Suggestion: Add ‘Solo mode’ to dungeons

mjharper

The last time there was any new content for high end solo play was Orsinium, with the Maelstrom Arena. In fact, that’s the ONLY content for high end solo play in the entirety of ESO. Everything else is (intentionally) easy overland content, PVP, or (increasingly) difficult group content.

For a challenge, solo players can attempt to do 4-player dungeons solo. But there’s several problems with this.

• Firstly, many of those dungeons have mechanics which require more than one player, either to click switches, or to free a trapped player who cannot free themselves.
• Secondly, the DLC dungeons have been pitched at increasing levels of difficulty, rendering them largely inaccessible even for players who are able to solo base-game dungeons on veteran difficulty

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My suggested solution to this dearth of content for high end solo play is to add a ‘Solo mode’ to all dungeons.

Note: I am not recommending adjusting the difficulty of dungeons to suit solo players. Four-player dungeons could and should remain designed for 4 players. It is not my intention here to question the wisdom of setting DLC dungeons at ever-increasing levels of difficulty, excluding the majority of the player base.

Such a ‘Solo mode’ should be an alternate instance which can only be accessed by a single player. All mechanics which require multiple players should be revised, so that only one lever need be pulled, or permanent stuns receive limited durations or can be broken free from, and so on.

For difficulty, ‘Solo mode’ DLC dungeons could be pitched at about the same level as 4-player base-game dungeons. Base-game dungeons could remain at the same difficulty level, although with any group mechanics removed. There should, as a consequence, also be ‘Normal’ and ‘Veteran’ difficulties for ‘Solo mode’.

Alternatively, ‘Solo mode’ for base-game dungeons could also be set to a ‘bridging’ difficulty, perhaps with ‘Normal’ difficulty being at the level of public dungeons, but again, with only one player able to access them. ‘Veteran Solo mode’ for base-game dungeons could then be set to the level of Normal 4-player mode. This would preserve difficulty difference between base-game and DLC dungeons, while making the process of soloing more accessible for mid-tier players.

Obviously, dungeons which are completed on ‘Veteran Solo mode’ should also offer monster helms. And ‘Solo mode’ should also be an option for completing Undaunted pledges.

The aim here is to offer more content for solo players, while leaving the group content intact. It would also have the benefit of effectively adding value to the ESO+ subscription.

Thoughts?

stojekarcub18_ESO

I can agree. Groups can be so frustrating...and a vet solo instance could prove not only exciting, but also self-rewarding.

Aurayna

Yes I agree with this ... I only play solo as none of my friends play this game and would love to be able to explore group delves which at the moment are too hard to complete

Acrolas

Challenging solo content will be designed if and when solo content is a good fit for what is being developed.

But you're definitely going to see more group content almost every quarter, so manage your expectations accordingly.

Minyassa

That would be awesome. Not all of us have the time to wait in endless queues or for friends to log in or for guilds to get something organized. Also some of us might like to actually see what the dungeons look like and what we are fighting, and maybe even do some looting.

Nairinhe

I like the idea very much! It can also solve that problem when your group doesn't care about dungeon quest (when it's more like "click-click-click-removing from instance" than enjoying the story)

Mayrael

What I always hated, not only in ESO but in any online game was mechanics that were forcing group play, like stand on multiple pressure plates or boss using unbreakable everlasting CCs etc. If I'm strong enough to clear the content solo, why I'm not allowed to do it? Even if it will take 8 times longer than with good group? That's my choice. Sometimes I just need such chilling challenge, to stop before boss, to not rush, drink a coffee, stretch a bit and then jump into the battle.

Tandor

I entirely agree, and it would additionally be a money-spinner for ZOS as it would give soloers a reason to buy the twice-yearly dungeon DLCs.

Chriagon

A solo mode for group dungeons would be awesome.

Mayrael

And let's point out that we don't want this "solo mode" to be any easier than the group one, just remove group forcing mechanics.

mocap

Agree. Though i want to read dungeon story and quests, rather than play for reward or challenge.

mairwen85

Rather than a 'solo mode' which will ultimately become a gimped version of the existing dungeons (retro fitting stripped mechanics and introducing bug-ridden changes), I'd rather see dedicated solo instanced dungeons designed specifically around solo play -- introducing mechanics and puzzles, problem solving and challenging boss fights.

