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Fun Fact/Theory: Varen might very well be the first "DC emperor"

Lyserus
Lyserus
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The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne after a "long and bloody" war, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

So yeah, DC is awesome :)
Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on May 22, 2021 2:11PM
  • Wing
    Wing
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    First DC emp and he almost ruined the world, nice guy.

    right, cannot let that happen again.
    ESO player since beta.
    full time subscriber.
    PC NA
    ( ^_^ )

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  • Korah_Eaglecry
    Korah_Eaglecry
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    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact (UESP likes to call it the First Daggerfall Covenant but in game books go into further detail) . And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion (est. 2E 580) didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact (est. sometime between 2E 272 - 2E 276) and the Daggerfall Covenant (est. around or shortly after 2E 566) did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.
    Edited by Korah_Eaglecry on March 13, 2019 6:34AM
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  • Lyserus
    Lyserus
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    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact. And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact and the Daggerfall Covenant did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.

    I believe in the chronicle written by Abnur Tharn he said "The war was long and bloody", after revising some books I do agree that the Tharns and Nibeny may have aided Varen in the war, but there is no way that in a long war Leovic didn't have any reinforcement. For a long and bloody war Leovic must had enough support in Cyrodiil, and it's very likely there is reinforcement from reach land.

    Varen didn't mention how he became emperor at all, he didn't like to mention the past, so him not mentioning DC is not a proof.

    Tho there is a chance that DC was dealing with reachmen from reach land without communication with Varen, thus only indirectly aided Varen in his war

    But still, considering the purpose of DC and the timeline, DC helping Varen is a big possibility
  • Korah_Eaglecry
    Korah_Eaglecry
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    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact. And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact and the Daggerfall Covenant did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.

    I believe in the chronicle written by Abnur Tharn he said "The war was long and bloody", after revising some books I do agree that the Tharns and Nibeny may have aided Varen in the war, but there is no way that in a long war Leovic didn't have any reinforcement. For a long and bloody war Leovic must had enough support in Cyrodiil, and it's very likely there is reinforcement from reach land.

    Varen didn't mention how he became emperor at all, he didn't like to mention the past, so him not mentioning DC is not a proof.

    Tho there is a chance that DC was dealing with reachmen from reach land without communication with Varen, thus only indirectly aided Varen in his war

    But still, considering the purpose of DC and the timeline, DC helping Varen is a big possibility

    ...Its also not proof that the Daggerfall Covenant was involved with Varen retaking the Imperial City. And while I havent seen the comment from Tharn about the war. It only took a year for Varen to defeat Leovic (as Varen still needed to go on a quest for the Amulet for a few years before the Soulburst in 2E 588 or 2E 589). So maybe for Tharn it was long and bloody but timeline wise it was quite short (2E 576- 2E 577). And often enough with these wars only a handful of battles might have been needed. Varens conquest could have cut down numerous armies that Leovic sent his way before sacking the Imperial City. Most modern day wars might see numerous battles span weeks or months in a short span of time. But wars like the ones youd encounter in Tamriel would probably be over the course of a year, probably during the fighting season which would exclude winter, and have a handful of actual battles that might span a few days or weeks at most not including any sieges. While its possible a Reachman army might have made its way into Cyrodiil from High Rock, you would think with the scandal that was the Longhouse Emperors these kinds of facts would have made it on to paper or into some song of sorts.

    And its not like Emeric would pass up an opportunity to legitimize his Alliances claim to the Imperial Throne if he had in fact backed Varen for the throne. With an Alliance of Elves and Khajiit and Nords, Dunmer and Argonians. Emeric supporting Varen and then Varen "dying" would leave Emeric the chance to claim he was better suited to sit the throne than either of the other two alliances.

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  • Aliyavana
    Aliyavana
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    Fun fact, Varen dies at the end of orsinium even if you didn't sacrifice him, so if you want to keep the most companions alive you should sacrifice Varen.
    Edited by Aliyavana on March 13, 2019 7:06AM
  • Seraphayel
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    Wing wrote: »
    First DC emp and he almost ruined the world, nice guy.

    right, cannot let that happen again.

