Make monster sets able to change weights on transmutation station?

Burgererer

I was thinking about this the other day, due to the constantly growing variety of sets with new DLC. As of right now, I believe there are 36 different sets balanced across 3 different chests. That's a 8.33% (1 in 12 chance (100/12)) chance of getting any weight of the set you want. Now, to my knowledge, most people like to min/max with exact weights to get the most armor and undaunted passives. Or at least I do. So, getting the exact piece and weight (not regarding traits) you want has a 2.77% chance (100/36, due to including all weights of one chest). I only bring this to peoples', and hopefully ZOS's, attention because of the growing number of sets. As of right now, I personally find it acceptable, as farming them over days gives you experience in the undaunted skill line, which is great anyway.

So, say you were to farm the exact piece you wanted (minus traits). I'd guess a lot of people do base game vets, and normal DLC, so 5 keys/day? So after 8 (just over 36 keys) days of farming, your RNG chances theoretically confirm the one you exactly want. Not too bad right? But again, with more DLC comes possibly slimmer odds. And let me be clear, I'm questioning making monster sets ONLY weight changeable, not any others, for balancing reasons. Sorry in advance for bad maths. Been outta college for awhile and I've gotten too comfortable with calculators.

Make this possible? Transmutation shards on the crown store for more ZOS income? Maybe make another chest/questgiver? Perfectly balanced as it is? I honestly just want to know others' thoughts, opinions, and suggestions on this idea that I think has been asked before.

TL;DR Change monster set weights due to increasingly slim chances of exact drop rates?

Stebarnz

To be honest the dungeons are that easy just by running a few times and asking the group for the one you need is more than enough for the weight.
If you are talking about shoulders with keys then when you have been playing a while and you have over 2000 keys sat there you will see why it isn't a problem as you play more.
After all its a MMO so the more you play the more you get etc.

Sylvermynx

Stebarnz wrote: »

To be honest the dungeons are that easy just by running a few times and asking the group for the one you need is more than enough for the weight.
If you are talking about shoulders with keys then when you have been playing a while and you have over 2000 keys sat there you will see why it isn't a problem as you play more.
After all its a MMO so the more you play the more you get etc.

Um. Well, the more you play the more the DEVS get maybe. Generally, the reason for RNG weighted wonky is so that those who want BIS run content all the time, which looks good as far as player metrics - for the stockholders (or in ZOS's case, the "majors" upline).

idk

As has been mentioned, dungeons are not hard to run and you can trade with anyone in your group.

The issue with what is being requested is how can Zos justify transmutation changing weight of only monster sets and no all sets. They cannot and doing it across the board will cause issues Zos does not want.

So sorry, but I doubt it will happen.

bluebird

Running dungeons for the monster helms is perfectly fine. They are a guaranteed drop for their specific dungeon, so you'll get any monster helm with any weight in like 1-2 runs max (if your group members trade you theirs). And even if people are unwilling to farm for the proper weight/trait combo, getting helms for transmuting is quite fast and easy.

The problem is the shoulder. You can open the proper chest a 100 times and still not see the shoulder you want, in any weight at all. Many guildees vent their frustration in guildchat after wasting 120 keys and still not getting the shoulder they wanted. The RNG of the chests is a real pain. You could get several repeats of the same sets, and 0 from the ones you want.

If anything should be changed, then it's the shoulder chests, possibly to a vendor system. For example exchange 10 keys for a specific shoulder with a random weight and random trait, exchange 40 keys for a specfic shoulder with a specific weight and a random trait, and exchange 60 keys for a specific shoulder with a specific weight and specific trait. Or whatever. Key cost subject to debate.

Noobslayer3255

idk wrote: »

The issue with what is being requested is how can Zos justify transmutation changing weight of only monster sets and no all sets. They cannot and doing it across the board will cause issues Zos does not want.

Not that I necessarily agree with the OP, but yes they easily can justify this. Very few sets come in every weight, sets like impreg. 95%+ of sets in the game drop in one specific weight exclusively. On the other hand, monster sets drop in every weight and are designed to be usable as such. This is not the case with weight specific sets.

therift

I said no the last two times this idea was brought up, because greedy gamers will then demand the system be expanded to all drop sets in the game, creating chaos.

