Stamplar Tanks

Banegrivm

Are they any good? In comparison to a Magplar tank how do they fare? I'm torn between which is going to be my main right now. I'm not liking the Magplar as it seems the only way I'm going to get good Magicka regen is if I wear light armor, which I really do not want to have to cave into to do. The one thing I love about the Stamplar is that I don't have to worry about stopping generally. I almost always have Stamina to keep attacking. Also I like the non squishyness of it thanks to plate armor. I'd love any help that I can get. Also I do like to PvP as well.

Narvuntien

I am a full hybrid templar tank. I am a breton for mag regen which is a bit odd.

Banegrivm

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

Hotdog_23

Personally my Templar tank is magic based and it does pretty well. I do run repentance and restoring focus for the stamina I need plus power of light for the minor breach and minor fracture. My mag recovery is around 1250 and stam around 500 I believe. Not at home right now to check.

It is a different build for sure. Have around 25k mag, 16k stam and 40k health. I can do normal and vet dungeons with it.

Banegrivm

Well really what I want to know about is Stamina. I want to know if it is viable and if so how does it compare to magicka? I'm thinking of going with a Stam build, I really love the concept for RP wise, but I just don't want to make a mistake and make a character that I will end up regretting later. Not to mention, I loves me some PvP!

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Banegrivm wrote: »

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

Tanks generally use magic for utility spells and Stam for blocking. That is why you need both. You say you are a Stam tank, what does your build look like.

Use Superstar, https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info946-SuperStar-CharacterBuilder.html, and combat metrics, https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1360-CombatMetrics.html screenshot them and upload them to imgur.com.

Banegrivm

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Banegrivm wrote: »

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

Tanks generally use magic for utility spells and Stam for blocking. That is why you need both. You say you are a Stam tank, what does your build look like.

Use Superstar, https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info946-SuperStar-CharacterBuilder.html, and combat metrics, https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1360-CombatMetrics.html screenshot them and upload them to imgur.com.

I am not a Stam tank... yet. This is why I am asking if it is viable or not. I have a Magicka Templar. I have a Stamina Templar. I am trying to find out everything that I can about the Stamina Templar, explicitly when it comes to tanking because I want to know if it is worthwhile or not. I am going to choose between one or the other. I am hoping it's my Stamina Templar. Honestly every time I login the Magicka one I am always running out of Magicka, and I even put purple Magicka Recovery glyphs on my jewelry. No matter what, I just always keep running out of mana. On my Stam character I can just take off and I become a wrecking crew. I know DPS is way better as Stamina hands down.

But what about tanking? I am hoping it's viable and decent because I'd really love for it to be doable so I can keep playing the Stamina character and axe the Magicka one.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Banegrivm wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Banegrivm wrote: »

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

Tanks generally use magic for utility spells and Stam for blocking. That is why you need both. You say you are a Stam tank, what does your build look like.

Use Superstar, https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info946-SuperStar-CharacterBuilder.html, and combat metrics, https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1360-CombatMetrics.html screenshot them and upload them to imgur.com.

I am not a Stam tank... yet. This is why I am asking if it is viable or not. I have a Magicka Templar. I have a Stamina Templar. I am trying to find out everything that I can about the Stamina Templar, explicitly when it comes to tanking because I want to know if it is worthwhile or not. I am going to choose between one or the other. I am hoping it's my Stamina Templar. Honestly every time I login the Magicka one I am always running out of Magicka, and I even put purple Magicka Recovery glyphs on my jewelry. No matter what, I just always keep running out of mana. On my Stam character I can just take off and I become a wrecking crew. I know DPS is way better as Stamina hands down.

But what about tanking? I am hoping it's viable and decent because I'd really love for it to be doable so I can keep playing the Stamina character and axe the Magicka one.

Leaving aside your problems with mag resource management on your magplar, tanks are a completely different game then a dps or healer. As a tank, you are there to control the battlefield, debuffs to the enemy and such. You do that through a variety of ways.

If I was to build a tankplar, the skills would look like this-

Front bar s/b, infused crusher

Extended ritual- radiant ward- repentance(switch out for deep thoughts if needed)- heroic slash- pierce armor- ulti empowering sweep/shield discipline

Back bar ice/lighting staff, infused weakening.

