With all the complaints about PVPers right now...

Goregrinder

What do PVEers who run trials and vet dungeons regularly do when a rando joins the group and hasn't learned the boss mechanics, or can't break 10k DPS, can't heal the group, can't tank correctly, but just wants to loot gear and nothing else? Do you just pat them on the head and say "Don't worry bud, you can tag along...?"

Because in my experience what happens is you get kicked by the group and told to learn your rotation better, or fix your build, or learn the boss mechanics next time.....basically "Learn 2 Play" is the response. Rather than welcoming new PVEers with open arms, and try to get more players interested in PVE, you kick them and tell them they need to figure out how to play their class. But they just want to finish their Undaunted quests and get a monster set, and then they are out of your hair!

Why kick them from your Dungeon or Trial group? Why not just work around them? Isn't that the same courtesy being asked from PVPers by the PVEers trying to complete quests in Cyrodiil?

CipherNine

This is very true. I am a PVE'er and I see this a lot. with the elitist attitude of PVE players when comes to newer players that still need to learn mechanics.

It doesn't make much sense to tell someone to learn how to do something by insulting them and kicking them. They can't learn anything if they are not given the chance to. We would have a lot more people actually wanting to do more of the content if they weren't treated like *** by all the elitist ***. It's like these players forgot that they didn't know *** when they were newer players as well.

drkfrontiers

Goregrinder wrote: »

Why kick them from your Dungeon or Trial group? Why not just work around them? Isn't that the same courtesy being asked from PVPers by the PVEers trying to complete quests in Cyrodiil?

Much of the vContent requires a focused team effort to successfully complete. If you don't know the mechanics it often leads to numerous wipes.

I'm nearing CP1000 and I still do not consider running some of them because I am not comfortable with my skills.

As in PvP there are plenty of stuck-up, "elite" players that want you to play according to their finely honed playbook.

Vote kicking someone should always be a last resort, and most of the time the offending party knows they are frustrating the effort and leave themselves.

This is world's apart from the sorts of griefing, tea-bagging, ganking & group gangbangs at sewer-gate/ quest givers/ IC that is the CV of PvPers in ESO.

SFDB

The problem is, and I'll try not to be technical, the Internet is full of blobs.

ZoS does not allow nasty things to be said, so we will call them "blobs."

"Blobs" are the people who rationalize to themselves that being an awful person is justified. They have invented excuses for why they can do something that anyone looking from the outside would clearly see lacks any sense of human decency, empathy, or frankly the right to breed.

Some blobs see PVP as the way to do this. The fact the game permits it is usually the only rationalization they need, but really, if they could find a way to do it even if the game didn't permit it, they still would.

Some blobs, on the other hand, are impatient. They want to run through things quickly, or efficiently, make some achievement.

Some blobs see themselves as elites, and that they should not have to suffer an inferior to be in their presence.

Some blobs look for ways to interfere in people just trying to play the game.

The problem isn't PVP or PVE, it's BvP, blobs vs players, who make the game world worse by acting like blobs.

xF1REFL1x

I see it a bit different. Camping the daily zones to intentionally take away from this event is different then getting killed trying to take keeps or playing pvp for the purpose what it was truly meant for. For pve players it would be like running a pvp player through a trial or dungeon already knowing ahead of time you will kick them at the end boss. I have never kicked a single player in a dungeon for not having the right build or experience... it's fun trying to help them out. I don't have a single build to run around in the pvp zones... but since the weekly event is there it sounded fun to check it out. I also don't think having the proper build for pvp would matter much against a group waiting for you anyway.

Goregrinder

drkfrontiers wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Why kick them from your Dungeon or Trial group? Why not just work around them? Isn't that the same courtesy being asked from PVPers by the PVEers trying to complete quests in Cyrodiil?

Much of the vContent requires a focused team effort to successfully complete. If you don't know the mechanics it often leads to numerous wipes.

I'm nearing CP1000 and I still do not consider running some of them because I am not comfortable with my skills.

As in PvP there are plenty of stuck-up, "elite" players that want you to play according to their finely honed playbook.