    Yeah that's why the drunken viking or the naive girl should become Emperor... not.
    Edited by Seraphayel on March 13, 2019 7:12AM
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    Aldmeri Dominion
    - Khajiit Arcanist -
  • Lyserus
    Lyserus
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    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact. And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact and the Daggerfall Covenant did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.

    I believe in the chronicle written by Abnur Tharn he said "The war was long and bloody", after revising some books I do agree that the Tharns and Nibeny may have aided Varen in the war, but there is no way that in a long war Leovic didn't have any reinforcement. For a long and bloody war Leovic must had enough support in Cyrodiil, and it's very likely there is reinforcement from reach land.

    Varen didn't mention how he became emperor at all, he didn't like to mention the past, so him not mentioning DC is not a proof.

    Tho there is a chance that DC was dealing with reachmen from reach land without communication with Varen, thus only indirectly aided Varen in his war

    But still, considering the purpose of DC and the timeline, DC helping Varen is a big possibility

    ...Its also not proof that the Daggerfall Covenant was involved with Varen retaking the Imperial City. And while I havent seen the comment from Tharn about the war. It only took a year for Varen to defeat Leovic (as Varen still needed to go on a quest for the Amulet for a few years before the Soulburst in 2E 588 or 2E 589). So maybe for Tharn it was long and bloody but timeline wise it was quite short (2E 576- 2E 577). And often enough with these wars only a handful of battles might have been needed. Varens conquest could have cut down numerous armies that Leovic sent his way before sacking the Imperial City. Most modern day wars might see numerous battles span weeks or months in a short span of time. But wars like the ones youd encounter in Tamriel would probably be over the course of a year, probably during the fighting season which would exclude winter, and have a handful of actual battles that might span a few days or weeks at most not including any sieges. While its possible a Reachman army might have made its way into Cyrodiil from High Rock, you would think with the scandal that was the Longhouse Emperors these kinds of facts would have made it on to paper or into some song of sorts.

    And its not like Emeric would pass up an opportunity to legitimize his Alliances claim to the Imperial Throne if he had in fact backed Varen for the throne. With an Alliance of Elves and Khajiit and Nords, Dunmer and Argonians. Emeric supporting Varen and then Varen "dying" would leave Emeric the chance to claim he was better suited to sit the throne than either of the other two alliances.
    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Varen Aquilarios had no ties to Daggerfall/Wayrest nor High Rock altogether politically, and Colovia also has no ties to the Covenant. Varen was squarely Imperial, wanting the throne of the Empire.

    I dont see how the Covenant can mooch off him.

    The goal of DC is to revive the great Reman empire again, bring stability to tamriel. Since there is no dragonblood indivisual we know during this time period, a colovian ally is the best candidate DC can get to put on a throne, especially the candidate already have support from colovia an nibeny

    Also, I don't think there is a source about when did Varen started the war, if there is please show me.
    2E576 is only the year Varen succeed, there is no indication that Varen started the rebellion that year, he might started the war anywhere between 576 and 566 (this is the year Leovic visited Anvil)

    And this is just a theory, I said there is the possibility, not saying this is the absolute fact
  • thedovahmon
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    Wing wrote: »
    First DC emp and he almost ruined the world, nice guy.

    right, cannot let that happen again.

    This is why the Ruby Throne is better off in Pact hands.
    "Voted most likely to reply with a reaction image. According to the Mournhold High School Yearbook."
  • susmitds
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    Wing wrote: »
    First DC emp and he almost ruined the world, nice guy.

    right, cannot let that happen again.

    This is why the Ruby Throne is better off in Pact hands.

    Nah, those drunkards have no right to any throne. Dominion will reclaim the throne to Tamriel once again.
    Edited by susmitds on March 13, 2019 10:29AM
  • starkerealm
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    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Varen Aquilarios had no ties to Daggerfall/Wayrest nor High Rock altogether politically, and Colovia also has no ties to the Covenant. Varen was squarely Imperial, wanting the throne of the Empire.

    I dont see how the Covenant can mooch off him.