Silver leash, time freeze, wall of elements, power of the light, restoring focus- ulti warhorn

Armor would be the classic ebon/alkosh(or almost any other tank set)/ thurvokyn/lord warden

This has everything you need. As you can see, the build uses almost an even amount of stam and mag skills.

It also depends on what you mean by "viable", the above build will get you through all four man stuff and all norm trials but vet hm trials are another story and I have no insight into that.

Banegrivm

Thank you for the information. It's a bit overwhelming to be honest but I have always said one thing that I like about ESO is that it requires intelligence to play, as opposed to other games that just about anyone can play. That gives me alot to think about. I wonder if there is a way to maybe take out some of the magic stuff and compensate with other stamina abilities.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Banegrivm wrote: »

Thank you for the information. It's a bit overwhelming to be honest but I have always said one thing that I like about ESO is that it requires intelligence to play, as opposed to other games that just about anyone can play. That gives me alot to think about. I wonder if there is a way to maybe take out some of the magic stuff and compensate with other stamina abilities.

Well yes there is but you have to remember that blocking cost stamina and you do not regen Stam while blocking. Out of magic= meh to a tank, out of Stam = dead tank.

Narvuntien

Banegrivm wrote: »

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

I have 40K hp 21K stam and 20K Mag. hence hybrid.

Sword and shield on both bars.

Ebon armor and Akarivi dragongaurd and shadowrend monster helm... Lots of mag regen. I have all hybrid everything tri enchants tri-stat jewellery and study trait.

Edziu

as I heared stamplar tank is inferior to magplar

not because of magica renege.max magica etc but because on magplar you have better healing form class skills for yourself as significant insta heal while on stamina you ahve only vigor which is pathetic even with extended ritual

I was building for stamlar tank as have mianly stamplar dd char so to chave switch if needed tank
for basic content and old dlc dungs it is fine, not that bad but for content like this you mcan go with anything tbh

I tried to tank vMhk.....without healer and with not good dps this is just hell for me with tanking on stamplar wbecause of missing selfheal
BUT
I think I could be not that bad if I invest fully into tankniess then for this because this my stamplar tank still have everything like jsut attributes spent and cp and morphs into stamina dps so I have to low health in overall than I should have and to much max stamina with also to low magica regen for templar shield to use very often instead of healing
+ have on it khajiit so race giving pretty nothing into tanking

with ebon and buff to dps set I have just 30k health which is really low and 40k health with plague doctor instead of buff set which is better but as I heared it is still not enough to b most efficient on tank - it shoudl be 50k or even 60k as for now so with race which have atleast 10% into max health

but at end as youalso wanted this compare mag to stamplar tank...as I said magplar is superior but only because of a bit better selfhealing mainly

and I was told I can also become vampire for his drain selfheal as he is % based healing of your max health - ony thing which is missing templar tank from every other class and this is only thing why templar mostly is one of worst classes to tank
this heal can be problematic as it is channeling skill on enemy so you neeed to be very aware when use it and when to stop it to not worse your situation

Banegrivm

I'm wondering if I hydridize out a bit and get some sets which give a little bit of Magicka than I could use Honor the Dead. As a Mag character it's a full heal for me. As a Stam its just a little more than half my bar.

Lord_Eomer

Narvuntien wrote: »

Banegrivm wrote: »

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

I have 40K hp 21K stam and 20K Mag. hence hybrid.

Sword and shield on both bars.

Ebon armor and Akarivi dragongaurd and shadowrend monster helm... Lots of mag regen. I have all hybrid everything tri enchants tri-stat jewellery and study trait.

You are not hybid, there is no such thing for tanking, we have two options either tank with Sword and Shield or Ice Staff.

Some players use Sword & Board on Main Bar and Ice staff on secondary bar. There used to be tanking with shields but blocking is must part of tanking for veteran contents.

Banegrivm

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Narvuntien wrote: »

Banegrivm wrote: »

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

I have 40K hp 21K stam and 20K Mag. hence hybrid.

Sword and shield on both bars.

Ebon armor and Akarivi dragongaurd and shadowrend monster helm... Lots of mag regen. I have all hybrid everything tri enchants tri-stat jewellery and study trait.