Vote kicking someone should always be a last resort, and most of the time the offending party knows they are frustrating the effort and leave themselves.

This is world's apart from the sorts of griefing, tea-bagging, ganking & group gangbangs at sewer-gate/ quest givers/ IC that is the CV of PvPers in ESO.

How is denying a player access to content by vote kicking them not also considered griefing? Why not stop and ask about what skills they are using? What order? What sets are they running? Why not work with them? Why be elistist and expect them to already know how to PVE when they enter a PVE zone? And then grief them for not yet knowing how to PVE?

That's basically the argument being made right now. "PVEers don't PVP, they're not going to know PVP rotations or how to survive a burst combo! Cut them some slack man!!"

drkfrontiers

xF1REFL1x wrote: »

For pve players it would be like running a pvp player through a trial or dungeon already knowing ahead of time you will kick them at the end boss.

The scary thing is that this happens. Often.

Goregrinder

xF1REFL1x wrote: »

I see it a bit different. Camping the daily zones to intentionally take away from this event is different then getting killed trying to take keeps or playing pvp for the purpose what it was truly meant for. For pve players it would be like running a pvp player through a trial or dungeon already knowing ahead of time you will kick them at the end boss. I have never kicked a single player in a dungeon for not having the right build or experience... it's fun trying to help them out. I don't have a single build to run around in the pvp zones... but since the weekly event is there it sounded fun to check it out. I also don't think having the proper build for pvp would matter much against a group waiting for you anyway.

How do I know that a random group I join isn't already planning on kicking me if my DPS is sub par?

VaranisArano

PVE has a pretty easy learning curve short of progression and top-tier content. Its called "Run the dungeon on Normal to learn mechanics, go look up a build online, and practice your rotation."

PVP? The learning curve is way, way steeper. There is no real equivalent to normal dungeons as is quite different at max level/CP. The best thing you can do is learn from experience. You are going to die a lot - we all did, and we all got better from experience.

If you want a guide that I think is super helpful for the steep learning curve of PVP, check out @Joy_Division 's https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/427360/joys-2018-advice-for-midyear-mayhem-event

If you want a guide I wrote for how you can do PVP quests with as little PVP risk as possible:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/452338/midyear-mayhem-for-no-pvp-pacifists-mostly-pvp-free-ways-to-get-your-event-tickets/p1

drkfrontiers

Goregrinder wrote: »

How is denying a player access to content by vote kicking them not also considered griefing? Why not stop and ask about what skills they are using? What order? What sets are they running? Why not work with them? Why be elistist and expect them to already know how to PVE when they enter a PVE zone? And then grief them for not yet knowing how to PVE?

That's basically the argument being made right now. "PVEers don't PVP, they're not going to know PVP rotations or how to survive a burst combo! Cut them some slack man!!"

Just to be clear on this - I am against vote kicking anyone. I firmly believe in helping people understand the mechanics. All I am saying is that there are folks that are more than happy to hit the vote kick the moment they see someone struggling.

A simple way to avoid these things which I have learnt is two golden rules to enjoying your run.

1.) If you are unsure of the mechanics, send 15 mins watching a YouTube of the mechanics
2.) Shout out to the group that you are new and learning. Folks warm to that pretty quickly

Running blindly into a VDungeon (esp. DLC) is only going to cause you frustration.

ccmedaddy

Goregrinder wrote: »

...when a rando joins the group and hasn't learned the boss mechanics, or can't break 10k DPS, can't heal the group, can't tank correctly, but just wants to loot gear and nothing else?

o.O

It's one thing to not know the mechanics, which is fine because it take like 30 seconds to explain via group chat, but if a DPS can't do more than 10k (!!) dps or a healer/tank doesn't know the basics of the role then they have no business for queuing for vet dungeons at all. You are simply not ready. Most people have other stuff to do and would much rather not spend 2+ hours in a dungeon just because some rando "needs gear".

Normal dungeons exists for a reason. Do them instead.

