Dungeon finder queue cap vs tanks and healers

tommalmm

So ok, it's not a big deal, since you can just spam the queue button until you succeed... or get booted from the server for spamming. But...

I've noticed one thing about the dungeon finder queue cap. The general idea is that too many DDs queue and not enough tanks and healers. The cap has been introduced to "fix" complete queue freeze when too many people queue at once.

So far so good.

Prime time, I want to queue my tank... "You can't queue at this moment". Not letting both support roles in makes the queue stall for much longer than necessary. Ideally the system would let the most needed roles in, despite of actual queue length (because that actually pops at least three other people from the queue, unloading it much faster), but even the simple solution (just let tanks and healers in) would probably help.

Just saying .

daemonios

You are assuming a number of things, which is normal because ZOS have never explained how the group finder works, what the bottlenecks are, or what it intends to do about them. Queuing as tank I often get the "someone declined" shenanigans for 10-20 minutes, so apparently getting queued as the most necessary role is not enough.

tommalmm

daemonios wrote: »

You are assuming a number of things, which is normal because ZOS have never explained how the group finder works, what the bottlenecks are, or what it intends to do about them. Queuing as tank I often get the "someone declined" shenanigans for 10-20 minutes, so apparently getting queued as the most necessary role is not enough.

That's a whole different issue. But you're right, obviously. I'm assuming a lot of things. Then again, I'm quite convinced my assumptions are not *completely* wrong. ; )

Jeremy

tommalmm wrote: »

So ok, it's not a big deal, since you can just spam the queue button until you succeed... or get booted from the server for spamming. But...

I've noticed one thing about the dungeon finder queue cap. The general idea is that too many DDs queue and not enough tanks and healers. The cap has been introduced to "fix" complete queue freeze when too many people queue at once.

So far so good.

Prime time, I want to queue my tank... "You can't queue at this moment". Not letting both support roles in makes the queue stall for much longer than necessary. Ideally the system would let the most needed roles in, despite of actual queue length (because that actually pops at least three other people from the queue, unloading it much faster), but even the simple solution (just let tanks and healers in) would probably help.

Just saying .

Tanks and healers are not support roles. They are tanks and healers - both of which serve primary functions in combat which are oddly enough to heal allies and to tank enemies. They are explained in detail on the activity finder page under the specific roles themselves if you need to take a look.

That being said: I'm having a difficult time understanding your post or your proposed solution. Even when I queue up as a tank I often have to spam the queue - and this happens in battlegrounds as well. So I doubt the specific roles have anything to do with it. It's more likely it's just a backlog in the queue system that causes this. That and DPS falling asleep or finding something else to do during long queue times. Basically the system can't handle the amount of people who are using it.

Synnastix

Lfg in zone is pretty fast if you’re tank / heals.

Ardan147

Here's an idea - make it less of a colossal pain in the you-know-what to level up a tank and maybe there will be more tanks available.

And while they're at it, maybe add a second dungeon finder that doesn't care about roles, for those times one might want to just find three other people to do a dungeon, that can generally be finished without a tank anyway (having to wait 40 minutes to get a group for vet Crypt of Hearts I when it can easily be completed with 4 dps is beyond moronic).

Taleof2Cities

Ardan147 wrote: »

Here's an idea - make it less of a colossal pain in the you-know-what to level up a tank and maybe there will be more tanks available.

Pro Tip: A lot of players level up to CP160 as a DPS ... and then change their skills/role at the gear cap. There's no rule that requires a player to play the character's designated role while leveling.

Veles

Good idea, but there is a little big problem - fake healers and tanks.

SaucyMcSauceface

Jeremy wrote: »

tommalmm wrote: »

So ok, it's not a big deal, since you can just spam the queue button until you succeed... or get booted from the server for spamming. But...

I've noticed one thing about the dungeon finder queue cap. The general idea is that too many DDs queue and not enough tanks and healers. The cap has been introduced to "fix" complete queue freeze when too many people queue at once.

So far so good.

Prime time, I want to queue my tank... "You can't queue at this moment". Not letting both support roles in makes the queue stall for much longer than necessary. Ideally the system would let the most needed roles in, despite of actual queue length (because that actually pops at least three other people from the queue, unloading it much faster), but even the simple solution (just let tanks and healers in) would probably help.

Just saying .

Tanks and healers are not support roles. They are tanks and healers - both of which serve primary functions in combat which are oddly enough to heal allies and to tank enemies. They are explained in detail on the activity finder page under the specific roles themselves if you need to take a look.