    Yeah, that's where I come out. Varen was one of the Colovian Kings. Colovia is a mess of minor kings and princes scattered across Western Cyrodiil (stretching between the Gold Coast and the boarders of Cyrodiil in game. But, this was neither Covenant, nor Dominion, territory, historically. Now, it's possible that one of those powers has seized control of that territory since the Soulburst, but that wouldn't retroactively make Varen a representative, much less a sovereign, of the Daggerfall Covenant.

    It's like saying that Tiber Septum is the first Daggerfall Covenant Emperor. Yes, he was born in the Alcair region of High Rock, but at that point the Covenant was a historical footnote, and he certainly didn't campaign for the Covenant.

    I mean, that's the real problem with this interpretation: Varen didn't fight for the Covenant; he fought to restore the Alessian dynasty. Remember, when he's asking to become a Dragonborn, he's not asking to simply gain the soul of a Dragon, he's specifically asking to be accepted into her bloodline. (With a minor caveat: it's been a few minutes since I ran that phase of the quest and listening to the dialog.)
  • thedovahmon
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    susmitds wrote: »
    Wing wrote: »
    First DC emp and he almost ruined the world, nice guy.

    right, cannot let that happen again.

    This is why the Ruby Throne is better off in Pact hands.

    Nah, those drunkards have no right to any throne. Dominion will reclaim the throne to Tamriel once again.

    We'll see about that ya sorry excuse of a Netch Fart with Butterknife ears- Blood for the Pact!
    "Voted most likely to reply with a reaction image. According to the Mournhold High School Yearbook."
  • Korah_Eaglecry
    Korah_Eaglecry
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    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact. And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact and the Daggerfall Covenant did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.

    I believe in the chronicle written by Abnur Tharn he said "The war was long and bloody", after revising some books I do agree that the Tharns and Nibeny may have aided Varen in the war, but there is no way that in a long war Leovic didn't have any reinforcement. For a long and bloody war Leovic must had enough support in Cyrodiil, and it's very likely there is reinforcement from reach land.

    Varen didn't mention how he became emperor at all, he didn't like to mention the past, so him not mentioning DC is not a proof.

    Tho there is a chance that DC was dealing with reachmen from reach land without communication with Varen, thus only indirectly aided Varen in his war

    But still, considering the purpose of DC and the timeline, DC helping Varen is a big possibility

    ...Its also not proof that the Daggerfall Covenant was involved with Varen retaking the Imperial City. And while I havent seen the comment from Tharn about the war. It only took a year for Varen to defeat Leovic (as Varen still needed to go on a quest for the Amulet for a few years before the Soulburst in 2E 588 or 2E 589). So maybe for Tharn it was long and bloody but timeline wise it was quite short (2E 576- 2E 577). And often enough with these wars only a handful of battles might have been needed. Varens conquest could have cut down numerous armies that Leovic sent his way before sacking the Imperial City. Most modern day wars might see numerous battles span weeks or months in a short span of time. But wars like the ones youd encounter in Tamriel would probably be over the course of a year, probably during the fighting season which would exclude winter, and have a handful of actual battles that might span a few days or weeks at most not including any sieges. While its possible a Reachman army might have made its way into Cyrodiil from High Rock, you would think with the scandal that was the Longhouse Emperors these kinds of facts would have made it on to paper or into some song of sorts.

    And its not like Emeric would pass up an opportunity to legitimize his Alliances claim to the Imperial Throne if he had in fact backed Varen for the throne. With an Alliance of Elves and Khajiit and Nords, Dunmer and Argonians. Emeric supporting Varen and then Varen "dying" would leave Emeric the chance to claim he was better suited to sit the throne than either of the other two alliances.
    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Varen Aquilarios had no ties to Daggerfall/Wayrest nor High Rock altogether politically, and Colovia also has no ties to the Covenant. Varen was squarely Imperial, wanting the throne of the Empire.

    I dont see how the Covenant can mooch off him.

