Riding Skill.. Anyone else feel this needs fixing?

ck37090

A. It takes 6 months to fully train!... So if you make an alt from scratch or like the warden they add a new class in... Six months?!? That's if you train daily
Or
B. You can pay $160 (retail) to buy riding lessons... That doesn't seem criminal?

... Then even with characters you have made it takes fifteen minutes to train them all dealing with all the long load screens

...I guess with pve it is just annoying but it does have some impact with pvp

I just think they need to do something with this.... Make horse speed and endurance all the same in pvp zones? Make training scrolls a reasonable price? Give a discount/decreased training time for alts? Add the riding training to the login screen so it can be done without having to deal with all the load screens?

...I get there is a goal to make money.. But riding scrolls (and all the crown store fluff for that matter) is ridiculous

Davor

Criminal? No not at all. Sleazy? Yeah I guess. While I may not agree with it, I can understand it. Sadly ESO plays like a Free to Play game but we need to buy it in order to play so that is why I don't agree with it. I wish it was account wide at least.

ckrobinson83

Yeah, I posted about this a while ago too. It's really crappy that they do this. I even posted ways to make it better without going over the top. Of course it was ignored, but that's kinda normal.

Sheezabeast

All you have to do is the introduction to Cyrodiil quest (no pvp required) and you get the Alliance Assault and Support skill lines. Under the Assault tree is the ability Rapid Maneuvers. Rapids makes mounted speed easier to deal with when you’re on a character with low mount speed. You get a skill point from the quest so you can use that to get your Rapids. Magicka or Stamina characters can use it.

Jameliel

Its sleazy and criminal. Only fan bois defend the current system. z0$ gonna z0$...

pauli133

It's a completely standard pay to catch up mechanic. I worry about those of you who consider that "criminal".

VaranisArano

Out of all the costumes and DLC I've spent my crowns on, I probably got my best money for fun worth out of the speed riding lessons I bought to finish out my new Cyrodiil toon. Totally worth it to not have to wait a month to keep up with my raid

I get that not everyone think that's worth it, but it was for me.

Taleof2Cities

VaranisArano wrote: »

Out of all the costumes and DLC I've spent my crowns on, I probably got my best money for fun worth out of the speed riding lessons I bought to finish out my new Cyrodiil toon. Totally worth it to not have to wait a month to keep up with my raid

I get that not everyone think that's worth it, but it was for me.

To add to this great post you sometimes receive the speed riding lessons in the free crown crates ... just sayin’.

silvermistktralasub17_ESO

It's also not all that hard to handle. I have 15 characters right now, 3 created after Morrowind dropped. All 15 characters (even the one of them that was made when the skills advisor was added) now have maxed ability in all 3 traits. Furthermore, I do not buy mount lessons unless they end up thrown into a bundle I'm buying for other reasons (like another mount). I turn in all of my crown crate riding lessons for gems. Even with this, I have not had all that much trouble getting my characters at max riding skill. It's a catch up game, but really not a big problem. I have never spent more time on that in a night than I would usually spend for getting my shadowy suppliers (I have 6 characters who need me to pick that up every night).

@Alassirana

SneakyBo, ExSO_Gold, and Demure Dragon Dealings

ck37090

VaranisArano wrote: »

Out of all the costumes and DLC I've spent my crowns on, I probably got my best money for fun worth out of the speed riding lessons I bought to finish out my new Cyrodiil toon. Totally worth it to not have to wait a month to keep up with my raid

I get that not everyone think that's worth it, but it was for me.

Not to judge... But really... Basically $10 for every 10 points of riding skill is your "best money for fun"? ... Raise your skill by 30 and you could have bought Somerset and all the content that goes with it... But raising riding Skill by 30 points is better?

Elsonso

They just need to allow us to learn one point in all three of the skills on the same day, rather than just one point in one skill per day. Or, combine the three riding skills into a single riding skill that increases capacity, speed, and stamina with each point invested.

notyuu

Criminal: No
Scummy as ***: Hell yes

LordSkyKnight

pauli133 wrote: »

It's a completely standard pay to catch up mechanic. I worry about those of you who consider that "criminal".