SoLooney

Cause you dont need a good rotation, good dps, raid awareness to siege and zerg surf

I see plenty of you pvp players wearing the stupidest sets to do dungeons with and we put up with that

Pvp is lucky to get pvers interested in going to cyrodiil in the first place

Goregrinder

ccmedaddy wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

...when a rando joins the group and hasn't learned the boss mechanics, or can't break 10k DPS, can't heal the group, can't tank correctly, but just wants to loot gear and nothing else?

o.O

It's one thing to not know the mechanics, which is fine because it take like 30 seconds to explain via group chat, but if a DPS can't do more than 10k (!!) dps or a healer/tank doesn't know the basics of the role then they have no business for queuing for vet dungeons at all. You are simply not ready. Most people have other stuff to do and would much rather not spend 2+ hours in a dungeon just because some rando "needs gear".

Normal dungeons exists for a reason. Do them instead.

Yes, if a PVEer can't defend quest NPC's from other PVPers in a PVP zone, then they have no business in a PVP zone, I agree with you man.

JumpmanLane

Who cares. Kill anybody that shows up. NB's have every right to gank ANYBODY they can gank. You got a problem with gankers, kill them. If you can't, that's on you. Pretend it's a mechanic and learn it lol.

Goregrinder

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Who cares. Kill anybody that shows up. NB's have every right to gank ANYBODY they can gank. You got a problem with gankers, kill them. If you can't, that's on you. Pretend it's a mechanic and learn it lol.

I mean I agree with you man! I just trying to understand what PVEers are complaining about, they should expect the same level of elitism that they give to newbies just trying to farm monster helms.

jircris11

Goregrinder wrote: »

What do PVEers who run trials and vet dungeons regularly do when a rando joins the group and hasn't learned the boss mechanics, or can't break 10k DPS, can't heal the group, can't tank correctly, but just wants to loot gear and nothing else? Do you just pat them on the head and say "Don't worry bud, you can tag along...?"

Because in my experience what happens is you get kicked by the group and told to learn your rotation better, or fix your build, or learn the boss mechanics next time.....basically "Learn 2 Play" is the response. Rather than welcoming new PVEers with open arms, and try to get more players interested in PVE, you kick them and tell them they need to figure out how to play their class. But they just want to finish their Undaunted quests and get a monster set, and then they are out of your hair!

Why kick them from your Dungeon or Trial group? Why not just work around them? Isn't that the same courtesy being asked from PVPers by the PVEers trying to complete quests in Cyrodiil?

I dont end game for this reason. Endgame pvers and most pvpers (that i have met on many games) have an unbearable ego about them.

oxygen_thief

Goregrinder wrote: »

Rather than welcoming new PVEers with open arms, and try to get more players interested in PVE, you kick them and tell them they need to figure out how to play their class.

oh come on do you read news? we have no space

Bealeb319

I carried a guy who wasn't lol 50 yet through a vet dungeon one time. I wasn't thrilled he got qued in and I probably didn't explain to him why it did not make sense for him to be there in the nicest way...but I didn't boot him and we completed the dungeon. If your argument is that we should pick on the people in PvP for the event because we are better than them then you are simply wrong and there is no way around that. What you are doing is turning people who are here for the event away from the game which sees fewer and fewer players every week. At some point it won't be fun for you when there are no new players for you to pick on.

xF1REFL1x

Goregrinder wrote: »

xF1REFL1x wrote: »

I see it a bit different. Camping the daily zones to intentionally take away from this event is different then getting killed trying to take keeps or playing pvp for the purpose what it was truly meant for. For pve players it would be like running a pvp player through a trial or dungeon already knowing ahead of time you will kick them at the end boss. I have never kicked a single player in a dungeon for not having the right build or experience... it's fun trying to help them out. I don't have a single build to run around in the pvp zones... but since the weekly event is there it sounded fun to check it out. I also don't think having the proper build for pvp would matter much against a group waiting for you anyway.

How do I know that a random group I join isn't already planning on kicking me if my DPS is sub par?

I don't think you would... I personally have never experienced it myself... been playing for a while now. Not saying it doesn't happen. I only know my character and can comment from that.

xF1REFL1x

drkfrontiers wrote: »

xF1REFL1x wrote: »

For pve players it would be like running a pvp player through a trial or dungeon already knowing ahead of time you will kick them at the end boss.

