My tweaks to the race change notes

Trancestor

High Elf - i think the new amount of magicka it will get is too much of a huge nerf to high max magicka builds, making it at least 500 more is fair IMO. Also i removed the gained stamina for activating a class ability because i think it's just useless as there's zero reason to make a high elf for a stamina class.

Spellcharge: 9% Magicka Recovery → Spell Recharge: Restore 575 Magicka after activating a Class Ability. This effect can occur once every 6 seconds. Reduces damage taken by 5% while you are using an ability with a cast or channel time.
Gift of Magnus: 10% Max Magicka → Syrabane’s Boon: Increases your Max Magicka by 2500.
Elemental Talent: 4% Fire/Shock/Ice damage → Increases your Spell Damage by 258.

Argonian - The small nerf to resourceful is fair, but if we're already trying to make races here suitable for both stam and mag why not give it also some stam instead of just mag. Give it also at least 750 more hp because the loss of 9% hp is a pretty big nerf. Also you're taking away 6% healing, that's pretty over the top for no apparent reason.

Resourceful: Gain 3% Max Magicka and restore 4620 Health, Magicka, and Stamina when you drink a potion → Increases your Max Magicka and Stamina by 750. Restore 3600 Health, Magicka, and Stamina when you drink a potion.
Argonian Resistance: 9% Max Health and 1485 Poison and Disease Resistance → Increases your Max Health by 1750 and your Disease Resistance by 2310. You are immune to the Diseased status effect.
Quick to Mend: 5% Healing Done and Received → Life Mender: Increases your Healing Done and Recieved by 4%.

Wood Elf - Changes seem fine mostly, but the 20% speed is definitely too much, roller blades are already incredibly annoying, 10% would be fine.

Y’ffre’s Endurance: 21% Stamina Recovery → Increases your Stamina Recovery by 258.
Resist Affliction: 6% Max Stamina and 1485 Poison and Disease Resistance → Increases your Max Stamina by 2000 and your Poison Resistance by 2310. You are immune to the Poisoned status effect.
Stealthy: Reduces detection Radius by 3m and Increases Damage Done in Stealth by 10% → Hunter’s Eye: Increases your Stealth detection radius by 3m. After you use Roll Dodge you gain 10% Movement Speed for 4 seconds.

Breton - Again, huge nerf to high max mag builds, make it 500 more at least. The last passive i added because i think there's not much reason to make a bosmer instead of a high elf, this would at least give it a nice advantage in PvP.

Gift of Magnus: 10% Max Magicka → Increases your Max Magicka by 2500.
Spell Resistance: 3960 Spell Resistance → Gain 2310 Spell Resistance and 100 Magicka Recovery.
Magicka Mastery: 3% Magicka Cost Reduction → Reduces the Magicka cost of your abilities by 7%. Gain flat reduction of snares by 15%.

Dark Elf - You took away any reason to play a Dark Elf over a High Elf in PvE, adding bit more HP and giving it back it's unique flame dmg buff would make it viable vs High Elf, more damage but less sustain.

Dynamic: 6% Max Stamina and Magicka → Increases your Max Stamina and Magicka by 1250.
Resist Flame: 3% Max Magicka and 2079 Flame Resistance → Increases your Max Health by 750 and your Flame Resistance by 2310. You are immune to the Burning status effect.
Destructive Ancestry: 7% Flame damage and 2% Frost/Shock Damage → Ruination: Increases your Weapon and Spell Damage by 258. Gain 258 Spell Damage to your Fire Damage abilities.

Imperial - Most under performing race before and still would be, adding this extra Stam, HP, Block and Bash reduction would make it at least something to consider.

Tough: 12% Max Health → Increases your Max Health by 2750.
Conditioning: 10% Max Stamina → Imperial Mettle: Increases your Max Stamina by 2750.
Red Diamond: 10% Chance on Melee Attack to heal for 6% of Max Health → When you deal Direct Damage you have a 15% chance to heal for 2000. Reduces the cost of your Block and Bash abilities by 10%.

Khajiit - Pretty good changes, the amount of recovery tho was kinda pathetic, doubling it would make things better.

Nimble: 20% Health Recovery and 10% Stamina Recovery → Robustness: Increases your Stamina and Magicka recovery by 150.
Stealthy: Reduce detection radius by 3m and Increase damage from Stealth by 10% → Lunar Blessings: Increases your Max Health, Magicka, and Stamina by 750.
Carnage: Increase Weapon Critical Chance by 8% → Feline Ambush: Increases your Weapon and Spell Critical Chance by 8%. Reduces your detection radius in Stealth by 5m.

Nord - Pretty good changes but again loss of 9% hp is big and only 1k HP to cover for that? 2k would make it fine.

Stalwart: 6% Max Stamina and 20% Health Recovery → Increases your Max Stamina by 1500. When you take damage, you gain 5 Ultimate. This effect can occur once every 10 seconds.
Resist Frost: 9% Max Health and 2079 Cold Resistance → Increases your Max Health by 2000 and your Cold Resistance by 2310. You are immune to the Chilled status effect.
Rugged: 6% damage reduction → Increases your Physical and Spell Resistance by 3960.

Orc - Pretty big loss of max HP and Stam with the change and only 500 to cover for it? Really? Make it 1500. 380 health restored MAYBE every 4 seconds? Might as well remove that, or triple the amount and make it count on melee damage to make it somewhat useful.

