[Idea] A Stamsorc Rework : Blood Sorcery

validifyedneb18_ESO

Ok so doesn't take much to realize people are unhappy with the current state of stamsorc atm, and numerically the class/stat is in the shitter right now.

Im just throwing an idea I think would be cool into consideration, so it can be promptly ignored by everyone.


I think the problem stems from a few key issues:

• A lot of passives etc are to do with lightning, which is a magic scaling damage type (In addition, some abilities "look" like lightning but do physical damage)
• They have almost no passives that benefit stamina
• Almost complete lack of usable class abilities (For example they have no "Summon" which feeds into the previous issue, as they lose out on the 8% hp with summon up passive - making bound armaments a summon would have worked before it got nerfed, they also only have exchange as a dark magic ability to proc the 20 seconds of minor prophecy)
• General lack of class identity, every class needs something that pegs it as that class, stamsorcs get a stam morph of hurricane. Thats it.
• The dusty class effect. A once top tier spec has been nerfed so many times and lose to much class identity that many players simply dont bother playing their stamsorcs anymore, and have re-rolled.

The blood mage:

• I am aware people are worried about bleeds, so I would not that my key emphasis is the theme rather than adding bleeding effects which could cause major balancing issues.
• DKs are Poison (Stamina) and Fire (Magica), why not do the same for another class where the same issue holds true (Sorcs=Lightning=Magica)
• There are plenty of under-utilised blood shaders/animations/effects in this game that could be used, so it would require significantly less development time than a completely new class (or even the stamina half of a new class)
• Opportunity to rework a lot of old / completely ignored skills into blood versions for stamina morphs
• Can justify how only magica get to be zookeepers, while stamina sorcs have a different unique identity
• Fills a gap in Roleplaying and general class identity. With the new necromancer clearly being very elder-scrolls-ien, there is still a clear gap for builds with blood effects as their core identity. mDKs with fire, mSorcs with lightning, mDens with frost, sDens with animals, sDKs with poison, NBs in general being terrible people. I know vampires are a thing, Im talking more shamanistic blood rituals and the like - think Mazzatun

A few examples: (names need work, I know)

• Bound Armaments - Blood Armaments, little work required to make purple into red for the effect, not like anyone actually CASTS this ability anyway though so could rework the effect to something cool too, also make it could as a summon ffs
• Empowered Ward -> Blood Ward, a stamina shield
• Crystal Fragments -> Crystallized Blood (People have been asking for a stam morph of this ability for ages, and lets be honest you're saving a lot of noobs from big mistakes by replacing this trash ability), Just make them into shiny red crystals rather than shiny purple crystals
• X Overload (Dont even know which most people use) -> Savage Overload, firing globules or streams of blood
• Storm Attro -> Earth Attro, Think pillars of nirn and earth attros from vBFR
• The new replacement for Implosion already fits perfectly
• A few passive changes could be done too, but I think this shows how the class can be given both a really cool signature style, and actual benefit from the class for stamina once again

tl;dr - make some purple stuff red, re-use some blood enchantment/ability/setproc assets to reduce work required, give the stamsorcs a new unique identity and use that identity to rework some skills to be good (while fitting the style, I mean lets be honest, making crystal fragments physical without changing it beyond that, would make no sense)

validifyedneb18_ESO

Would be interested in what stamsorcs think tbh, especially with the concept of their class style being completely overhauled to something different.

cpuScientist

Nah keep it wind. Air atro, and of course stamFrag

Ajax_22

Nightblades already have the blood magic theme. Wind (physical) fits the class much better. It's already covered under the Stormcalling skill line, and has been started with Hurricane. We just need more skills in the theme.

brandonv516

If anything NBs should have blood magic with their Siphoning Tree.

Could be Air (Aero?) damage for Stamsorcs. I don't know maybe crossing Final Fantasy lines too much lol.

Aedrion

I like the idea of blood magic but Magicka NB already has that covered with Siphoning.
Sorc is centered around daedric magic, and storms.

Stamsorc's niche was or should be air magic that throws electrified wind blasts, charged cyclones etc.
All of that is possible but ZoS has to realise it's essential first because stamsorc is on life support.

validifyedneb18_ESO

To everyone who posted about NBs and Air, I agree Air WOULD be cool if Zeni actually committed to it, however I also think NBs currently do not show blood/bleed centric design. The siphoning skill line really feels like an after thought and the play-style is all about rouge-ishness rather then shamanistic blood magic.