You are not hybid, there is no such thing for tanking, we have two options either tank with Sword and Shield or Ice Staff.

Some players use Sword & Board on Main Bar and Ice staff on secondary bar. There used to be tanking with shields but blocking is must part of tanking for veteran contents.

So you're saying it's either Stam or Magicka? A guy above said that he was a hybrid build and was doing well with it.

usmcjdking

Stamplar tank is generally in a really, really bad spot. It's not unplayable but it's really not flexible at all.

- 1 it has no useful mag dump. Purify isn't good enough as most of the threatening stuff in this game cannot be cleansed.
- 2 no good heal. Stam temp tank has exceptionally poor healing, the absolute worst in 4 man content. This forces the temp tank to build into absurd amounts of stat boosting gear so that vigor tooltip can reach a meaningful number.
- 3 lost a whole lot of mitigation last patch. It lost the full uptime on Minor Protection & Minor Vitality and no longer has access to vitality. And it lost 15% block mitigation towards melee attacks with no way to get it back.

+ 4 has gobs of damage. Stamplar tank is better defined as a 35khp DPS with puncture spammable. It's not uncommon for me to pull 20k S/T on a boss that isn't very threatening, or even 12k versus a boss that is.
+ Best AOE heals in the game. Because the stamplar is going to dump everything into weapon damage and max stam, operating with as little health as possible, you're going to have a massive Vigor tooltip. My tanks vigor tooltip is 13.7k to friendlies and 16k to myself which makes it one of the best HOTs in the game.
+ On demand Major Protection. Temp tank can power through a lot of BS by being able to have major protection at any given time on a 72 cost ultimate.

The generally accepted healtank (mag temp) operates better as it allows you to run a 3rd DPS outright. Stam temp needs to be built to be a brawler or it crutches on the strength of your healer (which is not good in a lot of fights with a preoccupied healer).

Banegrivm

Wow that is really disappointing. I just can't stand the Magicka suckage on the Magplar. It seems no matter what I try, I'm always sucking down Magicka and just never have enough of it, no matter what I do. Even after three purple glyphs of Magicka Regen on my jewelry.

Royaji

Banegrivm wrote: »

Wow that is really disappointing. I just can't stand the Magicka suckage on the Magplar. It seems no matter what I try, I'm always sucking down Magicka and just never have enough of it, no matter what I do. Even after three purple glyphs of Magicka Regen on my jewelry.

Honestly sounds like you are not heavy attacking enough.

Banegrivm

Royaji wrote: »

Banegrivm wrote: »

Wow that is really disappointing. I just can't stand the Magicka suckage on the Magplar. It seems no matter what I try, I'm always sucking down Magicka and just never have enough of it, no matter what I do. Even after three purple glyphs of Magicka Regen on my jewelry.

Honestly sounds like you are not heavy attacking enough.

I can chain abilities on my Stamplar repeatedly... without having to heavy attack even once.

Hotdog_23

usmcjdking wrote: »

Stamplar tank is generally in a really, really bad spot. It's not unplayable but it's really not flexible at all.

- 1 it has no useful mag dump. Purify isn't good enough as most of the threatening stuff in this game cannot be cleansed.
- 2 no good heal. Stam temp tank has exceptionally poor healing, the absolute worst in 4 man content. This forces the temp tank to build into absurd amounts of stat boosting gear so that vigor tooltip can reach a meaningful number.
- 3 lost a whole lot of mitigation last patch. It lost the full uptime on Minor Protection & Minor Vitality and no longer has access to vitality. And it lost 15% block mitigation towards melee attacks with no way to get it back.

+ 4 has gobs of damage. Stamplar tank is better defined as a 35khp DPS with puncture spammable. It's not uncommon for me to pull 20k S/T on a boss that isn't very threatening, or even 12k versus a boss that is.
+ Best AOE heals in the game. Because the stamplar is going to dump everything into weapon damage and max stam, operating with as little health as possible, you're going to have a massive Vigor tooltip. My tanks vigor tooltip is 13.7k to friendlies and 16k to myself which makes it one of the best HOTs in the game.
+ On demand Major Protection. Temp tank can power through a lot of BS by being able to have major protection at any given time on a 72 cost ultimate.

