It's About Trust

Tandor

Valrien wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Jameliel wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

Scarbridge wrote: »

<vent>

I debated a long time whether to post this or not.

I understand the developers are always trying to "level the playing field" for everyone, which is nearly impossible when you have a game with both PvE and PvP merged together.

I started playing ESO back in early 2014, and I've invested many hours of my life in this game.

What the developers don't seem to understand (or care about) is that when you choose a character type and a style of play and you build your character, this takes a lot of time and resources.

You examine the various skill lines available, weapon types, armor, enchantments, accessories. You decide whether you're going to be magicka heavy, stamina heavy, or somewhere in between.

The beautiful thing, originally, about ESO, was that you could decide how you were going to play. You didn't have to be perfectly balanced with your stats. You could focus on one area and build that up. It takes a lot of time and investment. You have to level of course, you have to build or buy the correct type/blend of armor, same for your choice of weapons, jewelry, and all the associated enchantments, mundus stone, etc.

As I said, this takes a lot of thought and investment in time and resources. It's something you build and perfect over time.

Then, one day, you log in, and your style of play and how things work are totally changed.

This has happened to me 3 times now since 2014. For me and how I play a sorcerer, I will completely have to rebuild everything to adapt to the recent changes.

I have no interest in doing this a fourth time.

For a moment, I considered starting a brand new character and going on the journey all over again. But I have no trust in ESO that as soon as I become comfortable building up a new character and a new style of play that they won't change the rules of the game, once again. It's maddening and disappointing, especially for a game I pay to play each month.

</vent>

I know some who stubbornly refuse to believe this, but ESO is a MMO. Classes are constantly changing and "balanced". That's the nature of literally every single MMO in this genre. You are not ever going to find a MMO that doesn't do this. That's a given going in to any game in this genre....I'm always suprised at the number of people who do not understand this long standing aspect of games of this nature. Nothing is set, things will change fairly regularly.
One thing to be dissatisfied with changes, completely another to never expect them.

You don't have to like that, but it's undisputable in MMO's. Things are always changing. Can't deal with that, stop playing MMO's. Or at least, change your expectations.

Name another major MMO with such constant changes the majority hate. Past or present. Have played nearly all of them except WoW, and NONE of them have such constant and random ridiculous changes.

Where is the empirical data to support your claim that "the majority" hate this game's constant changes? Some loud voices on the forum or in zone chat don't constitute the majority of the playerbase, and a good many of those voices were equally loud 3 updates ago, then 2 updates ago, then last update and now this one. I've honestly lost count of how many times they were quitting the game for good. Even those who were quitting over strict principles with the crown crate issue are still around. I get that some people feel strongly about certain things, but the bottom line is that it's just a game - and one of many at that, so those people will either move on to a different one (most don't), or just have their say and then carry on playing as usual. Meanwhile everyone else will carry on regardless as they're either not materially affected or just accept and adapt. 'Twas ever thus in forum land.

Ohhhh, I see. You're one of those "If you don't like it, just leave" guys

No, I'm one of those "You'll have a moan and then carry on playing" guys.

Plus I tend to pick people up on wild and unsubstantiated claims like "the majority hate".

Darkenarlol

blizzard definitely won 2018 prize in losing trust of loyal customers =D

as for zos... looks like i'm not gonna resub untill next big patch

if it gonna be nerfmire's brother... then i think this ftp doesn't worth my sub at all

anyway we shall see

Biro123

One of the main reasons that makes the changes so unpupular in this game, is that it's s horizontal-progression game, not a vertical-progression game..

But then we keep getting cp-rises and new sets each update that all add to power-creep, which means the only way they can adjust abilities without completely screwing PVE balance is downwards.

Yesterday, it's unpopular and you may need to switch sets etc. But you may already have some of them anyway. Unlike a vertical game where buffs can be made because there will be a new tier of content coming with the expansion, but the downside of that is all your old gear becoming trash as you have to grind the next tier of gear... And woe-betide anyone who falls behind a few tiers.

On the grand scheme of things, I'd rather the ESO model and take a few nerfs.

Kadoin

Scarbridge wrote: »

<vent>

I debated a long time whether to post this or not.

I understand the developers are always trying to "level the playing field" for everyone, which is nearly impossible when you have a game with both PvE and PvP merged together.

I started playing ESO back in early 2014, and I've invested many hours of my life in this game.

What the developers don't seem to understand (or care about) is that when you choose a character type and a style of play and you build your character, this takes a lot of time and resources.

You examine the various skill lines available, weapon types, armor, enchantments, accessories. You decide whether you're going to be magicka heavy, stamina heavy, or somewhere in between.

The beautiful thing, originally, about ESO, was that you could decide how you were going to play. You didn't have to be perfectly balanced with your stats. You could focus on one area and build that up. It takes a lot of time and investment. You have to level of course, you have to build or buy the correct type/blend of armor, same for your choice of weapons, jewelry, and all the associated enchantments, mundus stone, etc.

As I said, this takes a lot of thought and investment in time and resources. It's something you build and perfect over time.

Then, one day, you log in, and your style of play and how things work are totally changed.

This has happened to me 3 times now since 2014. For me and how I play a sorcerer, I will completely have to rebuild everything to adapt to the recent changes.

I have no interest in doing this a fourth time.

For a moment, I considered starting a brand new character and going on the journey all over again. But I have no trust in ESO that as soon as I become comfortable building up a new character and a new style of play that they won't change the rules of the game, once again. It's maddening and disappointing, especially for a game I pay to play each month.

</vent>

Wait, you're disappointed that your build was destroyed only 3 times since 2014? It happens to me every patch on Templar and DK, and on every hybrid build I use... This time I literally have no idea what I will do with 8/9 of my chars

Chicharron

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

Chicharron wrote: »

Why do they all start like that?

