Snipe From 40 Meters Shouldn't Stun
Aliyavana
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Snipe is essentially a 40 meter dizzying swing with defile and is usually combined with cloak to be one of the most rewarding skills for little effort. There is little counterplay when the majority of players hide behind a zerg or group and to make it even worse, nightblades are able to consitantly combine stun you with snipe thanks to cloak and its just makes for a pretty bad experience. most bowblades will snipe at you when you are already fighting someone else and with the stun from cloak, it makes will quickly turn the fight around to their fellow zerglings favor. There is no reason a 40 meter ability should stun, if anything it should only stun when the bowblade is playing riskier.
Edited by Aliyavana on January 10, 2019 6:54AM 39
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Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »stop trying to destroy snipe
stop trying to destroy our ranged playstyle every single day making request therads to destroy archer playstyle.
nothing wrong with what we have, its been here since 5+ years.
Until either snipe from 40 meters away doesnt do as much damage as dizzying swing, or dizzying swing gets a 40 meter range increase, I cant agree with your perception of me wanting to destroy your playstyle. Id prefer to look at it as properly balance it, and 5 years or not, it is never too late to fix it.Edited by Aliyavana on March 26, 2019 11:57PM31 -
xenowarrior92eb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@Aliyavana if you die to a sniper then you should try PvE since Pvp its clearly not for you.35 -
Aliyavana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »@Aliyavana if you die to a sniper then you should try PvE since Pvp its clearly not for you.
A sniper as in one? No. Various zergling spamming snipe comfortably behind a zerg and other annoyances? Sure, everyone dies then.
Im sure i could melt you in (no cp) pvp however and if you think pvp isnt for me and i end up melting you then that would mean it would be even less for you
Edited by Aliyavana on December 20, 2018 1:56AM19 -
dazee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭How is snipe stunning at all? I dont think the stun from stealth on NB should even apply to attacks with that much range.Playing your character the way your character should play is all that matters. Play as well as you can but never betray the character. Doing so would make playing an mmoRPG pointless.5 -
xenowarrior92eb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@Aliyavana clearly a 2nd proof you should go PvE since if you go solo vs zergs then again...Pvp its not for you...yes of u have 50 snipers on u at once u insta die but if u have like a bunch of noobs like 3-4 spamming only snipes then it comes to ur skill to demolish them...I play stamblade and unlike the shame of my kind I dont play bow builds cuz they are just bad and once someone gets close and it does u are dead in 2 swings.4 -
Judas Helviaryn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I can't believe people have such an issue with Snipe. All I see are hate and rage from people who don't understand how to counter it, and people who think the loudest ones are the right ones.
You can hear snipe when it is cast on you, even from stealth.
You can preemptively ward, dodge, block, or reflect.
You can unload on people who are snipe spamming, punishing their lack of finesse.
That's literally all the counter-play I need, and that's all there should be.Edited by Judas Helviaryn on December 20, 2018 2:32AM12 -
Katahdin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Lets also remove stun from Crushing Shock and Shock reach and remove the CC from flame reach to while we are at it
Heck lets remove ALL ccs, stuns, roots, snares, time stop, negate, etc. That would be awesome.
.Edited by Katahdin on December 20, 2018 2:37AMBeta tester November 20139 -
omgiztim✭✭✭I have played bowblade since beta. Spamming snipe is not a very successful gameplay. It may be high damage but way too slow. A true bow build needs far more skill. The playstyle is balanced for what it is. High range damage with little if any melee defense vs high melee damage (dizzy swing) with high defense.
What you hate is I catch you and your dead. What i hate is you catch me and im dead. Its a fair trade off.
I dont understand why my damage/range should be nerfed yet yours not. You dont see me whinning that i cant tank as an archer. I accept the balance and die often when rushed with hurricane/bugs etc and dizzy swing. Just as you should accept the times i do pull off a ranged combo and kill you.
Range and stealth are not a guaranted safety. There are many counters to it just as I have some counters to escape melee. Out of all the PVP issues, I find the balance between range and melee to be the best balanced as is. There is no need to change it.
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JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
✭I would love to see snipe and rapid fire to be swapped and have their costs/damage/morphs adjusted accordenly. That would overall place bow in a better spot while removing much of the cancer assoiated with it.
Here is a sugestion towards how I would change the skills
Rapid fire: Unleash a barrage of 3 arrows each dealing x physical damage over 0.6 seconds
cost similar to other stam spammables
28 m
Morph 1:
Toxic barrage: Converts damage to poison damage. Targets affected by Toxic barrage take y% extra poison damage from all poison sources for 2/3/4/5 seconds
Morph 2:
Archer's focus: Decreases the cost and applies minor fracture for 10 seconds on afflicted target.
Snipe: Plant an arrow into an enemy's vital spot dealing z physical damage (instant cast)
Cost 120 (90?, 150? Insert a number?) ult
28m
Morph 1:
Lethal arrow: Changes to poison damage, applys major defile and poisoned status for 4 seconds
Morph 2:
Focused aim: Increases the damage, but adds a 1.1 second cast time
Thoughts ? Changes?Edited by JobooAGS on December 20, 2018 4:06AM3 -
Oberstein✭✭✭
History, like a human being, is thirsty when it wakes from its slumber…History wants to drink up an enormous amount of blood. And even if history has tired of drinking blood, that’s only in regards to the amount. But what about quality? The larger the sacrifice is, the more delighted the cruel gods will be.4 -
Sy1ph5✭✭✭✭Since your only argument is a personal attack instead of anything worthwhile do us all a favor and stop. @xenowarrior92eb17_ESO
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MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Judas Helviaryn wrote: »I can't believe people have such an issue with Snipe. All I see are hate and rage from people who don't understand how to counter it, and people who think the loudest ones are the right ones.