That being said: I'm having a difficult time understanding your post or your proposed solution. Even when I queue up as a tank I often have to spam the queue - and this happens in battlegrounds as well. So I doubt the specific roles have anything to do with it. It's more likely it's just a backlog in the queue system that causes this. That and DPS falling asleep or finding something else to do during long queue times. Basically the system can't handle the amount of people who are using it.

The OP's proposed solution addressed the exact issue that you note here. They are proposing that the fact that the specific roles are not taken into account in terms of who is allowed into the queue could well be the problem. It is entirely possible that if the queue is filled with all DPS when it maxes out, then the cap would prevent any tanks or healers from getting into the queue, and that that would create the backlog that you are suggesting is a cause because none of the dps in the queue would have access to the other necessary roles for the system to form a group. The OP does not know that this is not already happening, but is suggesting that perhaps the cap should not consider Tanks and Healers as being subject to the cap as letting them into the queue is likely to reduce the number of people in the queue because then a group would actually be able to form.

tommalmm

SaucyMcSauceface wrote: »

The OP's proposed solution addressed the exact issue that you note here. They are proposing that the fact that the specific roles are not taken into account in terms of who is allowed into the queue could well be the problem. It is entirely possible that if the queue is filled with all DPS when it maxes out, then the cap would prevent any tanks or healers from getting into the queue, and that that would create the backlog that you are suggesting is a cause because none of the dps in the queue would have access to the other necessary roles for the system to form a group. The OP does not know that this is not already happening, but is suggesting that perhaps the cap should not consider Tanks and Healers as being subject to the cap as letting them into the queue is likely to reduce the number of people in the queue because then a group would actually be able to form.

Thank you. It was late in the night so I might have not been super clear at expressing the idea.

Itzmichi

tommalmm wrote: »

So ok, it's not a big deal, since you can just spam the queue button until you succeed... or get booted from the server for spamming. But...

I've noticed one thing about the dungeon finder queue cap. The general idea is that too many DDs queue and not enough tanks and healers. The cap has been introduced to "fix" complete queue freeze when too many people queue at once.

So far so good.

Prime time, I want to queue my tank... "You can't queue at this moment". Not letting both support roles in makes the queue stall for much longer than necessary. Ideally the system would let the most needed roles in, despite of actual queue length (because that actually pops at least three other people from the queue, unloading it much faster), but even the simple solution (just let tanks and healers in) would probably help.

Just saying .

Well, yeah you get the message of "You can't queue at this moment" spam it like 3-4 times and you are able to queue up on a tank without no problems and the good thing is that you actually get into a dungeon, which is still not the optimal solution, but better then not being able to queue up at all,right?

tommalmm

Itzmichi wrote: »

tommalmm wrote: »

So ok, it's not a big deal, since you can just spam the queue button until you succeed... or get booted from the server for spamming. But...

I've noticed one thing about the dungeon finder queue cap. The general idea is that too many DDs queue and not enough tanks and healers. The cap has been introduced to "fix" complete queue freeze when too many people queue at once.

So far so good.

Prime time, I want to queue my tank... "You can't queue at this moment". Not letting both support roles in makes the queue stall for much longer than necessary. Ideally the system would let the most needed roles in, despite of actual queue length (because that actually pops at least three other people from the queue, unloading it much faster), but even the simple solution (just let tanks and healers in) would probably help.

Just saying .

Well, yeah you get the message of "You can't queue at this moment" spam it like 3-4 times and you are able to queue up on a tank without no problems and the good thing is that you actually get into a dungeon, which is still not the optimal solution, but better then not being able to queue up at all,right?

Yes. But that's not my point. I'm not saying the cap is bad. It was not a rant. The cap serves its purpose.

The thing is that I'll spam and get in, but how many tanks and healers won't? Which in effect makes all the DDs wait longer than necessary.

My point is that group finder doesn't seem to take roles into account when allowing people into queue when it's capped.

Edit: Damn, I must suck at expressing my ideas

FierceSam

You are assuming that the queue cap is more sophisticated than “if more than x players are queuing, cap the queue”. I would be astonished if it was more complicated than that. It is, literally, something they cobbled together hurriedly in an afternoon as a damage limitation exercise.

And that’s fine because I don’t want ZOS to spend a second more on this stopgap measure. I want them to spend ALL their development time on finally fixing the group finder and their wretched servers. Properly.

I’d rather take a few weeks of it working like this, than have them introduce a kludge and think they’ve done enough.