Vampire and Werewolf community

Rampeal

Let me start off and say that I am not trying to offend anyone or implying that ESO is not a great game. I love this game. That being said let's jump in.

As a player ESO the game is fun and enjoyable, but for myself and many others there is a severe lack of Vampire and Werewolf content. I know what most will say that there is Glenumbra for the werewolves and Rivenspire for the Vampires. The game does really well with the whole "Becoming a WW/Vamp", but it stops there.

Now I know many will say that "Well you Wolfhunter DLC and Vamp/WW content is not important". I disagree. One of the biggest draws to the game for myself and many is that ESO is one of the few if not the only MMOs that offer the werewolf/Vampire experience. I would dare to say 50% of the player base plays as a WW/Vamp and yet it feels like they have been ignore. Black Marsh and Murkmire are full of Vamp/WW lore, yet it feels like generic questline and no representation. Biggest problems I find with Vamp/WW are very different, yet both have issues

Werewolf. This skill line feels like a actual class, yet that is where it ends. The serious lack of representation in the game is the biggest issue. Yes you do see Werewolves in the world and do quest to stop them, yet that is where it stops. Murkmire, Black Marsh, Eastmarch, and even Elsweyr are full of Werebeast and we never see any of them. Where are the Werelions, Werecrocs, Werebears? Where is the quest for these creatures and lore? And even more where are the options to select which Werebeast we can be? Heck at this point I would take a special skin from the Crown store like you did for the warden bear. Anything.

Vampire. Vamps have the opposite side of the coin. This skill line feels so bland. The skills are mediocre to bad and most people only use them for the passive. Not to mention the mind boggling idea that is " the less you feed the more powerful you are". Sure I can see the penalty you get, but with the passives the way they are you can negate them almost all together. Instead of feeding and growing stronger you feed and become weaker. It makes no sense.It has had the least love Skill line wise compared to the werewolf. I want to be a vampire. I want to be able to feed on people during combat rather than a red beam coming out of my hand. The ultimate is mediocre. I mean where is the option to become a vampire lord? Yeah I know the Volkihar in skyrim are the only ones that can do that, but give us something.

Again I love this game, but I would like to see more in the way of Vampire and Werewolf gameplay in ESO.

I have said my peace and do not wish to offend anyone, so please if you respond please do it in a kind and respectful manner.

Thank you for your time and see you in ESO.

Siohwenoeht

I'd like to see some rework of both skill lines, but I'm not sure they could do enough story content to justify a popular dlc.

Unless it's rescuing an certain rivenspire vampire from the clutches of molag bal

I'd love to have a reason to use any skill other than mistform, used to love drain until I figured out that it's just for fun and not really competitive. Although I've begun to flesh out a build for it if the numbers can come out right.

Aliyavana

hmm I agree that vampires could use a rework to be more interesting

Rampeal

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

I'd like to see some rework of both skill lines, but I'm not sure they could do enough story content to justify a popular dlc.

Molag Bal tries to use the Vampire clans to invade and you have to team up with Lamae Bal. DLC something

mann9753b16_ESO

Yeah, Werewolf either shoud actually feel like an ultimate, or they should get rid of the very harsh time limit you get.

As it is now, you will actually lower your overall DPS for a small increase in single target DPS and a bit more survival, and you have to pay 300 ultimate for it and it sets you in a constant state of "muste feed, must fight, must feed!"

The Werewolf is certainly not strong enough for all the limitations it gets.

StormeReigns

These are just my opinion on the less used skills to make them bit more interesting and possibly bit more functional, the passive are fine IMHO.
Old / New

Clouding Swarm
Darken the sky with a cloud of bats, dealing 1011 Magic Damage to nearby enemies every 1 second for 5 seconds.
While the bats swarm around you this ability changes into Materialize, allowing you to instantly teleport to an enemy and strike them for 2140 Magic Damage. While the bats swarm around you, you can use this ability again to instantly teleport to an enemy and deal high damage.

- Growing Swarm
Darken the sky with a cloud of bats, dealing XXXX Damage (scales to highest damage) to nearby enemies every 0.5 second for 6 seconds. While the bats swarm around you this ability grows in strength for each enemy struck increasing the size up to 15meters (max). Increase duration by 1 second for each enemy killed in the swarm (up to a max of 4 seconds) and increase damage max damage by 5% for each enemy that dies within the swarm up to a maximum of 75%.

Drain
Invigorating Drain
Consume an enemy's life force, dealing 1265 Magic Damage and restoring 20% of your missing Health every 1 second for 3 seconds. When you activate the drain, the enemy is stunned for 3 seconds. Player recovers 5 Ultimate every 1 second.

- Cursing Drain
Consume an enemy's life force, dealing XXXX Damage (scales to highest) and restoring 20% of your missing Health every 1 second for 3 seconds. When you activate the drain, the enemy is stunned for 2.5 seconds. After the Drain is finished, leave behind a cursing bite that drains additional 5% every 1 second for 3 seconds. Player recovers 15 Ultimate every 0.5 second.

