Curious of this...

Eporem

moreso how Boethra and Mafala might be connected to the Khajiit

ArchMikem

I believe they're Azurah's Sisters in the legends. Dunno why that would associate them with the Khajiit though.

RaddlemanNumber7

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

Korah_Eaglecry

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

It makes sense that the Good Daedra would have their fingers in the creation of more than one civilization. And the exodus from Summerset would definitely have taken the path leading through or near present day Khajiit territory.

I think there was text somewhere speaking of the Chimer travelling through deserts at some point in their travels. I always thought they were speaking of Elsweyr.

Ihsan997

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

This honestly makes me wonder about the true influence (or limits of influence) of the Imperial and Aldmeri pantheons. I’ve read on forums and wikis that the Divines represent normative religious practice on Tamriel, and some NPCs present that as the case. But if we look at worship by demographics:

- orcs, goblins, and (ostensibly) ogres worship Malacath
- dark elves (for most of their history) worship Azura, Boethiah, and Mephala
- wood elf and Khajiit pantheons include daedra
- Reachmen are daedra-worshipping Bretons

So perhaps the pantheons of the Altmer, Imperials, Nords, Redguards, and most Bretons align with the Divines, but a significant portion of Tamriel’s population seems to be “daedra worshippers.” Then one must wonder, is it really heresy?

Argonians are just a whole other thing from the entire rest of Nirn.

HappyLittleTree

Ihsan997 wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

This honestly makes me wonder about the true influence (or limits of influence) of the Imperial and Aldmeri pantheons. I’ve read on forums and wikis that the Divines represent normative religious practice on Tamriel, and some NPCs present that as the case. But if we look at worship by demographics:

- orcs, goblins, and (ostensibly) ogres worship Malacath
- dark elves (for most of their history) worship Azura, Boethiah, and Mephala
- wood elf and Khajiit pantheons include daedra
- Reachmen are daedra-worshipping Bretons

So perhaps the pantheons of the Altmer, Imperials, Nords, Redguards, and most Bretons align with the Divines, but a significant portion of Tamriel’s population seems to be “daedra worshippers.” Then one must wonder, is it really heresy?

Argonians are just a whole other thing from the entire rest of Nirn.

Sithis

LennoxPoodle

HappyLittleTree wrote: »

Ihsan997 wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

This honestly makes me wonder about the true influence (or limits of influence) of the Imperial and Aldmeri pantheons. I’ve read on forums and wikis that the Divines represent normative religious practice on Tamriel, and some NPCs present that as the case. But if we look at worship by demographics:

- orcs, goblins, and (ostensibly) ogres worship Malacath
- dark elves (for most of their history) worship Azura, Boethiah, and Mephala
- wood elf and Khajiit pantheons include daedra
- Reachmen are daedra-worshipping Bretons

So perhaps the pantheons of the Altmer, Imperials, Nords, Redguards, and most Bretons align with the Divines, but a significant portion of Tamriel’s population seems to be “daedra worshippers.” Then one must wonder, is it really heresy?

Argonians are just a whole other thing from the entire rest of Nirn.

Sithis

Sithis/Padomay/Akel/Fadomay too, but that is just natural I guess. He is one half of the entire cosmos (the rest being Anu/Satak/Ahnurr). But don't they mainly worship the Hist, which exist in both Mundus and (parts of) oblivion?

Eporem

This plaque might connect Azurah to the Khajiit by way of what Khunzar-ri might have spoken of

ArchMikem

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

It makes sense that the Good Daedra would have their fingers in the creation of more than one civilization. And the exodus from Summerset would definitely have taken the path leading through or near present day Khajiit territory.

I think there was text somewhere speaking of the Chimer travelling through deserts at some point in their travels. I always thought they were speaking of Elsweyr.

Nope, the Khajiit were already present on Tamriel when the first Adlmeri explored East. There was that Lorebook about that Elven explorer Topal the Pilot who when discovering the Mainland during the Merethic Era and sailing up toward present day Imperial City, recorded seeing animal-like creatures watching from the banks of the Niben. These were presumably ancient Khajiit.

OtarTheMad

Found on Khajiit's lore page on UESP

Other theories speak of them being descendants of Aldmeri settlers, proved by the visual similarity of Ohmes and Ohmes-raht to Men and Mer, especially Bosmer. The Khajiiti creation myth suggests the Bosmer and Khajiit to have common ancestors; Azurah having taken the forest people that were torn between the shape of beast and man and given them the many shapes of the Khajiit. But with Y'ffre telling Nirni of Azurah's doings and shaping the remaining forest people into the Bosmer, this link was cut.

Cundu_Ertur

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Words_of_Clan_Mother_Ahnissi

Eporem

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Found on Khajiit's lore page on UESP

Other theories speak of them being descendants of Aldmeri settlers, proved by the visual similarity of Ohmes and Ohmes-raht to Men and Mer, especially Bosmer. The Khajiiti creation myth suggests the Bosmer and Khajiit to have common ancestors; Azurah having taken the forest people that were torn between the shape of beast and man and given them the many shapes of the Khajiit. But with Y'ffre telling Nirni of Azurah's doings and shaping the remaining forest people into the Bosmer, this link was cut.