The scary thing is that this happens. Often.

Sad to hear...

Linaleah

Goregrinder wrote: »

drkfrontiers wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Why kick them from your Dungeon or Trial group? Why not just work around them? Isn't that the same courtesy being asked from PVPers by the PVEers trying to complete quests in Cyrodiil?

Much of the vContent requires a focused team effort to successfully complete. If you don't know the mechanics it often leads to numerous wipes.

I'm nearing CP1000 and I still do not consider running some of them because I am not comfortable with my skills.

As in PvP there are plenty of stuck-up, "elite" players that want you to play according to their finely honed playbook.

Vote kicking someone should always be a last resort, and most of the time the offending party knows they are frustrating the effort and leave themselves.

This is world's apart from the sorts of griefing, tea-bagging, ganking & group gangbangs at sewer-gate/ quest givers/ IC that is the CV of PvPers in ESO.

How is denying a player access to content by vote kicking them not also considered griefing? Why not stop and ask about what skills they are using? What order? What sets are they running? Why not work with them? Why be elistist and expect them to already know how to PVE when they enter a PVE zone? And then grief them for not yet knowing how to PVE?

That's basically the argument being made right now. "PVEers don't PVP, they're not going to know PVP rotations or how to survive a burst combo! Cut them some slack man!!"

the difference is, your example would work better if you compared it to organized group, say, taking keeps to get emperor for someone, but you have a person along that doesn't siege, doesn't attack anything, doesn't repair, doesn't contribute much at all and has a slow horse to boot.

and yeah, I can see that organized pvp group kicking a person that is holding them back.

but what is happening here is NOT that. what's happening here is equivalent of a player waiting for another player to start killing mobs around a master chest, only for the waiting player to swoop in and take that chest, while the player who starting clearing their way to the chest - is still in combat.

so... don't be that guy.

JumpmanLane

Goregrinder wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Who cares. Kill anybody that shows up. NB's have every right to gank ANYBODY they can gank. You got a problem with gankers, kill them. If you can't, that's on you. Pretend it's a mechanic and learn it lol.

I mean I agree with you man! Ijust trying to understand what PVEers are complaining about, they should expect the same level of elitism that they give to newbies just trying to farm monster helms.

And I agree with you! I imagine it's a bit if a blow to be able to run high end pve content and get ganked silly while mistakenly believing they are running "pve" content in Cyro.

I'm not going out if my way to kill any "pve" players in Cyro. I'm going out of my way to kill ANY BODY with the wrong faction tag on in Cyro. I've been in Cyro since level 10. Nobody ever cut me any breaks. Dying is better for you in the long run. Learn from it.

I'd be ashamed to come whining in the forums about dying in pvp; but I suppose there's a bigger stigma when a pve player dies. I unno rez out. You'll feel better lol.

Goregrinder

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Who cares. Kill anybody that shows up. NB's have every right to gank ANYBODY they can gank. You got a problem with gankers, kill them. If you can't, that's on you. Pretend it's a mechanic and learn it lol.

I mean I agree with you man! Ijust trying to understand what PVEers are complaining about, they should expect the same level of elitism that they give to newbies just trying to farm monster helms.

And I agree with you! I imagine it's a bit if a blow to be able to run high end pve content and get ganked silly while mistakenly believing they are running "pve" content in Cyro.

I'm not going out if my way to kill any "pve" players in Cyro. I'm going out of my way to kill ANY BODY with the wrong faction tag on in Cyro. I've been in Cyro since level 10. Nobody ever cut me any breaks. Dying is better for you in the long run. Learn from it.

I'd be ashamed to come whining in the forums about dying in pvp; but I suppose there's a bigger stigma when a pve player dies. I unno rez out. You'll feel better lol.

Yeah that's really it. We don't care who you are, PVEer, PVPer, questing, exploring, looking for skyshards, etc... if you are red, you are dead. When we raid keeps, we kill EVERYTHING, players, NPC's, we don't care.

