How does the leveling scaling work?

Gazelle

I am relatively new to ESO. I am currently following the main quest. I read that when you level up, the enemies also scale with you. So if I have a higher level, than my enemies are stronger to.

But how exactly does this work?

I want to know this, because I am used to "grind" in other RPGs in other to make sure that I am strong enough for the monsters in the quests. However, if I would grind in ESO, it will have no benefit because the enemies will scale with me right?

So in the end, what is the point of leveling at all if everything scales with you? You are never going to feel powerfull, because if you are powerfull, your enemies are that too.

I guess/hope that is more subtle than I am saying it as above and that is why I opened this thread to let you give me your thoughts on how this scaling works.

Tabbycat

I think most things are scaled to CP160 and as you gain CP beyond 160 you begin to get the power creep where content becomes less difficult. I'm getting closer to CP 400 now and things are much easier to kill than they were when I just started CP levels. So yes, you do get progression and the sense of becoming more powerful as you level. It just doesn't kick in so much until you get into CP.

Also, while you are leveling, make sure you are taking advantages of using set bonus pieces. That will make things much easier for you than using the random hodgepodge pieces you get from quest rewards.

static_recharge

Scaling is actually the other way around. All enemies are max level (cp160, max gear level) and you are scaled up to that at all times. Leveling now is about unlocking skills and being able to wear max level gear. With this system you can play with your high level friends. Also you need to update your great every so often because you could actually get weaker as you level due to the way the scaling works.

Royaji

Nothing scales with you. All enemies are always at the same level. What gets scaled is your character and their stats to be closer (and initially far exceeding) what fully leveled character's are.

Danikat

It would be more accurate to say you scale to the level of the monsters. Everything in this game is scaled to level 50 and 160 champion points (CP). Below that player characters are scaled up, and the scaling gradually reduces as you level up.

It is actually possible to 'out level' content, but it takes a long time. The maximum CP you can use currently is about 860, so once you're above 160 you'll start finding things get much easier (too easy according to some people). But until then it will vary a lot, especially if you don't keep your gear up to date.

But that doesn't mean levelling up has no benefits until you reach the cap. Gaining levels enables you to use more skills, which makes a huge difference to combat, and to actually assign your attributes so they're focused on what's useful to you instead of the flat increase from scaling.

I strongly recommend you don't focus on trying to grind up until you can out level content. Firstly because the effect is minimal but also because it will only ever work in relatively simple content. Sure you can get to the CP cap and then rush through open world quests without having to think about what buttons you're pushing, but if you want to do anything else, particularly veteran mode dungeons and trials (raids) that's not going to work and if it's the only tactic you've learned you're going to have a very hard time adjusting to actually learning to use your skills effectively, knowing when to dodge etc.

Gazelle

Tabbycat wrote: »

I think most things are scaled to CP160 and as you gain CP beyond 160 you begin to get the power creep where content becomes less difficult. I'm getting closer to CP 400 now and things are much easier to kill than they were when I just started CP levels. So yes, you do get progression and the sense of becoming more powerful as you level. It just doesn't kick in so much until you get into CP.

Also, while you are leveling, make sure you are taking advantages of using set bonus pieces. That will make things much easier for you than using the random hodgepodge pieces you get from quest rewards.

Thanks! How do I get set bonus pieces? Do I need to buy them somewhere?

kringled_1

NPC enemies are at a fixed level. You are effectively scaled up while leveling, but if you do not keep upgrading your gear/consumable items, you will see a loss of stats (until you hit the equipment cap). You will get more powerful in ESO but not as a simple result of leveling. More power comes from leveling the skill lines and unlocking both active and passive skills.
Most overland questing you can do from the start; this is not ESO's difficult content.

Gazelle

Thanks all of you! I really did not know this.

So the gear is very important. How do I get good gear? Should I go buy that from vendors?

kringled_1

Gazelle wrote: »

Tabbycat wrote: »

I think most things are scaled to CP160 and as you gain CP beyond 160 you begin to get the power creep where content becomes less difficult. I'm getting closer to CP 400 now and things are much easier to kill than they were when I just started CP levels. So yes, you do get progression and the sense of becoming more powerful as you level. It just doesn't kick in so much until you get into CP.