The generally accepted healtank (mag temp) operates better as it allows you to run a 3rd DPS outright. Stam temp needs to be built to be a brawler or it crutches on the strength of your healer (which is not good in a lot of fights with a preoccupied healer).

This is spot on. Well written, awesome form me. Reasons you listed is why I went full magic instead of stam. In my opinion the other thing a Templar really lacks is a pull method for trash. I know silver lash works but just expensive on stam for me.

Plus all this talk about hybrid builds is kinda funny to me as all tanks are really a hybrid built to some degree.

Brrrofski

Tanks aren't really magica or stamina (RIP my amazing saptank build from One Tamriel )

Typically, you'll put most points into health. You'll have more max stamina than magica (for blocking and because when you activate another Templar's shards or the undaunted bubbles, they restore your highest resource, so you need higher stam as that's what you want back).

The rest of your build is then made around being bulky (so increasing your physical and spell resistances, damage mitigation from thing like minor and major protection or/and getting block mitigation so you take less damage while blocking. If you are doing trials, you also want a set that will buff the group, like alkosh or torugs. Both these sets help increase the group's damage

The final thing you need is magica recovery as you'll use a lot of magica utility skills.

You'll also need a way of getting stam back, usually while you are blocking. Templar's have a morph of their tube which go as stam back. Nightblade use leeching strikes. Wardens have their bull netch. Dragonknights have two passives which do this. Sorc is the only one that needs to drop block to do so when they use dark conversion.

With all that said, Templar tank is not in a good spot. You don't have much use for magica as your skills don't really go well for ranking. A DK for instance can spam an earthen heart ability to get stam back as well as using chains and talons for enemy control. A Warden has several heals of time for them and the group, gripping shards and their portal skill for enemy control and also crystallised shield which gives ultimate gain and allows you drop to drop block when fighting enemies who are using projectiles. Sorcerer uses dark deal for stamina back, then prison for enemy control. Nightblade has a few buffs too, although they killed the saptank playstyle so not too effective either.

The common thing that they all have that Templar lacks is a health based heal that costs magica. Warden has polar wind (which also heals an ally), DKs have dragonblood, specs use their clanfear and nightblade have dark clock. So pushing high health and high magica recovery helps them with healing. Templar lacks that. All it's healing sources are based or weapon or spell damage and stamina or magica.

Templar tank is doable, but a lot harder. Like my warden tank can do a lot of 4 man without a healer. Not only can it self heal, but also heal others with burst heals and heals of time. I did WGT the other day with no healer and no deathed it, even ignoring the pinion mechanic on that boss. Even taking the group heals away, I reckon other tanks like DK and sorc could do that as long as the group all self healed. A templar could never do that.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

. 1 it has no useful mag dump. Purify isn't good enough as most of the threatening stuff in this game cannot be cleansed. .

How is radiant ward not good? Up to 40% of your health as a ward, AOE damage useful for procing the passives of the aedric spear line. Even better now that it is basically an extra 40% health on demand. Best Ward in the game for tanks.

FrancisCrawford

Banegrivm wrote: »

Oh? How did you go Hybrid? What sort of things did you do? I thought about that originally but I wasn't sure how it would work out really. Everyone keeps saying put all your points into one or the other.

Tanks are an exception. High magicka or stamina give you high numbers on damage or healing skills. Most tanks, however, rely on utility skills, or perhaps the occasional heal or shield that scales with health.

A downside to this strategy is that while a healer can do enough DPS to carry a terrible group, because their healing and damage scale with exactly the same stats, a classic tank finds damage-dealing to be much harder.

Veuth

Brawler + Blazing Shields is a perfect combination to tank enemies/bosses, although not as tanky as perhaps Sorc or Dk.

usmcjdking

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

. 1 it has no useful mag dump. Purify isn't good enough as most of the threatening stuff in this game cannot be cleansed. .

How is radiant ward not good? Up to 40% of your health as a ward, AOE damage useful for procing the passives of the aedric spear line. Even better now that it is basically an extra 40% health on demand. Best Ward in the game for tanks.

Doesn't benefit from block mitigation.