My main hope would be that, in general, StamSorcs regain a cool and (hopefully unique) identity. The blood idea is just one idea I know id really love, and threw in for consideration.

MashmalloMan

It's sad to see so many people passionate on the forums about interesting ideas for stam sorcs because ultimately seem to fall upon deaf ears. It's been years and still waiting for something new.. we actually continue to lose more each patch.

To blood magic, no thanks, I chose stam sorc because I liked the wind/lightning theme. Passives are already in a good place for sta DD, just need slight tweaks and less reliance on bound armaments. Need more buffs/debuff access, group utility and class morphs so it doesn't always feel like a walking weapon skill line.

Physical ults, why is there 5/6 magicka DD ults. Even healer and tank roles miss out here. Rework for a #airatro + better utility absorbtion field for healers and #tankpoweroverload.

Daedric Summoning needs a rework in the way of more self buffing battle magic instead of just pets.

Rework of bound armaments, lazy skill for passive stats. Should be changed to bound daedric weapons, I have no idea why they used it as an opportunity to give tanks block mitigation, why would a tank need +11% light atk dmg is beyond me, even 8% sta is kind of lackluster when the mag morph gives minor ward/resolve, you don't want more mag than sta so that's a weird enough dynamic..

Tanks probably want the clanfear for the self heal and 8% max hp, but it takes up 2 slots.

Clanfear reworked slightly to work for stam builds, not BiS for DD, but an option nonetheless instead of scaling off max magicka for pitiful tooltip dmg.. it already scales off of weapon crit, penetration and cp, just tweek the tooltip scaling.

Rebate passive should provide stam or magicka return without needing the pet to die.

A dark magick ability like sta crystal frags is needed.

I'm happy with current dark deal. I think it's unique enough for instant sta return + sta over time.

With the removal of implosion, a class execute or dot is needed more than ever.

Think outside the box, we could be the first class to have a new single target dot that provides minor force. Are we not tired of using rearming trap..

validifyedneb18_ESO

Marshall1289 wrote: »

It's sad to see so many people passionate on the forums about interesting ideas for stam sorcs because ultimately seem to fall upon deaf ears. It's been years and still waiting for something new.. we actually continue to lose more each patch.

To blood magic, no thanks, I chose stam sorc because I liked the wind/lightning theme. Passives are already in a good place for sta DD, just need slight tweaks and less reliance on bound armaments. Need more buffs/debuff access, group utility and class morphs so it doesn't always feel like a walking weapon skill line.

Physical ults, why is there 5/6 magicka DD ults. Even healer and tank roles miss out here. Rework for a #airatro + better utility absorbtion field for healers and #tankpoweroverload.

Daedric Summoning needs a rework in the way of more self buffing battle magic instead of just pets.

Rework of bound armaments, lazy skill for passive stats. Should be changed to bound daedric weapons, I have no idea why they used it as an opportunity to give tanks block mitigation, why would a tank need +11% light atk dmg is beyond me, even 8% sta is kind of lackluster when the mag morph gives minor ward/resolve, you don't want more mag than sta so that's a weird enough dynamic..

Tanks probably want the clanfear for the self heal and 8% max hp, but it takes up 2 slots.

Clanfear reworked slightly to work for stam builds, not BiS for DD, but an option nonetheless instead of scaling off max magicka for pitiful tooltip dmg.. it already scales off of weapon crit, penetration and cp, just tweek the tooltip scaling.

Rebate passive should provide stam or magicka return without needing the pet to die.

A dark magick ability like sta crystal frags is needed.

I'm happy with current dark deal. I think it's unique enough for instant sta return + sta over time.

With the removal of implosion, a class execute or dot is needed more than ever.

Think outside the box, we could be the first class to have a new single target dot that provides minor force. Are we not tired of using rearming trap..

Agree with everything you said tbh. Obviously I want blood magic because I think it would be cool but Air is the natural physical side to the magica lightning. Not a fan of summons personally so Id love to see the stamside of the summoning tree focus more on buffs like you said.

Also re-arming trap feels crap to use. Half the time I wont even run it because I just dont like it, so something else with minor force would be a great idea lol.