And yeah it is them feeling their level of elitism dished back at them, and SUDDENLY they don't like it lol

MrGraves

As a more casual PvEr I don't know a lot of trial mechanics and was very late to do trials. Always start with normal trials. No one's really been rude to me / kicked me from a trial group? I've never been kicked from dungeon either I don't think and for me the only players I refuse to play with (usually I don't kick tho I just leave group and they can replace me) are really toxic/entitled players. You used to only be able to do the part 2 of dungeons in vet mode but that's not the case anymore and you can learn how to PvE through doing normal content first before jumping right into vet. IDK if you join a vet trial knowing you have no clue and don't bother asking if that's ok with everyone first I'm not sure why you wouldn't expect ppl to ask you to maybe come back when you have learnt the basics first? Though going from PvP to PvE shouldn't be too hard anyway so maybe find a norm group for the dungeons/trials first or read up on it a bit. Though I agree there are always alot of elitst players but those exist in any game type.

And when it comes to events where people want to participate and have to get out of their comfort zones (pvpers going to do dungeons for undaunted event, or pvers going to do pvp for any of the pvp events that are tied to things like getting event tickets or what not) there's pretty much always really toxic people. Even if that's the content you usually do.

therift

This 'Us' vs 'Them' mentality is hardly conducive to a happy gaming environment.

It would be helpful if everyone worked towards de-escalation.

Just sayin'

redspecter23

Any time I have a puglet in my dungeon or trial run, I assume they bring a solid 4k dps. They may or may not have ice staff as a primary damage weapon. They will likely be way out of range of heals, die constantly and scream for rezzes. They may also immediately state all the items they are looking for on the run before even saying hello.

With all that as an assumption, I will bring them along for amusement purposes only and only if I know I can already complete the run whether they are there or not. If they do want to learn their role, I am more than willing to discuss it with them later on, after the run when we have more time to talk about it.

Goregrinder

SoLooney wrote: »

Cause you dont need a good rotation, good dps, raid awareness to siege and zerg surf

I see plenty of you pvp players wearing the stupidest sets to do dungeons with and we put up with that

Pvp is lucky to get pvers interested in going to cyrodiil in the first place

MrGraves wrote: »

... IDK if you join a vet trial knowing you have no clue and don't bother asking if that's ok with everyone first I'm not sure why you wouldn't expect ppl to ask you to maybe come back when you have learnt the basics first? ....

Well that's what I mean. As a PVPer who has to run PVE content for gear, I put up with getting kicked constantly. Like I expect that either my DPS isn't enough or the Random Dungeon finder puts me in a Dungeon I've never done, so I don't know the mechanics.

I got thrown in a pug last week, with a tank who was new to tanking and new to the same dungeon as me, didn't bash the boss or anything....we wiped 7 times. Then I didn't break a tether soon enough and died, so we wiped again. And in chat they were like "Duuude....." and then immediately kicked me. The first 7 wipes were because of the tank, not me..yet they kick me the moment I die.

But you know what? I didn't complain about it, because I'm not going going to dedicate my time to learn everything I need to in order to farm something. So I understand that my experience should reflect my level of dedication to something, so it is what it is.

But now the tables have turned.

The request is that we should understand PVEers are out of their comfort zone and are not equipped or skilled to properly PVP, but they have quests that take them into a PVP zone...so they suddenly want to be shown mercy, or given a "pardon" for being bad at PVP.


Well, where is our PVE pardon then?

SidraWillowsky

I won't vote to kick someone unless they're basically sitting in a corner facing a wall or are a straight-up DPS build with no health and no taunt queued as a tank.

PvE DPS is what I'm good at and I'm happy to use my skills to carry/help people through a dungeon if they're at least willing to try.

JumpmanLane

Goregrinder wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Who cares. Kill anybody that shows up. NB's have every right to gank ANYBODY they can gank. You got a problem with gankers, kill them. If you can't, that's on you. Pretend it's a mechanic and learn it lol.

I mean I agree with you man! Ijust trying to understand what PVEers are complaining about, they should expect the same level of elitism that they give to newbies just trying to farm monster helms.

And I agree with you! I imagine it's a bit if a blow to be able to run high end pve content and get ganked silly while mistakenly believing they are running "pve" content in Cyro.