In the same vein, dungeons should be designed for either group or solo play: increased enemy health and numbers != group content (or hard mode) and decreased enemy health and numbers != solo mode. Each has a specific play style and requirement.

eklhaftb16_ESO

There's no reason not to do it. It costs next to nothing, and it means opening the existing content to more players.

There could be three difficulties for the solo content: 1) story mode (delve-like easy, with overland-grade drops and one-time quest rewarding a cosmetic item related to the dungeon); 2) lone adventurer mode (dungeon-like difficult, rewards dungeon set drops) and finally 3) lone veteran mode (rewards monster helmets).

Sparr0w

Just saying people have solo'd vSCP, vFL, vCoS so yeah...

Lumenn

As I've said in other threads, imo forced grouping was one of the main reasons WOW killed EQ. It was just more solo friendly at the time(mmo shouldn't HAVE to mean you wait until you can get a group to play, it just means other people play in the same world)I play and enjoy ESO simply because it IS solo friendly. Would love to see this implemented.

mairwen85

Lumenn wrote: »

As I've said in other threads, imo forced grouping was one of the main reasons WOW killed EQ. It was just more solo friendly at the time(mmo shouldn't HAVE to mean you wait until you can get a group to play, it just means other people play in the same world)I play and enjoy ESO simply because it IS solo friendly. Would love to see this implemented.

I think the same is true for the original vision for Craglorn. I loved the old Craglorn, but the forced grouping made it something of a missed opportunity, no one wants to be forced to do things strictly one way or not at all. After they reworked it, and made it more solo friendly, it found a better place with the player base -- I would like to see ZOS revisit the adventure zone concept, knowing what they do now and populate it equally solo and group oriented.

Aurie

I totally agree with OP and others.

There is an increasing number of solo MMO players generally, and ESO is no exception. Although some will ask what the point is of playing a multi online game if you are not going to group with other people, the fact is that for various reasons more and more gamers choose to play solo.

We already have a healthy proportion of the playerbase here in ESO who play solo and therefore, due to the reasons stated above in other posts, cannot enjoy much of the game's content.

Please change this @ZOS so that we solo players are not restricted to overland, delves and the easier dungeons.

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thorwyn

Let me be the first to ... well... disagree then.
Soloing is fine, I spend 90% of my ingame time soloing stuff, because I want to go my own pace and not rely on someone else. BUT in my opinion, every MMO needs a part that can not be soloed. If you want top notch gear, you have to work together with other people.
Now, most 4 player dungeons do not yield top notch gear, I know. But some of them, CoA for example, do (BSW). You can solo CoA btw, it's just not exactly easy. Making everything soloable takes away the last remains of social aspect of the game and makes it a bit like the current event, where 200 sociopaths are fighting over a water bottle in Clockwork City.

Gargath

Damn this is MMO, not single player game. This constant pressure on making everything either very easy or soloable is annoying. I have a feeling this would end like with heroics in swtor, years ago they could be done with companion without struggle and other people and soon those missions became boring like the whole game and then many people left the game.

If you are good enough you don't need solo mode.
I'm only average player and did some dungeons solo, but it was a very challenging experience.
If you are bad and suck in dungeons, practice more, adapt, change gears.
But don't try to set everything according to your needs.

mairwen85

thorwyn wrote: »

Let me be the first to ... well... disagree then.
Soloing is fine, I spend 90% of my ingame time soloing stuff, because I want to go my own pace and not rely on someone else. BUT in my opinion, every MMO needs a part that can not be soloed. If you want top notch gear, you have to work together with other people.
Now, most 4 player dungeons do not yield top notch gear, I know. But some of them, CoA for example, do (BSW). You can solo CoA btw, it's just not exactly easy. Making everything soloable takes away the last remains of social aspect of the game and makes it a bit like the current event, where 200 sociopaths are fighting over a water bottle in Clockwork City.