Just seems a shame, stamsorc has just what I want from my stamina builds, but also has almost nothing.

Also Id like to see something different than just a stamFrag, id like to see a stam version where it turns into like a spammable cast or something. I mean the mag version only works because its a proc anyway, cast it normally and you drop DPS like nothing else. And we cant just have the exact same proc mechanic but physical/stam.

validifyedneb18_ESO

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

It's sad to see so many people passionate on the forums about interesting ideas for stam sorcs because ultimately seem to fall upon deaf ears. It's been years and still waiting for something new.. we actually continue to lose more each patch.

To blood magic, no thanks, I chose stam sorc because I liked the wind/lightning theme. Passives are already in a good place for sta DD, just need slight tweaks and less reliance on bound armaments. Need more buffs/debuff access, group utility and class morphs so it doesn't always feel like a walking weapon skill line.

Physical ults, why is there 5/6 magicka DD ults. Even healer and tank roles miss out here. Rework for a #airatro + better utility absorbtion field for healers and #tankpoweroverload.

Daedric Summoning needs a rework in the way of more self buffing battle magic instead of just pets.

Rework of bound armaments, lazy skill for passive stats. Should be changed to bound daedric weapons, I have no idea why they used it as an opportunity to give tanks block mitigation, why would a tank need +11% light atk dmg is beyond me, even 8% sta is kind of lackluster when the mag morph gives minor ward/resolve, you don't want more mag than sta so that's a weird enough dynamic..

Tanks probably want the clanfear for the self heal and 8% max hp, but it takes up 2 slots.

Clanfear reworked slightly to work for stam builds, not BiS for DD, but an option nonetheless instead of scaling off max magicka for pitiful tooltip dmg.. it already scales off of weapon crit, penetration and cp, just tweek the tooltip scaling.

Rebate passive should provide stam or magicka return without needing the pet to die.

A dark magick ability like sta crystal frags is needed.

I'm happy with current dark deal. I think it's unique enough for instant sta return + sta over time.

With the removal of implosion, a class execute or dot is needed more than ever.

Think outside the box, we could be the first class to have a new single target dot that provides minor force. Are we not tired of using rearming trap..

Agree with everything you said tbh. Obviously I want blood magic because I think it would be cool but Air is the natural physical side to the magica lightning. Not a fan of summons personally so Id love to see the stamside of the summoning tree focus more on buffs like you said.

Also re-arming trap feels crap to use. Half the time I wont even run it because I just dont like it, so something else with minor force would be a great idea lol.

Just seems a shame, stamsorc has just what I want from my stamina builds, but also has almost nothing.

Also Id like to see something different than just a stamFrag, id like to see a stam version where it turns into like a spammable cast or something. I mean the mag version only works because its a proc anyway, cast it normally and you drop DPS like nothing else. And we cant just have the exact same proc mechanic but physical/stam.

Edit: Oh and as another note, id like to see air be a different color to lightning. Not a fan of the purple as its really indicative of lightning, we need white/cyan or something.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

EpicRekkoning

There's so many options for ZOS to approach stam sorcs. Honestly, they are the only class without a true stam identity.

I agree with the air idea over the blood. The blood class should be connected to NBs.

Here are some ideas for air:
- air skills in general have a chance to set targets off balance (gusts of wind can stagger people)
- powered overload becomes a morph that does physical damage. Shoots gusts of wind from hands (light attachs) and a large cone gust (heavy). Reduced light and heavy attack range (5m), but increased damage by up to 50% the closer to the target.
- one of the morphs of lightning splash can be converted to a stamina skill (tornado)
- one morph of bolt escape changed so that the player dashes like a gust of wind that staggers and interrupts targets; player doesn't travel as far.
- daedric summoning tree changed to Conjuration Master
- air atro is a must. Swirls around with many swords doing large aoe damage with a chance to cause targets to bleed
- unstable clanfear change to deal physical damage
- change twighlight tormentors to a durzog, physical damage and causes target to bleed.
- harden ward becomes a stam shield and increases the physical damage of pets by x% while slotted
- change Dark Magic tree to Mystic Arts
- change crystal blast to a wind burst; cone attack that does x physical damage and a reduced by x% per additional target hit. Sets targets off balanced
- change daedric tomb to a stam ability (not sure how this one will look)

Please keep asking for a stam sorc identity!

validifyedneb18_ESO

EpicRekkoning wrote: »

There's so many options for ZOS to approach stam sorcs. Honestly, they are the only class without a true stam identity.