No, you say? This thread is proof that players will lobby to expand features to cover more stuff.

The point is moot, anyway, since ZoS is aware of the problem, agreed it needs a change, commented on at least two very strong player solutions, and may introduce the new system within the next three Updates.

Xerikten

there is the golden merchant too

WrathOfInnos

I’d love it if we could change the weight of any armor piece. Medium Advancing Yokeda please? Heavy Alkosh? The ability to run 5 False Gods + 5 Mother’s Sorrow + Asylum Staff without being in 7 light. Many possibilities could come from this extension of the transmutation system.

SeliniaHlaalu

I like this idea, extend the transmute system, perhaps increase the cost of crystals for changing the weight.

kargen27

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Stebarnz wrote: »

To be honest the dungeons are that easy just by running a few times and asking the group for the one you need is more than enough for the weight.
If you are talking about shoulders with keys then when you have been playing a while and you have over 2000 keys sat there you will see why it isn't a problem as you play more.
After all its a MMO so the more you play the more you get etc.

Um. Well, the more you play the more the DEVS get maybe. Generally, the reason for RNG weighted wonky is so that those who want BIS run content all the time, which looks good as far as player metrics - for the stockholders (or in ZOS's case, the "majors" upline).

What you are describing is called a win/win scenario. We get to play a game we find fun (why else would you play) and the company makes money for investors.

Moonsorrow

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

I’d love it if we could change the weight of any armor piece. Medium Advancing Yokeda please? Heavy Alkosh? The ability to run 5 False Gods + 5 Mother’s Sorrow + Asylum Staff without being in 7 light. Many possibilities could come from this extension of the transmutation system.

I would love that kind of system. More options is always the better. Making the 5-1-1 nice to do on optimized parts and exactly those type of situations with special weapon sets instead of undaunted head/shoulder and so on. One can dream.

rei91

And take away like 70% of obscenely mindless grind in this game? BLASPHEMY!

White wabbit

So run a dungeon once get what you want and never run it again , so any new players wont have anyone to run with . Its not hard to run these dungeons and there is even the golden vendor so i dont see that this idea is needed

Vildebill

This upgoing trend of people asking for stuff for free is getting pretty silly. It's not like it's hard to do any of the dungeons non-HM, then you have 1/3 chance to get right weight for transmutation, maybe even right trait, or someone in the group might get it and trade it to you (or go with guilidies that know what you're looking for to guarantee a trade).

I'm all for removing mindless grinds and stupid systems, like vMA was before transmutation, but this proposal is pretty lazy.

ZonasArch

rei91 wrote: »

And take away like 70% of obscenely mindless grind in this game? BLASPHEMY!

I grew up playing RuneScape... The grinding on ESO feels like climbing a set of stairs after going up K2. Instant rewards all day long! Food x4, pots x4, materials are super cheap with few exceptions, every dungeon you do you'll get 5k or so worth of gold totally reliably... The list goes on.

It isn't too bad. Except CP grind. F*** that s***!

rei91

ZonasArch wrote: »

rei91 wrote: »

And take away like 70% of obscenely mindless grind in this game? BLASPHEMY!

I grew up playing RuneScape... The grinding on ESO feels like climbing a set of stairs after going up K2. Instant rewards all day long! Food x4, pots x4, materials are super cheap with few exceptions, every dungeon you do you'll get 5k or so worth of gold totally reliably... The list goes on.

It isn't too bad. Except CP grind. F*** that s***!

Well I didn't talk about money/resources, they're easy in this game and I'm grateful for that. But all that gear grind can get tedious sometimes.

FangOfTheTwoMoons

Vildebill wrote: »

This upgoing trend of people asking for stuff for free is getting pretty silly. It's not like it's hard to do any of the dungeons non-HM, then you have 1/3 chance to get right weight for transmutation, maybe even right trait, or someone in the group might get it and trade it to you (or go with guilidies that know what you're looking for to guarantee a trade).

I'm all for removing grinds and stupid systems, like vMA was before transmutation, but this proposal is pretXty lazy.

For one, I doubt the loot pool for monster helms is 1/3. I'm sure the table has been skewed to favor more runs. Medium Veli comes to mind here. Second, literally no one is asking for anything for free. Did you even read OP's post?