    The goal of DC is to revive the great Reman empire again, bring stability to tamriel. Since there is no dragonblood indivisual we know during this time period, a colovian ally is the best candidate DC can get to put on a throne, especially the candidate already have support from colovia an nibeny

    Also, I don't think there is a source about when did Varen started the war, if there is please show me.
    2E576 is only the year Varen succeed, there is no indication that Varen started the rebellion that year, he might started the war anywhere between 576 and 566 (this is the year Leovic visited Anvil)

    And this is just a theory, I said there is the possibility, not saying this is the absolute fact

    The source is The Pirate Queen of the Gold Coast.

    Your title flat out states that your opinion is rooted in facts that establish a connection between the Daggerfall Covenant and Varen. When there is none to be found.
    Penniless Sellsword Company
    Captain Paramount - Jorrhaq Vhent
    Korith Eaglecry * Enrerion Aedihle * Laerinel Rhaev * Caius Berilius * Seylina Ithvala * H'Vak the Grimjawl
    Tenarei Rhaev * Dazsh Ro Khar * Yynril Rothvani * Bathes-In-Coin * Anaelle Faerniil * Azjani Ma'Les
    Aban Shahid Bakr * Kheshna gra-Gharbuk * Gallisten Bondurant * Etain Maquier * Atsu Kalame * Faulpia Severinus
    What is better, to be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort? - Paarthurnax
  • Dracan_Fontom
    Dracan_Fontom
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    Technically EP wins the war... Hail Talos!
  • starkerealm
    starkerealm
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    @Lyserus, that's probably a better title.
  • Silver_Strider
    Silver_Strider
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    So.....
    What I'm hearing is that DC is responsible for the Planemeld.

    Talk about incompetence.
    Argonian forever
  • MaisonNaevius
    MaisonNaevius
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    Technically EP wins the war... Hail Talos!

    In fact no. I do not know if EP exists at the end of the second Era.
    Talos was a general of Colovian Estates of King Cuhlecain. Cuhlecain is the king of Falkreath, part of Colovia much later after ESO (and who will return to Skyrim after).
    > Wiki spécialisé sur la Légion impériale dans ESO <
    http://teslegionimperiale.blogspot.com/

    > Wiki sur les colonies et personnalités politiques impériales dans ESO <
    https://tesocyrodiil.blogspot.com/

    > Cyrodiil de l'Info <
    https://cyrodiildelinfo.blogspot.com/

    - Naevius-
  • starkerealm
    starkerealm
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    Technically EP wins the war... Hail Talos!

    Uh, no. The Nord who would eventually become Tiber Septum, and then Talos came from the Alcair region of High Rock. So, not really, IN Skyrim.
  • idk
    idk
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    First DC emp and he almost ruined the world, nice guy.

    Actually, it as Manimarco that almost ruined it.

    Varen was just a pawn in the deception like the rest of the companions of the time. Then again, what should one really expect of an Altmer but to attempt to lay ruin to the world?
    Edited by idk on March 14, 2019 10:30AM
  • starkerealm
    starkerealm
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    idk wrote: »
    First DC emp and he almost ruined the world, nice guy.

    Actually, it as Manimarco that almost ruined it.

    Varen was just a pawn in the deception like the rest of the companions of the time. Then again, what should one really expect of an Altmer but to attempt to lay ruin to the world?

    Minor detail: It's possible that Manimarco (and Vanus) are Aldmer, not Altmer. I've run across conflicting info on this subject, so it's not 100% clear.
  • Nagastani
    Nagastani
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    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact. And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact and the Daggerfall Covenant did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.

    I believe in the chronicle written by Abnur Tharn he said "The war was long and bloody", after revising some books I do agree that the Tharns and Nibeny may have aided Varen in the war, but there is no way that in a long war Leovic didn't have any reinforcement. For a long and bloody war Leovic must had enough support in Cyrodiil, and it's very likely there is reinforcement from reach land.

    Varen didn't mention how he became emperor at all, he didn't like to mention the past, so him not mentioning DC is not a proof.