Also, while you are leveling, make sure you are taking advantages of using set bonus pieces. That will make things much easier for you than using the random hodgepodge pieces you get from quest rewards.

Thanks! How do I get set bonus pieces? Do I need to buy them somewhere?

For set bonuses, you need to be using 2 or more pieces of that set.
There are crafted sets; usually I'd ask someone to craft those for you if you are new.
Every zone also has a light armor, medium, and heavy armor set. They will drop the various pieces from places in the zone - in general for the base game, dolmens drop jewelry, delves drop feet and waist pieces, public dungeons drop hands and shoulder pieces and weapons, world bosses drop head/chest/legs and weapons. Some pieces are also quest rewards.

Danikat

Gazelle wrote: »

Tabbycat wrote: »

I think most things are scaled to CP160 and as you gain CP beyond 160 you begin to get the power creep where content becomes less difficult. I'm getting closer to CP 400 now and things are much easier to kill than they were when I just started CP levels. So yes, you do get progression and the sense of becoming more powerful as you level. It just doesn't kick in so much until you get into CP.

Also, while you are leveling, make sure you are taking advantages of using set bonus pieces. That will make things much easier for you than using the random hodgepodge pieces you get from quest rewards.

Thanks! How do I get set bonus pieces? Do I need to buy them somewhere?

Gear sets come from all kinds of places. Some are crafted (or can be purchased from other players) others are drops in a specific area, or a dungeon or trial. https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Sets

You'll often find equipment which has a set name in the description and a list of bonuses for wearing 2, 3, 4 or 5 pieces. That's set gear. The ones you'll encounter first and most often are overland sets. Early on you can just choose from what you find and get from quests but once you reach CP 160 (which is the gear cap) you'll probably want to make sure you get sets which are right for your build.

starkerealm

Danikat wrote: »

It is actually possible to 'out level' content, but it takes a long time. The maximum CP you can use currently is about 860, so once you're above 160 you'll start finding things get much easier (too easy according to some people). But until then it will vary a lot, especially if you don't keep your gear up to date.

Some nitpicks, important numbers and info here:

The spending cap for CP is 810. That changed with Mirkmire. (It had been stepping up by 30 with each release since Dark Brotherhood, with a single 39 point jump at Morrowind.)

Gear stops at 160. After that, there's no, "keeping your gear up to date," and you can simply work on collecting the sets you want. It's kinda freeing, and I really wish players didn't have to wait until 160 to start collecting gear.

Stat progression stops at CP300. So, each time you level up you get an attribute point, at certain levels you get a second or even a third. By the time you hit 50, you'll have 64 points and stop earning more attribute points. However, each CP spent will increase one of your three stats by a small percentage (I forget the exact math.) Red stars increase health, green increase Stam, and Blue increase Magicka. This stops once you've put 100 total points into those stars. (So, you get the bonus for spending the points, not having them, and this only stacks for the first 100 points. At champion, you rotate around, so a CP300 will have 100 points to spend on each.)

As for overleveling content... not exactly. Basic overland content is aimed at around 150. Most vet dungeons are aimed a bit higher than that. Usually between 160 for base game vet 1s, up to around 600cp for vet trials and vet DLC dungeon hard modes. That said, this is a very loose guide. It's not a hard, "you must be this high to ride this ride."

Nestor

For gear, as long as it is near your character level, it is good enough. Each zone drops a set for Magic, or Stamina or Health. There is Jewelry from Dolmens, Larger Items and Weapons from World Bosses and other Bosses, and Smaller items from Delve Bosses. You can also buy this stuff from the Guild Kiosks in most cities and near a lot of Wayshrines. You get bonuses for 2 or 3 or 4 or 5 pieces of a set. Try to match up and have at least one set on. It does not have to be a full 5 piece, but it can help. Heck, I have ran 4 or 5 sets of 2 or 3 pieces in each set and done quite well.

As for "Good Gear", don't worry about that until CP160, as before that, you will out level your gear pretty quick. Just use whatever drops from the game as loot until you get there. Or, find a friendly crafter and ask them to make you something. Please give them a tip for their time. Or, browse the Kiosks. Don't sweat the traits, they are a small difference.