I agree with the air idea over the blood. The blood class should be connected to NBs.

Here are some ideas for air:
- air skills in general have a chance to set targets off balance (gusts of wind can stagger people)
- powered overload becomes a morph that does physical damage. Shoots gusts of wind from hands (light attachs) and a large cone gust (heavy). Reduced light and heavy attack range (5m), but increased damage by up to 50% the closer to the target.
- one of the morphs of lightning splash can be converted to a stamina skill (tornado)
- one morph of bolt escape changed so that the player dashes like a gust of wind that staggers and interrupts targets; player doesn't travel as far.
- daedric summoning tree changed to Conjuration Master
- air atro is a must. Swirls around with many swords doing large aoe damage with a chance to cause targets to bleed
- unstable clanfear change to deal physical damage
- change twighlight tormentors to a durzog, physical damage and causes target to bleed.
- harden ward becomes a stam shield and increases the physical damage of pets by x% while slotted
- change Dark Magic tree to Mystic Arts
- change crystal blast to a wind burst; cone attack that does x physical damage and a reduced by x% per additional target hit. Sets targets off balanced
- change daedric tomb to a stam ability (not sure how this one will look)

Please keep asking for a stam sorc identity!

What would be particularly cool is if they added a Air Staff too, the only physical type destruction staff. Some of the abilities like force pulse would be garbo because its split magic damage, but wall and others could be good not to mention the idea of a staff wielding physical build is cool.

Chilly-McFreeze

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

*cough* You can't be serious. Just take a look at the showpiece class that stam NBs are. How many passives doesn't affect them at all? Siphoning maybe has some that aren't too beneficial but to include stamblades into the statement that they have almost no benefitting passives seems a bit odd.

Somewhere out there is another stam sorc thread that takes a deeper look at passive usefullness compared to other classes. And it turnes out that only stamplars come out nearly equal to stam sorcs on the passive side. But then again, they make up for that via active skills.

burglar

I play both a stam sorc and a melee magicka NB, and would love to see any progress toward having a stronger presence of melee mage-ness. So far, melee magicka classes seem all but absent at this point. I felt like the psijic abilities took the melee magicka classes to a new level, because even though melee light attacks are weak on melee mages, with elemental weapon and the passive, you could build up charges quickly then combine them with a class ability or something. I could never get that to work out so that the built up charges would fire the psijic orb + elemental weapon + light attack and animation cancel with an ability to deliver four attacks at once.

Oh wait, stamina sorc is... stamina based, so it's not really a melee magicka class in the same way I am thinking of my melee magicka NB. But stam sorc is still a mage of sorts... I don't know how they could implement both, a magicka based melee class, and a mage based melee character that uses stamina. Stam sorc and melee magicka NB seem to be falling into the same rut though; melee magicka NB has seen very little attention.

This has me thinking though, what if each weapon type had unlockable upgrades with certain amounts of a specific stat allocated to them? Like, say with lots of points in health, a dual wielding stam sorc would cause a disease-like type of lightning damage, because lightning would can cause DNA in blood to mutate, which functions like a disease. Or with points allocated into magicka and dual wielding, magicka abilities can be cast onto weapons, allowing them to deliver the damage those attacks would have caused if cast, except it's delivered via melee attacks. Although, they would have to come up with three 'flavors' of each morph for each class to fit this idea, which might be a bit much to ask for.

Crixus8000

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

It really doesn't though except stamplar. Other classes can still make use of their passives. Stamsorc has 2 completely useless passives in dark magic AND daedric summoning, and then even the 20% stam/hp rec requires us to waste 2 bar slots to get it.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

*cough* You can't be serious. Just take a look at the showpiece class that stam NBs are. How many passives doesn't affect them at all? Siphoning maybe has some that aren't too beneficial but to include stamblades into the statement that they have almost no benefitting passives seems a bit odd.

Somewhere out there is another stam sorc thread that takes a deeper look at passive usefullness compared to other classes. And it turnes out that only stamplars come out nearly equal to stam sorcs on the passive side. But then again, they make up for that via active skills.