I worry about those who are willing to accept the current system that is in place.


I agree with the others. The mechanic as it is currently is completely asinine.

ck37090

... And just to clarify...I was using the term "criminal" figuratively not literally

vometia

Davor wrote: »

Criminal? No not at all. Sleazy? Yeah I guess. While I may not agree with it, I can understand it. Sadly ESO plays like a Free to Play game but we need to buy it in order to play so that is why I don't agree with it. I wish it was account wide at least.

I think that really sums it up for me: there's so much inconvenience and tedium that seems to be designed to usher me to the crown store, even though I pay for ESO+ (yes, I know this includes 1,500 crowns a month, but it's not really anything like enough to offset the artificial inconveniences) as well as the original AAA price for the game itself. I think ZOS really need to ease off on the hard sell because it's too much: I'm just on the side of continuing with my sub because no other SP games are grabbing me right now but I'm not recommending it to people because way too much of it has been paywalled and contrived to maximise the amount of time you need to keep on paying.

I know the usual response to this sort of complaint is "you don't need to pay" and I'm well aware of that, which is why I'm saying it's very much on a knife edge and at present is mainly the beneficiary of me having nothing better to do. That's not really a healthy approach to customer retention. Then again, I'm not a marketroid so what do I know?

mikemacon

Yep. Because no other MMO has similar catch up mechanics. ZOS completely went out onto a limb here.

::turns and stares into camera::

ck37090

mikemacon wrote: »

Yep. Because no other MMO has similar catch up mechanics. ZOS completely went out onto a limb here.

::turns and stares into camera::

... But should it be necessary on top of a monthly subscription fee? Maybe these type of convenience improvements should be included with the monthly subscription.

Porter_H

I've started 3 new characters to level their riding skills even if it'll be a while before I play them. It takes forever just to log on them and train though with the insane load screens. Something needs to be done about the riding training.

Even if they want it to be a grind.... let us queue the riding training for a week or something (pick the training and pay the amount for 8? trainings) just so it's not such a hassle.

Katahdin

Yep, this has been complained about for years and I agree 6 months to level a horse is TOO LONG.

However it will never change because ZoS sells mount upgrades in the crown store.
So if you want if faster, break out the credit card.

Im currently leveling my 15th character's mount and this will probably be the last character I ever make because of
mount training and because getting world bosses and Craiglorn content that needs a group completed is nothing short of a pain in the rear

EvilCroc

Riding lessons are OK. I have 25 days left until all my alts will be fully trained. You all should suffer the same way.

Agenericname

ck37090 wrote: »

mikemacon wrote: »

Yep. Because no other MMO has similar catch up mechanics. ZOS completely went out onto a limb here.

::turns and stares into camera::

... But should it be necessary on top of a monthly subscription fee? Maybe these type of convenience improvements should be included with the monthly subscription.

In way ESO+ already shortens the time required to get the training. You could, if you choose, spend the crowns on riding training. Between the crowns, gems that can be extracted from daily rewards (when applicable), and riding lessons as a daily reward, the time required for training can be significantly reduced.

I wouldn't necessarily object to the ideas, but, it doesn't have to take 6 months to train riding now. If I started a character today, with one months worth of crowns sitting there already, in 30 days I would have my speed maxed and started on the next.

Kiralyn2000

Eh, I don't even consider it 'sleazy' because it's not necessary. I'd give a serious "what's wrong with you" look at anyone who actually spent crowns on riding lessons. It feels like one of those things included in a cash shop for completeness' sake, not because they actually intend anyone to buy it.

edit: as for being accepting about it.... yeah, I suppose that I've gotten used to every single online game that's interested in player retention, having a variety of 'daily tasks' to encourage one to come back regularly. Daily quests, login rewards, cooldowns, etc. It's been standard even in subscription & pay games for at least 5 years now. You're a bit late trying to stop that train from leaving the station. Just like we're not going to be able to stop "always online" even for single player games, every company in existence having their own launcher/store/login, and "live games"/"games as a service".

