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Major and Minor Defile.
PureEnvelope35
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Good day/night people!
As you can guess by the title, this post is mainly gonna touch on PvP issues, those issues being Major and Minor defile.
I think that many people who play PvP, both in Champion Point (CP) and Non-Champion Point campaigns can agree that defiles are an extremely annoying and hard to counter mechanic in PvP, the reason being that they reduce your healing by a large amount, and without healing one simply can not survive in PvP.
For anyone unsure on the numbers, without any CPs into the befoul passive, the number for minor defile is 15% healing reduction and 30% for major, this means that one can easily reduce an opponent's healing by 45% in non CP campaigns, where your healing is already lower than in CP campaigns, this can easily be increased to ≈70% healing reduction in CP campaigns with a high amount of points into befoul.
Normally stacking major and minor debuffs isn't an issue, take Maim for example where very few sources exist for it in both minor and major forms, however this is not the case for defile. The defile debuff is possibly one of the easiest debuffs to apply to enemy players, some of the sources are:
- Dragonknight Standard (Major)
- Certain Poisons (Minor)
- Durok's Bane (Major)
- Lethal Arrow (Major)
- Fasalla's Guile (Minor)
- Disease Enchantment (Minor)
- Diseased Status Effect (Minor)
- The new update to Cyrodiil's Crest (Major)
- Thurvokun (Minor)
- Reverberating Bash (Major)
- Death Stroke (Major)
- Healing Seed (Major)
- Dark Flare (Major)
- Claws of Anguish (Major)
- Any disease damage ability (5% chance for Major Defile)
I think that should be just about every source but let me know if I missed any.
An extremely strong debuff, which is useless for PvE, has some of the most and easiest to get sources and the results of the debuff are easily proven to be slightly unbalanced in certain aspects.
Does anyone else feel that defiles need to be reworked? If so in what ways would it be best to stay balanced?
Edited by PureEnvelope35 on July 18, 2018 3:33PM As you can guess by the title, this post is mainly gonna touch on PvP issues, those issues being Major and Minor defile.
I think that many people who play PvP, both in Champion Point (CP) and Non-Champion Point campaigns can agree that defiles are an extremely annoying and hard to counter mechanic in PvP, the reason being that they reduce your healing by a large amount, and without healing one simply can not survive in PvP.
For anyone unsure on the numbers, without any CPs into the befoul passive, the number for minor defile is 15% healing reduction and 30% for major, this means that one can easily reduce an opponent's healing by 45% in non CP campaigns, where your healing is already lower than in CP campaigns, this can easily be increased to ≈70% healing reduction in CP campaigns with a high amount of points into befoul.
Normally stacking major and minor debuffs isn't an issue, take Maim for example where very few sources exist for it in both minor and major forms, however this is not the case for defile. The defile debuff is possibly one of the easiest debuffs to apply to enemy players, some of the sources are:
- Dragonknight Standard (Major)
- Certain Poisons (Minor)
- Durok's Bane (Major)
- Lethal Arrow (Major)
- Fasalla's Guile (Minor)
- Disease Enchantment (Minor)
- Diseased Status Effect (Minor)
- The new update to Cyrodiil's Crest (Major)
- Thurvokun (Minor)
- Reverberating Bash (Major)
- Death Stroke (Major)
- Healing Seed (Major)
- Dark Flare (Major)
- Claws of Anguish (Major)
- Any disease damage ability (5% chance for Major Defile)
I think that should be just about every source but let me know if I missed any.
An extremely strong debuff, which is useless for PvE, has some of the most and easiest to get sources and the results of the debuff are easily proven to be slightly unbalanced in certain aspects.
Does anyone else feel that defiles need to be reworked? If so in what ways would it be best to stay balanced?
Fashion is the true endgame.PC EU
3
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Dillpat✭✭✭why cant u put this much effort into your memes on discord?
but good points.@Dillpaat PC EU/NA
Just a laggy memer
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXwr2YeTb0aQXEI99RfwQsg?view_as=subscriber?&ab_channel=DILLPAAT3 -
I don’t know what class you are on, but a hard counter to defile nerds is to run away...
But +1, It does need a look at. There are definitely a few too many ways to stack these debuffs. Stam dk and nb come to mind specifically0 -
Yakidafi✭✭✭✭✭
✭Disease status effect give major Defile.
Not sure why you separated disease enchantment and status effect.
