New Feature: Party-finder System

Matthew_Galvanus

Quite simply, there should already be a system that anyone can access that lets us advertise parties we're forming for events (like dungeons, world bosses, etc). We all know that trying to find a party for anything is a disgusting waste of time, you expend more effort trying to find a group for a dungeon than you do running the dungeon itself.

Final Fantasy 14 has a system exactly what I'm proposing, its essentially a new menu that allows us to publicly advertise our group to the entire server.

for example i could title the group as "City of Ash 1 Veteran Farming Party"
I could set a CP minimum of 300 (meaning only those of 300cp or higher could join)
I can limit the party size if i wished to.
I can choose specific role types for each open spot in the party. For example: I'm running as a tank and i set three open spots, two classified as DPS and one classified as Healer.

in Final Fantasy 14 you are able to specify what classes you want for each role (like dragon knight as tank, warden as healer, etc), but since every class can play as tank, dps, or healer, that wouldn't really be a feasible option.

It would also be a huge help to separate the lists into categories such as: Ebonheart Pact dungeons. Aldermeri Dominion Dungeons, Daggerfall Covenant Dungeons, Trials, World Bosses, etc. This would help organize the party finder system and make it easy for players to find exactly what they are looking for.

overall a system like this would be far better than what we have (which is currently nothing). Having party advertisements listed all in one place would be a huge boon seeing as how we wouldn't be stuck in a single area advertising in zone chat.

johnbonne

Such a system exists in WoW as well, and it's been a huge help in finding players to do group-required world quests, dungeon runs and even the most difficult content in the twilight days of the expansion. It has been exploited through addons, and is partly responsible for further reducing social interactions/increasing apathy within the community, but this is to be expected with such a large amount of the playerbase that forces such necessary tools to be implemented in the first place because they weren't social enough or too apathetic to begin with. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

I would hope it's at the leader's discretion who stays and who is kicked, which will surely lead to problems that the democratic vote-kick protects against.... but what system is perfect? What utopia is not in reality dystopia?

I like the idea, and I think it's an expansion to advertising in city chat channels and using guilds to find optimal groups. I would hope that it catches on rather than being the alternative to random auto-queuing functions that seem more popular.

Peekachu99

I agree. But you’re going to get some really stupid responses like: what we have is fine, this isn’t FFXIV, it promotes eletism (it actually promotes the opposite), I like shouting in zone and more. It will be a parade of hand waving and idiocy.

It’s easier to group in mobile MMORPGs (King’s Raid, Dragon’s Nest) than it is in ESO and that’s inexcusable.

Danikat

There is a group finder in ESO but it only works for dungeons and it doesn't let you choose a group, it just dumps you into the first one with a space for your role.

I agree it would be nice to have something we can use for any content, and where we can specify 'non-standard' group types (for example I could say I'm making a group to do the quest in a dungeon and we'll be going slowly, reading dialogue etc.) and then players can choose which ones to join, so they end up grouped with like-minded people instead of someone who wants to read the dialogue ending up with someone who wants to get in and out as fast as possible and them annoying each other.

Guild Wars 2 has a similar system. It doesn't have many actual options, you just pick the content you're doing and whether you're looking for a 5 man party or (where it's available) a 10 or 50 man squad, but then it has a free text box so you can write in whatever you want. People who are looking for a group can see all the ones currently advertise and pick which one to join. It seems to work well, both for people with high standards and those who just want anyone to come help or want a relaxed run.

I know some people are very opposed to things like restricting groups by CP level or class, but the system we have now doesn't stop them doing that - people will still vote-kick anyone who doesn't meet their standards, it just means joining a group is basically pot luck, you roll the metaphorical dice and hope you end up in a group who will accept you and if not you have to start over.

Alchemical

Yeah, this is increasingly common in MMOs to the point it's basically a standard. Almost all the other big ones on the market have some kind of informal party finder. And it seems especially essential for ESO, considering how variable party composition can be (compared to how in FF14/WoW only certain classes can preform certain roles).