    Tho there is a chance that DC was dealing with reachmen from reach land without communication with Varen, thus only indirectly aided Varen in his war

    But still, considering the purpose of DC and the timeline, DC helping Varen is a big possibility

    ...Its also not proof that the Daggerfall Covenant was involved with Varen retaking the Imperial City. And while I havent seen the comment from Tharn about the war. It only took a year for Varen to defeat Leovic (as Varen still needed to go on a quest for the Amulet for a few years before the Soulburst in 2E 588 or 2E 589). So maybe for Tharn it was long and bloody but timeline wise it was quite short (2E 576- 2E 577). And often enough with these wars only a handful of battles might have been needed. Varens conquest could have cut down numerous armies that Leovic sent his way before sacking the Imperial City. Most modern day wars might see numerous battles span weeks or months in a short span of time. But wars like the ones youd encounter in Tamriel would probably be over the course of a year, probably during the fighting season which would exclude winter, and have a handful of actual battles that might span a few days or weeks at most not including any sieges. While its possible a Reachman army might have made its way into Cyrodiil from High Rock, you would think with the scandal that was the Longhouse Emperors these kinds of facts would have made it on to paper or into some song of sorts.

    And its not like Emeric would pass up an opportunity to legitimize his Alliances claim to the Imperial Throne if he had in fact backed Varen for the throne. With an Alliance of Elves and Khajiit and Nords, Dunmer and Argonians. Emeric supporting Varen and then Varen "dying" would leave Emeric the chance to claim he was better suited to sit the throne than either of the other two alliances.
    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Varen Aquilarios had no ties to Daggerfall/Wayrest nor High Rock altogether politically, and Colovia also has no ties to the Covenant. Varen was squarely Imperial, wanting the throne of the Empire.

    I dont see how the Covenant can mooch off him.

    The goal of DC is to revive the great Reman empire again, bring stability to tamriel. Since there is no dragonblood indivisual we know during this time period, a colovian ally is the best candidate DC can get to put on a throne, especially the candidate already have support from colovia an nibeny

    Also, I don't think there is a source about when did Varen started the war, if there is please show me.
    2E576 is only the year Varen succeed, there is no indication that Varen started the rebellion that year, he might started the war anywhere between 576 and 566 (this is the year Leovic visited Anvil)

    And this is just a theory, I said there is the possibility, not saying this is the absolute fact

    The source is The Pirate Queen of the Gold Coast.

    Your title flat out states that your opinion is rooted in facts that establish a connection between the Daggerfall Covenant and Varen. When there is none to be found.

    Actually there kind of is.

    https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Daggerfall_Covenant
    http://teso.mmorpg-life.com/true-heirs-of-the-empire-lorebook/

    So obviously while Emperor Varen wasn't a DC noble, it's a situation where the DC nobles 'followed' him. There are several references in game to DC wanting to restore Varen's Empire and other language that suggests how DC politics followed Varen's Imperial policies and were willing to fight and die to have them restored, let alone liberate Cyrodiil.

    "...One land! One Emperor!" There's more to this statement than you think

  • OtarTheMad
    OtarTheMad
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    Technically EP wins the war... Hail Talos!

    Uh, no. The Nord who would eventually become Tiber Septum, and then Talos came from the Alcair region of High Rock. So, not really, IN Skyrim.

    They won't commit to a backstory for him. Although a year or two ago I found an interview on Imperial Library where a Bethesda person said that he was Atmoran. UESP backs this up but I can't find the interview anymore.

    From UESP:
    Tiber Septim was born in Atmora under the name Talos, meaning "Stormcrown" in the old Ehlnofey
  • RaddlemanNumber7
    RaddlemanNumber7
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    The lore indicates that Tiber Septim had multiple identities prior to his accession. Even after the Imperial administration had finished tidying up the Second Era there was still some evidence of that.

    This can only mean one thing. The Vestige is fated to become Tiber Septim, every single one of them.
    PC EU
  • Lyserus
    Lyserus
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    Reposted for formatting, ignore
    Edited by Lyserus on May 23, 2021 12:34PM
  • Lyserus
    Lyserus
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    ✭✭
    Nagastani wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact. And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact and the Daggerfall Covenant did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.

