Lv 50 (or any other) as max level instead of CP 160?

Avrael

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/461022/idea-level-100-as-max-level-instead-of-cp-160/p1

My other thread didnt really make clear what my main point was. English isnt my first language, forgive me if i formulate something wrong.
I didnt just want lv 100, i wanted to disconnect the normal levels from the CP-System and make only those normal levels the requirement for equipment, items, consumables and enemies. I didnt want to bind it to any specific number, lv 100 just sounded nice to my OCD.

So here ill discuss basically the same idea, but with lv 50, or really ANY normal level, instead of lv 100, so noone gets stuck at the "Lv 100 is a bad idea" part, which i agree upon now.
For most of finer details, see my other post, even if its probably not nessecary at all. I just want to write less here, and probably only need to write less too.

But for a bit of detail, here the short version: I dont like that there are so many "max levels". Lv 50 as the normal level cap. CP 160 as the equipment and enemie cap. Potions are still only for CP 150. Food ranges everywhere between Lv 1 and CP 160. Max CP to get points for is 810 atm, max CP i hear its 3600, maybe unlimited, i really dont know.

So tell me, does that sound optimal to you? Here is what i would call at least better:

Max lv 50 for everything! CP only as a Bonus-System AFTER the normal levels (like Paragon points in Diablo or something), i wont say a number here because im not informed enough on it.
I would say maybe truly unlimited, and make it scale much lower with every level spent. And by that i mean the entire system, not just specific trees or skills. For instance, when you would put points into one skill, all other skills would ALSO scale lower at that point, so you cant just softcap absolutley all passives. But again, dont take this too seriously, this scaling is just an idea i pulled out my back, it may be completley terrible, idk.


Feel free to discuss and please dont get caught in unimportant things... again...

Tabbycat

No, keep everything as it is

It really isn't that bad to get the Champion points, to be honest. You get a ton of enlightenment to help you along and then if you get the bonus xp from scrolls/potions or events to stack with enlightenment, they fly by really fast.

Edit to add:

Since all areas including your character (regardless of level) have been scaled up to I think CH160, players who have difficulty beating content will have no way of getting better to complete said content if there isn't a way for them to get stronger. That strength is provided through Champion points. Before everything was effectively the same level, if you ran into difficult content, you could just wait it out until you were a higher level and then go back and do it. You can't do that anymore. So your only recourse, especially after reaching max level and maybe golding out what equipment you have, is to get stronger through the Champion Point system so you can go back and complete what you struggled with before. This needs to be in place because there's always going to be players who think the difficulty of content is too easy and some who think it is too hard. Champion points effectively allow players to change the level of difficulty of the content they are playing. Too easy? Use fewer champion points. Too hard, do something to earn more of them and try again.

Avrael

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

No, my point isnt to REACH the CP... darn, am i really that hard to understand?

Nestor

The leveling system in the game is not cohesive because of the history of the levels with Vet Ranks and how CPs were introduced.

However, the goofiness of this exists only for the first character that levels to CP160. Afterthat,every character that hits L50 is automatically at the CP level for the account. So, really, the only thing weird is the numbers.

Now compared to before, where every alt had to be leveled to the game cap going through millions of exp per level, this is much better.

Should the numbers change? Maybe. Will it really change anything in the game if they do? Probably not. You will still have to earn some arbitrary amount of experience to gain end game levels, with more experience needed for the first character, and less for subsequent alts.

Edaphon

No, keep everything as it is

Avrael wrote: »

My other thread didnt really make clear what my main point was.

Neither does this thread, I'm afraid.

ArchMikem

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

I actually like removing gear level requirements from Champion Points. It would help would be crafters.

zaria

No, keep everything as it is

Nestor wrote: »

The leveling system in the game is not cohesive because of the history of the levels with Vet Ranks and how CPs were introduced.

However, the goofiness of this exists only for the first character that levels to CP160. Afterthat,every character that hits L50 is automatically at the CP level for the account. So, really, the only thing weird is the numbers.

Now compared to before, where every alt had to be leveled to the game cap going through millions of exp per level, this is much better.

Should the numbers change? Maybe. Will it really change anything in the game if they do? Probably not. You will still have to earn some arbitrary amount of experience to gain end game levels, with more experience needed for the first character, and less for subsequent alts.

CP makes ESO very alt friendly, yes you still need skillpoints and lore books but this can be gathered while leveling up to 50.
Reducing the number of crafting levels between cp10 and 160 makes lots of sense however.

profundidob16_ESO

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Avrael wrote: »

No, my point isnt to REACH the CP... darn, am i really that hard to understand?

I'm afraid so...I'll try to clarify your point of view. Currently on live settings are:

Character level ranges from level 1 + CP0 until level 50 + CP810
Item level ranges from level 1 + CP0 until level 50 + CP160

you propose this change:

Character level ranges from level 1 + CP0 until level 50 + CP810
Item level ranges from level 1 + CP0 until level 50 + CP0


because the numbers trigger your OCD and the change would make everything simpler and easier.