Crixus8000 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

It really doesn't though except stamplar. Other classes can still make use of their passives. Stamsorc has 2 completely useless passives in dark magic AND daedric summoning, and then even the 20% stam/hp rec requires us to waste 2 bar slots to get it.

Nightblade Stam skills

Power extraction
Killers blade
Surprise attack
Leaching strikes
Relentless focus
Incapacitating strike

Dragon Knight Stam skills

Venomous claw
Noxious breath
Flames of Oblivion
Igneous weapons
Corrosive armor
Standard of might


Templar Stam skills

Biting jabs
Binding javelin
Power of the light
Repentance
Restoring focus
Empowering sweep

Sorcerer Stam skills

Hurricane
Dark deal
Critical surge
Bound armaments
Greater storm atronach

Warden Stam skills

Cutting dive
Subterranean assault
Bull netch
Bird of prey
Soothing spores
Green lotus
Wild guardian

Seems pretty balanced to me.

Chilly-McFreeze

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

*cough* You can't be serious. Just take a look at the showpiece class that stam NBs are. How many passives doesn't affect them at all? Siphoning maybe has some that aren't too beneficial but to include stamblades into the statement that they have almost no benefitting passives seems a bit odd.

Somewhere out there is another stam sorc thread that takes a deeper look at passive usefullness compared to other classes. And it turnes out that only stamplars come out nearly equal to stam sorcs on the passive side. But then again, they make up for that via active skills.

Crixus8000 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

It really doesn't though except stamplar. Other classes can still make use of their passives. Stamsorc has 2 completely useless passives in dark magic AND daedric summoning, and then even the 20% stam/hp rec requires us to waste 2 bar slots to get it.

Nightblade Stam skills

Power extraction
Killers blade
Surprise attack
Leaching strikes
Relentless focus
Incapacitating strike

Dragon Knight Stam skills

Venomous claw
Noxious breath
Flames of Oblivion
Igneous weapons
Corrosive armor
Standard of might


Templar Stam skills

Biting jabs
Binding javelin
Power of the light
Repentance
Restoring focus
Empowering sweep

Sorcerer Stam skills

Hurricane
Dark deal
Critical surge
Bound armaments
Greater storm atronach

Warden Stam skills

Cutting dive
Subterranean assault
Bull netch
Bird of prey
Soothing spores
Green lotus
Wild guardian

Seems pretty balanced to me.

You are changing the topic. Your quote and comment was about passives, Not skills. Also, atronach is not even a physical dmg ("stamina ") skill.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

*cough* You can't be serious. Just take a look at the showpiece class that stam NBs are. How many passives doesn't affect them at all? Siphoning maybe has some that aren't too beneficial but to include stamblades into the statement that they have almost no benefitting passives seems a bit odd.

Somewhere out there is another stam sorc thread that takes a deeper look at passive usefullness compared to other classes. And it turnes out that only stamplars come out nearly equal to stam sorcs on the passive side. But then again, they make up for that via active skills.

Crixus8000 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

It really doesn't though except stamplar. Other classes can still make use of their passives. Stamsorc has 2 completely useless passives in dark magic AND daedric summoning, and then even the 20% stam/hp rec requires us to waste 2 bar slots to get it.

Nightblade Stam skills

Power extraction
Killers blade
Surprise attack
Leaching strikes
Relentless focus
Incapacitating strike

Dragon Knight Stam skills

Venomous claw
Noxious breath
Flames of Oblivion
Igneous weapons
Corrosive armor
Standard of might


Templar Stam skills

Biting jabs
Binding javelin
Power of the light
Repentance
Restoring focus
Empowering sweep

Sorcerer Stam skills

Hurricane
Dark deal
Critical surge
Bound armaments
Greater storm atronach

Warden Stam skills

Cutting dive
Subterranean assault
Bull netch
Bird of prey
Soothing spores
Green lotus
Wild guardian

Seems pretty balanced to me.

You are changing the topic. Your quote and comment was about passives, Not skills. Also, atronach is not even a physical dmg ("stamina ") skill.

All ultimates scale with your highest stats. The atro will give you the highest DPS out off all the ultis a stamsorc can use. Sorcs also get a 5% increase to physical and lightning damage. Regardless of build. If are not using the atro on single target fights, you are losing DPS.