Indeed... you can solo vMA too

No one is saying 100% everything soloable, and not soloable for the same rewards either. I agree that top, top tier items should be obtained only through certain content and when completed to the game's spec and criteria for that content. A separate set of rewards for solo content -- not just dyes or a lame bust -- would be nice though. But I'd prefer, as I said before, that there was more specific solo instance content of the Maelstrom Arena calibre; even if that means reusing assets from existing dungeons (just not as a watered down version of the group content).

Lumenn

thorwyn wrote: »

Let me be the first to ... well... disagree then.
Soloing is fine, I spend 90% of my ingame time soloing stuff, because I want to go my own pace and not rely on someone else. BUT in my opinion, every MMO needs a part that can not be soloed. If you want top notch gear, you have to work together with other people.
Now, most 4 player dungeons do not yield top notch gear, I know. But some of them, CoA for example, do (BSW). You can solo CoA btw, it's just not exactly easy. Making everything soloable takes away the last remains of social aspect of the game and makes it a bit like the current event, where 200 sociopaths are fighting over a water bottle in Clockwork City.

Believe me when I say I'm not being aggressive, as I am genuinely curious. And I do appreciate that you stated it's your opinion. But why do you think playing an mmo means I must not only socialize(i do) but with people who also play the same game,(again, I do) same server, have the same times to play, and plan and organize said time just to hope to advance a character(gear etc) or be thrust in a PUG situation which COULD turn out ok, but could also turn into a debacle that nightmares are made from. Since the days of EQ1 I've heard "solo suxors" play single if you want to solo, it's in the name MMO you HAVE to group.

Why? MMO just means you all play in the same world. Why does it mean you have to staple someone to your rear end to advance? EQ was BAD about that, especially melee characters. ESO is better. But why is a group regarded as mandatory to advance, and not optional? Genuinely curious.

Minyassa

Lumenn wrote: »

thorwyn wrote: »

Let me be the first to ... well... disagree then.
Soloing is fine, I spend 90% of my ingame time soloing stuff, because I want to go my own pace and not rely on someone else. BUT in my opinion, every MMO needs a part that can not be soloed. If you want top notch gear, you have to work together with other people.
Now, most 4 player dungeons do not yield top notch gear, I know. But some of them, CoA for example, do (BSW). You can solo CoA btw, it's just not exactly easy. Making everything soloable takes away the last remains of social aspect of the game and makes it a bit like the current event, where 200 sociopaths are fighting over a water bottle in Clockwork City.

Believe me when I say I'm not being aggressive, as I am genuinely curious. And I do appreciate that you stated it's your opinion. But why do you think playing an mmo means I must not only socialize(i do) but with people who also play the same game,(again, I do) same server, have the same times to play, and plan and organize said time just to hope to advance a character(gear etc) or be thrust in a PUG situation which COULD turn out ok, but could also turn into a debacle that nightmares are made from. Since the days of EQ1 I've heard "solo suxors" play single if you want to solo, it's in the name MMO you HAVE to group.

Why? MMO just means you all play in the same world. Why does it mean you have to staple someone to your rear end to advance? EQ was BAD about that, especially melee characters. ESO is better. But why is a group regarded as mandatory to advance, and not optional? Genuinely curious.

^THIS, so much this!! I too have always wondered why people assume that just because a game allows a myriad of people to be online at the same time and do content together, it means they HAVE to do content together. Ridiculous. People gather together for many different reasons, and some of us just want to do things at our own pace while we chitchat with others. Or are not into chitchat so much but like seeing other people's outfits and houses. Or like to do group content and want absolutely NOTHING to do with anyone socially. There are all types and it's absurd for a game to try to force a player to be any particular type. Giving the opportunity for group content is great. Making it mandatory is totally not great.

thorwyn

Believe me when I say I'm not being aggressive, as I am genuinely curious. And I do appreciate that you stated it's your opinion. But why do you think playing an mmo means I must not only socialize(i do) but with people who also play the same game,(again, I do) same server, have the same times to play, and plan and organize said time just to hope to advance a character(gear etc) or be thrust in a PUG situation which COULD turn out ok, but could also turn into a debacle that nightmares are made from. Since the days of EQ1 I've heard "solo suxors" play single if you want to solo, it's in the name MMO you HAVE to group.