While leveling, just having gear near your level is what is important, not what sets there are. Of course, if your a Magic character, use gear for that, Stamina use gear for that. It is good to try different sets anyway, as you can find out what works best for you. Sure, there are build sites out there that suggest what to wear, but that does not apply to how you play, but how they play.

As for Best, again, don't worry about that. Unless your running Vet Trials for leaderboard times, you do not need the best gear, just the gear that makes the most sense to how you play the game and do combat.

Other Keys, find a Mundus stone (there are 3 in each zone) and use the bonus from that. You can change these as you go along, and having a bonus is better than no bonus. But, some bonuses are better for how you play. Google ESO Mundus for locations and bonuses.

Use Blue or Purple Food for your level. Some foods scale from 1 to CP160, some are more level specific. Again, you can get a crafter or buy some or use Crown Store items.

Get some Restore Potions, or make them.

Keep your gear repaired. Just remember, the gear does not really diminish until it breaks, so 20% Health on the gear is OK, 0% is not. So, you don't have to repair at say 80%. Any Merchant can repair, or you can get Repair Kits by doing Crafting Writs.

Nestor

Other Tips

Combat in this game comes down to Skill Rotations, with Light or Heavy Attacks interspersed. So, it's more like 1,2,3,4,1,2,3 dead. Pick your skill rotations so that one skill will set up or buff another skill. For example, use a skill that Snares, then a skill that gives Damage over Time to an area so the snared mobs spend longer in pain, then use a spam damage skill. This is just one example.

Once you learn a good rotation, then you can weave in light or heavy attacks between the skills to extend the resource pool you play from. So it's more like 1, LMB, 2, LMB,3, LMB, 4, LMB, 1 Dead. Then once you learn how to weave attacks, then you can start animation canceling to up your DPS.

So, attacks are not just a spam of the Left Mouse Button, but an application of your skills and weapon attacks.

You add in Blocking (reduce damage), Bashing (interrupting a caster or heavy attack wind up), Dodge Rolling (double click on a WASD key to avoid damage and get out of red quickly). Throw in some terrain advantage, and your basically a Mobile, Agile and Hostile wrecking machine.

As for Gear, well, while leveling, gear does not matter as long as you have something. It does not have to be best in slot, or even all that good. Also, we have lots of dropped set pieces so if you spend any time in a zone, you will more than likely pick up a set or two to wear. Each zone has a Magic, a Stamina and a Health or Tank set. Since everything scales, you can use this gear longer than you would think from the levels. It is only once you reach CP160 that you really want to worry about the gear, and by then you will have a good idea of what to use and where to farm for it.

Until then, the most important thing with gear is to wear a mix of it (light/medium/heavy) so they all level up somewhat equally. Also, have one skill from each of the 3 class skill lines on your bar at all times, and at least one weapon skill. For the 5th, it can be another weapon or attack skill or a support skill or some skill you want to level.

Nestor

Leveling and Gear

First leveling character? Forget about Builds right now. No need, your handicapped anyway by the game so you are way more powerful than you need to be. Instead take advantage of this buff to properly level your character so you can be deadly when it matters later on when you are not buffed by the level scaling. In other words, you can create a rotation that makes you think your all that and a biscuit because of the scaling buffs, then get a rude awakening come Champ Ranks when you are on your own.

In other words, right now if your wearing any gear, the mobs will die.

1. Have one class skill on your bar at all times, swapping them out once the skill reaches Morph stage. Worry about your Morphs later.
2. Have one weapon skill on your bar at all times, again until Morph stage
3. Wear a mix of all 3 armor types so they all level about equally
4. From L1 to L20, invest in attack skills and actives
5. From L20 to L35 start investing in Passives and Support Skills
6. From L35 to L50 start investing in Morphs (but only if all your class skills are at the Morph Stage), Passives and Crafting Skills
7 From CP10 to CP160 try out dropped sets to see which ones fit your playstyle, don't worry about traits right now, fill in passives and actives you may have missed
8. Grind on Dolmens to level your Fighters Guild, or find the Lore Books to level Mages Guild
9. Do some stealing to level Legerdemain, best source for money in the game
10. Decon every piece of gear you get that you are not going to use immediately to level equipment crafting, no need to invest skills points until Champ Ranks.

