How do you feel about current state of Wardens?

Tasear

What is your number one concern with them?

MinarasLaure

Tank and healer are ok, dps wise is bad, really bad.
Magden will never be fixed as its counterpart stamden is already pretty strong ( nothing special in Pve, pretty damn good in pvp)
Eventually nobody will play magden dps anymore

Carbonised

Stamden too powerful in PvP. Magden too little power in PvE as a DD.

AlienatedGoat

Magden weak noodle DPS in PvE, everything else is fine.

theyancey

I'm playing a magden. I only PvE. Yes, she does indeed suck.

Revokus

Magden super strong in pvp in a group of 2+ in heavy with master ice staff and awesome healing with the teleport and malubeth. But solo or duel without an execute(sorry bear) or class stun it’s really weak. But again warden was marketed as a support class by the devs. Maybe that’s why they don’t buff it PVE wise and maybe people should stop crying about it whenever they can that the devs don’t know how to make a class and blocking us from getting a new one in th future.

Starlight_Knight

So now we have to name only 1 concern? lol
Well i guess ill have to be broad with an answer -
To many buffs, no secondary effects on skills, ie CC / execute.

( But really we know its the whole picture - the class needs a bit of tlc across the board - a lot of skills need altering a bit to make it less clunky, and iron out those cast times, and the bear needs some serious love for use in pvp )

DocFrost72

Probably the most disturbing thing is how few people will actually worry about wardens' state of affairs.

PvE:

Good spot heals and tank. Tanks are one utility spell away from par to DKs, and healers are only missing shards (which is compensated slightly by the minor regen buffs from shrooms).

Dps is tricky. Stamina dps is in a decent spot with a simple rotation (or mine is simple anyway), but anyway lot of dps hinges on the bear. Non stationary fights are hard. Magic needs help. Magicka wardens can pull surprisingly high parses, but they require more effort to do so.

Neither warden dps spec brings anything really unique to the raid. No minor buffs, and toughness is already handled by warhorn in optimized groups.

PvP:

Stam damage is strong, and that compounds the issue of pve dps and utility. Healer and tank are both pretty good; aoe defile and lots of snares and roots. One issue, but it is the same for mag damage.

Mag damage doesn't have a stun. WHY. It is so, so strange that one of the most underperforming mag specs had its stun removed, especially a ranged undodgeable that stamina couldn't access without giving up its burst. It was a really good idea...

Zardayne

Hayden_Knight wrote: »

So now we have to name only 1 concern? lol
Well i guess ill have to be broad with an answer -
To many buffs, no secondary effects on skills, ie CC / execute.

( But really we know its the whole picture - the class needs a bit of tlc across the board - a lot of skills need altering a bit to make it less clunky, and iron out those cast times, and the bear needs some serious love for use in pvp )

This said just about everything I want to...

jkolb2030

I've been playing my stamden a lot lately, and i actually really love it for PvP...

I wouldn't say its too overpowered in PvP, i just think it has what every other class in the game should have - an identity and playstyle that is backed up with its own class skills. Access to a lot of buffs and heals, and the damage is good but also takes some timing to land your burst. Okay.... maybe tree heals are a bit ohpee.

In PvE though, what makes the stamden great in PvP also makes it rough in PvE.. It's hard to keep up your DPS in a rotation style since a lot of the damage skills have a delay / clunky animation telegraph that you have to try to weave with. And the fact that your DPS is so reliant on the bear ulti that you cannot bring some of your unique ultimates to the group without sacrificing a huge chunk of DPS (i believe the bear ulti is upwards of ~15% of total DPS according to Srrendar). I'd love to be able to have some competitive DPS w/o the bear, and be able to bring some cleave with permafrost or extra heals with trees.

I'd have to agree with some of the above responses to generalize though - the class just needs some smoothing out in terms of less clunky skills, and minor tweaks to add some better PvE dmg/utility skills.

Watchdog

Tasear wrote: »

What is your number one concern with them?

The bear pet. Give me a big dog or a big eagle and I would be much happier.

BozzyTheDrummer

I have actually been wanting to make a magden really badly now after my cousin recently made his. we both made new PvP toons for Midyear Mayhem, I made a stam blade and he made a magden.

He is way more knowledgeable than I am about wardens, but he seemed to play his perfectly, in both PvE and PvP. For the majority of the BG matches we played together during the mayhem event, we were mostly in the top two and 80% of the time, he had the mot kills out of everyone.

