Melee magicka weapons

keidser

I don't see why we don't have melee magicka weapons. It's the only thing that misses, and would really make a lot of builds more enjoyable (for me, at least).

Maybe it could be an enchant that made the weapons abilities use mag instead of stam. Fx if enchanting 2 swords could make you use dual wield abilities and use magicka? (and maybe you HAVE to have both weapons enchanted to let it use mag?)
I'm a pretty new player, but I've read that mag builds are far ahead of stam builds. So I thought, that by making it an enchant, you would "nerf" the weapons a bit and balance it out that way. If that's not enough, or too much, the enchant can give or take something from the weapons.
The same would go for S&B and 2h..

I really feel that it's missing. All class skills are magicka based, and only 2-4 from each class can be converted to stamina. I find this weird and really limits melee builds vs ranged builds.

Of course there's the aesthetic component too.. It looks weird standing up front with my closerange templar skills and my longrange flamestaff shooting fireballs at the bandit that's striking me with his axe.

I think I'm not alone in this, although not everyone agrees...

TL:DR I really want some kind of magicka based melee weapon!

Cheers!

AcadianPaladin

The templar's puncturing strike (and its morphs) are magical melee weapons. My magic templar loves hers.

keidser

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

The templar's puncturing strike (and its morphs) are magical melee weapons. My magic templar loves hers.

Magical melee skills... My magplar love those too, but aren't quite enough to make up for the absense of magicka melee weapons

Beardimus

Yep we need this / something. Forcing all Magika toons to run dual wands is dull.

I've run MagDW from launch tho. It's been harder each patch ill say that and summerset was pretty much the death of it.

So you know running DW swords gives you good damage boost to skills, runs two traits, allows you to regain stamina with a HA, and the last passives buffs damage 5% etc etc. Problem is now you an get 5:5:2 with a staff and the passives are better and light attack weaves are gd damage there's kinda no real point to MagDW now apart from.beinf stubborn.

So time for magika weapons yes

josiahva

I don't know about magicka melee weapons per se...but even if they didn't do that, what would be more interesting is an actual skill line using temporary magicka melee weapons like the templar's spear or the DK's whip. A skill line with 5 active skills each being a different temporary magicka melee weapon....or several different skill lines focusing on one "weapon" each. I would love to see magicka DPS other than DKs

PlagueSD

keidser wrote: »

I don't see why we don't have melee magicka weapons. It's the only thing that misses, and would really make a lot of builds more enjoyable (for me, at least).

Because standing in melee as a clothie is a death sentence.

keidser

PlagueSD wrote: »

Because standing in melee as a clothie is a death sentence.

For a raiding min/maxer, yes I guess, idk. But for the casual roleplayer, then not really.
Besides, a magplar seems to be pretty close with his skills anyway.

Valkysas154

PlagueSD wrote: »

keidser wrote: »

I don't see why we don't have melee magicka weapons. It's the only thing that misses, and would really make a lot of builds more enjoyable (for me, at least).

Because standing in melee as a clothie is a death sentence.

I disagree my magplar has over 22k resist with Channeled Focus 20khp and if i wear Light of Cyrodiil set
thats neg 15% dmg why channeling an ability and since Puncturing Sweep is a channel +heal..
Light armor is not as weak as you think

And it might stack with the Deliberation passive making it 45% dmg reduction well if you use a psijic skill that is a channel like meditate on the hardest hits

TheShadowScout

keidser wrote: »

I don't see why we don't have melee magicka weapons.

...why would a nerdy mage waring a frigging -robe- instead of proper armor -want- to get within reach of that big, burly warriors axe when they can cast great balls of fira at those warriors from a (somewhat) safe distance?

(Yeah, there are some builds that can do it - those using skills with built in heals. But others...)

keidser wrote: »

Maybe it could be an enchant that made the weapons abilities use mag instead of stam.

Nah.
Basically its like this...
...if you use your -muscles- to swing/thrust/use a weapon to do its damage, its stamina.
...if you use your -magic- to conjure up some flashy spell to do damage, its magica.
Generally, that's it.

Some class skills are a bit of both, and those then often have a morph to "specialize".
And among them, there -are- "melee magic" abilities. Impulse from the destro staff, and several low-range class skills (and yes, templars have the best one with their golden spears - puncturing strikes, through DKs have some good ones as well with lava whip and searing strike, and nightblades are not left out either with red daggers for assassins blade and veiled strike...) come to mind...

...that being said...

...mopre weapon choices for magica characters other then "What flavor staff would you like" would be very much appreciated. Things like one-handed and magic for hybrid characters, or twin magic to dual-wield the offhand from that... In that spirit: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/371862/additional-weapon-skill-ideas-mk-ii

Jamdarius

PlagueSD wrote: »

keidser wrote: »

I don't see why we don't have melee magicka weapons. It's the only thing that misses, and would really make a lot of builds more enjoyable (for me, at least).

