Eso class passive problems

JinMori

So, there is a problem with some class passives, this is a bit of a continuation from my topic about class unique buffs, but looking at some passive recently, i thought, wow why did i never make a post about this? Some of eso passives just straight out suck.

Examples, for sorc

Rebate, which gives you 1.4 k mag when your pet is unsummoned or killed, absolute trash passive since you don;t want your pets to die, your pets will mostly not die, and the only use out of this is atro when it despawns, it gives you 1.4k magicka, wow that really helped me sustain...

Expert summoner, is only useful if you have a pet, and even then it's not that great, not really a bad passive, but the problem i have with this one is that it only works if you have a pet active.

Blood magic, is meh, borderline bad, self heal, but not really any good, this will not really help you much.

Persistance, good for tanking i guess, but nothing else, a more comprehensive passive would be better.

Exploitation, only procs if you use a dark magic ability, which you will not use as stam sorc, or pet sorc, and probably nothing aside from magicka sorc with crystal fragments, make this skill useful for every role.

Templar

Spear wall is not bad, but duration might be a little too short

Balanced warrior is good, but should provide spell damage as well as weapon damage, problem is that this is much more useful for stamina compared to magicka.

enduring rays is pretty meh.

Illuminate, i never played tank or healer, but i know for a fact that both dd and healer proc this, because all of them use at least 1 dawn's wrath ability, don;t know for tank, might need a readjustment there.

restoring light is focused for healer, but it does provide some good utility even for dd and tank.

Nb

Executioner, pretty trash passive, nothing else to say, kinda like rebate, but a bit better, still trash though.

Hemorrhage unlike pretty much all other will proc from each and every setup, because you will always crit at least once every 20 sec, so there is nothing to worry about, even if you are heal or tank.

Aside from hemmorage nb passive are solid, probably the best out of any class.

Dk.

Combustion is very good, but the stamina regen is not very good, because poison doesn;t proc nearly as much as burning.

Burning heart is pretty good, but a bit too focused on tanks, would be good to have it do something for other playstiles as well.

Same thing for elder dragon, although a pretty good passive, the range on abilities is also pretty decent.

Mountain's blessing, same problem as minor prophecy, requires you to use a ability from that skilline, which some roles do not use.

Healping hands is not very good, somewhat decent for pvp i guess is some occasions, but even then, 900 stam isn;t gonna save the day, it;s gonna be barely noticeable.


Warden

Unlike rebate, Bond with nature procs from skills like sub assault and bird making it already much better, as those are your spammables, meaning that they will proc a lot, not an amazing self heal, but not bad either.

Green balance passives, are basically useless in pve for anything aside healing, in pvp they have more applications for other setups, but considering that templar skills have some use for every setup in both pvp and pve, i find these passives to be just worse overall, and the minor toughness, just sucks honestly, it's a passive that got taken away from warhorn to make it "unique" and cannot compare to it's counterparts, i would take 10 % weapon damage or 6 % crit anyday over 10 % health, especially considering this was once in warhorn.

Glacial presence is actually a slight dps gain, not bad, but probably a pain in the ass in pvp.

Frozen armor, focused for tank, fine, not really any use for stamwarden though.

icy aura, decent

Piercing cold, Very good, but no stamina counterpart.

JinMori

Out of all of them, id say, sorc has some of the worst.

Rebate is probably the single worst passive of any class skilline.

JinMori

This thread didn't really get any attention, probably because the post is a bit long, so in short, some passives suck, i listed those i think have the biggest problems.

JamesDX

I stopped reading at "Elder dragon is a good passive". They nerfed the range on whip to give it back in a passive...

idk

1. Rebate is not a trash passive, and you did not even get to an actual example of why it is has a low value.

First. It is irrelevant if you do not want your pets to die. There are situations they will die and you have little power to prevent it. Of course I am talking about extreme PvE outside of a group instance but it exists. It also includes PvP. So it is not really trash.

Second, you would have served your argument better if you had said it had less value since pets will not die in group instances anymore (but not worthless as pointed out above).

2. Your Expert Summoner argument can be used with the above as well. However, there are many passives throughout the game that have requirements for the use of a skill from that line. A great many skill lines have passives like this and they work well.