Brawny: 6% Max Health and Stamina → Increases your Max Health and Stamina by 1500.
Unflinching: Healing Received by 5% and 20% Health Recovery → Increases your Healing Received by 4%. When you deal melee damage you restore 1260 Health and 380 Stamina. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.
Swift Warrior: 4% Melee attack, 12% Sprint cost reduction and 10% Sprint Speed → Increases your Weapon Damage by 258. Reduces the cost of your Sprint ability by 12% and increases your Movement Speed while Sprinting by 10%.

Redguard - Same as before, pretty big loss to high max stam builds, make it 500 more at least.

Exhilaration: 9% Stamina Recovery → Martial Training: Reduces the cost of your Weapon abilities by 8%.
Conditioning: 10% Max Stamina → Increases your Max Stamina by 2500.
Adrenaline Rush: When you deal damage with a melee attack you restore 792 Stamina. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds. → When you deal Direct Damage, you restore 950 Stamina. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.

Narvuntien

The 500 extra or whatever will have to be tested on the PTS thats pretty easy to change during that process.

umm, why are you nerfing bosmer more after they lost the stealth gameplay that was half the reason anyone ever played them? They have no damage buffs at all in their passives.

I also play a dumner Magdk and I mourn the loss of the flame damage but.. I am not sure why you would add it to the final passive and not just replacing the hp passive that isn't super important... Another option is to give them a sustain passive only for fire damage which would be kind of like how altmer have the channelling passive.

SodanTok

I think posts like this are utterly pointless and show how some people are detached from what this race balance was about. If the design of the combat balance was to put races on somewhat equal footing in terms of balanced amount of stuff they have then making thread and randomly nerfing some while buffing others just puts it away.

If you think you know better and can do better, go ahead. But if you are just adding and removing instead of shifting you arent really doing anything. If you give redguards 500 stam for free you have to remove that from somewhere else.

Then you went ahread and put melee damage restriction on orc when its exactly what this patch is removing.

In general, even if some of your ideas might be in right direction competently ignoring the point of these race changes just makes your good points fall flat

Trancestor

SodanTok wrote: »

I think posts like this are utterly pointless and show how some people are detached from what this race balance was about. If the design of the combat balance was to put races on somewhat equal footing in terms of balanced amount of stuff they have then making thread and randomly nerfing some while buffing others just puts it away.

If you think you know better and can do better, go ahead. But if you are just adding and removing instead of shifting you arent really doing anything. If you give redguards 500 stam for free you have to remove that from somewhere else.

Then you went ahread and put melee damage restriction on orc when its exactly what this patch is removing.

In general, even if some of your ideas might be in right direction competently ignoring the point of these race changes just makes your good points fall flat

Nothing i changed ignores the point of the changes, if anything it just reinforces it. I think the changes are a step in the right direction i just gave my opinion on what should be tweaked here and there while staying within the vision of these changes.

"then you went ahread and put melee damage restriction on orc" yeah i changed that from "dealing damage with a weapon ability" which are all melee anyway. I just think melee and orc makes more sense, doesn't matter really anyway.

MashmalloMan

I agree with most of this and it was my same thought process on a lot of your decisions however...

Dunmer gets way too much fire DMG here though, I'd reduce that to 129 or cost reduction of fire abilities by 5%.

Increasing all those max pools seems a bit too much too. I'd wait till pts. 2k is fine for most builds. Max resource stacking builds may be the only 1s to suffer, but only by 200-600 the more you stacked. Non mag stacking builds by your change would see a buff of 600-1k max resources while stacking builds only break even.

As a redguard with around 31k max sta on live, these changes would net me about 180 more sta. I'd assume the closer you get to 35k you start to break even and I don't care to lose sta anyway because the sustain is a huge buff.

It's different for everyone, but it's fine to lose something here.. we don't have to buff the pools just so we don't get nerfed.

1500 for orc is too much, 1k is the sweet spot. The heal is negligible and if they need to justify the more resources, take that heal away please. I'd be happy with 1k and triple HP return though.

Nord and khajiit - agreed.

Imperial, those pools are too high. I'd say 2500 is the limit. Everything else looks good. I don't think that heal has a CD though... Might be very powerful.

Argonian was over performing, what you propose keeps them as still an amazing pick. They removed the healing received for a reason. The stam is nice. 1500hp instead.

sneakymitchell

@Trancestor Have you read the whole post on the racial rebalance?
They want to make sure that all races can do the counter part of stam.
Sure some races use stam only like orc but it’s still useful for magic builds to help with sprint, roll dodge, and some stam skills.
What about dark elves who want to do stam Playstyle or hybrids? Guess it’s just kicking all the players who want to play those rolls. But hey let everything be the same. Let’s see how long the player base will continue if nothing changes to the meta.

Tholian1

The reduction of block and bash for Imperial isn’t very useful to me. A reduction in cost of break free seems like it would be more useful and would still fit with the lore description the devs have assigned to Imperials.

sneakymitchell

Tholian1 wrote: »

The reduction of block and bash for Imperial isn’t very useful to me. A reduction in cost of break free seems like it would be more useful and would still fit with the lore description the devs have assigned to Imperials.

Blocking still useful either way plus the healing will help mag imperial since it price on direct damage with no cooldown but still have to deal with little rng.

Parrot1986

How can you have come to this without being able to actually test the changes proposed themselves? All you’ve done is decide numbers are too low/high and put your own numbers.

There’s no actual evidence to back this up just and that’s summed up by the Breton proposed changes adding more resources to a class that has already OP resource management. There’s got to be a trade off not to mention Breton shouldn’t need to run either sustain sets, mundus in PVP or recovery food in PVE giving it more resources or damage potential.