From your quote:

Other theories speak of them being descendants of Aldmeri settlers, proved by the visual similarity of Ohmes and Ohmes-raht to Men and Mer, especially Bosmer. The Khajiiti creation myth suggests the Bosmer and Khajiit to have common ancestors; Azurah having taken the forest people that were torn between the shape of beast and man and given them the many shapes of the Khajiit. But with Y'ffre telling Nirni of Azurah's doings and shaping the remaining forest people into the Bosmer, this link was cut.

and from this, from here: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Wild_Hunt

The Wild Hunt is a magical trait innate to all Bosmer. It is brought on by a collective ritual performed by many Bosmer, causing them to shapeshift into a horde of feral, supernatural beasts. These monsters stampede, changing their form constantly, slaying and devouring all in their path and eventually, when left with no surviving targets, turn upon themselves in a "cannibalistic ***".[2] This transformation is seen by the Bosmer as a return to the chaos of the Dawn Era, when they were unable to hold onto one shape for more than a moment. After they made the Green Pact with Y'ffre, he taught the Bosmer how to escape that chaos and retain their form, but also how to return to it by instigating the Wild Hunt.[3] These shapeshifters are said to be able to take on a gaseous form which makes them impossible to contain without the aid of magic.[4] There's even some suggestion they can take on the form of water.[1]


Would this suggest then that the Khajiit in the Dawn Era, were once spirits that Azurah convinced to change while they were still shapeshifting and Y'ffre hearing of this, showed the remaining et'Ada in that area what else they could become.

Eporem

Cundu_Ertur wrote: »

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Words_of_Clan_Mother_Ahnissi

Korah_Eaglecry

ArchMikem wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

It makes sense that the Good Daedra would have their fingers in the creation of more than one civilization. And the exodus from Summerset would definitely have taken the path leading through or near present day Khajiit territory.

I think there was text somewhere speaking of the Chimer travelling through deserts at some point in their travels. I always thought they were speaking of Elsweyr.

Nope, the Khajiit were already present on Tamriel when the first Adlmeri explored East. There was that Lorebook about that Elven explorer Topal the Pilot who when discovering the Mainland during the Merethic Era and sailing up toward present day Imperial City, recorded seeing animal-like creatures watching from the banks of the Niben. These were presumably ancient Khajiit.

Topal is very outdated lore. Im not sure why people keep pointing back to this bit of lore when just about everything else that Topals adventures mentioned has since been abandoned. Topal also discovered bird like people that have never been mentioned in the lore since and the Orcs are described as if they existed prior to the whole thing with Boethiah and Trinimac.

SirAxen

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

It makes sense that the Good Daedra would have their fingers in the creation of more than one civilization. And the exodus from Summerset would definitely have taken the path leading through or near present day Khajiit territory.

I think there was text somewhere speaking of the Chimer travelling through deserts at some point in their travels. I always thought they were speaking of Elsweyr.

Nope, the Khajiit were already present on Tamriel when the first Adlmeri explored East. There was that Lorebook about that Elven explorer Topal the Pilot who when discovering the Mainland during the Merethic Era and sailing up toward present day Imperial City, recorded seeing animal-like creatures watching from the banks of the Niben. These were presumably ancient Khajiit.

Topal is very outdated lore. Im not sure why people keep pointing back to this bit of lore when just about everything else that Topals adventures mentioned has since been abandoned. Topal also discovered bird like people that have never been mentioned in the lore since and the Orcs are described as if they existed prior to the whole thing with Boethiah and Trinimac.

Topal is essentially retconned, no?

Bruccius

SirAxen wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

It makes sense that the Good Daedra would have their fingers in the creation of more than one civilization. And the exodus from Summerset would definitely have taken the path leading through or near present day Khajiit territory.

I think there was text somewhere speaking of the Chimer travelling through deserts at some point in their travels. I always thought they were speaking of Elsweyr.

Nope, the Khajiit were already present on Tamriel when the first Adlmeri explored East. There was that Lorebook about that Elven explorer Topal the Pilot who when discovering the Mainland during the Merethic Era and sailing up toward present day Imperial City, recorded seeing animal-like creatures watching from the banks of the Niben. These were presumably ancient Khajiit.

Topal is very outdated lore. Im not sure why people keep pointing back to this bit of lore when just about everything else that Topals adventures mentioned has since been abandoned. Topal also discovered bird like people that have never been mentioned in the lore since and the Orcs are described as if they existed prior to the whole thing with Boethiah and Trinimac.

Topal is essentially retconned, no?

Not in the slightest.

SirAxen

Bruccius wrote: »

SirAxen wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

At last, a clue to an embarrassing origin story!

IIRC this is a really, really old ghost from Ashen Scar. I'm taking this as confirmation that deep down the cat-mer are just another bunch of heretical, daedra-worshipping elves like the Chimer.

It makes sense that the Good Daedra would have their fingers in the creation of more than one civilization. And the exodus from Summerset would definitely have taken the path leading through or near present day Khajiit territory.

I think there was text somewhere speaking of the Chimer travelling through deserts at some point in their travels. I always thought they were speaking of Elsweyr.

Nope, the Khajiit were already present on Tamriel when the first Adlmeri explored East. There was that Lorebook about that Elven explorer Topal the Pilot who when discovering the Mainland during the Merethic Era and sailing up toward present day Imperial City, recorded seeing animal-like creatures watching from the banks of the Niben. These were presumably ancient Khajiit.

Topal is very outdated lore. Im not sure why people keep pointing back to this bit of lore when just about everything else that Topals adventures mentioned has since been abandoned. Topal also discovered bird like people that have never been mentioned in the lore since and the Orcs are described as if they existed prior to the whole thing with Boethiah and Trinimac.

Topal is essentially retconned, no?

Not in the slightest.

No? Cool. I was asking because I've heard that it was a few times but I've never seen anything definitive on it. It seems a lot has changed.

Eporem

Since Nirn was fairly new when Topal the Pilot took his journey I like to imagine him as seeing the original forms the spirits, the et'ada, were taking at that time in order to survive their surroundings. The et'Ada that choose Bird-men I like to think did survive and are in a different form.