Nestor

Mounts

Once on the horse, lets talk about a few things.

1. You can sprint past your Stamina as long as you keep sprinting or don't hit a rock or a pebble or something that slows you down. As such, you have to re-apply the Sprint as you go along. On the PC, this is the Left Shift, not sure on the consoles.
2. Speed of the Horse until you get that part upgraded to around 25 to 30 is kind of slow to the point it almost not worth it to ride if your in a hurry. Sure you get there faster than running, it just feels like your going slower than you can run.
3. Once past the first two character bag space upgrades, horse bag space is the cheapest in game, but it takes the longest to max out as it's one bag a day.
4. Stamina is useful to upgrade, but most people wait until Speed and Bags are upgraded before investing in Stamina.
5. You can upgrade one element of your riding each day at the stables. Some people roll alts early and park them at the stables upgrading things before they play them
6. You can buy packs of Riding Lessons in the Crown Store.
7. The upgrades you apply to one character do not carry over to another character.
8. Different Mounts are different skins the Riding Upgrades apply to all Mounts on that character.

Nestor

Leveling

The best way to level in this game is to just do the Story Content and Explore the Zones.

Or, if you want to level and not spoil the story:

1. Collect all the Skyshards in the zone. Avoid any and all quests other than those that show up in the delves that have skyshards. These quests do not give set items for rewards so no loss there.
2. Farm the dolmens a few times to get set jewelry that help your character
3. Do the Public Dungeons including all the bosses and the Group Event
4. Move to the next zone.

In doing this, I could fully gear up my character with level appropriate stuff, and it was helpful gear. May not have been the best, but you don't need the best while leveling. Any gear I farmed from Dolmens or PD's is repeatable, so I can get it at CP160 by just repeating. Then, I had all the content quests left for me once I reached CP160 as those can give you sweet Set Drops in good traits you want. And, Quest Experience is huge for gaining CPs once your past CP160. Kind of a waste before that.

In about 8 zones, I would be fully leveled in Mages, Fighters, Class, 3 Armors and Weapon Skills. Note to get the farthest in the least number of zones for Mages, concentrate on one Alliance for the first 5 zones. Then you only need a few more zones. Now you have only Undaunted to level, although I would get to almost 3 in that from Dungeon Achievements.

Nestor

Leveling Crafting (it easier than you think)

Here is the thing about Crafting, you don't need it until End Game (post CP160) but you can level it in preparation with few to no skill points invested. Crafting can eat up 122 Skill Points to fully invest, so this will gimp your combat while leveling. Best to invest as few points as possible while levleing your character and crafting.

Equipment Crafting

Decon all mob loot other than what you are using to research traits. Research traits, learn two on all items you would use, then learn 3, etc. Focus on Divines, Infused and Training for your first three for Armor, Sharpened, Precise and Training for your Weapons. Then go for the other ones. Nirn is expensive, and a lot of people suggest putting a priority on that, I can't see why. The Trait is all but useless for Armor or Weapons. Best place to find Mob Loot is Public Dungeons, then over land grind spots. Grind on mobs until your bags are full, then go on a decon fest. Remembering to save the ones you need or want to research. Use the Lock Function and or an Inventory Mule to hang on to those. Only invest Skill points while leveling it into the Research and Extraction Passive, the last really only needing one point.

Enchanting

Ignore all the "advice" on the web about using an enchanting partner. First, use Mob Loot decon to raise this up to a point. Later on as you approach end game have some some gold, then start making Green, Blue or Purple Glyphs on one character and decon them on an Alt. You will level Enchanting faster than trading the glyphs with another player, which is tedious by the way. (like pull out your hair and make a doily tedious). Use Green up to about L15 in the Enchanting Skill, Blue up to about L30/35 and Purple up to about L46/47. Then learn the runes you don't know, you should be at or near 50, if not, make/decon some more Purples.

