Your Feeling of the Racial Changes now that they are testable

nsmurfer

The racial changes are out on the PTS server, we had several people testing them and can be tested by any pC player as now. I would like to understand what most people think about the changes. keep in mind, that it is never possible to truly balnce everything. Also please keep your feeling about race change token situations out. There are other places for that.

Sabbathius

Negative

I voted Negative, at least the way they are now. Argonians took too much of a hit. Nords still lack a clear purpose. Imperials are also neither here nor there. And that's just to name a few. If this goes live as-is, we're pretty much guaranteed another "rebalance" in a year or two. I wish they would take their time, give it some serious thought, do this ONCE, let us have a free race change for a week, so we can fix out character lineup, and put this to rest. But it looks like the cycle will continue, and we'll be expected to fork over 3,500 crowns per character just so we don't end up with noncompetitive builds. Feels like a racket. Hence the negative vote.

Red_Feather

Positive

I have heard from multiple sources that it is more balanced than it was before. Guild Leader, Inklings, came on last night after doing stream about it and seemed pleased, which was a good sign. Said that certain races come out on top for certain roles, but that it's actually really close and that the devs did a good job.

susmitds

Very Positive

I am really pleased with these changes.

After extensive hours of testing, speaking only about racial changes within the ranges of possibility, I would go as far as saying ZOS pulled off a freaking miracle here. Few optimizarions are possible here and there. I shared a full feedback here in https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/455283/racial-pve-pvp-feedback-and-some-recommended-changes-using-test-data-previously-performed#latest

This patch would have been the perfect balance patch, with the race changes and sorcerer changes, only to be spoiled by two of the most broken sets I have heard of in a while, namely Curse Eater and Symphony of Blades. It almost seems that, there are two different groups of people in charge of balance, with the Skill balance for this patch as good as the Set balance team is bad.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

Very Positive

Sabbathius wrote: »

I voted Negative, at least the way they are now. Argonians took too much of a hit. Nords still lack a clear purpose. Imperials are also neither here nor there. And that's just to name a few. If this goes live as-is, we're pretty much guaranteed another "rebalance" in a year or two. I wish they would take their time, give it some serious thought, do this ONCE, let us have a free race change for a week, so we can fix out character lineup, and put this to rest. But it looks like the cycle will continue, and we'll be expected to fork over 3,500 crowns per character just so we don't end up with noncompetitive builds. Feels like a racket. Hence the negative vote.

Maybe you missed this

https://youtu.be/abp7mRe9CZk

rexagamemnon

Negative

All the other races are balanced except Imperials, Imperials were gutted and the changes were not even lore based at the minimum

Amphithoe

Neutral

Androconium

I uninstalled my game. It wont be easy for me to check this now.

nsmurfer

Very Positive

Sabbathius wrote: »

I voted Negative, at least the way they are now. Argonians took too much of a hit. Nords still lack a clear purpose. Imperials are also neither here nor there. And that's just to name a few. If this goes live as-is, we're pretty much guaranteed another "rebalance" in a year or two. I wish they would take their time, give it some serious thought, do this ONCE, let us have a free race change for a week, so we can fix out character lineup, and put this to rest. But it looks like the cycle will continue, and we'll be expected to fork over 3,500 crowns per character just so we don't end up with noncompetitive builds. Feels like a racket. Hence the negative vote.

@Sabbathius
Some very good endgame dPS in the name got very low differences between the races, say between Altmer and Argonian, at raid DPS of 60k DPS. At that range, the difference is lesser than 1k. For 99% of the population, who struggle to pull 30K on a good day, you won't find a difference. Also, being BiS Pvp tanks should make them slightly weaker in pve Dps. Nord are great for PvP and also for PvE tanking.
Imperials did get somewhat short end of the stick. @susmitds had one of the better suggestions for imperials in one of his threads.

nsmurfer

Very Positive

susmitds wrote: »

I am really pleased with these changes.

After extensive hours of testing, speaking only about racial changes within the ranges of possibility, I would go as far as saying ZOS pulled off a freaking miracle here. Few optimizarions are possible here and there. I shared a full feedback here in https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/455283/racial-pve-pvp-feedback-and-some-recommended-changes-using-test-data-previously-performed#latest

This patch would have been the perfect balance patch, with the race changes and sorcerer changes, only to be spoiled by two of the most broken sets I have heard of in a while, namely Curse Eater and Symphony of Blades. It almost seems that, there are two different groups of people in charge of balance, with the Skill balance for this patch as good as the Set balance team is bad.

I think they have only one team. but these both of those sets look ridiculously broken. @ZOS_Gilliam @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Finn @ZOS_GinaBruno , please have a look at those sets. Either one can have widespread implications on Pvp and the second one seems OP af in pvE as well.

ccmedaddy

Very Positive

My mind reels thinking about all the race/class combos that weren't previously viable before.

leeux

Neutral

They are OK except for the outliers, Dunmer, Bosmer and Imperial that seems to have been ripped off of some of their identities... not sure if I care honestly, even if I have Dunmers and Imperials myself, but sure there are people that considers that important and I respect that, so I can't say in good conscience that the changes are 100% positive... they're not for a big group of people.

SpiderCultist

Positive

I like the changes in spite of having to burn a few tokens in order to optimize all my characters

what I don't understand is the drama about dark elves, they are still viable and lore-friendly, I won't change mine

Bouldercleave

Positive

Androconium wrote: »

I uninstalled my game. It wont be easy for me to check this now.

Then why did you feel the need to post?