Accelerating Drain
Consume an enemy's life force, dealing 1265 Magic Damage and restoring 20% of your missing Health every 1 second for 3 seconds. When you activate the drain, the enemy is stunned for 3 seconds. Grants Minor Expedition, increasing movement speed by 10% for 17-20 seconds.

- Hungering Drain
Consume all enemies' life force with in a 6meter radius, dealing XXXX Damage (scales to highest) and restoring 10% of your missing Health every 0.5 second for 4 seconds for each enemy drained. When you activate the drain, the enemy is snared 3 seconds. Grants Minor Expedition, increasing movement speed by 10% for 4 seconds.

Mist
Baleful Mist
Dissolve into a dark mist, reducing your damage taken by 75% and dealing 473 Magic Damage to nearby enemies every 1 second for 4 seconds. Entering this form removes and grants immunity to all disabling and immobilization effects, but you cannot be healed and your Magicka Recovery is disabled. Also deals damage to nearby enemies.

- Lingering Mist
Dissolve into a dark mist, reducing your damage taken by 75%; increasing your Movement Speed by 15% for 2 seconds. Leaving behind a dark cloud that deals XXXX Damage (scales to highest) to nearby enemies every 1 second for 4 seconds in a 4 meter radius - upon second activation you teleport back to your original location expelling the dark mist and dealing an additional 10% max damage in a 8meter radius. Entering this form removes and grants immunity to all disabling and immobilization effects, but you cannot be healed and your Magicka Recovery is disabled.

Just a thought on vampire, nothing really on WW, due to I use the skill line for the 15% stamina recover while leveling alts till I get the ults I want.
Outside of maybe adding Van/Dawnguard as skill line to balance between Vamp and WW.

Rampeal

mann9753b16_ESO wrote: »

Yeah, Werewolf either shoud actually feel like an ultimate, or they should get rid of the very harsh time limit you get.

As it is now, you will actually lower your overall DPS for a small increase in single target DPS and a bit more survival, and you have to pay 300 ultimate for it and it sets you in a constant state of "muste feed, must fight, must feed!"

The Werewolf is certainly not strong enough for all the limitations it gets.

Exactly. And vampire the same way. You don't feel like a vampire. I would love to sneak and feed in PvP and PvE, I mean it does damage and stuns, yet I can't because feeding makes my abilities cost more and I lose the resist buff. So I become weaker the more I feed lol.

Jeremy

Rampeal wrote: »

Let me start off and say that I am not trying to offend anyone or implying that ESO is not a great game. I love this game. That being said let's jump in.

As a player ESO the game is fun and enjoyable, but for myself and many others there is a severe lack of Vampire and Werewolf content. I know what most will say that there is Glenumbra for the werewolves and Rivenspire for the Vampires. The game does really well with the whole "Becoming a WW/Vamp", but it stops there.

Now I know many will say that "Well you Wolfhunter DLC and Vamp/WW content is not important". I disagree. One of the biggest draws to the game for myself and many is that ESO is one of the few if not the only MMOs that offer the werewolf/Vampire experience. I would dare to say 50% of the player base plays as a WW/Vamp and yet it feels like they have been ignore. Black Marsh and Murkmire are full of Vamp/WW lore, yet it feels like generic questline and no representation. Biggest problems I find with Vamp/WW are very different, yet both have issues

Werewolf. This skill line feels like a actual class, yet that is where it ends. The serious lack of representation in the game is the biggest issue. Yes you do see Werewolves in the world and do quest to stop them, yet that is where it stops. Murkmire, Black Marsh, Eastmarch, and even Elsweyr are full of Werebeast and we never see any of them. Where are the Werelions, Werecrocs, Werebears? Where is the quest for these creatures and lore? And even more where are the options to select which Werebeast we can be? Heck at this point I would take a special skin from the Crown store like you did for the warden bear. Anything.

Vampire. Vamps have the opposite side of the coin. This skill line feels so bland. The skills are mediocre to bad and most people only use them for the passive. Not to mention the mind boggling idea that is " the less you feed the more powerful you are". Sure I can see the penalty you get, but with the passives the way they are you can negate them almost all together. Instead of feeding and growing stronger you feed and become weaker. It makes no sense.It has had the least love Skill line wise compared to the werewolf. I want to be a vampire. I want to be able to feed on people during combat rather than a red beam coming out of my hand. The ultimate is mediocre. I mean where is the option to become a vampire lord? Yeah I know the Volkihar in skyrim are the only ones that can do that, but give us something.

Again I love this game, but I would like to see more in the way of Vampire and Werewolf gameplay in ESO.

I have said my peace and do not wish to offend anyone, so please if you respond please do it in a kind and respectful manner.

Thank you for your time and see you in ESO.

The problem is if they improve vampires the forums will turn into a riot because players don't want to feel "forced" to become a Vampire since they don't like the aesthetics.

So instead of improving Vampire I think instead they need to offer more world skill lines players can choose from to supplement their classes. That way there is more choices besides just werewolf and vampire - which doesn't seem to appeal to a lot of players. Add something else that is attractive looking that gives 10% regen as a passive.