3. Exploitation is same response as above. Again, not an issue and you did not provide any real reasoning for change. Every class has a passive like this that requires the use of a skill from a certain line to provide a similar buff. It works well.

I am stopping there because I see a theme. It seems more like OP would just like it different but that is the sole reasoning for most of these. It is just another I want things to be different thread without any real justification of the issues.

JinMori

JamesDX wrote: »

I stopped reading at "Elder dragon is a good passive". They nerfed the range on whip to give it back in a passive...

Well, what it provides is not bad, but i do realize that they nerfed whip etc range and gave it to the passive.

What i meant is that it's only "good" for tanks, and nothing else really, the recovery isn;t bad, but not great.

Moonsorrow

Well after seeing how good the Necromancer passives gonna be, i sure wish they would update some of the old classes passives also to be in the same level (being good and efficient).

JinMori

idk wrote: »

1. Rebate is not a trash passive, and you did not even get to an actual example of why it is has a low value.

First. It is irrelevant if you do not want your pets to die. There are situations they will die and you have little power to prevent it. Of course I am talking about extreme PvE outside of a group instance but it exists. It also includes PvP. So it is not really trash.

Second, you would have served your argument better if you had said it had less value since pets will not die in group instances anymore (but not worthless as pointed out above).

2. Your Expert Summoner argument can be used with the above as well. However, there are many passives throughout the game that have requirements for the use of a skill from that line. A great many skill lines have passives like this and they work well.

3. Exploitation is same response as above. Again, not an issue and you did not provide any real reasoning for change. Every class has a passive like this that requires the use of a skill from a certain line to provide a similar buff. It works well.

I am stopping there because I see a theme. It seems more like OP would just like it different but that is the sole reasoning for most of these. It is just another I want things to be different thread without any real justification of the issues.

Did you not read?

I did give some justifications for the change.

Isn't for example this passive is pretty much worthless for stam sorc because they do not use a dark magic ability enough of a justification?

You might find it;'s not, but clearly i listed a |"real (wtf is that even supposed to mean?)" reason for the change, and didn't say it just for the sake of changing, i see a thread with your posts honestly, you don't really try to understand, you just spew out some things even though you didn't really try to understand, and try to undermine the argument of another person, by formulating poor arguments out of lack of understanding, just like my potl post i made some time ago, you might disagree with my solution, but in the end, i was correct on the fact that if you do your rotation very fast, like you should, you will recast your potl too soon, and nothing will change that fact, but even though i provided all the data you needed, even the rotation and a few parses, you still went with your preconceived notion, that i must be doing something wrong, because it couldn't possibly be you who are in the wrong, no, that's not possible, so it's not even worth trying.

Honestly, can you just refrain from commenting before you actually understand something? It would be appreciated, i don;t know where you got that, but you should really work on it.

Also i did give an example on why rebate it's low value, and even if you pet dies like crazy, the mag return is still pretty bad, even though it won;t really happen, as a result, you will get pretty much nothing out of that passive.

idk

JinMori wrote: »

idk wrote: »

1. Rebate is not a trash passive, and you did not even get to an actual example of why it is has a low value.

First. It is irrelevant if you do not want your pets to die. There are situations they will die and you have little power to prevent it. Of course I am talking about extreme PvE outside of a group instance but it exists. It also includes PvP. So it is not really trash.

Second, you would have served your argument better if you had said it had less value since pets will not die in group instances anymore (but not worthless as pointed out above).

2. Your Expert Summoner argument can be used with the above as well. However, there are many passives throughout the game that have requirements for the use of a skill from that line. A great many skill lines have passives like this and they work well.

3. Exploitation is same response as above. Again, not an issue and you did not provide any real reasoning for change. Every class has a passive like this that requires the use of a skill from a certain line to provide a similar buff. It works well.

I am stopping there because I see a theme. It seems more like OP would just like it different but that is the sole reasoning for most of these. It is just another I want things to be different thread without any real justification of the issues.

Did you not read?

I did give some justifications for the change.

Yes, I did. I read what I responded to very carefully. I stopped after Sorc because I did not see a reason to continue.