I agree.

barney2525

No, keep everything as it is

I'm not sure why you think there is a big difference between level 50 and level 50/160 CP

160 CP does not create a huge power difference (as you have to split the 160 into 3 categories), but it does give an advantage over flat level 50. But since it is Not huge, using 50/160 works just as well as for the "Top of the Line" as a flat 50.

And as has been noted, it really does not take a whole lot of effort to get to 160. If my non-combat Khajiit Magicka Templar Master Crafter can make 50/270, anyone can make 50/160 - IMHO.

Raammzzaa

No, keep everything as it is

Just why?

Wolfchild07

They're planning to...one day...redesign CP's anyway. They might be gone completely for all we know. I guess we have to just wait and see what happens.

Avrael

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

barney2525 wrote: »

I'm not sure why you think there is a big difference between level 50 and level 50/160 CP

160 CP does not create a huge power difference (as you have to split the 160 into 3 categories), but it does give an advantage over flat level 50. But since it is Not huge, using 50/160 works just as well as for the "Top of the Line" as a flat 50.

And as has been noted, it really does not take a whole lot of effort to get to 160. If my non-combat Khajiit Magicka Templar Master Crafter can make 50/270, anyone can make 50/160 - IMHO.

... thats exactly my point. CP 160 isnt even CLOSE to flat lv 50! There are like 10 tiers of gear/food/potion level diffrence. Just go try to do anything with lv 50 gear and tell me your expirience, just... try it.

And AGAIN, my point is NOT the effort of GETTING to CP 160, thats really damn easy, i know that, im not complaining about that, stop mentioning that! Im CP 832 atm, and im not even complaining about that! Im complaining that CP 160 is treated as a normal level (also nothing above that). Only up to lv 50 should be treated as a "normal" level, for gear, for monsters, for everything imo.

Merlight

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Seems Veteran Ranks weren't that bad after all, huh?

DeadlyRecluse

Other Option

I would have no problem if they "squished" the character progression tied to CP ranks 10-160 into the 1-50 progression and scaled all CP gear down to 50.

The CP-tiered gear is a relic of the old vet ranks system, and doesn't necessarily make a ton of sense. It's one of the things about ESO that is always funny when explaining it to new players:

"Yeah, max level is 50, but they you gain CP, and every 10 CP is kind of a new level, but only the first 160 CP/16 ranks. And the CP cap is 800+. It goes back to veteran ranks and Cadwell's gold..."


...that being said, the current system is perfectly serviceable, and I don't see a good argument for an exhaustive reworking of it.

Rikumaru

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Gear imo should be scaled to level 50. I can imagine how frustrating it must be to wait to get any gear until CP 160 for new players. In BDO you don't ever need to wait for levels to equip gear (minus awakened), you only need to actually have the equipment. As for the level, level 50 looks much better than CP 160 imo.

Avrael

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

@Rikumaru Yes, ill admit that the main reason i started this topic is, because it looks better. It doesnt even have to make more sense, it LOOKS like it makes more sense. Say what you want, for me personally aesthetic is important in a game. You wouldnt run around in starter gear dyed crap brown either if you have the choice... probably... i mean you could...
And because CP 10-150 gear gets pretty much never used. Per account one time on one character, after that never again. and GUESS how much CP 10-150 materials i have on my account... honestly im not willing to count them. Ill NEVER use them EVER again. It makes no sense. Or all the lower food and drink recepies... who uses them? Right, absolutley noone. There are surely over 500 recepies in the game that NEVER get used!

Demra

I am currently cp 130 and it is super tedious to get to 160 as every 10 cp i keep getting weaker as i outlevel my gear and it is pointless to collect sets. I get even more annoyed when i get a great piece set with the right trait at cp130. Its like what's even the point. This 10-160 grind is a nightmare as i am having to do a bunch of stuff i don't really enjoy just cause it give more exp. And when you search for items in guild store you have to type 150-160 instead of just clicking max level.

Merlight

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Avrael wrote: »

Say what you want, for me personally aesthetic is important in a game. You wouldnt run around in starter gear dyed crap brown either if you have the choice... probably... i mean you could...

Actually I would like to keep the appearance of some lower-tier weapons or shields. I don't always like the tint of top-tier gear.

Merlight

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Demra wrote: »

This 10-160 grind is a nightmare as i am having to do a bunch of stuff i don't really enjoy just cause it give more exp.

That's your choice. You could instead be doing whatever you enjoy, and watch CP flow in as a side effect. These low CP practically rain on you wherever you go.

West1389

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Ya I hate the cp for gear. You really cant do anything of meaning until 160. Also there really is no point to change gear at all until 160. The rule kind of is training gear at lv 10, 30, and 50. You stay with those until 160. I'm 150 right now gear is still lv 30. That's not with grinding dolmens either. That's beating the main story, mages guild, fighters guild, and the main quest. So lv 30 has held up no issues.