Then maybe we could get some improvements to Vampire without everyone else having a cow over it.

barney2525

It sounds like you are trying to make vampires and werewolves into actual classes. That's not what they are.
The character race and class are the core of the character. Werewolf and vampire are additional benefits/drawbacks, further enhancing the race/class.

They are additional skill lines. Just like Psijiic skill lines. Just like Guild skill lines. Just like Undaunted skill lines.

Granted, some skill lines are easier to get access to than others.

But many people go for the vampire or werewolf skill lines for many different reasons. I have One vampire character. And I will be honest. I had refused to make a vampire because they look Ugli. I can't stand trying to play a game, staring at a screen where the image repulses me. But I needed One character to become a master vampire - so I could get decent White Dye.

Now I just keep the character parked at a temple in case someone wants a bite

I think you are making way more of the issue than needs to be. If the game was focused on creating vampire and werewolf characters, I can see the point. My impression from players has been they usually want the bite so they can have the skill line. Not because they really are interested in Rping vampire life.

Also, from the few requests I have seen in chat of characters asking for the bite, your 50% number is Waaaaay too high.

IMHO

Noxavian

barney2525 wrote: »

It sounds like you are trying to make vampires and werewolves into actual classes. That's not what they are.
The character race and class are the core of the character. Werewolf and vampire are additional benefits/drawbacks, further enhancing the race/class.

They are additional skill lines. Just like Psijiic skill lines. Just like Guild skill lines. Just like Undaunted skill lines.

Granted, some skill lines are easier to get access to than others.

But many people go for the vampire or werewolf skill lines for many different reasons. I have One vampire character. And I will be honest. I had refused to make a vampire because they look Ugli. I can't stand trying to play a game, staring at a screen where the image repulses me. But I needed One character to become a master vampire - so I could get decent White Dye.

Now I just keep the character parked at a temple in case someone wants a bite

I think you are making way more of the issue than needs to be. If the game was focused on creating vampire and werewolf characters, I can see the point. My impression from players has been they usually want the bite so they can have the skill line. Not because they really are interested in Rping vampire life.

Also, from the few requests I have seen in chat of characters asking for the bite, your 50% number is Waaaaay too high.

IMHO

Every skill line you mentioned has more skills/diversity/viability than the vampire's skills. I also feel like you're really missing the point of this post, this post is talking about the addition of werewolf/vampire content, not just in skill line improvements but through lore and quests etc. To say that werewolves/vampires don't need such is, I'm sorry, blatantly wrong.

Also no, the majority of people literally take vampire just for the passives. You make it seem like there are a lot of different reasons why people would go such, when in reality it's either for "rp reasons" or to get the passives. Nobody wants to go vampire for the abilities because all of the abilities are preeeeetty bad unless you're running a very specific pvp build. They're all bad for pve though, so. Which, imo, is bad design by default. All magicka based characters should not be defaulting to vampire practically. The solution here is to nerf vampire passives and give them ACTUAL viable skills + new passives for said skills. A lot of their passives could honestly be grouped together, a good 2-3 of them anyways.

Also for your argument of them being additional skill lines, why does vampire get the short end of the stick when werewolf/the other lines feel like actual viable lines with abilities that can be used? Why is vampire the second shortest skill line in the entire game? Only beaten by soul magic. Why does werewolf feel more like a "subclass" than vampire?

My final question is, why try to defend the current state of things? You literally lose nothing by getting vampire/werewolf content and hey, maybe some skill line improvements. Sure, you could try to brush it off as "Wow this guy is just wanting to make these things classes" or "vampire/werewolves are dumb", but when a goooood amount of posts are asking for something, there's a good chance there is a bit of truth behind it. Vampire improvements is easily in the top 5 most requested things with this game, I feel like a lot of people forget that. The posts regarding such are consistent and it has a lot of backing. So what do you have to lose, exactly? Say they do add in 3 more skills and re-vamp the vampire line, or say they do add in someway to become a vampire lord. What do *you* lose, exactly?

Noxavian

Rampeal wrote: »

Let me start off and say that I am not trying to offend anyone or implying that ESO is not a great game. I love this game. That being said let's jump in.

As a player ESO the game is fun and enjoyable, but for myself and many others there is a severe lack of Vampire and Werewolf content. I know what most will say that there is Glenumbra for the werewolves and Rivenspire for the Vampires. The game does really well with the whole "Becoming a WW/Vamp", but it stops there.

Now I know many will say that "Well you Wolfhunter DLC and Vamp/WW content is not important". I disagree. One of the biggest draws to the game for myself and many is that ESO is one of the few if not the only MMOs that offer the werewolf/Vampire experience. I would dare to say 50% of the player base plays as a WW/Vamp and yet it feels like they have been ignore. Black Marsh and Murkmire are full of Vamp/WW lore, yet it feels like generic questline and no representation. Biggest problems I find with Vamp/WW are very different, yet both have issues

Werewolf. This skill line feels like a actual class, yet that is where it ends. The serious lack of representation in the game is the biggest issue. Yes you do see Werewolves in the world and do quest to stop them, yet that is where it stops. Murkmire, Black Marsh, Eastmarch, and even Elsweyr are full of Werebeast and we never see any of them. Where are the Werelions, Werecrocs, Werebears? Where is the quest for these creatures and lore? And even more where are the options to select which Werebeast we can be? Heck at this point I would take a special skin from the Crown store like you did for the warden bear. Anything.