Provisioning and Alchemy

Don't worry about these, you can level these professions in about an 20 minutes, for both. Just collect the Various Solvents and Reagents and Provisioning Ingredients/Recipes as you go along. Once end game, then you can level it. Use Mushrooms to level Alchemy, or Flowers that make potions you won't use. Make sure you grab solvents (waters) as your leveling as they can be rare to find in the guild stores. For Provisioning, make the highest level Green Recipes you can make. Blue or Purples do not give any more inspiration than Greens, so save those for character use.

Yes, use Drop Sets for now, and Yes, level your crafting skills and do the Trait Research. Traits are why you craft as they allow you to make Special Crafted Sets. There are two sets in the game that your going to want to make, Julianos for your Magic Characters, and Hundings Rage for your Stamina Characters. There are no better sets in the game to have 5 pieces of. Period. Well, Twice Born Star is great to, but your a year out from making that. But you need to start learning your traits now.

While it takes 6 traits known to be able to make Hundings or Julianos, 9 Traits for Twice Born Star. You don't need to know learn all of these traits on everything before you craft anything. In fact, there are nice sets that you only need to know 2 or 3 or 4 traits to make. So, learn 2 traits first, then 3 etc. This way you can be making set items in just a few days. So, start learning those traits. Focus on the gear you will use first, then fill in the rest later. This means:

Casters
Heavy Chest/Legs
Light Feet/Hands/Waist
Shoulders and Heads are good to, but there are 2 Piece Monster sets that can take up those slots. So learn the traits on these pieces, but prioritize the ones above.
Staves (all 4 of them)

Stamina
All Medium Armors
Daggers, Swords, Axes, Bow

Tanks
All Heavy Armors, Sword and Shield and maybe Staves (Ice is your tanking stick). Can add in Axes or Maces for the weapons if you want.
For Armors, Sturdy, then Divines, Infused, Reinforced. Same with Shields but Nirn can be nice on a Shield.
For Weapons, Infused, Sharpened, Defending. Charged for the Staff

Learn Training, Divines and Infused on the Armors first, Sharpened, Precise, Infused and Training on the Weapons. Powered is good for the Healing Staff, Defending is good for Sword or other one handed Melee. Then fill in the rest until you have 6 traits on each piece of gear you will use. Eventually you will learn all 9 traits. Some people recommend Nirn as an early trait to learn. Unless they change it, don't listen to them. You might use it on a Shield or a Weapon but that is about it. You need it someday, but it's expensive and you need your gold for other things.

Invest the skill points into the Research Passives. I can't stress enough how much of a time sink Trait Research is. Be able to learn more than one at a time, and reduce the time needed. Get an addon for Trait Research Tracking, I recommend Craft Store. If your on the Consoles, find one of the spreadsheets out there or make one to track this. Have I mentioned you need to learn your traits?

Doing this you will be ready to invest skill points into Crafting when it matters and not have to spend months getting ready. Did I mention Trait Research and how much a time sink it is? The last two traits will take you a month each to learn, on each item you learn them on. Get started now, yesterday would have been better.

JamilaRaj

Gazelle wrote: »

So in the end, what is the point of leveling at all if everything scales with you?

The point is that you will level up whether you like it or not, and unless you keep up with gear, you will become actually weaker as you level up.

Gazelle wrote: »

You are never going to feel powerfull, because if you are powerfull, your enemies are that too.

Overland enemies do less damage per second than is your health regen, solo monster is literally incapable of killing you no matter what, so no worries, genuine seal clubbing experience awaits, but generally while you can not outlevel enemies, you can outgear them (you may notice even here on forums that when players talk about "builds", they invariantly focus on gear).

So the real busy work is getting gear, not levels, and players have both positive and negative incentives to care about gear, because they will be rewarded (feel and be more powerful) if they do, and punished (feel and be weaker) if they do not. This is important, because gear is major selling point of DLCs and expansions.
Furthermore, this system enables ZOS to sell the same DLC to players of all level ranges. Not so much because it would actually make it equally difficult for all level ranges (power creep is still there, from multiple causes, not just gear), but simply because it is very opaque. If ZOS focused on levels (no scaling) and released DLC for level range X-Y, players outside of this range (and that could be majority) would be reluctant to buy it, as well as if it released DLC and did not say what level range it is, or even if it relesed DLC and said there is something for any level, because that would imply aside form that something, the rest would be unplayable/unfit for player of given arbitrary level.