I'm not going out if my way to kill any "pve" players in Cyro. I'm going out of my way to kill ANY BODY with the wrong faction tag on in Cyro. I've been in Cyro since level 10. Nobody ever cut me any breaks. Dying is better for you in the long run. Learn from it.

I'd be ashamed to come whining in the forums about dying in pvp; but I suppose there's a bigger stigma when a pve player dies. I unno rez out. You'll feel better lol.

Yeah that's really it. We don't care who you are, PVEer, PVPer, questing, exploring, looking for skyshards, etc... if you are red, you are dead. When we raid keeps, we kill EVERYTHING, players, NPC's, we don't care.

And yeah it is them feeling their level of elitism dished back at them, and SUDDENLY they don't like it lol

EXACTLY! They’re dying because they have the wrong faction tag on. They’re getting ganked because they are gankable. They act like they are getting picked on or something. Fight back! If you die rez out and fight back some more. You’re in Cyro, expect to have to fight people. You expect to have to fight NPCs in dungeons and trials, even overland. Whine less fight more is my earnest advice.

Goregrinder wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

Cause you dont need a good rotation, good dps, raid awareness to siege and zerg surf

I see plenty of you pvp players wearing the stupidest sets to do dungeons with and we put up with that

Pvp is lucky to get pvers interested in going to cyrodiil in the first place

MrGraves wrote: »

... IDK if you join a vet trial knowing you have no clue and don't bother asking if that's ok with everyone first I'm not sure why you wouldn't expect ppl to ask you to maybe come back when you have learnt the basics first? ....

Well that's what I mean. As a PVPer who has to run PVE content for gear, I put up with getting kicked constantly. Like I expect that either my DPS isn't enough or the Random Dungeon finder puts me in a Dungeon I've never done, so I don't know the mechanics.

I got thrown in a pug last week, with a tank who was new to tanking and new to the same dungeon as me, didn't bash the boss or anything....we wiped 7 times. Then I didn't break a tether soon enough and died, so we wiped again. And in chat they were like "Duuude....." and then immediately kicked me. The first 7 wipes were because of the tank, not me..yet they kick me the moment I die.

But you know what? I didn't complain about it, because I'm not going going to dedicate my time to learn everything I need to in order to farm something. So I understand that my experience should reflect my level of dedication to something, so it is what it is.

But now the tables have turned.

The request is that we should understand PVEers are out of their comfort zone and are not equipped or skilled to properly PVP, but they have quests that take them into a PVP zone...so they suddenly want to be shown mercy, or given a "pardon" for being bad at PVP.


Well, where is our PVE pardon then?

Don’t cut em NO BREAKS! Kill em and let ZOS sort em out lol.

Goregrinder

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Who cares. Kill anybody that shows up. NB's have every right to gank ANYBODY they can gank. You got a problem with gankers, kill them. If you can't, that's on you. Pretend it's a mechanic and learn it lol.

I mean I agree with you man! Ijust trying to understand what PVEers are complaining about, they should expect the same level of elitism that they give to newbies just trying to farm monster helms.

And I agree with you! I imagine it's a bit if a blow to be able to run high end pve content and get ganked silly while mistakenly believing they are running "pve" content in Cyro.

I'm not going out if my way to kill any "pve" players in Cyro. I'm going out of my way to kill ANY BODY with the wrong faction tag on in Cyro. I've been in Cyro since level 10. Nobody ever cut me any breaks. Dying is better for you in the long run. Learn from it.

I'd be ashamed to come whining in the forums about dying in pvp; but I suppose there's a bigger stigma when a pve player dies. I unno rez out. You'll feel better lol.

Yeah that's really it. We don't care who you are, PVEer, PVPer, questing, exploring, looking for skyshards, etc... if you are red, you are dead. When we raid keeps, we kill EVERYTHING, players, NPC's, we don't care.

And yeah it is them feeling their level of elitism dished back at them, and SUDDENLY they don't like it lol

EXACTLY! They’re dying because they have the wrong faction tag on. They’re getting ganked because they are gankable. They act like they are getting picked on or something. Fight back! If you die rez out and fight back some more. You’re in Cyro, expect to have to fight people. You expect to have to fight NPCs in dungeons and trials, even overland. Whine less fight more is my earnest advice.