Vampire. Vamps have the opposite side of the coin. This skill line feels so bland. The skills are mediocre to bad and most people only use them for the passive. Not to mention the mind boggling idea that is " the less you feed the more powerful you are". Sure I can see the penalty you get, but with the passives the way they are you can negate them almost all together. Instead of feeding and growing stronger you feed and become weaker. It makes no sense.It has had the least love Skill line wise compared to the werewolf. I want to be a vampire. I want to be able to feed on people during combat rather than a red beam coming out of my hand. The ultimate is mediocre. I mean where is the option to become a vampire lord? Yeah I know the Volkihar in skyrim are the only ones that can do that, but give us something.

Again I love this game, but I would like to see more in the way of Vampire and Werewolf gameplay in ESO.

I have said my peace and do not wish to offend anyone, so please if you respond please do it in a kind and respectful manner.

Thank you for your time and see you in ESO.

Thank you for making this post man, as someone who has played this game for a very long time I've been on break for little over a year now due to how ignored vampire/werewolves have been. I started playing back in 2016 because I thought "Wow man, this game has a lot of potential for vampire/werewolf DLC, content, skill line updates etc. Can't wait!" Fastforward three years and they've hardly been touched. It's almost a disgrace that we do not have proper vampire/werewolf story lines, hub areas, etc. Before anyone tries to say "oh but i dont want this to be Twilight Online", in literally every ES game ever there has always been vampire/werewolf side-stories that sometimes have huge plots. So no, it's nothing new just being added for the "twilight fanboys" or something.


This is, quite literally, the ONLY mmo that has a proper vampire/werewolf mechanic with the lore to back it up. I agree fully with everything you've stated, ESPECIALLY the fact that the vampire skill line is so bland. (Which it is, there is absolutely no denying it.)

Also, where the heck is the hunter skill line, exactly? Why is there no third option for players that want to be neither? The game has been out for 5 years. Also worth noting they literally have a pile of free money right in front of them. It's so easy. Make a chapter based around vampires/werewolves/x hunter group. Rework vampire, polish up werewolf a bit, add in a whole new world-skill line, all on top of new stories based upon which group you're in along with a whole bunch of new stuff. Literally it's a gold mine I have no idea why nothing has been done with it yet.

Runkorko

Rampeal wrote: »

Let me start off and say that I am not trying to offend anyone or implying that ESO is not a great game. I love this game. That being said let's jump in.

As a player ESO the game is fun and enjoyable, but for myself and many others there is a severe lack of Vampire and Werewolf content. I know what most will say that there is Glenumbra for the werewolves and Rivenspire for the Vampires. The game does really well with the whole "Becoming a WW/Vamp", but it stops there.

Now I know many will say that "Well you Wolfhunter DLC and Vamp/WW content is not important". I disagree. One of the biggest draws to the game for myself and many is that ESO is one of the few if not the only MMOs that offer the werewolf/Vampire experience. I would dare to say 50% of the player base plays as a WW/Vamp and yet it feels like they have been ignore. Black Marsh and Murkmire are full of Vamp/WW lore, yet it feels like generic questline and no representation. Biggest problems I find with Vamp/WW are very different, yet both have issues

Werewolf. This skill line feels like a actual class, yet that is where it ends. The serious lack of representation in the game is the biggest issue. Yes you do see Werewolves in the world and do quest to stop them, yet that is where it stops. Murkmire, Black Marsh, Eastmarch, and even Elsweyr are full of Werebeast and we never see any of them. Where are the Werelions, Werecrocs, Werebears? Where is the quest for these creatures and lore? And even more where are the options to select which Werebeast we can be? Heck at this point I would take a special skin from the Crown store like you did for the warden bear. Anything.

Vampire. Vamps have the opposite side of the coin. This skill line feels so bland. The skills are mediocre to bad and most people only use them for the passive. Not to mention the mind boggling idea that is " the less you feed the more powerful you are". Sure I can see the penalty you get, but with the passives the way they are you can negate them almost all together. Instead of feeding and growing stronger you feed and become weaker. It makes no sense.It has had the least love Skill line wise compared to the werewolf. I want to be a vampire. I want to be able to feed on people during combat rather than a red beam coming out of my hand. The ultimate is mediocre. I mean where is the option to become a vampire lord? Yeah I know the Volkihar in skyrim are the only ones that can do that, but give us something.

Again I love this game, but I would like to see more in the way of Vampire and Werewolf gameplay in ESO.

I have said my peace and do not wish to offend anyone, so please if you respond please do it in a kind and respectful manner.

Thank you for your time and see you in ESO.

Nothing to say about WWs. Dont even care.