VaranisArano

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Eh, I don't even consider it 'sleazy' because it's not necessary. I'd give a serious "what's wrong with you" look at anyone who actually spent crowns on riding lessons. It feels like one of those things included in a cash shop for completeness' sake, not because they actually intend anyone to buy it.

edit: as for being accepting about it.... yeah, I suppose that I've gotten used to every single online game that's interested in player retention, having a variety of 'daily tasks' to encourage one to come back regularly. Daily quests, login rewards, cooldowns, etc. It's been standard even in subscription & pay games for at least 5 years now. You're a bit late trying to stop that train from leaving the station. Just like we're not going to be able to stop "always online" even for single player games, every company in existence having their own launcher/store/login, and "live games"/"games as a service".

What's wrong with me? (Bought 3 of the 10-pack Speed lessons)

Well, as I said above, I bought the riding lessons when I brought a new-ish stam warden toon to PVP for my guild raids because that was the difference between me spending a month slowly riding behind my guildmates, constantly trying to catch up, getting left behind and probably ganked in Cyrodiil, or I could go right to 60 mount speed and keep up with my friends who had full speed mounts.

I bought the lessons. I had a ton of fun playing on that stam warden with my friends in my PVP guild raid in Cyrodiil.

It wasn't necessary. I could have waited that month. But purchasing those speed lessons was totally worth it for me. Maybe not for everyone.

Mattock_Romulus

VaranisArano wrote: »

Out of all the costumes and DLC I've spent my crowns on, I probably got my best money for fun worth out of the speed riding lessons I bought to finish out my new Cyrodiil toon. Totally worth it to not have to wait a month to keep up with my raid

I get that not everyone think that's worth it, but it was for me.

$160 pay to win in Cyrodiil. Glad it worked out for you.

ck37090

VaranisArano wrote: »

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Eh, I don't even consider it 'sleazy' because it's not necessary. I'd give a serious "what's wrong with you" look at anyone who actually spent crowns on riding lessons. It feels like one of those things included in a cash shop for completeness' sake, not because they actually intend anyone to buy it.

edit: as for being accepting about it.... yeah, I suppose that I've gotten used to every single online game that's interested in player retention, having a variety of 'daily tasks' to encourage one to come back regularly. Daily quests, login rewards, cooldowns, etc. It's been standard even in subscription & pay games for at least 5 years now. You're a bit late trying to stop that train from leaving the station. Just like we're not going to be able to stop "always online" even for single player games, every company in existence having their own launcher/store/login, and "live games"/"games as a service".

What's wrong with me? (Bought 3 of the 10-pack Speed lessons)

Well, as I said above, I bought the riding lessons when I brought a new-ish stam warden toon to PVP for my guild raids because that was the difference between me spending a month slowly riding behind my guildmates, constantly trying to catch up, getting left behind and probably ganked in Cyrodiil, or I could go right to 60 mount speed and keep up with my friends who had full speed mounts.

I bought the lessons. I had a ton of fun playing on that stam warden with my friends in my PVP guild raid in Cyrodiil.

It wasn't necessary. I could have waited that month. But purchasing those speed lessons was totally worth it for me. Maybe not for everyone.

I get what you are saying... But do you really think those lessons should essentially cost the same as that entire Morrowind upgrade/content you purchased? Because that is basically what they are charging

rfennell_ESO

ck37090 wrote: »

A. It takes 6 months to fully train!... So if you make an alt from scratch or like the warden they add a new class in... Six months?!? That's if you train daily
Or
B. You can pay $160 (retail) to buy riding lessons... That doesn't seem criminal?

... Then even with characters you have made it takes fifteen minutes to train them all dealing with all the long load screens

...I guess with pve it is just annoying but it does have some impact with pvp

I just think they need to do something with this.... Make horse speed and endurance all the same in pvp zones? Make training scrolls a reasonable price? Give a discount/decreased training time for alts? Add the riding training to the login screen so it can be done without having to deal with all the load screens?