Goregrinder wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

Cause you dont need a good rotation, good dps, raid awareness to siege and zerg surf

I see plenty of you pvp players wearing the stupidest sets to do dungeons with and we put up with that

Pvp is lucky to get pvers interested in going to cyrodiil in the first place

MrGraves wrote: »

... IDK if you join a vet trial knowing you have no clue and don't bother asking if that's ok with everyone first I'm not sure why you wouldn't expect ppl to ask you to maybe come back when you have learnt the basics first? ....

Well that's what I mean. As a PVPer who has to run PVE content for gear, I put up with getting kicked constantly. Like I expect that either my DPS isn't enough or the Random Dungeon finder puts me in a Dungeon I've never done, so I don't know the mechanics.

I got thrown in a pug last week, with a tank who was new to tanking and new to the same dungeon as me, didn't bash the boss or anything....we wiped 7 times. Then I didn't break a tether soon enough and died, so we wiped again. And in chat they were like "Duuude....." and then immediately kicked me. The first 7 wipes were because of the tank, not me..yet they kick me the moment I die.

But you know what? I didn't complain about it, because I'm not going going to dedicate my time to learn everything I need to in order to farm something. So I understand that my experience should reflect my level of dedication to something, so it is what it is.

But now the tables have turned.

The request is that we should understand PVEers are out of their comfort zone and are not equipped or skilled to properly PVP, but they have quests that take them into a PVP zone...so they suddenly want to be shown mercy, or given a "pardon" for being bad at PVP.


Well, where is our PVE pardon then?

Don’t cut em NO BREAKS! Kill em and let ZOS sort em out lol.

"...wipe them out...all of them..." - Sheev Palpatine, Emperor of the Galactic Empire

Gilvoth

Goregrinder wrote: »

What do PVEers who run trials and vet dungeons regularly do when a rando joins the group and hasn't learned the boss mechanics, or can't break 10k DPS, can't heal the group, can't tank correctly, but just wants to loot gear and nothing else? Do you just pat them on the head and say "Don't worry bud, you can tag along...?"

Because in my experience what happens is you get kicked by the group and told to learn your rotation better, or fix your build, or learn the boss mechanics next time.....basically "Learn 2 Play" is the response. Rather than welcoming new PVEers with open arms, and try to get more players interested in PVE, you kick them and tell them they need to figure out how to play their class. But they just want to finish their Undaunted quests and get a monster set, and then they are out of your hair!

Why kick them from your Dungeon or Trial group? Why not just work around them? Isn't that the same courtesy being asked from PVPers by the PVEers trying to complete quests in Cyrodiil?

Goregrinder wrote: »

What do PVEers who run trials and vet dungeons regularly do when a rando joins the group and hasn't learned the boss mechanics, or can't break 10k DPS, can't heal the group, can't tank correctly, but just wants to loot gear and nothing else? Do you just pat them on the head and say "Don't worry bud, you can tag along...?"

Because in my experience what happens is you get kicked by the group and told to learn your rotation better, or fix your build, or learn the boss mechanics next time.....basically "Learn 2 Play" is the response. Rather than welcoming new PVEers with open arms, and try to get more players interested in PVE, you kick them and tell them they need to figure out how to play their class. But they just want to finish their Undaunted quests and get a monster set, and then they are out of your hair!

Why kick them from your Dungeon or Trial group? Why not just work around them? Isn't that the same courtesy being asked from PVPers by the PVEers trying to complete quests in Cyrodiil?

you hit the nail right on the head, good thread.
i love this thread, all truth.
last night i got alot of hate whispers and the whole time i kept thinking about all the hate i got when i was trying to do undaunted quests and got kicked and shamed and all the times i got kicked and hate whisperd in pve.
i dont like the pve in eso, i only go to those pve quests and caves to get the unlocks for undaunted and im only there also for the gear, but they treated me horrible and i promise they will continue to do that to not only you and me and all of us.

i love this pvp event.
i dont respond to hate whispers.