About vamps. I think you need to google "vampire"
The hunger shapren their skills but make vampires more reckless and feral. More close to the beast.
Feeding make them more balanced.
Vamp line bland ? Heh. Its MORE than usefull in pvp, and even in pve have his uses. Ult regen is fine, and mist form can save you many times is used at the right time. Same as ultimate.

About that both lines need more game content and lore i do agree.
And there are 3 zones for vamps/wws not 2.
I`l love if they reskin vamp stages. Not very impresed of how they look at stage 4.
WW should give stam regen in human form too, but take bonus poison dmg.

Noxavian

runkorkoeb17_ESO wrote: »

Rampeal wrote: »

Let me start off and say that I am not trying to offend anyone or implying that ESO is not a great game. I love this game. That being said let's jump in.

As a player ESO the game is fun and enjoyable, but for myself and many others there is a severe lack of Vampire and Werewolf content. I know what most will say that there is Glenumbra for the werewolves and Rivenspire for the Vampires. The game does really well with the whole "Becoming a WW/Vamp", but it stops there.

Now I know many will say that "Well you Wolfhunter DLC and Vamp/WW content is not important". I disagree. One of the biggest draws to the game for myself and many is that ESO is one of the few if not the only MMOs that offer the werewolf/Vampire experience. I would dare to say 50% of the player base plays as a WW/Vamp and yet it feels like they have been ignore. Black Marsh and Murkmire are full of Vamp/WW lore, yet it feels like generic questline and no representation. Biggest problems I find with Vamp/WW are very different, yet both have issues

Werewolf. This skill line feels like a actual class, yet that is where it ends. The serious lack of representation in the game is the biggest issue. Yes you do see Werewolves in the world and do quest to stop them, yet that is where it stops. Murkmire, Black Marsh, Eastmarch, and even Elsweyr are full of Werebeast and we never see any of them. Where are the Werelions, Werecrocs, Werebears? Where is the quest for these creatures and lore? And even more where are the options to select which Werebeast we can be? Heck at this point I would take a special skin from the Crown store like you did for the warden bear. Anything.

Vampire. Vamps have the opposite side of the coin. This skill line feels so bland. The skills are mediocre to bad and most people only use them for the passive. Not to mention the mind boggling idea that is " the less you feed the more powerful you are". Sure I can see the penalty you get, but with the passives the way they are you can negate them almost all together. Instead of feeding and growing stronger you feed and become weaker. It makes no sense.It has had the least love Skill line wise compared to the werewolf. I want to be a vampire. I want to be able to feed on people during combat rather than a red beam coming out of my hand. The ultimate is mediocre. I mean where is the option to become a vampire lord? Yeah I know the Volkihar in skyrim are the only ones that can do that, but give us something.

Again I love this game, but I would like to see more in the way of Vampire and Werewolf gameplay in ESO.

I have said my peace and do not wish to offend anyone, so please if you respond please do it in a kind and respectful manner.

Thank you for your time and see you in ESO.

Nothing to say about WWs. Dont even care.

About vamps. I think you need to google "vampire"
The hunger shapren their skills but make vampires more reckless and feral. More close to the beast.
Feeding make them more balanced.
Vamp line bland ? Heh. Its MORE than usefull in pvp, and even in pve have his uses. Ult regen is fine, and mist form can save you many times is used at the right time. Same as ultimate.

About that both lines need more game content and lore i do agree.
And there are 3 zones for vamps/wws not 2.
I`l love if they reskin vamp stages. Not very impresed of how they look at stage 4.
WW should give stam regen in human form too, but take bonus poison dmg.

No, the vampire line *is* bland. The only skill that sees use in PVP is mist form and sometimes the bats, I've literally never seen a single vampire skill used in anything above normal dungeons and Im cp 400-something.

The skill line can be improved, why be sated with just 2 skills and 1 ultimate? I don't exactly see what you have to lose by them improving/adjusting the skill line to make it more vampiric. Not a single build works around you actually being a vampire, where as werewolves have entire builds dedicated to them. That's just how it is. To say there are no improvements to be made and things are fine how they are is quite foolish.

Runkorko

Noxavian wrote: »

No, the vampire line *is* bland. The only skill that sees use in PVP is mist form and sometimes the bats, I've literally never seen a single vampire skill used in anything above normal dungeons and Im cp 400-something.

Drain is usefull too/ both pvp and pve.
85% of eso players run the META builds. And vamp is not part of the meta.
Thats why you done see ppl use vamp skills.
And btw, vamp have 3 skills and you say that you see ppl using 2 of them
You do the math ...
Vont share build or reason when and why to use vampire skills, but trust me, they are everything but useless.

Not a single build ? PPL pay race changes to make vamp build works m8.
They even level a new character because the bonuses vamp provide can be huge.
Again - please read/ test more.

essi2

Both skill lines need to be reworked, currently most of the abilities have limited uses or no uses at all. Especially in the Vamp line.

As for the claim that 50% of players are either Vamp or WW, most people use the because they have useful passives and the WW transform can be powerful in BGs.


Most of them care little or not at all about Vamp/WW content beyond the skill lines.