...I get there is a goal to make money.. But riding scrolls (and all the crown store fluff for that matter) is ridiculous

They really should consolidate the riding skill points down to half of what it is (so it takes half as much time).

It's a bit ridiculous.

It also costs 45k gold (which isn't that big of a deal, but on multiple characters it gets a bit heavy).

They should, at least, allow you to transfer riding skill to another character... because it gets tedious and is a little bit of a drag on new characters to have to level riding skill up all over again.

Taleof2Cities

Mattock_Romulus wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Out of all the costumes and DLC I've spent my crowns on, I probably got my best money for fun worth out of the speed riding lessons I bought to finish out my new Cyrodiil toon. Totally worth it to not have to wait a month to keep up with my raid

I get that not everyone think that's worth it, but it was for me.

$160 pay to win in Cyrodiil. Glad it worked out for you.

Riding lessons aren’t pay to win ... 1/10 effort on post.

Eiagra

When I got into the game, it was not long after riding skill was transferred from the Mount to the Character. So I missed out on the frustration of having to feed every single horse I have every day... Which is probably good.

But I also maxed my riding before there was even an option to speed it along with the Crown Store. Or before there was Crown Store period.

When you are just starting out on your main, it's okay. It's just part of the process. It's not expensive (250 gold per day), but it is a long haul. It forced me to prioritize what I wanted to boost, and since inventory space was at a premium (this was before craft bags in ESO+), once I got Speed and Stamina to 10, I focused purely on getting Capacity to 60. After that, I focused on Speed, then Stamina since that wasn't a trait I specifically needed to worry about (I don't really PvP, and my horse is going to go down no matter what if it comes to that).

The first time, no big deal. Subsequent times, definitely felt like a hassle. It became a daily log-in process of switching characters, training, switching, training, etc. until all of my alts were done. I only maxed 1 of each class, so I've a total of 5 characters I focused on. The rest are mules or temporary.

Could it be improved? Probably. It would be nice if we could throw more gold at it to get, say, 1 point in Speed, Stamina, and Capacity per day, instead 1 in one of them per day. Thus reducing the overall time to max to 60 days instead of 6 months. Does it bother me how it is right now? Not enough to throw a conniption over it. *shrug*

Mattock_Romulus

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Mattock_Romulus wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Out of all the costumes and DLC I've spent my crowns on, I probably got my best money for fun worth out of the speed riding lessons I bought to finish out my new Cyrodiil toon. Totally worth it to not have to wait a month to keep up with my raid

I get that not everyone think that's worth it, but it was for me.

$160 pay to win in Cyrodiil. Glad it worked out for you.

Riding lessons aren’t pay to win ... 1/10 effort on post.

Because being able to keep up with your group or catch up to enemies in PVP isn't important. Right.

Starlock

I played for around a year without ever buying a horse. They seemed pointless to me... walking everywhere was fine and I got to enjoy the scenery and pick up mats along the way. I would get really confused when I watched a player mount their horse in town to travel maybe a stone’s throw away, then talk to an NPC or hit a wayshrine. I wondered why everyone else was in such a hurry and so impatient to get to where they were going.

These days I understand a little better, but still generally regard mounts as optional. ZoS relies on you getting used to 60 ride speed and then becoming intolerant of anything else. It’s almost happened to me.

DuskMarine

ck37090 wrote: »

A. It takes 6 months to fully train!... So if you make an alt from scratch or like the warden they add a new class in... Six months?!? That's if you train daily
Or
B. You can pay $160 (retail) to buy riding lessons... That doesn't seem criminal?

... Then even with characters you have made it takes fifteen minutes to train them all dealing with all the long load screens

...I guess with pve it is just annoying but it does have some impact with pvp

I just think they need to do something with this.... Make horse speed and endurance all the same in pvp zones? Make training scrolls a reasonable price? Give a discount/decreased training time for alts? Add the riding training to the login screen so it can be done without having to deal with all the load screens?

...I get there is a goal to make money.. But riding scrolls (and all the crown store fluff for that matter) is ridiculous

it takes 2 months to train but having to do it every day is annoying especially on your 8th character it needs to be account bound