You can hear snipe when it is cast on you, even from stealth.
You can preemptively ward, dodge, block, or reflect.
You can unload on people who are snipe spamming, punishing their lack of finesse.
That's literally all the counter-play I need, and that's all there should be.
The game sound lags and is too unreliable for the “listen for it” defence to carry any weight.9 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Many skills stun from cloak and that stun is not directly coded with that skill but the group it is in.
Edit: Zos groups a lot of items which is why it is likely skills that stun have a relation to a specific group that permits this behavior.Edited by idk on December 20, 2018 3:30AM0 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You cant take without giving. People cant stand Snipe but we also cant stand Fossilize and Jabs and yes, Dizzying Swing. You ever get one shot by a Dizzying Swing + Berserker Strike combo? Its never fun.
CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!2 -
Sy1ph5✭✭✭✭
Works for some mag builds and zerglings. Doesn't work well for Stam builds or builds pressed for slots like magsorc. Not saying snipe shouldn't stun from stealth( I don't think snipe should exist in its current form at all.) Just saying that radiant magelight existing is hardly a justification for snipe stunning from stealth.4 -
JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
✭Snipe (and anything that doesnt reveal you when you cast) stun from stealth(crouching), not cloak. Only veiled strike and morphs stun from cloak. However your arguement otherwise remains the same0 -
Sy1ph5✭✭✭✭
No you don't all of those are melee range. And force the player to using them to actually fight you outside of a straight gank. This isn't an argument about what you personally as a player find frustrating.2 -
JobooAGS✭✭✭✭✭
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No you don't all of those are melee range. And force the player to using them to actually fight you outside of a straight gank. This isn't an argument about what you personally as a player find frustrating.
Playing devil's advocate, but there are 22m gap closers that somewhat negate range (Yes I am aware of tactics to maintain range for most range builds)0 -
Acrolas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Works for some mag builds and zerglings. Doesn't work well for Stam builds or builds pressed for slots like magsorc. Not saying snipe shouldn't stun from stealth( I don't think snipe should exist in its current form at all.) Just saying that radiant magelight existing is hardly a justification for snipe stunning from stealth.
I put Radiant Magelight on every PVP character. Because a carefully planned and maximized build does not matter if you're too dead to use it.signing off1 -
omgiztim✭✭✭
No you don't all of those are melee range. And force the player to using them to actually fight you outside of a straight gank. This isn't an argument about what you personally as a player find frustrating.
The point is we are comparing a ranged high damage/low defense to a melee high damage/high defense. If you nerf the ranged that will off balance the melee. So you must nerf both to keep them balanced.
Your gap closer must stay the same to keep the balanced play. Lowering the range on the gap closer would tip the scale to the range players benefit.
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Judas Helviaryn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Judas Helviaryn wrote: »I can't believe people have such an issue with Snipe. All I see are hate and rage from people who don't understand how to counter it, and people who think the loudest ones are the right ones.
You can hear snipe when it is cast on you, even from stealth.
You can preemptively ward, dodge, block, or reflect.
You can unload on people who are snipe spamming, punishing their lack of finesse.
That's literally all the counter-play I need, and that's all there should be.
The game sound lags and is too unreliable for the “listen for it” defence to carry any weight.
Never had an issue listening for snipe, even when I had satellite. Sounds to me like your game is already unplayable, if it's worse than that.1 -
Kel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's not a snipe issue, or even a nightblade issue.
If you bow attack from stealth ...with any class or bow ability, it stuns you. Has zero to do with cloak.
I do this on my DK all the time.
The stun has nothing to do with any particular ability....it comes from a bow attack from stealth.Edited by Kel on December 20, 2018 4:36AM2 -
Sy1ph5✭✭✭✭
No you don't all of those are melee range. And force the player to using them to actually fight you outside of a straight gank. This isn't an argument about what you personally as a player find frustrating.
The point is we are comparing a ranged high damage/low defense to a melee high damage/high defense. If you nerf the ranged that will off balance the melee. So you must nerf both to keep them balanced.
Your gap closer must stay the same to keep the balanced play. Lowering the range on the gap closer would tip the scale to the range players benefit.
Nah snipe just shouldn't exist it doesn't work well for ranged players it works well for Xv1ers if those two are the same well maybe there is a problem with bow. People married to the bow would benefit if they swapped the idea of snipe and rapid fire. Your argument is unclear and you made up vague hypotheticals that don't nessecarily reflect the reality of cyrodil to back it up. I'm willing to listen if you come up with something that makes more sense3 -
omgiztim✭✭✭I agree that snipe and a rapid fire switch could be better if designed right. As a pure bow user, snipe is far too slow to use as a spamable and is really only an opener for me or used because it is the only thing that has enough range to hit a player during a keep defense.
Are you suggesting a quicker, lower damage high range option?2 -
MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Judas Helviaryn wrote: »Judas Helviaryn wrote: »I can't believe people have such an issue with Snipe. All I see are hate and rage from people who don't understand how to counter it, and people who think the loudest ones are the right ones.
You can hear snipe when it is cast on you, even from stealth.
You can preemptively ward, dodge, block, or reflect.
You can unload on people who are snipe spamming, punishing their lack of finesse.
That's literally all the counter-play I need, and that's all there should be.
The game sound lags and is too unreliable for the “listen for it” defence to carry any weight.
Never had an issue listening for snipe, even when I had satellite. Sounds to me like your game is already unplayable, if it's worse than that.
Pretty much, but there are times where the combat would be fine but only the sound would have issues. Weird I know, but it happens and I know I’m not the only one this happens too and it completely eliminates one of he main counters to gankers and snipe.
One of the many reasons I detest the PVP in this game.0