Sheezabeast

I would love a small zone where like the Hircine home, you got unlimited werewolf form duration while you were there, and you could hunt or rp or just hang out with other werewolves. They could have a quest or not, just having the zone would be nice. They could make a vampire equivalent, it could be a large palatial castle with crypts and coffins, and have a human cattle pen in the basement for them to feed, and they would retain stage 4 benefits while looking like stage one.

VDoom1

One thing you mentioned would be absolutely epic. Vampire + Werewolf skins! Like omg. o.o Cool!!!

We did get to see a new kind of Werewolf in the March of Sacrifices dungeon, the last boss. We have also seen a kinda Khajiit Werewolf in Moonhunter Keep. So more variety to the werewolves in skin and such is probably very sought after, and if added would be very much appreciated! In general more customization for werewolves and vampires is something we players want.

As for how they play. I have tried out Vampire once (sorry vamp club, I cured myself) felt odd. It was cool with how your appearance changes depending on your status and the skill line was interesting. But it did not appeal to me and it seemed, sorry, boring.

As for the Werewolf skill line, well that is another story. I agree that it does feel a bit more like it's own class. Sure it might have some balancing issues. In general I really enjoy playing as a werewolf. My main has been a werewolf since yeah 2014.

Content, you said it. There is not much content for either of them. Yes 2 dungeons for werewolves, a kinda vamp zone. Some quests here and there. But considering all that's not there....well a lot is missing. You make an excellent point with Werebears. Where are they? Poof?

Tasear

Oh werewolf and vampire specific skins sounds like easy money...and happy players.

Noxavian

runkorkoeb17_ESO wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

No, the vampire line *is* bland. The only skill that sees use in PVP is mist form and sometimes the bats, I've literally never seen a single vampire skill used in anything above normal dungeons and Im cp 400-something.

Drain is usefull too/ both pvp and pve.
85% of eso players run the META builds. And vamp is not part of the meta.
Thats why you done see ppl use vamp skills.
And btw, vamp have 3 skills and you say that you see ppl using 2 of them
You do the math ...
Vont share build or reason when and why to use vampire skills, but trust me, they are everything but useless.

Not a single build ? PPL pay race changes to make vamp build works m8.
They even level a new character because the bonuses vamp provide can be huge.
Again - please read/ test more.

No, drain is not. I have literally been kicked from dungeon groups before for using drain instead of an actual skill. It isn't. And yes, I see people using 2 of them. Usually mistform and batform, I have LITERALLY never seen another player use the life drain skill in any dungeon I've ever been in. And no, I'm prettttty sure they are useless. People pay race changes to make vampire builds work? That is the first time I've ever heard of anything of the sort. What is there to race change to make work? There isn't enough vampire skills TO make a build around. The "bonuses" vampire can provide are the OP passives (which is why every magicka player takes them).

Again, please read what I am saying and explain your logic. What on earth would YOU as a player be losing if they improved the skill line or reworked it? Is your pride about vampires not needing any work and being totally 100% fine that large to where you can't gracefully accept improvements/updates to such? There is nothing great about present vampire aside from 2 of it's passives, that is just how it is. Why are you trying so hard to defend it when CLEARLY a lot of people think otherwise, so why not just accept change and the improvements that come with? Are you really telling me you're satisfied with 2 mediocre abilities and 1 ultimate and there absolutely NO WAY could be any improvements/reworks to make it more balanced?

craybest

YES! I totally agree with this! give us more vampire/werewolf zones, areas, quests, stories, lore, etc! and also please rework the abilities.
also the skins in the store sounds like a great idea!

crazywolfpusher

New skins?

barney2525

Noxavian wrote: »

barney2525 wrote: »

It sounds like you are trying to make vampires and werewolves into actual classes. That's not what they are.
The character race and class are the core of the character. Werewolf and vampire are additional benefits/drawbacks, further enhancing the race/class.

They are additional skill lines. Just like Psijiic skill lines. Just like Guild skill lines. Just like Undaunted skill lines.

Granted, some skill lines are easier to get access to than others.

But many people go for the vampire or werewolf skill lines for many different reasons. I have One vampire character. And I will be honest. I had refused to make a vampire because they look Ugli. I can't stand trying to play a game, staring at a screen where the image repulses me. But I needed One character to become a master vampire - so I could get decent White Dye.

Now I just keep the character parked at a temple in case someone wants a bite

I think you are making way more of the issue than needs to be. If the game was focused on creating vampire and werewolf characters, I can see the point. My impression from players has been they usually want the bite so they can have the skill line. Not because they really are interested in Rping vampire life.

Also, from the few requests I have seen in chat of characters asking for the bite, your 50% number is Waaaaay too high.

IMHO

Every skill line you mentioned has more skills/diversity/viability than the vampire's skills. I also feel like you're really missing the point of this post, this post is talking about the addition of werewolf/vampire content, not just in skill line improvements but through lore and quests etc. To say that werewolves/vampires don't need such is, I'm sorry, blatantly wrong.