    I believe in the chronicle written by Abnur Tharn he said "The war was long and bloody", after revising some books I do agree that the Tharns and Nibeny may have aided Varen in the war, but there is no way that in a long war Leovic didn't have any reinforcement. For a long and bloody war Leovic must had enough support in Cyrodiil, and it's very likely there is reinforcement from reach land.

    Varen didn't mention how he became emperor at all, he didn't like to mention the past, so him not mentioning DC is not a proof.

    Tho there is a chance that DC was dealing with reachmen from reach land without communication with Varen, thus only indirectly aided Varen in his war

    But still, considering the purpose of DC and the timeline, DC helping Varen is a big possibility

    ...Its also not proof that the Daggerfall Covenant was involved with Varen retaking the Imperial City. And while I havent seen the comment from Tharn about the war. It only took a year for Varen to defeat Leovic (as Varen still needed to go on a quest for the Amulet for a few years before the Soulburst in 2E 588 or 2E 589). So maybe for Tharn it was long and bloody but timeline wise it was quite short (2E 576- 2E 577). And often enough with these wars only a handful of battles might have been needed. Varens conquest could have cut down numerous armies that Leovic sent his way before sacking the Imperial City. Most modern day wars might see numerous battles span weeks or months in a short span of time. But wars like the ones youd encounter in Tamriel would probably be over the course of a year, probably during the fighting season which would exclude winter, and have a handful of actual battles that might span a few days or weeks at most not including any sieges. While its possible a Reachman army might have made its way into Cyrodiil from High Rock, you would think with the scandal that was the Longhouse Emperors these kinds of facts would have made it on to paper or into some song of sorts.

    And its not like Emeric would pass up an opportunity to legitimize his Alliances claim to the Imperial Throne if he had in fact backed Varen for the throne. With an Alliance of Elves and Khajiit and Nords, Dunmer and Argonians. Emeric supporting Varen and then Varen "dying" would leave Emeric the chance to claim he was better suited to sit the throne than either of the other two alliances.
    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Varen Aquilarios had no ties to Daggerfall/Wayrest nor High Rock altogether politically, and Colovia also has no ties to the Covenant. Varen was squarely Imperial, wanting the throne of the Empire.

    I dont see how the Covenant can mooch off him.

    The goal of DC is to revive the great Reman empire again, bring stability to tamriel. Since there is no dragonblood indivisual we know during this time period, a colovian ally is the best candidate DC can get to put on a throne, especially the candidate already have support from colovia an nibeny

    Also, I don't think there is a source about when did Varen started the war, if there is please show me.
    2E576 is only the year Varen succeed, there is no indication that Varen started the rebellion that year, he might started the war anywhere between 576 and 566 (this is the year Leovic visited Anvil)

    And this is just a theory, I said there is the possibility, not saying this is the absolute fact

    The source is The Pirate Queen of the Gold Coast.

    Your title flat out states that your opinion is rooted in facts that establish a connection between the Daggerfall Covenant and Varen. When there is none to be found.

    Actually there kind of is.

    https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Daggerfall_Covenant
    http://teso.mmorpg-life.com/true-heirs-of-the-empire-lorebook/

    So obviously while Emperor Varen wasn't a DC noble, it's a situation where the DC nobles 'followed' him. There are several references in game to DC wanting to restore Varen's Empire and other language that suggests how DC politics followed Varen's Imperial policies and were willing to fight and die to have them restored, let alone liberate Cyrodiil.

    "...One land! One Emperor!" There's more to this statement than you think

    ohh thank you for reviving this thread of mine :p Glad to see there are people still like to discuss the lore of this game!

    aye and the quote in the book (for anyone too lazy to click the link) are:
    In 2E 578, Emeric had already concluded a treaty with Emperor Varen Aquilarios, until his disappearance which resulted in Cyrodiil falling to the Daedra-worshippers.
    Even the once-promising Emperor Varen fell victim to Daedric corruption, his reforms swept away by the puppet-masters of the Daedric Cabal.


    DC called the emperor Varen "promising" and mentioned his "reforms", this is enough proof to say that at least DC approves Varen and his reign.