Because standing in melee as a clothie is a death sentence.

Say that to my Mag DK main melee with 1h/s that did vet maelstorm yesterday while exchanging blows with last boss and ye I have been wearing only light armor well and shield and using shielding skill + burning embers to go through it

keidser

TheShadowScout wrote: »

keidser wrote: »

I don't see why we don't have melee magicka weapons.

...why would a nerdy mage waring a frigging -robe- instead of proper armor -want- to get within reach of that big, burly warriors axe when they can cast great balls of fira at those warriors from a (somewhat) safe distance?

(Yeah, there are some builds that can do it - those using skills with built in heals. But others...)

keidser wrote: »

Maybe it could be an enchant that made the weapons abilities use mag instead of stam.

Nah.
Basically its like this...
...if you use your -muscles- to swing/thrust/use a weapon to do its damage, its stamina.
...if you use your -magic- to conjure up some flashy spell to do damage, its magica.
Generally, that's it.

I would use a mix of light and heavy armor to get in the heat of battle. And I don't want to cast fireballs, it's just the only magicka option. I want to have melee magicka weapons and stand in the middle of everything while having a lot more in my arsenal than the stamina converted class skills.

Lightsabers don't seem to need a lot of muscle. Convert that to fantasy and you have a spellsword. Fantasy is so versatile that you can make the spellsword just as powerful, light, heavy or anything you(/developers) like.

Paladins are closerange melee semi casters. Why not let that archetype have a melee weapon that actually benefits their magical abilities?

Death knight-types are the same.

Druids (or wardens in this game).



One of my points is, that no matter what logic you come with, a fantasy setting can cope and adapt. I just really want the opportunity to roleplay this way not everyone wants to.. But not everyone likes the stereotypical mage with pyjamas and a stick.

And it seems like some of the other guys above have fine experiences with light armor in closerange. And again, the templars puncturing sweep is already so upfront that you/I might as well carry a sword, or the likes.



If adding melee magicka weapons somehow would destroy the game, then ofc no, it shouldn't be implemented. But I can't see how having the choice to play with them would ruin the gaming experience for other players.
Even if they wouldn't be used in any hardcore endgame meta setup, why not give the opportunity to the casual roleplaying part of the playerbase?

Thestephenmcraeub17_ESO

I know a lot of magicka builds used to run dual swords for the 5% damage boost, is that still a thing? I feel like it really fell off once they buffed destro staves. But I've been thinking about giving it another shot for my mDK, just don't know how viable it is compared to a good inferno staff

TheShadowScout

keidser wrote: »

Paladins are closerange melee semi casters. Why not let that archetype have a melee weapon that actually benefits their magical abilities?

Not back when I played them they weren't. They were more like... warriors with some healing spells. Doing their damage by weapons, and using their "lay on hands" and "turn undead" abilities to supplement that...
That's how they roll. In ESO terms, stamina character with some magica support skills. Their magical abilities -always- take second place, a distant second place, to their warriors prowess, both for paladins and death knights. Otherwise they'd be clerics and liches.
Druids... are generally casters. Often denied proper weaponry even (only wooden clubs and golden sickles does not for great warriors make) In some universes, with an "Shapeshift into beast" melee option, a niche which in ESO is filled by lycantropes.

And we DO have the "magic melee weapons" in the game. The "summoned weapons". DKs lava whips, templars spears, nightblades red daggers and bow, fighters guild dawnbreaker, etc.
That's it. You magic it up, strike a blow, and then... the magic dissipates again.
That's how those work in ESO.

But as I stated, I fully agree that there should be more options for people to "play as they want"!

At the very least, "One-handed and Magic" for hybrid spellsword type characters (even though the current setup sadly makes those a bit... suboptimal, something that -really- ought to be tinkered with... make hybrids great again! Or at least decent...). And once they make an offhand rune/want item, it only makes sense to let people dual-wield those for quick-cast magic, perhaps at a lower range then staves... that consideration gavce borth to my "Twin Magic" idea. As stated:

TheShadowScout wrote: »

In that spirit: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/371862/additional-weapon-skill-ideas-mk-ii

dodgehopper_ESO

Skill lines I'd like to see them add:

1. Spell + Sword
2. Spell+Shield
3. Unarmed weapons (not a true weapon line but something you could use regardless of weapon in hand).
4. Longspear/halberd.
5. Shortspear+Shield
6. Stamina-staff. (This could probably fit in Halberd)
7. Fear Staff/Illusion Staff
8. Corruption Staff.

keidser

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Otherwise they'd be clerics and liches.

And we DO have the "magic melee weapons" in the game. The "summoned weapons". DKs lava whips, templars spears, nightblades red daggers and bow, fighters guild dawnbreaker, etc.