JobooAGS

Neutral

Meant to say positive, just imperial as a dd is a bit lacking and argonian seemed to have got nerfed a bit too much.

I wonder if dunmer got 2k mag and 500-650 stam, would those who arent happy with the dunmer changes be happier?

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO

Very Positive

khajiit gets full buff, im good.

LordGavus

Positive

From all the tests I've seen the changes look good. The difference in dps for the 60k players works out to be pretty small.

In fact I doubt my 35k ass will even notice any difference

Matthros

Very Positive

JobooAGS wrote: »

I wonder if dunmer got 2k mag and 500-650 stam, would those who arent happy with the dunmer changes be happier?

Unfortunately it would make the players running Dunmer as stam characters un-happy since they would be losing alot more stam and they don't have a sustain bonus.

Tholian1

Negative

Imperial needs a bump for DD. Of course most others are happy with the “balance” as their favorite race didn’t come in last.

Savos_Saren

Neutral

PVP- wise, Dunmer magDDs took a hit.

Altmer and Breton still come out on top- since they can spec toward damage (because of their regen bonuses).

Dunmer should have higher spell damage because of the lack of regeneration. (It will even out because dunmer will have to spec toward magic regen)

Caligamy_ESO

Negative

I feel that they are more generic and boring than they were before, and the dumb experience bonus to weapon skill lines is absolutely pointless. Replace it with something else, anything else.. hell give us an active racial skill like the old Dunmer Ancestor Guardian... just anything but a experience bonus to a weapon skill that keeps up with our level anyways.

Tommy_The_Gun

Negative

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/453551/upcoming-racial-balance-changes-for-update-21/p1
1. Allow more effective options when picking a race for each role in tanking, healing, or damage dealing.
2. Equalize the overall power that each race provides by using our set bonus efficiency system, which compares the total amount of power that a bonus provides under equal terms.
3. Retain and enhance the unique feeling and gameplay patterns that each race allows.
4. Improve the sense of progression that the racial passives provide when leveling up.
5. Achieve the above goals while still obeying our rich and structured lore and storytelling.

TBH I feel like almost none of this goals have been achieved and the only overall difference in the long run (PTS vs current live server) will be that argonian will swap places with nord as a bottom tier race.

susmitds

Very Positive

Matthros wrote: »

JobooAGS wrote: »

I wonder if dunmer got 2k mag and 500-650 stam, would those who arent happy with the dunmer changes be happier?

Unfortunately it would make the players running Dunmer as stam characters un-happy since they would be losing alot more stam and they don't have a sustain bonus.

Realistically, it would not change anything. What it would do however, is mathematically balance the class better. I mean, Dunmer was topping pretty much every stamina DPS charts by a hair, being a hybrid race on PTS and magicka race on live. 500 lesser stamina is unnoticeable. However, it would do justice to majority of the dunmer players in the game, who use magicka characters. It matches the raw magicka damage of Altmer, which fits the lore of dunmeri folk as basically Altmer who lost their magicka restoring nature for physical prowess, still retaining their destructive nature.

If you want proof of this, it can be seen in the magicka DPS charts, where Dunmer average parses in the 60k zone are less than 200 less than that of Altmer, in spite of having 750 lesser magicka and sustain.

Seraphayel

Very Positive

Most changes are great. Imperials could need a small buff, everything else seems to be excellently balanced.

CrimsonGTX

Positive

Surprisingly they got a lot right this time, but I have to agree with everyone else about Imperials.

Mudcrabber

Positive

I feel this has narrowed the gap between the races, especially for very min-maxed builds by switching to flat bonuses. Choosing the wrong race will be much less costly than it is now. The end-game differences are minimized, rather than amplified.

I think Khajiit got the best deal. They're now a hybrid race, but they compete with the best at both stamina and magicka. And they're now the only stealth race, and stealthier than before.

Bretons are back from the dead with their strong cost reduction.

Bosmer got a bad deal I think. They lost their stealth bonus, and instead get a roll-dodge speed bonus that kinda duplicates what you already get with bows.

My Argonian main's also getting nerfed all-around, and it's the last race I would have thought needed a nerf. But I can live with that if it means I can make a Khajiit magicka nekomancer.

susmitds

Very Positive

Mudcrabber wrote: »

I feel this has narrowed the gap between the races, especially for very min-maxed builds by switching to flat bonuses. Choosing the wrong race will be much less costly than it is now. The end-game differences are minimized, rather than amplified.

I think Khajiit got the best deal. They're now a hybrid race, but they compete with the best at both stamina and magicka. And they're now the only stealth race, and stealthier than before.

Bretons are back from the dead with their strong cost reduction.

Bosmer got a bad deal I think. They lost their stealth bonus, and instead get a roll-dodge speed bonus that kinda duplicates what you already get with bows.

My Argonian main's also getting nerfed all-around, and it's the last race I would have thought needed a nerf. But I can live with that if it means I can make a Khajiit magicka nekomancer.

Bosmer speed buff, stacks with bow.

Starlock

Very Positive

My opinion hasn’t changed. It won’t until the next iteration of the PTS.

Tasear

Positive

Could be better, but I say a job well done.

luen79rwb17_ESO

Positive

Looking very good but I agree Imperials should be improved

JamuThatsWho

Positive

After seeing and reading some of the tests people have done on the PTS, I'm fairly happy with the changes.

Sure, my Dunmer MagDK lost his sweet Flame damage buff, but I'm rolling a Magicka Necro anyway when Elsweyr drops. I'm just undecided on race atm; I could go all out with an Altmer/Breton, or go Khajiit for versatility if I want to try Stamina down the road.