    Whether they supported Varen in his initial war is still theoritical admittentedly, but i would still say that it is a very likely possibility due to:
    1. DC want the empire to be rebuilt
    2. DC approves Varen and his acts.
    3. DC and Varen share the same enemy, long house emperors
    4. DC is really close to reachmen (Leovic's ally) and all three races are not on good terms with them
    Edited by Lyserus on May 23, 2021 12:35PM
  • Nomadic_Atmoran
    Nomadic_Atmoran
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nagastani wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    Lyserus wrote: »
    The first DC, consist of purely breton city states (and led by a unnamed Gardner King), was established in 2E542, even before Jorunn and Ayrenn are born (And this is the time that Moricar succeed the emperor because his father Durcorach the Black Drake is killed by Emeric

    2E543, Orsinium is given back to orcs, making breton and orcs friendly

    We know nothing about what happened exactly in the next 17 years, up until 2E560 the Knahaten Flu broke out, DC and rest of Tamriel probably had their hands full with the flu, and 3 years later 2E563 Emeric is crowned due to the death of Gardner King

    2E566, Ranser war broke out and it is finished next year, 2E567 the 2nd DC (the one we know of) is established, led by High King Emeric, and around this time Moricar is died and Leovic succeed as the emperor

    We do not know when did Leovic make the act to legalize daedric worship, but at 2E576 he was already overthrown by Varen Aquilarios.

    So 10 years after DC is established a new "normal" emperor is finally installed on the ruby throne, which give or take with DC needing to recover from Ranser's war and make sure the new alliance is solid, is probably just around the time DC was able to use their strength to overthrown the Longhouse emperor

    Also, Varen was the duke of Chorrol, which is under the protection of Fort Rayles, which around this time is controlled by DC.
    And don't forget the fact that tho Varen is a duke, his strength doesn't go beyond his town and his nephew in Kvatch is paying close attention to the pirate queen of Anvil so he probably didn't help, and even tho Abnur suggested the Tharns helped Varen, Clivia was the wife of Leovic up until Leovic is killed.

    With all this, it is quite possible that Varen had outside help from DC, and used DC army and his own Colovian army to overthrown Leovic while Nibeny probably didn't do much. Don't forget that the area between Orsinium and West Skyrim is filled with reachman and they were still attacking DC at 2E582-3 (both in north Bankorai and Orsinium), so Varen at the very least needed an army to secure his own northern border

    So yeah, DC is awesome :)

    So the Daggerfall Covenant was actually more like a Trade Agreement that evolved into a sort of Tamrielified NATO pact. And Ransers War solidified that pact into an Alliance.

    Now by the time Varen marched for the Imperial City, Tamriel looked very similar to the way it does in game. The Aldmeri Dominion didnt yet exist but the Ebonheart Pact and the Daggerfall Covenant did. And the rest of Tamriel is broken up into independent kingdoms and city states. But there is absolutely no evidence in the lore or in the game that suggests that the Daggerfall Covenant provided aid or troops to Varens war. Thats not to say Emeric would not have supported Varen, as he had no love for the Longhouse Emperors and surely would prefer an Imperial on the throne over a Reachman. But it is a fact that Varen turned to Abnur Tharn as an ally in his campaign to seize the throne and return it to Imperial hands. And Varen himself at no point and time speaks of the Daggerfall Covenant or Emeric providing him aid in his quest when he recounts his life story while he helps the Vestige defeat Molag Bal.

    Its more likely that because of the fractured state of Tamriel, the issues smaller kingdoms were facing at the time, and the two newly established alliances consolidating their power. That Varen and Tharn were able to attack the Imperial City without having to worry about Leovic receiving reinforcements and didnt need aid in rallying the Imperials to his side.

    I believe in the chronicle written by Abnur Tharn he said "The war was long and bloody", after revising some books I do agree that the Tharns and Nibeny may have aided Varen in the war, but there is no way that in a long war Leovic didn't have any reinforcement. For a long and bloody war Leovic must had enough support in Cyrodiil, and it's very likely there is reinforcement from reach land.

    Varen didn't mention how he became emperor at all, he didn't like to mention the past, so him not mentioning DC is not a proof.