As for passives, they are similar to activate skills, all classes have around the same amount that are useful to Stam.

Chilly-McFreeze

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

*cough* You can't be serious. Just take a look at the showpiece class that stam NBs are. How many passives doesn't affect them at all? Siphoning maybe has some that aren't too beneficial but to include stamblades into the statement that they have almost no benefitting passives seems a bit odd.

Somewhere out there is another stam sorc thread that takes a deeper look at passive usefullness compared to other classes. And it turnes out that only stamplars come out nearly equal to stam sorcs on the passive side. But then again, they make up for that via active skills.

Crixus8000 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

It really doesn't though except stamplar. Other classes can still make use of their passives. Stamsorc has 2 completely useless passives in dark magic AND daedric summoning, and then even the 20% stam/hp rec requires us to waste 2 bar slots to get it.

Nightblade Stam skills

Power extraction
Killers blade
Surprise attack
Leaching strikes
Relentless focus
Incapacitating strike

Dragon Knight Stam skills

Venomous claw
Noxious breath
Flames of Oblivion
Igneous weapons
Corrosive armor
Standard of might


Templar Stam skills

Biting jabs
Binding javelin
Power of the light
Repentance
Restoring focus
Empowering sweep

Sorcerer Stam skills

Hurricane
Dark deal
Critical surge
Bound armaments
Greater storm atronach

Warden Stam skills

Cutting dive
Subterranean assault
Bull netch
Bird of prey
Soothing spores
Green lotus
Wild guardian

Seems pretty balanced to me.

You are changing the topic. Your quote and comment was about passives, Not skills. Also, atronach is not even a physical dmg ("stamina ") skill.

All ultimates scale with your highest stats. The atro will give you the highest DPS out off all the ultis a stamsorc can use. Sorcs also get a 5% increase to physical and lightning damage. Regardless of build. If are not using the atro on single target fights, you are losing DPS.

As for passives, they are similar to activate skills, all classes have around the same amount that are useful to Stam.

This is a joke, right? No, other classes don't get as little out of their passives and class skills as stam sorcs, especially not combined. Also, you can't totally ignore the distinction of skills and passives, especially when bar space is as limited as in this game.

Where is my spam? Where is my target bound dot? Where is my execute? Or my burst skill? Or my gap closer? Or my actual stun that doesn't eat up 1/3 of my resources? Where are my debuffs? The answer to those questions is: not in my class lines.

Ultimates scale with the highest resource, right, but they still scale with a specific CP. And for the atro that's not mighty. Only place a stam sorc gets as much out of the atro is no cp pvp. And there your opponent ususally moves away from the immovable object.

validifyedneb18_ESO

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

*cough* You can't be serious. Just take a look at the showpiece class that stam NBs are. How many passives doesn't affect them at all? Siphoning maybe has some that aren't too beneficial but to include stamblades into the statement that they have almost no benefitting passives seems a bit odd.

Somewhere out there is another stam sorc thread that takes a deeper look at passive usefullness compared to other classes. And it turnes out that only stamplars come out nearly equal to stam sorcs on the passive side. But then again, they make up for that via active skills.

Crixus8000 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

.They have almost no passives that benefit stamina

This goes for all Stam versions of the classes.

It really doesn't though except stamplar. Other classes can still make use of their passives. Stamsorc has 2 completely useless passives in dark magic AND daedric summoning, and then even the 20% stam/hp rec requires us to waste 2 bar slots to get it.

Nightblade Stam skills

Power extraction
Killers blade
Surprise attack
Leaching strikes
Relentless focus
Incapacitating strike

Dragon Knight Stam skills

Venomous claw
Noxious breath
Flames of Oblivion
Igneous weapons
Corrosive armor
Standard of might


Templar Stam skills

Biting jabs
Binding javelin
Power of the light
Repentance
Restoring focus
Empowering sweep

Sorcerer Stam skills

Hurricane
Dark deal
Critical surge
Bound armaments
Greater storm atronach

Warden Stam skills

Cutting dive
Subterranean assault
Bull netch
Bird of prey
Soothing spores
Green lotus
Wild guardian

Seems pretty balanced to me.

You are changing the topic. Your quote and comment was about passives, Not skills. Also, atronach is not even a physical dmg ("stamina ") skill.

