Is there a particular reason that Spears are not playable?

Dusk_Coven

There are spears in-game as cosmetic items / non-interactable furniture objects, but spears haven't been playable since Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind. What happened?

LordTareq

I think spears are considered to be too 'plain' which is a shame. Most MMO's in general neglect spears for some reason.

Edziu

I have something interessing:

go to Skywatch in Aurridion to fighters guild, just outside you will see two couples of training fighters and all 4 of them are using spears and if you look for some time at then you will notice they have atleast 5 different animations to use like for full skilline

phaneub17_ESO

The way I see it Spears wouldn't have its own skill line so it would fall under the two-handed skill line, then they would have to create its own passive category possibly the "daggers" of two-handers providing critical strike bonus. They have to rework the animations as the usually weapon swing of swords, axes, and maces won't look right such as using a Charge attack would look funny swinging a spear in an overhead smash when its better suited to be in a thrusting motion. And possibly the most annoying thing is having to create art assets for EVERY single motif that exists in the game.

They're also not doing something like this for free, it doesn't really add much to the game except more work on their part without having it give them any revenue for doing it. Maybe one day they will do a Weapons Pack DLC that includes a whole variety of weapons that includes spears, but they they have to wonder how well would it sell and if it be worth the effort in doing so.

TheShadowScout

Edziu wrote: »

I have something interessing:

go to Skywatch in Aurridion to fighters guild, just outside you will see two couples of training fighters and all 4 of them are using spears and if you look for some time at then you will notice they have atleast 5 different animations to use like for full skilline

You will find spear training warriors in Murkmire... just take a look around in dead-water village sometime!

phaneub17_ESO wrote: »

The way I see it Spears wouldn't have its own skill line so it would fall under the two-handed skill line...

...though that would not fit, seeing how ALL the two-handed skills are "slashing" type attacks, and spears would be more... "poking"...

But I really, really would love to see a "polearms" skill line, not just for spears, but... for all of the fin things you could wield, from spears to halberds, from tridents to naginata, from glaives to poleaxes... no surprise I would say that though:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/371862/additional-weapon-skill-ideas-mk-ii/p1

Edziu

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Edziu wrote: »

I have something interessing:

go to Skywatch in Aurridion to fighters guild, just outside you will see two couples of training fighters and all 4 of them are using spears and if you look for some time at then you will notice they have atleast 5 different animations to use like for full skilline

You will find spear training warriors in Murkmire... just take a look around in dead-water village sometime!

idk, I stopped looking that in detail in newer maps but this place which I wrote is basic game and is for much longer in game so its is showing ZOS not only had but still have animations for spears like maybe they had in plans to adds this but at end this is not in game

but maybe it is still chance they will add this someday as I know it was never said by them they are not going to do this + as we see there are animations for this...something for start is already in game for this skilline :P

Anhedonie

There was a question like that asked on reddit 2-3 months ago, I think. Basically, devs said that they tried initially to make spears playable, but things didn't work out in the end. So it's more of a technical issue.

Casdha

I can see it now, equip a spear and everyone looks like a Templar.

Androconium

In Tes3 they were just two handed clubs. I used one early on becuase it was enchanted, i nicked it from a hut in Ald Ruhn

red_emu

Casdha wrote: »

I can see it now, equip a spear and everyone looks like a Templar.

Templars do not use spears. They are light sabre toothpicks.

LennoxPoodle

phaneub17_ESO wrote: »

The way I see it Spears wouldn't have its own skill line so it would fall under the two-handed skill line, then they would have to create its own passive category possibly the "daggers" of two-handers providing critical strike bonus. They have to rework the animations as the usually weapon swing of swords, axes, and maces won't look right such as using a Charge attack would look funny swinging a spear in an overhead smash when its better suited to be in a thrusting motion. And possibly the most annoying thing is having to create art assets for EVERY single motif that exists in the game.

They're also not doing something like this for free, it doesn't really add much to the game except more work on their part without having it give them any revenue for doing it. Maybe one day they will do a Weapons Pack DLC that includes a whole variety of weapons that includes spears, but they they have to wonder how well would it sell and if it be worth the effort in doing so.

Nah, spears and polearms should get their own skill line if they are ever introduced. The critical spot for 2H can just be filled by long swords. Spears would work better as a control and aoe based tanking weapon anyway.
It's not that bad that they aren't in though. It's a big bulky weapon of war and not a sidearm suited for an adventurer.