ZonasArch

rei91 wrote: »

ZonasArch wrote: »

rei91 wrote: »

And take away like 70% of obscenely mindless grind in this game? BLASPHEMY!

I grew up playing RuneScape... The grinding on ESO feels like climbing a set of stairs after going up K2. Instant rewards all day long! Food x4, pots x4, materials are super cheap with few exceptions, every dungeon you do you'll get 5k or so worth of gold totally reliably... The list goes on.

It isn't too bad. Except CP grind. F*** that s***!

Well I didn't talk about money/resources, they're easy in this game and I'm grateful for that. But all that gear grind can get tedious sometimes.

Let me reposition myself, I seem to have forgotten one detail... Before transmutation, I thought it was absolutely bad. After that update, I'm more ok with it after I started running cyrodiil more consistently, getting tons of stones, enough to not worry about traits anymore.

But yeah... Gear grind can suck sometimes. I had to open 38 chests for one monster shoulder, and it was the wrong weight class, only to get two more within the next 5 keys... When I didn't need it anymore...

I'm still ok with most of the grinding in this game though. Could be idealy shorter, but boy!, it could be much worse, potentially.

Dusk_Coven

I think the reason they would be hesitant to make such a change is it would reduce grind.
Being allowed to change traits already reduced the grind significantly. Reduce it any more and once people get their sets they might not want to do dungeons, and that would hurt group finder.
Right now you might spend over 100 keys getting the weight/type shoulder piece you want and that's before you Transmute it. That's a lot of runs to fuel the group finder.

Vildebill

FangOfTheTwoMoons wrote: »

Vildebill wrote: »

This upgoing trend of people asking for stuff for free is getting pretty silly. It's not like it's hard to do any of the dungeons non-HM, then you have 1/3 chance to get right weight for transmutation, maybe even right trait, or someone in the group might get it and trade it to you (or go with guilidies that know what you're looking for to guarantee a trade).

I'm all for removing grinds and stupid systems, like vMA was before transmutation, but this proposal is pretXty lazy.

For one, I doubt the loot pool for monster helms is 1/3. I'm sure the table has been skewed to favor more runs. Medium Veli comes to mind here. Second, literally no one is asking for anything for free. Did you even read OP's post?

I have a lot of medium Velidreth. Some in divines. But it's ridiculous to even talk about something like that without real data to back it up, your opinion is just an opinion. But good for you that you're so sure about it, that kind of sureness is very contributing to discussions, who need facts?

And yes, I read it. And I don't think it's needed. I don't play extremely much, and still have most helmets in most weights, in good traits. Same with shoulders, and since I haven't needed shoulders for so long, I sit on piles of undaunted keys. Many friends to me do the same. It's not even remotely hard to get undaunted shoulders and helmets.

Elwendryll

Not really that interesting. And I don't think much people would be willing to transmute for a 1/3 chance for helmets. Shoulder are a bit annoying, but if you do your pledges regularly you drown under the keys.

FangOfTheTwoMoons

Vildebill wrote: »

FangOfTheTwoMoons wrote: »

Vildebill wrote: »

This upgoing trend of people asking for stuff for free is getting pretty silly. It's not like it's hard to do any of the dungeons non-HM, then you have 1/3 chance to get right weight for transmutation, maybe even right trait, or someone in the group might get it and trade it to you (or go with guilidies that know what you're looking for to guarantee a trade).

I'm all for removing grinds and stupid systems, like vMA was before transmutation, but this proposal is pretXty lazy.

For one, I doubt the loot pool for monster helms is 1/3. I'm sure the table has been skewed to favor more runs. Medium Veli comes to mind here. Second, literally no one is asking for anything for free. Did you even read OP's post?

I have a lot of medium Velidreth. Some in divines. But it's ridiculous to even talk about something like that without real data to back it up, your opinion is just an opinion. But good for you that you're so sure about it, that kind of sureness is very contributing to discussions, who need facts?

And yes, I read it. And I don't think it's needed. I don't play extremely much, and still have most helmets in most weights, in good traits. Same with shoulders, and since I haven't needed shoulders for so long, I sit on piles of undaunted keys. Many friends to me do the same. It's not even remotely hard to get undaunted shoulders and helmets.