I started playing in 2014
I started playing since Beta
I am ESO + subscriber

Does that give more value to your opinion?

Maybe because it does? You need to consider what kind of value this introduction produces. I think, it's both negative and positive value. I mean, if you kept playing the game that much time, you have experienced a lot of different game mechanics and changes. But you also have biased opinion and sometimes nostalgic ways of looking at things.

When you read such posts, you should keep this in mind and you will gain much more value after properly evaluating the opinion.

As for ESO+ subscribers... Well, they certainly experience game from somewhat different aspect than non-ESO+ players, but can't tell, whether it is more valuable or not.

At least I can gather more information from these introductions than without them

I have been playing almost 4 years, ESO+ and I have seen my Templar fall from heaven to hell with that fetish that developers have for nerf everything.

And still I think that my opinion is as valid as that of someone with 1 month of play.

Valrien

Kadoin wrote: »

Scarbridge wrote: »

<vent>

I debated a long time whether to post this or not.

I understand the developers are always trying to "level the playing field" for everyone, which is nearly impossible when you have a game with both PvE and PvP merged together.

I started playing ESO back in early 2014, and I've invested many hours of my life in this game.

What the developers don't seem to understand (or care about) is that when you choose a character type and a style of play and you build your character, this takes a lot of time and resources.

You examine the various skill lines available, weapon types, armor, enchantments, accessories. You decide whether you're going to be magicka heavy, stamina heavy, or somewhere in between.

The beautiful thing, originally, about ESO, was that you could decide how you were going to play. You didn't have to be perfectly balanced with your stats. You could focus on one area and build that up. It takes a lot of time and investment. You have to level of course, you have to build or buy the correct type/blend of armor, same for your choice of weapons, jewelry, and all the associated enchantments, mundus stone, etc.

As I said, this takes a lot of thought and investment in time and resources. It's something you build and perfect over time.

Then, one day, you log in, and your style of play and how things work are totally changed.

This has happened to me 3 times now since 2014. For me and how I play a sorcerer, I will completely have to rebuild everything to adapt to the recent changes.

I have no interest in doing this a fourth time.

For a moment, I considered starting a brand new character and going on the journey all over again. But I have no trust in ESO that as soon as I become comfortable building up a new character and a new style of play that they won't change the rules of the game, once again. It's maddening and disappointing, especially for a game I pay to play each month.

</vent>

Wait, you're disappointed that your build was destroyed only 3 times since 2014? It happens to me every patch on Templar and DK, and on every hybrid build I use... This time I literally have no idea what I will do with 8/9 of my chars

Sorc has been getting destroyed long before Templar and DK.

See patch 1.2 for reference

TheDarkoil

I thought the same as you in regards to the shield nerf, truth is though they are still pretty good however I've completely stopped using one now and guess what? I still don't die and I'm pumping out more dps.

Sylvermynx

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I know some who stubbornly refuse to believe this, but ESO is a MMO. Classes are constantly changing and "balanced". That's the nature of literally every single MMO in this genre. You are not ever going to find a MMO that doesn't do this.

I know, right? I think back to what I went through, playing a Hunter in WoW from vanilla through Cataclysm.... the pendulum swings were amazing.

Yeah.... I remember running for 40 levels, and being so thrilled to finally get mounted. And then spending another 20 levels to get to flying.

And I remember leaving WoW for good before WoD landed. So far, I'm thoroughly enjoying ESO, we'll see how long I last here. I started WoW in early 2006, quit in 2013. Played RIFT from 2013 to 2016 - and then they went directions I didn't like, and it wasn't as engaging a game as WoW had been (though I do miss the housing setup, still thinking about going back to RIFT just for that, since ESO's housing is.... um.... VERY gimped in comparison....)

2016 until June this year, I played Skyrim again. Still play it, and Oblivion, still love them both. ESO keeps me pretty well occupied now though!

Bevik

When you grow up and having your own stuffs and find out they are mostly mass produced garbage you will realize can't trust anyone who wants your money. And this is very true for everything and everyone. I learned this by multiple mechanics who tried to fix our car. Somehow everyone found something wrong, different things of course what noone else could see and somehow found other things also they could not fix. Do not trust anyone or anything who wants your money! Never! You can have your hopes high but better expect less and be surprised by the good news.

idk

Ruinhorn wrote: »

God, really? MMO is a huge business, is it so difficult to understand? Despite everything you still play and

pay to play each month

It's not about trust and feelings. It's about a balance between income and investments developers and managers make into this game.

You are so right and so wrong at the same time.

Yes, it is about business but business deals with feelings every day. Merely understanding the basics of advertising tells us that much.

Zos lost much of it's potential business and actual business with the pathetic launch this game has on PC. Many did not trust Zos to get their head out of. . . . and get this game running well. 4.5 years later with the knee jerk changes Zos has made many times, along with the continued instability of the game itself I still do not think we can trust Zos to figure out how to run this business. I have long advocated that the top guy has remained the same through all this and his management style is all that has been consistent, if we can actually say it exists.

AcadianPaladin

Admittedly I'm primarily a solo PvE player but it seems the game does not move from unbalanced toward balance over time from what I have seen. It simply moves from unbalanced to a different kind of unbalanced. ESO's been trying to balance for how many years now? Is it balanced now? Of course not. I would rather see a static unbalance where I can learn the rules on the playing field and adapt/adjust ONE TIME to a static state of unbalance. This seems much preferable to perpetually trying to adjust to ever-changing states of differing unbalance.

I can see tweaking skills and sets for a game's first couple of years but after that, stop adding/changing sets and skills. New content does not have to mean new sets and skills.