In fact you have not provided any well thought out idea above. Being that you stated Expert Summoner was only useful if you are using a pet but did not offer that point for Rebate it is clear that you did not think this through very well.

So in the end I really suggest you read your own post before starting to question if I read it because your message show a lack of understanding of what you are actually trying to say.

BTW, your reasoning is your opinion of why you do not like each item and nothing more. Also, BTW, I did not read your recent reply past what I quoted. Questioning if I read when my response clearly shows I did is just condescending which is a poor way to start off a reply and an indication it does not matter what I say, that you will argue for the sake of it because I disagree.

JinMori

idk wrote: »

JinMori wrote: »

idk wrote: »

1. Rebate is not a trash passive, and you did not even get to an actual example of why it is has a low value.

First. It is irrelevant if you do not want your pets to die. There are situations they will die and you have little power to prevent it. Of course I am talking about extreme PvE outside of a group instance but it exists. It also includes PvP. So it is not really trash.

Second, you would have served your argument better if you had said it had less value since pets will not die in group instances anymore (but not worthless as pointed out above).

2. Your Expert Summoner argument can be used with the above as well. However, there are many passives throughout the game that have requirements for the use of a skill from that line. A great many skill lines have passives like this and they work well.

3. Exploitation is same response as above. Again, not an issue and you did not provide any real reasoning for change. Every class has a passive like this that requires the use of a skill from a certain line to provide a similar buff. It works well.

I am stopping there because I see a theme. It seems more like OP would just like it different but that is the sole reasoning for most of these. It is just another I want things to be different thread without any real justification of the issues.

Did you not read?

I did give some justifications for the change.

Yes, I did. I read what I responded to very carefully. I stopped after Sorc because I did not see a reason to continue.

In fact you have not provided any well thought out idea above. Being that you stated Expert Summoner was only useful if you are using a pet but did not offer that point for Rebate it is clear that you did not think this through very well.

So in the end I really suggest you read your own post before starting to question if I read it because your message show a lack of understanding of what you are actually trying to say.

You are wrong, the reason why i did not say that is because rebate gives you magicka back from atro, the best st ulti for sorc and it isn;t a permanent pet, i am getting really tired of your 10 iq points conversations, please refrain from talking to me ever again until you formulate a good argument, that is not there just for the sake of disagreement.

idk

JinMori wrote: »

idk wrote: »

JinMori wrote: »

idk wrote: »

1. Rebate is not a trash passive, and you did not even get to an actual example of why it is has a low value.

First. It is irrelevant if you do not want your pets to die. There are situations they will die and you have little power to prevent it. Of course I am talking about extreme PvE outside of a group instance but it exists. It also includes PvP. So it is not really trash.

Second, you would have served your argument better if you had said it had less value since pets will not die in group instances anymore (but not worthless as pointed out above).

2. Your Expert Summoner argument can be used with the above as well. However, there are many passives throughout the game that have requirements for the use of a skill from that line. A great many skill lines have passives like this and they work well.

3. Exploitation is same response as above. Again, not an issue and you did not provide any real reasoning for change. Every class has a passive like this that requires the use of a skill from a certain line to provide a similar buff. It works well.

I am stopping there because I see a theme. It seems more like OP would just like it different but that is the sole reasoning for most of these. It is just another I want things to be different thread without any real justification of the issues.

Did you not read?

I did give some justifications for the change.

Yes, I did. I read what I responded to very carefully. I stopped after Sorc because I did not see a reason to continue.

In fact you have not provided any well thought out idea above. Being that you stated Expert Summoner was only useful if you are using a pet but did not offer that point for Rebate it is clear that you did not think this through very well.

So in the end I really suggest you read your own post before starting to question if I read it because your message show a lack of understanding of what you are actually trying to say.

You are wrong, the reason why i did not say that is because rebate gives you magicka back from atro, the best st ulti for sorc and it isn;t a permanent pet, i am getting really tired of your 10 iq points conversations, please refrain from talking to me ever again until you formulate a good argument, that is not there just for the sake of disagreement.

Umm, you do not differentiate requiring a permanent pet vs any pet.

So again, read your own OP and maybe fix the train of thought errors, et al, before trying to tell someone they are wrong. I read this recent reply and it was clear you did not bother taking my advice, to read your own OP.