Also cant do any dungeon until 160 dont want to get a item I want then get angry that's its cp 150 or lower.

Demra

Merlight wrote: »

Demra wrote: »

This 10-160 grind is a nightmare as i am having to do a bunch of stuff i don't really enjoy just cause it give more exp.

That's your choice. You could instead be doing whatever you enjoy, and watch CP flow in as a side effect. These low CP practically rain on you wherever you go.

True but i mostly enjoy pvp and i cannot do it effectivly unless i have decent gear. Especially battlegrounds where my team counts on me. Until lv 50 it was fun, but now i just feel i am in stand by mode. I just want to get it over with so that i can go back to do what i like. Good thing i only need to do it once so probably my bitterness will pass in a week or so.

Merlight

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Demra wrote: »

True but i mostly enjoy pvp and i cannot do it effectivly unless i have decent gear. Especially battlegrounds where my team counts on me. Until lv 50 it was fun, but now i just feel i am in stand by mode. I just want to get it over with so that i can go back to do what i like. Good thing i only need to do it once so probably my bitterness will pass in a week or so.

I see, that sucks. But I wouldn't bother with changing gear every 10 CP anyway. Back when we had Veteran Ranks, I crafted VR4, then VR8, then VR14. I was wearing each of those for at least a month. Was partly because I refused to go farm mats in elf-lands

Avrael

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

I feel like finally some people understand me. FeelsGoodMan

SoLooney

From the moment you hit lvl 50 aka cp 10 up to cp160 is not that much of a grind.

It's been years for me but dont brand new cp accounts get 4mil enlightenment the moment they hit lvl 50? Lol

All the older players, we all made the grind to cp 160 then max cp. It doesn't even take that long to get cp 160

And if you think it's boring or not worth it, then dont focus on grinding, do quests, explore etc, exp will just flow naturally.

All mmo have a grind. If you dont like grinding, mmo are not your thing and you shouldnt be playing them

jainiadral

No, keep everything as it is

Ok, I think I get you now. OCD issues... I don't really have those, so the CP thing doesn't bug me at all. If gear is kept to lvl. 50, and monsters remain at 50, the the CP system would be a nice hedge against difficulty just like it currently is.

Making top level food consistent with max monster and armor level might be worthwhile. That said, I don't have a problem with how it is now, aside from how annoying the one-time grind to 160 is.

Demra wrote: »

I am currently cp 130 and it is super tedious to get to 160 as every 10 cp i keep getting weaker as i outlevel my gear and it is pointless to collect sets. I get even more annoyed when i get a great piece set with the right trait at cp130. Its like what's even the point. This 10-160 grind is a nightmare as i am having to do a bunch of stuff i don't really enjoy just cause it give more exp. And when you search for items in guild store you have to type 150-160 instead of just clicking max level.

Ohgod... that time was the worst. Once you were done with the enlightenment bonus at--what was it, 100?-- doing the rest was a horrible slog. I bought both of those welcome pack thingies with the XP boosts and P2W poisons because I couldn't kill anything without them. Dumped all my crate gems into XP boosts... When I finally slapped on my final set gear at 160, I felt like a god

That part of the game needs a lot of help and attention. I'm not sure if capping gear levels would be the solution, though.

TheInfernalRage

No, keep everything as it is

but the the CP system itself needs to be changed

Avrael

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Boop, lets just hear some more opinions.

ZaroktheImmortal

Well CP levels are at least shared between characters so the highest you've gotten on them is shared with other characters. Getting to CP 160 isn't too hard the real challenge is trying to get to 810. Though gear stops levelling at 160.

therift

Your English is excellent. Your arguments are clearly written. Other than minor points of composition, primarily word choice, your writing skill is nearly indistinguishable from a native English speaker. Do not worry about your communication skill.

zvavi

No, keep everything as it is

lets assume u have 10X amount of xp to reach max level of a character. then from that max level, another 5X for the 160 cp. as i know zeniax, if they actually close that gap, it will not en up being 10X to get an alt to max level, and even more towards the 15X, which is something i dont want.thing is, as things are now, you need relatively less xp to level alts than what you needed for your main. which is, imo, a good thing.

jcm2606

Yes, Lv 50 (or insert number here) for everything and CP only as bonus

Gear should cap out at L50, so the moment a player hits L50, they can start acquiring their actual gear, regardless of their CP.

Yes, this is an actual issue for newer players, especially in PVP. When a newer player hits L50, they instantly hit a wall that they won't be able to climb until CP 160. Until they do, they're a potato, no matter how good they actually are, because they're outleveling their gear so fast. This not only hurts their experience, but it also hurts the experience of anybody playing with them, which is especially true in PVP.