Also no, the majority of people literally take vampire just for the passives. You make it seem like there are a lot of different reasons why people would go such, when in reality it's either for "rp reasons" or to get the passives. Nobody wants to go vampire for the abilities because all of the abilities are preeeeetty bad unless you're running a very specific pvp build. They're all bad for pve though, so. Which, imo, is bad design by default. All magicka based characters should not be defaulting to vampire practically. The solution here is to nerf vampire passives and give them ACTUAL viable skills + new passives for said skills. A lot of their passives could honestly be grouped together, a good 2-3 of them anyways.

Also for your argument of them being additional skill lines, why does vampire get the short end of the stick when werewolf/the other lines feel like actual viable lines with abilities that can be used? Why is vampire the second shortest skill line in the entire game? Only beaten by soul magic. Why does werewolf feel more like a "subclass" than vampire?

My final question is, why try to defend the current state of things? You literally lose nothing by getting vampire/werewolf content and hey, maybe some skill line improvements. Sure, you could try to brush it off as "Wow this guy is just wanting to make these things classes" or "vampire/werewolves are dumb", but when a goooood amount of posts are asking for something, there's a good chance there is a bit of truth behind it. Vampire improvements is easily in the top 5 most requested things with this game, I feel like a lot of people forget that. The posts regarding such are consistent and it has a lot of backing. So what do you have to lose, exactly? Say they do add in 3 more skills and re-vamp the vampire line, or say they do add in someway to become a vampire lord. What do *you* lose, exactly?

Well, to answer the last question first - It's simply my opinion. Last I checked, Forums was the place to put out your opinion. I'm not "defending" the current state of things, or anything else for that matter. Just stating my opinion..

OK, first point - Why would they design content specifically requiring the characters to be vampires or werewolves? If the content is ' For ' werewolves or vampires, it's not for Non-vamps/WW. A standard character would not be a part of the story aspect. Why would Non-vamp/WW get involved with vamp/WW? You seem to be saying that vampire or werewolf is equal to being a Race. They are not equal to Races, from the game perspective.

Second - OK, you want to nitpick. I said Skilline. Skilline includes the passives. I am aware that the passives are more valuable and thats what a lot of players go for. But again, you seem to want vampire and werewolf to be equal with Races by reworking them and giving them more skills. They are not Races. And I would not want them to be 'improved' the way you want. If they were made as beneficial as you want them to be EVERYONE would be either vamp or WW. That is not what this game is supposed to be.

Third - I was not involved in the decision making process, so I don't know why they were set up the way they are. I suspect you do not know the reasons either. My opinion is that since vampire and WW are possible Enhancements to Any character, they wanted to give a balance of positive and negative effects.

Fourth - Content, not a big deal. I just don't see a reason that the company would focus on WW or vampire as a defining aspect of ESO. That's why I don't see much happening there. As for "improvements", again, this is my opinion after playing RP games for 40 years, players only want improvements to make their own personal characters "bigger and badder". Everyone has seen how the character classes and builds shift as soon as a change is announced. Very few people simply play their character with the same build after every change. And since Vamp and WW is an Enhancement that every character can have - Once you "improve" vampire and WW enough, there will not be ANY regular classes in play.

People want vampire and WW to be a Distinct advantage instead of the quasi advantage it currently is. Making an Enhancement so good and powerful that No one can pass it up is inherently Bad for the game.

IMHO

Reistr_the_Unbroken

Vampires need love too ZoS- please give them a polymorph like the werewolves got the werewolf lord poly

OmniDo

I'd just like the ability to turn into a Mist as a Mount.
I'd be happy with that.

Rampeal

The thing I hear the most is that Werewolf and Vampire don't deserve content, lore or any Developer time because it is a "World Skill and not a Class skill". Well let us look at that.

Psijic Order, Dark Brotherhood, Thieves Guild all got their own Lore and questline and they are just singular skill lines like WW and Vamp.

Then there are the classes. Vamp/WW doesn't need love or attention because it is not a class. Well let us look at that. Majority of the Meta builds online have players using Mainly weapon skills than class skills. My favorite one is the whole "Ultimate Mage or Ultimate Stam build" with [insert class here] and out of the 10 skills and two ultimate you can have on front and back bar there is maybe one to two class skills. At least with my werewolf I use 100% of my skills.

Just saying that WW have complete builds out there and they are (whether you like it or not) a legitimate play style. There is even armor sets for WW and Vamp.

So yes Zos does need to turn their attention to the WW and Vamp players. Especially Vampire. They need to be reworked to be a better skill like the Werewolf is rather than a free Magick/ Stam regen took they have always been.

CMDR_Un1k0rn

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

I'd like to see some rework of both skill lines, but I'm not sure they could do enough story content to justify a popular dlc.

Unless it's rescuing an certain rivenspire vampire from the clutches of molag bal

I'd love to have a reason to use any skill other than mistform, used to love drain until I figured out that it's just for fun and not really competitive. Although I've begun to flesh out a build for it if the numbers can come out right.

On the spoiler... YES. Would be a nice epilogue to the whole Molag Bal thing IMO.

craybest

content ABOUT vampires and werewolves doesn't mean the player NEEDS to be one of either to do the content. Ravenspire is about vampires, but it's not required of the player to be one.
we know both vamp and WW need to be good enough for some people to want to play it but not good enough so it's madatory for everyone. but right now it has too many cons and most people who do it probably do it because they think it's cool or because of the lore.