All ultimates scale with your highest stats. The atro will give you the highest DPS out off all the ultis a stamsorc can use. Sorcs also get a 5% increase to physical and lightning damage. Regardless of build. If are not using the atro on single target fights, you are losing DPS.

As for passives, they are similar to activate skills, all classes have around the same amount that are useful to Stam.

This is a joke, right? No, other classes don't get as little out of their passives and class skills as stam sorcs, especially not combined. Also, you can't totally ignore the distinction of skills and passives, especially when bar space is as limited as in this game.

Where is my spam? Where is my target bound dot? Where is my execute? Or my burst skill? Or my gap closer? Or my actual stun that doesn't eat up 1/3 of my resources? Where are my debuffs? The answer to those questions is: not in my class lines.

Ultimates scale with the highest resource, right, but they still scale with a specific CP. And for the atro that's not mighty. Only place a stam sorc gets as much out of the atro is no cp pvp. And there your opponent ususally moves away from the immovable object.

Not to mention it doesn't count as physical damage for proc sets or dot buffs like deadly strike.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

. This is a joke, right? No, other classes don't get as little out of their passives and class skills as stam sorcs, especially not combined. Also, you can't totally ignore the distinction of skills and passives, especially when bar space is as limited as in this game.

All right, if you really believe this, list out all the passives from each class. Show me.

validifyedneb18_ESO

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

. This is a joke, right? No, other classes don't get as little out of their passives and class skills as stam sorcs, especially not combined. Also, you can't totally ignore the distinction of skills and passives, especially when bar space is as limited as in this game.

All right, if you really believe this, list out all the passives from each class. Show me.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/456615/stamsorc-by-far-has-the-least-usable-passives-and-buffs-debuffs-and-needs-to-be-looked-at/p1

Why even bother arguing, there's an entire thread on the issue.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

. This is a joke, right? No, other classes don't get as little out of their passives and class skills as stam sorcs, especially not combined. Also, you can't totally ignore the distinction of skills and passives, especially when bar space is as limited as in this game.

All right, if you really believe this, list out all the passives from each class. Show me.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/456615/stamsorc-by-far-has-the-least-usable-passives-and-buffs-debuffs-and-needs-to-be-looked-at/p1

Why even bother arguing, there's an entire thread on the issue.

Honestly, looking through the passives of a sorc, the only 2 I see that don't have use is blood magic and rebate. All the others are worth something,.

validifyedneb18_ESO

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

. This is a joke, right? No, other classes don't get as little out of their passives and class skills as stam sorcs, especially not combined. Also, you can't totally ignore the distinction of skills and passives, especially when bar space is as limited as in this game.

All right, if you really believe this, list out all the passives from each class. Show me.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/456615/stamsorc-by-far-has-the-least-usable-passives-and-buffs-debuffs-and-needs-to-be-looked-at/p1

Why even bother arguing, there's an entire thread on the issue.

Honestly, looking through the passives of a sorc, the only 2 I see that don't have use is blood magic and rebate. All the others are worth something,.

Uh what... Even for other classes there are wayore than just 2 passives that don't benefit stam players...?

Am I just feeding a troll here?

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

. This is a joke, right? No, other classes don't get as little out of their passives and class skills as stam sorcs, especially not combined. Also, you can't totally ignore the distinction of skills and passives, especially when bar space is as limited as in this game.

All right, if you really believe this, list out all the passives from each class. Show me.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/456615/stamsorc-by-far-has-the-least-usable-passives-and-buffs-debuffs-and-needs-to-be-looked-at/p1

Why even bother arguing, there's an entire thread on the issue.

Honestly, looking through the passives of a sorc, the only 2 I see that don't have use is blood magic and rebate. All the others are worth something,.

Uh what... Even for other classes there are wayore than just 2 passives that don't benefit stam players...?

Am I just feeding a troll here?

No, I am not a troll. I want to understand your thoughts. Now with what you have said here, I don't understand what you are on about. Even temps have only 2 passives from my reckoning that are absolutely no good for a stamplar, light Weaver and enduring rays, though even thoughs would be useful if the stamplar decided to use the ultis from those skill lines. Please help me understand.