Why? MMO just means you all play in the same world. Why does it mean you have to staple someone to your rear end to advance? EQ was BAD about that, especially melee characters. ESO is better. But why is a group regarded as mandatory to advance, and not optional? Genuinely curious.

Noone said you are forced to do PUG's. As long as you are in an active guild, you should be able to find a group pretty quickly and without the waiting queue blues. Like I said, I'm soloing most of the time and enjoy doing so. If you think about it, how much of the entire content in ESO is solo? Basically everything except trials and dungeons is deisgned to be played solo. Why would you take away the remaining ... 2%? 5%?
To me, it adds diversity to the game. There is content where I have to kill stuff, where I have to sneak, where I have to solve puzzles and there's also some content where I have to find 3 other dudes to come along with me.
Now about the rewards: This is actually a relic from the past. Each and every MMO I have played over the years required people to do group stuff if they wanted to have a shot at getting the best possible gear. It is just another obstacle layer, because I know that I have to work on my group playing skills. Maybe I'm getting old and conservative.

AcadianPaladin

The game was marketed to solo players as well as the MMO crowd. Though I'm primarily a soloist, it does take solo, PvP and PvE group players to sustain the game. I support the idea in the original post because it appeals to soloists without bothering the other types of players.

Azurya

Yes, would love to have this
in WoW we had the possibility
and it is challenging to work your way
to get a boss solo to the floor
and much is possible here:
last week I join LFG and ended up in Crypt1, alone,
all other members were shown offline..........
that was fun!

Ragged_Claw

It's a great idea, it doesn't remove the need or ability to group for hard content but adds an extra challenge for players. I enjoy soloing the base game dungeons because it means I can go back and do quests and listen to Npcs etc that I couldn't do with the group that just ran through it ignoring everything. Automatically scaling dungeons to the amount of group members would be nice too, so that if you could only scrape up two or three people, you'd still be able to take on some of the vet DLC offerings. I don't think it would negatively impact group dungeons since in my experience most people prefer to do them in a group, it just adds another option for us lone wolves.

thorwyn

Obviously, dungeons which are completed on ‘Veteran Solo mode’ should also offer monster helms. And ‘Solo mode’ should also be an option for completing Undaunted pledges.

Another thing that came to my mind here is...
Wouldn't the entire idea be a huge advantage for DD classes and a HUGE disadvantage for support classes? No DD would play 4 man dungeons anyomre, leaving the poor healers or tanks way behind.

idk

mjharper wrote: »

Note: I am not recommending adjusting the difficulty of dungeons to suit solo players. Four-player dungeons could and should remain designed for 4 players. It is not my intention here to question the wisdom of setting DLC dungeons at ever-increasing levels of difficulty, excluding the majority of the player base.

Alternatively, ‘Solo mode’ for base-game dungeons could also be set to a ‘bridging’ difficulty, perhaps with ‘Normal’ difficulty being at the level of public dungeons, but again, with only one player able to access them. ‘Veteran Solo mode’ for base-game dungeons could then be set to the level of Normal 4-player mode. This would preserve difficulty difference between base-game and DLC dungeons, while making the process of soloing more accessible for mid-tier players.

Thoughts?

My thoughts is it does not seem sincere to "not recommend adjusting the difficulty to suit solo players" then turn around and suggest Normal difficulty could be set to the very low challenge of a public dungeon. Then to suggest nerfing vet solo mode to the challenge of a normal 4 man dungeon and go on to suggest monster helms should drop from this significantly easier mode really makes that first paragraph I quoted sound very insincere.

The two paragraphs above are most certainly in contrast with each other.

HappyLittleTree

Agree but then they shouldn't drop dungeon gear

mairwen85

What I'd envision would be buffed versions of the delves, instances to single player, average difficulty of a base game dungeon, with puzzle and battle mechanics, with unique/enhanced versions of the zone set as reward--specialist items if story oriented. If they can get that right, I'd happily see more complex attempts at solo dungeons.

Also, who says tanks and healers can't have specific class/role oriented dungeons and rewards

TheHsN

WHOOOAAAa you ask to much FROM ZOS...

They broked the game already while they are trying to implement things. For adding solo mechanics they wil lose that dungeon ones and for all:D



Pls ask something that they can make it...
like nerf bosses healths or armors or their damages...