard laptop graphic, and can still squeeze decent FPS, even if my skills could get sporadic 1-5 sec lag, or infinite loading screen), and EVERYBODY prefer small skirmishes?



On a more serious note: I love Volendong. Kaal PC NA player here, proudly EP. We love it when AD kept getting the hammer, and 3 out of 5 times we managed to meet u in the open, wrestled it, and POW! BACK IN YO FACE!

The other 2 times, AD ramped us up all the way back to the scrolls gate.


AT ALL TIMES, all factions pop-locked. So don't give me *** about "ooooh boo hoo, they got more numbers, so we lost da hammer.", since I've been a couple times we TRIED to get it and AD zerged steamrolled my ass like cream puffs. In-game name same: Davadin, if that jogs anyone's memory. I'm the *** med-armor DK that dies alot, but also got the Volendong-killer achievement just couple weeks back when the rest of my meow-butthole pact was too scared to take a step forward. (Except Elong, or Agrippa, or Mari who I remember on top of my head)(where's Ahtu?)

So yes, improve it. Use different timers, or cooldown. Buff it. Nerf it. Improve the server while yer at it to fix the lag.

But either way, I for one vote for more chaos and huge battles. On top of the occasional small fights, of course.


Y'know, there's this thing called Battleground, if anyone wants a "better game experience by load balancing clusters of players". They're no-CP too, to boot!

thank you for the lag that people like you are creating

Cyrodiil was marketed as large scale siege warfare, you replied to some one who enjoys playing the way cyrodiil is meant to be played!

You have no argument.