By poisons I guess you mean the Craftable ones?
@PureEnvelope35Edited by Yakidafi on July 18, 2018 3:31PMMoons and sands shall be your guide and path.
PC EU/NA0 -
Akagami94✭✭✭The amount of defile in sets are too damn high. Lack of inspiration from devs? Where are those dodge change, crit, max stats sets or you get increased healing/execute or w/e when u meet a cirtan condition, where you can play around with as a player.
But my honest opinion about the amount of defile major and minor is good enough. But it shouldn't stack to the point were some1 has 80% healing debuf.
And ofcourse people would say. L2p or just purge it.. defile is the least priority debuff for getting purges. So if u have more than 5 debufs, u still have defile debuf on you.
It should be the first or second priority to purge.1 -
PureEnvelope35✭✭✭✭The amount of defile in sets are too damn high. Lack of inspiration from devs? Where are those dodge change, crit, max stats sets or you get increased healing/execute or w/e when u meet a cirtan condition, where you can play around with as a player.
But my honest opinion about the amount of defile major and minor is good enough. But it shouldn't stack to the point were some1 has 80% healing debuf.
And ofcourse people would say. L2p or just purge it.. defile is the least priority debuff for getting purges. So if u have more than 5 debufs, u still have defile debuf on you.
It should be the first or second priority to purge.
Purge is a good ability, too bad stam builds can use it a max of about 2-3 times, depending on the class and playstyle. Mag has a bit of an easier job but purge is still too expensive to use reliably.Fashion is the true endgame.PC EU0 -
Akagami94✭✭✭I don’t know what class you are on, but a hard counter to defile nerds is to run away...
But +1, It does need a look at. There are definitely a few too many ways to stack these debuffs. Stam dk and nb come to mind specifically
About the part "to run away" you never had a zerg behind you, that can cap close 24/7 where your resources are getting drained more with each use of dodgeroll or ball of ligthing/streak.
Ur dead anway..1 -
Akagami94✭✭✭PureEnvelope35 wrote: »The amount of defile in sets are too damn high. Lack of inspiration from devs? Where are those dodge change, crit, max stats sets or you get increased healing/execute or w/e when u meet a cirtan condition, where you can play around with as a player.
But my honest opinion about the amount of defile major and minor is good enough. But it shouldn't stack to the point were some1 has 80% healing debuf.
And ofcourse people would say. L2p or just purge it.. defile is the least priority debuff for getting purges. So if u have more than 5 debufs, u still have defile debuf on you.
It should be the first or second priority to purge.
Purge is a good ability, too bad stam builds can use it a max of about 2-3 times, depending on the class and playstyle. Mag has a bit of an easier job but purge is still too expensive to use reliably.
Not to mention defile is least priorities0 -
PureEnvelope35✭✭✭✭Disease status effect give major Defile.
Not sure why you separated disease enchantment and status effect.
By poisons I guess you mean the Craftable ones?
@PureEnvelope35
Yeah craftable ones, also thanks for mentioning about the status effect, never got any clear answers when testing it.Edited by PureEnvelope35 on July 18, 2018 3:34PMFashion is the true endgame.PC EU0 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭Agree, major defile is too easy to have access too. All skills, poisons and sets that currently give major should give minor, while only ultimates should be able to grant major. And allow all classes to have a way or the other to access defile via ulti (maybe, idk, might be op af tbh)1 -
Rickter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Both defile and heals need to be reworked at the same time. Nerfing one over the other would make one or the other too powerful.
Befoul is too front loaded, but Blessed, Quick recovery and for some classes, Elfborn all enhance healing.
look at the bigger picture or we will continue to have an imbalanced and broken game.RickterESO
PC | NA | DC
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Guilds: PvP:Bloodletter | StamDK | Alliance Rank 46 | Former Emperor of Shor (2018) | Former Emperor of Thornblade #4terms (2015)PvE:vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMA | vDSA | vMoL | ALL Vet 4 Man Dungeons5 -
PureEnvelope35✭✭✭✭Both defile and heals need to be reworked at the same time. Nerfing one over the other would make one or the other too powerful.
Befoul is too front loaded, but Blessed, Quick recovery and for some classes, Elfborn all enhance healing.
look at the bigger picture or we will continue to have an imbalanced and broken game.
You've got some very good points here. Issue is just that the balance changes only happen every ~Every 3 months.Fashion is the true endgame.PC EU0