I almost wonder if this is something that could be accomplished with a AddOn? Before WoW implemented the Group Finder tool there was a mod/site known as OpenRaid which facilitated the same thing. It died out when it became a part of the base game (and partly because the owner's hubris) but I can't imagine that it would be too difficult to do something like that.

Party Finder, I think, makes content far more accessible as it allows you to strictly define your expectations. And end-game accessibility is something ESO sorely needs. Many people don't even do vet dungeons, much less trials, due to plain ol intimidation. Being able to search specifically for a 'learning party' or 'casual runs' can help mitigate that. At the same time people only looking for progression parties or people who already have completed it can specify and cut down on unneeded animosity towards newbies.

Danikat

It's definitely something that could be accomplished with an addon or even something like a Discord group. The problem then is the only people using it are ones who have heard it exists and taken the extra steps to use it.

That's especially problematic for people looking to group with casual players or ones who don't do group content often, even in the open-world, because they're unlikely to go looking for a tool to facilitate something they rarely do. At least until it hits a kind of 'critical mass' like TTC is starting to, where many people are hearing through word of mouth that it's more useful for people who aren't dedicated traders because it makes it quicker to find what you want.

But it could be a good 'proof of concept' - show both players and ZOS what it can achieve and maybe that will encourage them to put it in the game. It happened with on-screen buff trackers, subtitles and probably lots of other changes.

Myyth

Such a system exists in WoW as well, and it's been a huge help in finding players to do group-required world quests, dungeon runs and even the most difficult content in the twilight days of the expansion.

I remember the WoW system. But I never used it because every group listing had notes saying - "must have this Ilevel gear", "must have this achievement", "must do this amount of dps or kick", or "this item, that item, and another item - on reserve".
I imagine the same sort of problem would happen in ESO.

johnbonne

Myyth wrote: »

Such a system exists in WoW as well, and it's been a huge help in finding players to do group-required world quests, dungeon runs and even the most difficult content in the twilight days of the expansion.

I remember the WoW system. But I never used it because every group listing had notes saying - "must have this Ilevel gear", "must have this achievement", "must do this amount of dps or kick", or "this item, that item, and another item - on reserve".
I imagine the same sort of problem would happen in ESO.

Of that there is no doubt, but I'd suggest countering it in the same way as people do in WoW: make your own group and set your own requirements. That seems to be the real issue here, that people lack the confidence to start and perhaps lead a group, or fear talking to others.

All the OP is asking for is a means to consolidate the group advertisements that are already out there, rather than having to go to from zone to zone finding a group for the content they want. People will always ask for achievements, classes, gear and so fourth, and this will make it easier for them to do.... but it's also making it easier for those who want to do the content and make a group without further hassle. Before the group finder in WoW people still asked for achievements, armoury checks and gearscore (which led to Blizzard implementing item level, which has been overridden by raider.io checks in late Legion and BfA). I don't think vetting people is going away any time soon. ^^

Nyladreas

Myyth wrote: »

Such a system exists in WoW as well, and it's been a huge help in finding players to do group-required world quests, dungeon runs and even the most difficult content in the twilight days of the expansion.

I remember the WoW system. But I never used it because every group listing had notes saying - "must have this Ilevel gear", "must have this achievement", "must do this amount of dps or kick", or "this item, that item, and another item - on reserve".
I imagine the same sort of problem would happen in ESO.

That is just completely false. What you said only applied to high end-game content. People use it every day for even world content, bosses, exploration, roleplaying,, holiday events, groups, in eso we could even have lore dungeon runs.

PvP, Casual content, Casual Raiding. It wouldnt have to have the dumb requirements as WoW has at all. Just let people have a giant party bulletin board.

Matthew_Galvanus

this got a fair bit of attention after i left for work, a lot of positive feedback i must say and im really glad about that.

ImmortalCX

A system like this will *punish* new or lower level players.

Groups will form up with the best available talent, which means that the "leftovers" either won't be able to make/join groups, and if they do, they will probably struggle with the content.