Tryxus

Tank: Excellent, great alternative to DK
Healer: Excellent, great alternative to Temp
Stamina: One of the top tier Stamina specs in PvP, Good DPSers in PvE tho their rotation is difficult
Magicka: No Class CC (except the Permafrost Ultimate), terrible Solo capabillities in PvP tho excellent group players, weakest Magicka DPS in PvE
Bear: needs a lot of help (pet shields, heals, damage reduction, blablabla,...)

Tasear

Watchdog wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

What is your number one concern with them?

The bear pet. Give me a big dog or a big eagle and I would be much happier.

I think you are asking for a different class with different species of bird.

MLGProPlayer

2.7% representation on leader boards as of a few weeks ago. All other classes are over 20%.

The class is in a terrible spot and has been ever since it released.

- Tank and healer are fine (not the best, but viable), but DPS is way behind every other class. Not only do they output lower DPS than every other class, but they're also forced to use a single target pet ultimate.
- DPS wardens have no utility skills. They don't provide any buffs or debuffs. None of their DPS skills have a secondary effect, they just deal damage.
- They rely heavily on specific sets for damage/utility (see Master Architect and Necropotence). If ZOS ever nerfs those sets, the class becomes even worse (and they're already the worst, by a wide margin).

MLGProPlayer

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Probably the most disturbing thing is how few people will actually worry about wardens' state of affairs.

PvE:

Good spot heals and tank. Tanks are one utility spell away from par to DKs, and healers are only missing shards (which is compensated slightly by the minor regen buffs from shrooms).

Dps is tricky. Stamina dps is in a decent spot with a simple rotation (or mine is simple anyway), but anyway lot of dps hinges on the bear. Non stationary fights are hard. Magic needs help. Magicka wardens can pull surprisingly high parses, but they require more effort to do so.

Neither warden dps spec brings anything really unique to the raid. No minor buffs, and toughness is already handled by warhorn in optimized groups.

PvP:

Stam damage is strong, and that compounds the issue of pve dps and utility. Healer and tank are both pretty good; aoe defile and lots of snares and roots. One issue, but it is the same for mag damage.

Mag damage doesn't have a stun. WHY. It is so, so strange that one of the most underperforming mag specs had its stun removed, especially a ranged undodgeable that stamina couldn't access without giving up its burst. It was a really good idea...

Magden pulls the lowest parse of any class, and that's with the bear ultimate, while every other class uses destro ultimate. And as you mentioned, they have the most difficult skill rotation in the game.

Zardayne

Why can't we have pet controls like every other MMO out there where I can send him in before I engage, put him in passive/guard mode, engage another target without heavy attacking, etc.

Remove the double ultimate for the bear too so as a Magden I can slot other needed ultimates

Starlock

My number one concern with them is that the min-max, power gaming, meta sheep crowds (especially the PvP variety thereof) are going to successfully push for changes that ruin the class for players who are not competitive gamers or who are not really into PvP. I suppose this concern isn't unique to wardens - that's a concern in general when it comes to game changes. The developers have done a pretty good job of being mindful of this so far, so I'm not too worried, but there have been occasional changes for the sake of "balance" (especially PvP) that have been frustrating. Warden has had a couple frustrating changes (I'm looking at you, removal of stun from shalks), but they're not so bad that I can't just deal with it. For the most part, the changes made have been nice improvements that don't impact how I play the game much.

MLGProPlayer

Zardayne wrote: »

Why can't we have pet controls like every other MMO out there where I can send him in before I engage, put him in passive/guard mode, engage another target without heavy attacking, etc.

Remove the double ultimate for the bear too so as a Magden I can slot other needed ultimates

There is a pet command key. I believe the default binding on PC is Y (I can't remember since I changed my binding).

You can use it to change targets as well as tell your pet to stand down/attack. It works pretty well actually.

Y + left click = attack target
Y + right click = stand down (pet won't attack until told to again)

_Ahala_

Magdens only class cc costs 200 ult

Onefrkncrzypope

They need a dps group buff(pushing for a mag damage buff like engulfing flames). Also they need to have a bear that actually is stronger. Its 3k dps but its an ulti that needs to be double barred. It dies easier than the freaking scamp. It goes full potato and stands there. The ulti can be wasted in a multiple enemy fight. The bear needs to act like an ulti and strong ulti.

TheInfernalRage

Tasear wrote: »

What is your number one concern with them?

Without the Bear, Magicka Warden DD's are almost close to useless.

1. FERAL GUARDIAN: That Bear should automatically come back to battle in 5/8 seconds after its beaten, without any casting and in both morphs. Physical morph still have the same increased damage, while the Magicka morph now stuns for 4s but only when hitting the Ultimate button.