Akrasjel

Effort

LennoxPoodle

Edziu wrote: »

I have something interessing:

go to Skywatch in Aurridion to fighters guild, just outside you will see two couples of training fighters and all 4 of them are using spears and if you look for some time at then you will notice they have atleast 5 different animations to use like for full skilline

I'm positive that those dudes just use the animations from the templar skill line. They still made the spear model just for decoration though. It could at least be used by NSCs IMHO.

Casdha

red_emu wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

I can see it now, equip a spear and everyone looks like a Templar.

Templars do not use spears. They are light sabre toothpicks.

Picture the same animation with a different graphic model

Vildebill

I think spear would fit under 2h weapons to have a weapon to give crit, like daggers do on dual wield.

How the dizzying swing animation would work with a spear though, I don't know

Bam_Bam

Edziu wrote: »

I have something interessing:

go to Skywatch in Aurridion to fighters guild, just outside you will see two couples of training fighters and all 4 of them are using spears and if you look for some time at then you will notice they have atleast 5 different animations to use like for full skilline

Yep! Noticed that too!

There also seems to be quite a few nudges towards unarmed combat, dotted around Elsweyr.

I have a strong suspicion that we will see the following, eventually:

1. Spear/Bo staff
2. Unarmed combat
3. Whips (1h and DW lines)

idk

Zos chose to not have a spear weapon line. That may change some day but until and unless you have to do with a magical spear with the Templar.

Grianasteri

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

There are spears in-game as cosmetic items / non-interactable furniture objects, but spears haven't been playable since Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind. What happened?

This has been asked multiple times, on a semi regular basis. Sadly no spears to date. It does not look likely.

When I think of spear combat... I'm thinking Oberyn Martel (The Viper) from Game of Thrones. Fast, sweeping, attacks, at a distance. I think it can be done and be an interesting skill line.

However, on balance, I do not think ESO needs another stamina weapon line. What it needs is an alternative Magica "weapon" skill line, because right now we have... Staffs. Thats it, 2 skill lines of which only one is DPS skill line.

Meanwhile Stamina has several stamina weapon skill lines, and several different types of weapons within these for variety and effect.

Some have suggested a "no weapon", magica skill line, using ones hands, or perhaps wielding awesome looking spell books in one hand.

Dusk_Coven

LennoxPoodle wrote: »

It's not that bad that they aren't in though. It's a big bulky weapon of war and not a sidearm suited for an adventurer.

Unless they're saving it for an eastern tradition skill line where it is more staff than western style pike/polearm. In such a case they could combine it with staff fighting and make the various types of polearms into mere motifs. That Hakoshae Festival costume picture has a Japanese-y background that hints at some future expansion in that style.

LennoxPoodle

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

LennoxPoodle wrote: »

It's not that bad that they aren't in though. It's a big bulky weapon of war and not a sidearm suited for an adventurer.

Unless they're saving it for an eastern tradition skill line where it is more staff than western style pike/polearm. In such a case they could combine it with staff fighting and make the various types of polearms into mere motifs. That Hakoshae Festival costume picture has a Japanese-y background that hints at some future expansion in that style.

The issue is less the way the weapon is wielded and more how it can be carried. Some shields and 2h weapons already break that "rule" tough. IRL great swords for example were something you took into battle, but nothing you carried around on your body all the time (IIRC there was never any carrying contraption or sheath for these things. Were probably just wrapped in cloth and shouldered or put on a mule or wagon). The same applies to spears, pike halberds and such.

Anyway, going by either western or eastern specifically is a bad idea. Both have polearm and staff (Bo- versus quarterstaff for example) traditions. I don't expect a Yari to be used very differently from a typical European spear. Dragonknight animations could be made a bit more Asian martial arts like though.

Vildebill wrote: »

I think spear would fit under 2h weapons to have a weapon to give crit, like daggers do on dual wield.