PvP, Stam sorcs can use negate just like there magic counterparts. I just don't understand, my Stam sorc is a bag of stats, they don't need the same named buffs because they have unique stat bonuses that make up for it.

validifyedneb18_ESO

Rebate. No summons and magic regen is mostly useless anyway.
Daedric protection. Good but ultimately feeds into armorments being used as an unused but slotted bar buff despite being an otherwise useless ability.
Expert summoner. We don't have summons.

Blood magic. There are no stam scaling abilities that can proc this.
Dark magic. We only use exchange from here, extra duration is entirely useless.

Capacitor. Magicka recovery. Technically useful, practically useless.

I guess now you can come back and say that the summons ARE useful because we have the attro that gets summoned like every 60 seconds for a few seconds, and deals shock damage.

Or that magicka recovery is actually useful when 10% of *** all, is still *** all.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

.Rebate. No summons and magic regen is mostly useless anyway.

Already agreed to this.

. Daedric protection. Good but ultimately feeds into armorments being used as an unused but slotted bar buff despite being an otherwise useless ability.

Bound armaments is one of the best damage mitigation tools in the game. That extra 36% mitigation is addative now, check this thread, https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5757750#Comment_5757750, so when you block, you get 86% damage mitigation, this is stronger then major protection. Bound armaments is a worthy front bar skill.

Expert summoner. We don't have summons.

When you use the atro, you get 28 seconds of 8% more health. That is like 1k more. Very useful.

. Blood magic. There are no stam scaling abilities that can proc this.

Also said this passive is no good in pve for Stam sorcs. But the same thing can be said for pet sorc too, frags is the only skill worth having your bar as a mag build DPS in pve but the proc chance on a pet sorc is really low.

. Dark magic. We only use exchange from here, extra duration is entirely useless.

Negate can be useful in pve and PvP. Then giving your group 6% more spell crit is useful.

. Capacitor. Magicka recovery. Technically useful, practically useless.

More magic for streak in PvP and more magic for dark deal in pve. Not sure what you are expecting from passives.

.I guess now you can come back and say that the summons ARE useful because we have the attro that gets summoned like every 60 seconds for a few seconds, and deals shock damage.

Almost a half a minute is not a "few". Going by your own estimation of every 60 seconds, that means the atro is up half the time. That is huge.

.Or that magicka recovery is actually useful when 10% of *** all, is still *** all.

This is very helpful. 5/7.

Crixus8000

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Honestly, looking through the passives of a sorc, the only 2 I see that don't have use is blood magic and rebate. All the others are worth something,.

The daedric summoning line has 2 useless passives basically and another that requires us to slot a skill on both bars, so we waste a slot for double bar bound armaments or use useless atro. And yes ultimates scale from highest stat but greater storm atro doesn't really do anything from stam sorc, I have tried it for a long time, mianly for the passive and not even once has it ever been useful in any situation, it's just weak for stam sorc.

So stam sorc has 4 useless passives and a few situational passives, one of them requires us to waste a lot of bar space, then we have a lack of skills and not even a single ult. that is not balanced.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

. And yes ultimates scale from highest stat but greater storm atro doesn't really do anything from stam sorc, I have tried it for a long time, mianly for the passive and not even once has it ever been useful in any situation, it's just weak for stam sorc.

On my build it gives more dps while giving more utility then ballista. No idea how it doesn't work like that for you. Not weak at all.

. one of them requires us to waste a lot of bar space,

You only have to slot it on your front bar. No reason to have it on your back bar. Honestly, it feels like I am taking crazy pills. Bound armaments is a fantastic skill.

Crixus8000

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

. And yes ultimates scale from highest stat but greater storm atro doesn't really do anything from stam sorc, I have tried it for a long time, mianly for the passive and not even once has it ever been useful in any situation, it's just weak for stam sorc.

On my build it gives more dps while giving more utility then ballista. No idea how it doesn't work like that for you. Not weak at all.

. one of them requires us to waste a lot of bar space,

You only have to slot it on your front bar. No reason to have it on your back bar. Honestly, it feels like I am taking crazy pills. Bound armaments is a fantastic skill.

Yeah you slot it on front bar then back bar will not have the passive so i need to slot it there too or slot atro. And atro has many issues. It dies too fast, it goes for a random target and they can just avoid it by running away. If I need survivability I will use spell wall, if I need damage I will use db.