Holycannoli

Nestor wrote: »

Do some stealing to level Legerdemain, best source for money in the game

How is it best source though? Genuine question. I steal from chests and lockboxes once in a while and make a little extra spending money but I don't know how people are finding it the best money source in the game.

I haven't invested any points in anything other than the sneak passive. I don't make near enough money from selling green and blue stolen items to invest in more fencing per day.

Nestor

Holycannoli wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

Do some stealing to level Legerdemain, best source for money in the game

How is it best source though? Genuine question. I steal from chests and lockboxes once in a while and make a little extra spending money but I don't know how people are finding it the best money source in the game.

I haven't invested any points in anything other than the sneak passive. I don't make near enough money from selling green and blue stolen items to invest in more fencing per day.

@Holycannoli

The two ships in Daggerfall, all of Orsinium are full of Containers with no oversight. Loot them all, anything that is 40 gold or better, and it takes about 10 minutes to fill your bags. Fence and repeat as the containers reset as you leave the refuge until you hit the cap, in less than 20 minutes you have 10K to 15K in gold. Since you don't need sneak passives any of your alts can do this.

I don't waste time only pulling Greens and better, 40 gold and better, it gets nicked. Of course I drop whites for green or blues as I go along if bag space is needed and I have not capped. You get more Gold per hour this way if you have Alts. I have spent two or more hours trying to get just Greens or better, too much time.

Now, if you only have one character, you can take the time only taking Greens or better. This also works for those who just fence when full and otherwise play the game. If you need more gold, use or roll some alts, you only need one or two skill points for this.

Now, it can make sense to focus on Greens and better if your chasing the Fence Achievement. I don't care about that myself.

If you have a bunch of alts, have them do Tier 1 Crafting Writs too. That is a nice daily source of fast and easy gold and you get most resources back if not simply gain resources.

Finally, grinding certain public dungeons and zombie spawns can net some gold. About 25K to 100K an hour depending on activity (yours and others). This would include Vendoring most or all of the mob loot. Of course you gain character exp too, so this good overall.

Tomg999

Gazelle wrote: »

So the gear is very important. How do I get good gear? Should I go buy that from vendors?

No! Don't buy anything except maybe a potion or two early on from vendors. They are a ripoff.
Buy from Guild vendors in big cities.

Don't sell to vendors except for little and "white" stuff. Join a trading guild or two. You will see invites from time to time in zone chat, or you can research it. Then you can go to the bank and sell stuff through your guild(s)

Sixsixsix161

Everyone is different, but here's my play style.

Get to a new zone - get all skyshards first. Do nothing else. This will enable you to get more passives at the same time you get your active skills.
Kill things along the way.
Pickup everything you can, including ores, herbs, etc., and sell them.
Stay off your horse. Walking through the woods you find runes, chests, books for the mages, etc., and stuff you can sell.
If you're in a hurry, you probably should play another game.
My play style is: I have the mages' and fighters' guild quests, also the prophet, and the main quest for the queen (or king, depended on where you start). I do one quest for each, then go back to side-quests. BTW, outstanding quests are Summerset and the psijics order. Then back to the four main quests, back to side quests, and on and on. Personally, I don't like finishing a main quest and then have 200 side-quests still to do.

Good luck.

6

Gazelle

Thank you all for the usefull tips. From what level you can do dungeons? I saw there are already 3 dungeons or so available for me to do, but is that wise when I am level 13 or so? Because I will be very weak I guess compared with others. How does scaling work in these dungeons?

Sorry for double post, at first it did not seem to respond...

Gazelle

Thank you all for the usefull tips. From what level you can do dungeons? I saw there are already 3 dungeons or so available for me to do, but is that wise when I am level 13 or so? Because I will be very weak I guess compared with others. How does scaling work in these dungeons?

Royaji

At level 13 you will actually have the most raw power compared to everyone else. It is intentionally part of the scaling system to boost low level characters more to offset the fact that they still do not have most of their skills unlocked. You should be fine in dungeons.

Gazelle

Ok thanks ! I will try a dungeon soon!