How the dizzying swing animation would work with a spear though, I don't know

Again, longswords would fit that better. By that I don't mean the things Dungeons and Dragons + TES I-IV classify as such, but the actual thing. For those who don't know: Compared to a "regular one handed sword" (arming sword) they have a slightly longer longer blade and significantly longer hilt allowing the user much more control (->crit) and can still comfortably be carried on the hip (usually). Famous pop cultural examples would be Anduril and most swords in the Witcher series. You could compare them to Katanas and Tachis I guess. One cool thing about them (and maybe reason for their development?) is halfswording, a technique emulating the precision of a Dagger, for hitting gaps in the enemies armor. (->crit again)
They fit the 2H animations significantly better than spears. Even designing them shouldn't be to hard. They can be heavily based on the 1H swords

Here is an example:

Firstmep

Animations.
Stat wise spears could be the dagger equiv of two handers, but the animations wouldnt add up.
Also there are more stamina based skill lines in the game than magicka, so adding a new spear skill line would probably have to be paired with a new magicka skill line. 1handed and rune was teased back in the day, but they havent followed up on it.
I suspect once they do a weapon skill line audit next patch(at least thats what we were told), we may see some new skill lines, probably with the new chapter.

Uryel

LennoxPoodle wrote: »

Spears would work better as a control and aoe based tanking weapon anyway.

Considering spears are weapons you thrust into an enemy, I fail to see how they would be AoE weapons. Unless they have some pierce-through mechanic, then they would have some sort of line-AoE, but that's it.

LennoxPoodle

Uryel wrote: »

LennoxPoodle wrote: »

Spears would work better as a control and aoe based tanking weapon anyway.

Considering spears are weapons you thrust into an enemy, I fail to see how they would be AoE weapons. Unless they have some pierce-through mechanic, then they would have some sort of line-AoE, but that's it.

Well one of the spears advantages is it's range, paired with high speeds, making it great at keeping enemies out of their attack range (as far as I know/have seen it is extremely hard to get past it, contrary to common believe), this includes multiple enemies. (->keeping multiple enemies at bay-> AoE CC)

Edziu

well spear can have an "sweep" skill as for cone aoe like templar cheapest ult, its also like spear but its full circle so what would be problem to make it in normal spear but more like just cone to be more realistic as for normal weapon? :P

Emmagoldman

Its sad

I hope at one point. What has people excited is either new classes, abilities (psiic) or crafting (jewelry). I dont know anyone that gets pumped for dungeon releases.

They would have to come up with motifs but that falls into the design of mmos, in which we continually do old content

Idinuse

Brittney want's to know too.

rotaugen454

Everyone knows that spears cause lag.... /s

AhPook_Is_Here

Spears are the foundation of ancient infantry, in every society that fielded an army. Spears have a tremendous advantage over swords and shorter weapons. Martial arts with spears are elegant, there is nothing unrefined about a spear in skilled hands. There are some derogatory terms associated with spears but I can't see that being an obstacle. If I were to choose 2 weapons to fight in close quarters with it would be a long spear and a short mace in reserve. Spear combat is unlike other 2h/1h+s weapons, it is based around puncturing, defensive counters and to a much lesser degree slashing. It could easily justify 2 weapon skill, a 2h long spear line and a 1h+s short spear line.

Not having spears in this game is a tremendous missed opportunity.

molecule

Anhedonie wrote: »

Basically, devs said that they tried initially to make spears playable, but things didn't work out in the end. So it's more of a technical issue.

Didn't stop them releasing the other classes

ghastley

Historically, spears have excelled as a phalanx, rather than as an individual combat weapon. Putting them in the game would demand doing multi-player animations that would take the game-play into a completely different direction. Not directly, maybe, but it's the thin end of a wedge that is better avoided.

Most combat has the light attack (which uses the individual weapon animation) cancelled by the skill use, so 2h, DW, S7B or Spear is almost irrelevant to the individual character anyway. It's only when a skill has an animation using the weapon that it becomes significant, and those are typically skills of that weapon line. To some extent, the Templar skills are the spear line in that respect.

And spear in the TES games has often mixed in generic pole-arms that should have very different animations from spears, such as halberds and long-hammers. Again, adding spear alone would just cause demand for the other pole-arms.

Edziu

ghastley wrote: »

Putting them in the game would demand doing multi-player animations that would take the game-play into a completely different direction.

look at #3 comment in this thread
idk about what animations you are talking..they are already even in game but only for some npc's...isnt it enough to start an new weapon skilline? as we have animations now only need just make them as skills to use with this weapon
why it cant be implemended especially when there is design for this when other weapons was and are in game?