2. LIVING VINES: Conditions of the Living Vines and/or its morphs should automatically be applied to the Bear, wherever it is.

3. IMPALING SHARDS: Winter's Revenge should deal X amount of damage before the damage over time ticks, but have reduced duration of 8s.

4. SCORCH: Subterranean Assault should have Major Fracture and Major Breach, while Deep Fissure have increased Magicka damage.

5. DIVE: Screaming Cliff Racer applies snare or causes fear for 4s but loses the damage based on distance.

weedgenius

NO EXECUTE!!!!

Tryxus

weedgenius wrote: »

NO EXECUTE!!!!

They have one

The_Lex

Regarding Magdens, there are multiple posts about specific points points. The common theme: dps and lack of a CC (the former being the greatest pain point).

The fact that you're asking for info that has been debated and discussed ad nauseum is troubling. I understand you are just doing your job as a class rep, but is ZOS reading these threads?

MLGProPlayer

TheInfernalRage wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

What is your number one concern with them?

Without the Bear, Magicka Warden DD's are almost close to useless.

1. FERAL GUARDIAN: That Bear should automatically come back to battle in 5/8 seconds after its beaten, without any casting and in both morphs. Physical morph still have the same increased damage, while the Magicka morph now stuns for 4s but only when hitting the Ultimate button.

2. LIVING VINES: Conditions of the Living Vines and/or its morphs should automatically be applied to the Bear, wherever it is.

3. IMPALING SHARDS: Winter's Revenge should deal X amount of damage before the damage over time ticks, but have reduced duration of 8s.

4. SCORCH: Subterranean Assault should have Major Fracture and Major Breach, while Deep Fissure have increased Magicka damage.

5. DIVE: Screaming Cliff Racer applies snare or causes fear for 4s but loses the damage based on distance.

They parse nearly 10k behind NB without the bear ultimate.

yurimodin

rolling a warden tank now......having fun but have not done enough content with it to know the shortcomings.

kojou

Stam Warden is ok because weapon abilities can fill in the gaps.

Magicka Warden needs a stun for PvP and a damage increase for PvE.

Perhaps making Growing Swarm a stun that "grows" upon break free?

Change Artic Blast to be based on Magicka and Spell Damage?

MLGProPlayer

A few suggestions I've made in the past:

- Make the bear a single bar ability so wardens can slot destro ultimate on 1 bar (they currently need to slot crushing shock or ele drain to maintain destro passives on both bars; no other class needs to do this)
- Increase the damage boost from the advanced species passive from 2% per animal companion skill to 3% (since wardens use few AC skills)
- Increase the damage of fetcher infection by 20% (its damage is far too low right now
- Increase the duration of bird of prey to 24s
- Change the durations of fetcher infection and winter's revenge to match wall of elements duration

The_Lex

My specific pain point (which is not really a pain point, per se), other than general DPS issues, is that I really wanted to play a frost mage/druid. The nature aspect is apparent throughout two skill trees, but the frost tree is so...unrelated to anything else. it was like those abilities were just thrown into the mix. Couple that with the frost staff - you have to specifically avoid a passive to avoid getting aggro in a group setting.

It's just not possible to play an Elder Scrolls style frost mage in this game.

Integral1900

Just deleted my third attempt at this class out of sheer frustration, a pve alt that I foolishly tried to turn into a rugged dps.... but I know when I’m beaten, here is my thoughts for what they are worth anyway

1 animations for the death pigeon and the shalks are aweful, soooo dull with no feeling of connection what so ever, I saw the original burrowing beast version of deep fissure and that was so awesome you could have sold the chapter to me on that alone

2 way to many buffs adding to a lack of identity that plagues this class

3 they make great tanks and good healers (but for god sake teach people what a cone heal is!!!!) the dps can spike quite high but it requires far to much faffing around with a bar load of seemingly random timers, overall I think the main reason they struggle in pve is it just takes too much thought. Most players can’t spare the attention to manage all those effects as well as avoid dungeon one-shot mechanics... if you don’t believe me just join a pug and watch...

4 the bear..... I’m not going to rant, even though I want to, so I will just say this. I kept a record of 100 times the bear needed to be re-spawned (eternal guardian is such a fake) out of all those times only three were because of the enemy, the rest were 32 times when it got stuck in the ceiling and just switched off, the remainder were cases where I didn’t see what happened but only realised later that the stupid thing was gone. Aincent elf ruins are realy bad for this

5 ice dps remains a dream, thaumaturge doesn’t work on most of the class ice skills being the main culprit, I don’t mind the taunt though as it means my mdk doesn’t need to slot a skill for it