FierceSam

Both skill lines are very ill thought out and would benefit from being revised.

The whole vampire system seems as if it’s organised backwards. Fundamentally, if you want to benefit from being a vampire in ESO, you never, ever feed so you stay at level 4. Feeding should be something that empowers the vampire, making them more powerful, instead here it weakens you. Feeding should make vampires look fantastic, while not feeding should make them look like desiccated corpses. The objective of the vampire should be to feed in order to maintain the benefits of level 4 vampirism. Becoming a vampire means sacrificing your soul (and your looks) in return for certain powers. Feeding is the only way to mitigate this while still enjoying the benefits. Additionally, NOT feeding for too long while a vampire should actually make your character weaker than their non-vampire original state. This would force the player to choose between feeding (living the life of the vampire) or seeking a cure (to return them to their pre-vampire state).

Rampeal

FierceSam wrote: »

Both skill lines are very ill thought out and would benefit from being revised.

The whole vampire system seems as if it’s organised backwards. Fundamentally, if you want to benefit from being a vampire in ESO, you never, ever feed so you stay at level 4. Feeding should be something that empowers the vampire, making them more powerful, instead here it weakens you. Feeding should make vampires look fantastic, while not feeding should make them look like desiccated corpses. The objective of the vampire should be to feed in order to maintain the benefits of level 4 vampirism. Becoming a vampire means sacrificing your soul (and your looks) in return for certain powers. Feeding is the only way to mitigate this while still enjoying the benefits. Additionally, NOT feeding for too long while a vampire should actually make your character weaker than their non-vampire original state. This would force the player to choose between feeding (living the life of the vampire) or seeking a cure (to return them to their pre-vampire state).

100% Agree. Read any Vampire book, Watch any Vampire movie and the Vampire is weak when not fed. The whole concept of "Not feeding = Stronger" is asinine. Bram Stoker the grandfather of all modern vampire depicted Dracula weak when not fed. At the end of the books this is one of the sole reasons he was defeated.

Go a month without eating you will be weak and barley able to move. I know what many will say, "You take more fire damage and health recovery is reduced by 80%" yeah until you take the passive and it negates have of that, not to mention most Vampires are Dark elves so that negates the fire damage right there. It seems more of a Regen buff with damage migration at 50% with no real penalty. Werewolf you have to at least have your ultimate slotted to get your stamina regen buff, Vampires don't. They need to rework the skill line and make it require you to have at least a skill or ultimate slotted for the passives to work. Werewolf, Psijic,Mages,Fighters and others require you to have abilities slotted for their passives to works. So should vampire. Would make the skill line feel like a actual vampire rather than a regen/dmg resist buff everyone gets.

barney2525

FierceSam wrote: »

Both skill lines are very ill thought out and would benefit from being revised.

The whole vampire system seems as if it’s organised backwards. Fundamentally, if you want to benefit from being a vampire in ESO, you never, ever feed so you stay at level 4. Feeding should be something that empowers the vampire, making them more powerful, instead here it weakens you. Feeding should make vampires look fantastic, while not feeding should make them look like desiccated corpses. The objective of the vampire should be to feed in order to maintain the benefits of level 4 vampirism. Becoming a vampire means sacrificing your soul (and your looks) in return for certain powers. Feeding is the only way to mitigate this while still enjoying the benefits. Additionally, NOT feeding for too long while a vampire should actually make your character weaker than their non-vampire original state. This would force the player to choose between feeding (living the life of the vampire) or seeking a cure (to return them to their pre-vampire state).

Most of this I agree with, which goes hand in hand with my opinion - Vampires and Werewolves are Not supposed to be a main focus in Elder Scrolls. The Races are the focus. The Three Banners War is the focus. Molag Bal is the mainline quest.

Vampires and Werewolves are an Enhancement. An extra option to add some flavor to a character, if the player wants to. Their abilities should Not be on a par with standard class skill lines, or as impactful as racial passives. IMHO, that's why the abilities are designed the way they are. They were not worried about going into great depths about the accuracy of the vamp/WW genre. I think they were more concerned about making sure the abilities did Not add too much to any character, so players would play the vamp/WW for Flavor and Not for combat stats.

So you have the balance of some good stuff and some bad stuff. And in a hardcore vamp/WW genre it does not make a lot of sense. But they are not Looking to make ESO a hardcore vamp/WW game.

And in a game mechanics sense, re-working skills for an Enhancement is much harder to keep balance than to do it for races or classes. EVERY character can potentially have the Enhancement. And what you do Not want, is one Enhancement to be so powerful that it takes over the game.

IMHO

mann9753b16_ESO

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

Vampires need love too ZoS- please give them a polymorph like the werewolves got the werewolf lord poly

You really want a 300 cost Ultimate that basically makes you weaker than you would be without it and has a time limit that allows you nothing but fight, feed, fight, feed, fight, feed? Oh and no benefits when you are not in that Ultimate form?