    Tho there is a chance that DC was dealing with reachmen from reach land without communication with Varen, thus only indirectly aided Varen in his war

    But still, considering the purpose of DC and the timeline, DC helping Varen is a big possibility

    ...Its also not proof that the Daggerfall Covenant was involved with Varen retaking the Imperial City. And while I havent seen the comment from Tharn about the war. It only took a year for Varen to defeat Leovic (as Varen still needed to go on a quest for the Amulet for a few years before the Soulburst in 2E 588 or 2E 589). So maybe for Tharn it was long and bloody but timeline wise it was quite short (2E 576- 2E 577). And often enough with these wars only a handful of battles might have been needed. Varens conquest could have cut down numerous armies that Leovic sent his way before sacking the Imperial City. Most modern day wars might see numerous battles span weeks or months in a short span of time. But wars like the ones youd encounter in Tamriel would probably be over the course of a year, probably during the fighting season which would exclude winter, and have a handful of actual battles that might span a few days or weeks at most not including any sieges. While its possible a Reachman army might have made its way into Cyrodiil from High Rock, you would think with the scandal that was the Longhouse Emperors these kinds of facts would have made it on to paper or into some song of sorts.

    And its not like Emeric would pass up an opportunity to legitimize his Alliances claim to the Imperial Throne if he had in fact backed Varen for the throne. With an Alliance of Elves and Khajiit and Nords, Dunmer and Argonians. Emeric supporting Varen and then Varen "dying" would leave Emeric the chance to claim he was better suited to sit the throne than either of the other two alliances.
    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Varen Aquilarios had no ties to Daggerfall/Wayrest nor High Rock altogether politically, and Colovia also has no ties to the Covenant. Varen was squarely Imperial, wanting the throne of the Empire.

    I dont see how the Covenant can mooch off him.

    The goal of DC is to revive the great Reman empire again, bring stability to tamriel. Since there is no dragonblood indivisual we know during this time period, a colovian ally is the best candidate DC can get to put on a throne, especially the candidate already have support from colovia an nibeny

    Also, I don't think there is a source about when did Varen started the war, if there is please show me.
    2E576 is only the year Varen succeed, there is no indication that Varen started the rebellion that year, he might started the war anywhere between 576 and 566 (this is the year Leovic visited Anvil)

    And this is just a theory, I said there is the possibility, not saying this is the absolute fact

    The source is The Pirate Queen of the Gold Coast.

    Your title flat out states that your opinion is rooted in facts that establish a connection between the Daggerfall Covenant and Varen. When there is none to be found.

    Actually there kind of is.

    https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Daggerfall_Covenant
    http://teso.mmorpg-life.com/true-heirs-of-the-empire-lorebook/

    So obviously while Emperor Varen wasn't a DC noble, it's a situation where the DC nobles 'followed' him. There are several references in game to DC wanting to restore Varen's Empire and other language that suggests how DC politics followed Varen's Imperial policies and were willing to fight and die to have them restored, let alone liberate Cyrodiil.

    "...One land! One Emperor!" There's more to this statement than you think

    There are no such references to following Varen. They may have shared some similar beliefs but that is far from "following" even in the most loose of definitions. The Daggerfall Covenant is fighting for the throne and feel they need to better solidify their claim by drawing parallels to the Reman Dynasty. Its a call to arms. A propaganda piece.

    Neither of your links establish anything more than what the Daggerfall Covenant claim to believe. But it does not link them through bloodline or treaty to Varen or even the Remans.
    Penniless Sellsword Company
    Captain Paramount Jorrhaq Vhent
    Korith Eaglecry - Laerinel Rhaev - Enrerion - Caius Berilius - Seylina Ithvala - Signa Squallrider - H'Vak the Grimjawl
    Yynril Rothvani - Tenarei Rhaev - Bathes-In-Coin - Dazsh Ro Khar - Aredyhel - Reads-To-Frogs - Azjani Ma'Les
    Kheshna gra-Gharbuk - Gallisten Bondurant - Aban Shahid Bakr - Etain Maquier - Atsu Kalame - Faulpia Severinus
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