Seems good on the surface, but it would destroy the game.

Matthew_Galvanus

ImmortalCX wrote: »

A system like this will *punish* new or lower level players.

Groups will form up with the best available talent, which means that the "leftovers" either won't be able to make/join groups, and if they do, they will probably struggle with the content.

Seems good on the surface, but it would destroy the game.

it really wouldn't. you have to understand that for every end game group running a dungeon on veteran, there would likely be 3-4 times as many lower levels forming groups of their own. you act like low level players couldn't use the system as well but this would be just as much a boon for them as it would be for end game players.

i can't tell you how many times i've had to skip dungeons ive come across (tempest island, im looking at you) because i could never get together people just by queueing and i could never find a party for it by advertising in zone chat. i can't be in every zone at once so this would make it infinitely easier for me to pull together a group of four to run a dungeon.

AcadianPaladin

I like the OP's idea. Not only does it allow more flexibility but it also has the potential to eliminate some traffic from an overused chat box system Awesome.

DanteYoda

It would get exploited and the epeeners would ruin it just like the rest...

tactx

They can't even get basic guild trader (auction house) functionality in place that has existed since EQ1. You can't even search for an item by text without having an addon and 20 subcategories selected. No way I'd expect this to happen though it would be nice...

Matthew_Galvanus

DanteYoda wrote: »

It would get exploited and the epeeners would ruin it just like the rest...

how exactly would it get 'exploited' you mean by players vetting the people who join their party? that's been happening since day one of ESO and literally every other MMORPG and i doubt it will ever stop.

Matthew_Galvanus

tactx wrote: »

They can't even get basic guild trader (auction house) functionality in place that has existed since EQ1. You can't even search for an item by text without having an addon and 20 subcategories selected. No way I'd expect this to happen though it would be nice...

the problem is that this is intentional on their part. they didn't want traders to all feel connected to one point otherwise what'd be the point of traveling directly to the npc if you could access a guild's store elsewhere?

Bevik

Hope they will rework the Grouping Tool in 2019. This must be in Top 5 on their list PvE or even PvP wise.

Matthew_Galvanus

Bevik wrote: »

Hope they will rework the Grouping Tool in 2019. This must be in Top 5 on their list PvE or even PvP wise.

i hope so too, with the Class Rep system i am cautiously optimistic about the changes we see in the future. my hope is that this thread will gain enough traction that the cause will be picked up by the reps. If that happens it's almost a guarantee they'd take a hard look at how they could make party finding easier for the community as a whole.

tactx

Matthew_Galvanus wrote: »

show previous quotes

tactx wrote: »

They can't even get basic guild trader (auction house) functionality in place that has existed since EQ1. You can't even search for an item by text without having an addon and 20 subcategories selected. No way I'd expect this to happen though it would be nice...

the problem is that this is intentional on their part. they didn't want traders to all feel connected to one point otherwise what'd be the point of traveling directly to the npc if you could access a guild's store elsewhere?

I get the separate trader part. But you cant just search from a text field to find an item on that trader. You have to pick so many options first to get into the category which is beyond absurd. Horrid UI design and a basic programming failure. Things like that are why I have doubts about them adding something like this. They can make a pretty game, but the programming and UX is awful.

doc_ketamine

Path of Exile had a great system for this ... there was a bulletin board in every town, where people posted LFG with details for what they wanted. Map farming, level grinding, boss farming, etc. Worked GREAT.

Matthew_Galvanus

tactx wrote: »

show previous quotes

Matthew_Galvanus wrote: »

tactx wrote: »

They can't even get basic guild trader (auction house) functionality in place that has existed since EQ1. You can't even search for an item by text without having an addon and 20 subcategories selected. No way I'd expect this to happen though it would be nice...

the problem is that this is intentional on their part. they didn't want traders to all feel connected to one point otherwise what'd be the point of traveling directly to the npc if you could access a guild's store elsewhere?