Reading is essential. Just like the title of this thread you didn't comprehend what I said. I said "I doubt," which doesn't imply I know for 100% fact but we can make educated guesses since we know ZoS skews other drops.

"It's ridiculous to talk about something like that without real data to back it up." Way to contradict yourself. You're the one who said it was 1/3 in the first place. You're the one who made all these statements with your "sureness". If my post didn't contribute anything yours sure as hell didn't.

I too have a lot of gear sitting around and piles of keys. Our personal experiences do not dictate the entire player base.

Also: Please point me to the part where people asked for something for free.

Vildebill

FangOfTheTwoMoons wrote: »

Vildebill wrote: »

FangOfTheTwoMoons wrote: »

Vildebill wrote: »

This upgoing trend of people asking for stuff for free is getting pretty silly. It's not like it's hard to do any of the dungeons non-HM, then you have 1/3 chance to get right weight for transmutation, maybe even right trait, or someone in the group might get it and trade it to you (or go with guilidies that know what you're looking for to guarantee a trade).

I'm all for removing grinds and stupid systems, like vMA was before transmutation, but this proposal is pretXty lazy.

For one, I doubt the loot pool for monster helms is 1/3. I'm sure the table has been skewed to favor more runs. Medium Veli comes to mind here. Second, literally no one is asking for anything for free. Did you even read OP's post?

I have a lot of medium Velidreth. Some in divines. But it's ridiculous to even talk about something like that without real data to back it up, your opinion is just an opinion. But good for you that you're so sure about it, that kind of sureness is very contributing to discussions, who need facts?

And yes, I read it. And I don't think it's needed. I don't play extremely much, and still have most helmets in most weights, in good traits. Same with shoulders, and since I haven't needed shoulders for so long, I sit on piles of undaunted keys. Many friends to me do the same. It's not even remotely hard to get undaunted shoulders and helmets.

Reading is essential. Just like the title of this thread you didn't comprehend what I said. I said "I doubt," which doesn't imply I know for 100% fact but we can make educated guesses since we know ZoS skews other drops.

"It's ridiculous to talk about something like that without real data to back it up." Way to contradict yourself. You're the one who said it was 1/3 in the first place. You're the one who made all these statements with your "sureness". If my post didn't contribute anything yours sure as hell didn't.

I too have a lot of gear sitting around and piles of keys. Our personal experiences do not dictate the entire player base.

Also: Please point me to the part where people asked for something for free.

Haha you are an aggressive one There are three weights. If the drop rate of the weights aren't skewed (which, to my knowledge, there are no evidence saying otherwise) it's 1/3 chance to get a specific weigh. I'm pretty sure that you'll agree on that at least since it's basic math. Make you educated guesses all you want, but I certainly don't see any evidence. But then again, keep argue about that if you want, but I'll leave it there if you don't want to accept common facts.

OP wanted weight choice on undaunted pieces to be free. Just like trait choice are free now with the transmute system (yes it costs something, but the choice is free nonetheless). And I don't think it's needed.

zaria

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

I’d love it if we could change the weight of any armor piece. Medium Advancing Yokeda please? Heavy Alkosh? The ability to run 5 False Gods + 5 Mother’s Sorrow + Asylum Staff without being in 7 light. Many possibilities could come from this extension of the transmutation system.

Medium Advancing Yokeda would be way more useful than changing weight on monster sets.

Burgererer

Sorry, I should've specified that I meant shoulders. Thought the chests/keys mention helped, but I just said sets. I personally love the mask system.

tyggerbob

My only comment on this is that this solution would be HEAVILY skewed towards PVP players from which the vast majority of your transmutation crystals come from. If there were a more balanced way to get the crystals, I would more readily support a suggestion like this.
Not being anti-PVP, it's just not everyone's cup of tea and I think it should be fair to both playstyles.

UntrustedExistenz

In eyes of my imagination I see posts from 2020,where ppl asks for vendor with items from dungeons.
And post where ppl asks for transmute crystals from world bosses, and post where ppl asks for non pvp - pvp campaign. Hmm.. wait a sec.. Some of it is already here!
Please, don't break a game with your ridiculous requests.