I get the separate trader part. But you cant just search from a text field to find an item on that trader. You have to pick so many options first to get into the category which is beyond absurd. Horrid UI design and a basic programming failure. Things like that are why I have doubts about them adding something like this. They can make a pretty game, but the programming and UX is awful.

al we can do is show them the way and hope they have half a brain

Matthew_Galvanus

doc_ketamine wrote: »

Path of Exile had a great system for this ... there was a bulletin board in every town, where people posted LFG with details for what they wanted. Map farming, level grinding, boss farming, etc. Worked GREAT.

doc_ketamine wrote: »

Path of Exile had a great system for this ... there was a bulletin board in every town, where people posted LFG with details for what they wanted. Map farming, level grinding, boss farming, etc. Worked GREAT.

a bulletin board is another awesome idea, and it would definitely fit in the lore of the game.

Alchemical

I thought about this thread again because a friend of mine was randomly off farming for pieces of the Sixth House robe in the Forgotten Waste and was wanting a group for it. It's not something a lot of people might think of when they're looking for something to do but I'm sure lots of people also don't have it and would be happy to join if they knew there was an active farming party for it! But it's not exactly easy to advertise for. If you're in the dungeon already you're limited to who's already in there, which might be no one or people only questing through not interested in farming. If you go outside there's more chance you might catch someone's attention but you're also competing for eyes with dailies world bosses and the off-topic chatter that goes on in zone.

And for those saying it would be 'abused', of course the ultra elite will use it to screen out casuals but they do that anyway. It's also easier to find other people with a similar experience level for newbies and casuals. Surprisingly, the type of people who aren't intense enough for elite runs are usually happy to run with each other and allow each other to make mistakes and don't get stressed over avoidable wipes like hardcore teams. If you were not doing even normal trials before because you were turned away by CP800 people farming them, but saw a group of people all similar level advertising for a chill run you might be willing to actually try it out!

Trust me, I also got annoyed at the 'you need to have the achievement from completing the heroic raid just to join our normal raid' crap back on WoW. But then I just made my own! And explicitly advertised it as welcoming to inexperienced players to help them get their mounts from Nightwell. I also tanked keystones for people who were afraid of doing Mythic+ dungeons because other players moaned about how hard they were. I depleted some keys on bad runs but I also helped a lot of people access content that they thought was barred to them and many were thankful and paid it forward by helping others now that they had experience. And I had a lot of fun doing that! I'm always happy to help people out but I can only be in so many guilds and I can only be aware of so many people who need help. A party finder/bulletin board does nothing but empower a wider audience of people to access content.

Matthew_Galvanus

with the addition of murkmire, we once again find ourselves with new content where players are forced to shout over each other to try and pull together parties to run group content. this is a problem that needs to be addressed sooner rather than later.

Aertew

Played FFXIV and I'm suprised ESO doesn't have this. Would solve sooo many problems like...

1. Fake tanks
2. Lore runs for dungeons
3. groups for only speedrunning dungeons
4. Groups for not speed running

ECT ECT. Please ZOS

redspecter23

This would be a fantastic addition. I would consider it a quality of life change. It takes all the work out of doing this zone by zone. You can already form up groups in such a way but the expectation is that you use guilds or zone to do it and that's just not efficient.

All you have to do is convince the higher ups in ZOS that this is a much needed positive addition that is worth the effort to implement and you're set.

DarcyMardin

Great idea!

Maitsukas

Another day, another necro.

Naftal

Aertew wrote: »

Played FFXIV and I'm suprised ESO doesn't have this. Would solve sooo many problems like...

1. Fake tanks
2. Lore runs for dungeons
3. groups for only speedrunning dungeons
4. Groups for not speed running

ECT ECT. Please ZOS

How would it solve fake tanks?

How would it solve 2-4?

You'd just have to kick people who don't do literally what you wanted just like now.

NerfSeige

Bro, why are you comparing this <snip> to FFXIV, a nominee for “The Game Award for Best Ongoing Game”

LMAO