But as I stated, I fully agree that there should be more options for people to "play as they want"!

At the very least, "One-handed and Magic" for hybrid spellsword type characters (even though the current setup sadly makes those a bit... suboptimal, something that -really- ought to be tinkered with... make hybrids great again! Or at least decent...). And once they make an offhand rune/want item, it only makes sense to let people dual-wield those for quick-cast magic, perhaps at a lower range then staves... that consideration gavce borth to my "Twin Magic" idea.

You have good points, but then give me the option to be a cleric or a lich, if those terms will better suit your, or anyones, vocabulary

Those aren't weapons... They are skills... And therefore doesn't really match my wishes.

The idea of one handed and magic, offhand runes, and all that, is nice. I'd support that! But I'd still want to dual wield to spellswords, or S&B a magic based onehand.. But I think I've made that very clear in all posts

Maybe the builds won't be optimal/meta, but they should at least be viable for most of the game.

Aebaradath

Jamdarius wrote: »

PlagueSD wrote: »

keidser wrote: »

I don't see why we don't have melee magicka weapons. It's the only thing that misses, and would really make a lot of builds more enjoyable (for me, at least).

Because standing in melee as a clothie is a death sentence.

Say that to my Mag DK main melee with 1h/s that did vet maelstorm yesterday while exchanging blows with last boss and ye I have been wearing only light armor well and shield and using shielding skill + burning embers to go through it

me wanna see

TheShadowScout

keidser wrote: »

You have good points, but then give me the option to be a cleric or a lich, if those terms will better suit your, or anyones, vocabulary

Cleric you can do. Templar with main magica, secondary stamina, mace, mixed light and heavy armor... and only using maces. it would be just like back in D&D...

Liches... well... those would need some necromancy, and a new "undead" status option next to vampire and werewolf. Thus for the time being, they would have to remain NPC mobs...

You can do quite a few other fun hybrid templates tho...

keidser wrote: »

Maybe the builds won't be optimal/meta, but they should at least be viable for most of the game.

Fu... uhm... forget the META! Some things are -fun- playing because they are not the most effective tactic available!
And more neat options would always be adding fun to the game...
But not at the expense of sense... so magica weapons ought to be -magic- and not lightsabers... (eh, I mean, magica copies of stamina weapons)

six2fall

wouldn't mind a conjured weapons skill line but instead of skills it would be passives (2h, dw, bow, s & b) that when put points into it would unlock a corresponding weapon skill line you'd then use a spectral weapon to level.

bg22

At launch, before I knew wth I was doing (I still don’t) I was a DW/1hS NB Hybrid. Actually worked really well, and it threw ppl off. I was fortunate enough to kill a well known twitch steamer live and record it! lol

I think I could build a viable PvP hybrid, no doubt.

keidser

TheShadowScout wrote: »

keidser wrote: »

You have good points, but then give me the option to be a cleric or a lich, if those terms will better suit your, or anyones, vocabulary

Cleric you can do. Templar with main magica, secondary stamina, mace, mixed light and heavy armor... and only using maces. it would be just like back in D&D...

Liches... well... those would need some necromancy, and a new "undead" status option next to vampire and werewolf. Thus for the time being, they would have to remain NPC mobs...

You can do quite a few other fun hybrid templates tho...

keidser wrote: »

Maybe the builds won't be optimal/meta, but they should at least be viable for most of the game.

Fu... uhm... forget the META! Some things are -fun- playing because they are not the most effective tactic available!
And more neat options would always be adding fun to the game...
But not at the expense of sense... so magica weapons ought to be -magic- and not lightsabers... (eh, I mean, magica copies of stamina weapons)

I read that hybrid builds are complete garbage, or something like that, and therefore the mix between magicka and stamina would fail?
An arcane sword can be spellcrafted into being light as nothing, and sharp as a regular sword, therefore making sense for a magic based hero/champion/whatwewannacallit.

In my mind, it would make sense. Maybe not in yours. But that's the funny thing about logic. What's logical for you may not be logical for me.... And then again, this is fantasy... Lets push away the realism and embrace the fact, that if you can shoot fireballs from a wooden stick without it burning up itself, then I think a sword can be infused with arcane (or anything else, really) and used by a fictional character and match the same amount of pain inflicted from the swing of a sword.

My question for you is, do you really think that having some kind of magicka based melee weapon is such a bad idea, that for the love of all that's anything, shouldn't be implemented in this game to satisfy a good percentage of the players? (I saw a poll from february where the majority voted yes on this topic)

I just hope that at some point, the developers has seen enough of these suggestions to implement it to the game.

YarYar

The issue that I see is currently magicka is set up to give you class options while stamina gives you weapon options. I'd be all for the introduction of more magicka weapons if stamina was given the option of stamina morphs for every class skill, not just the small handful currently available.

TheShadowScout

keidser wrote: »

I read that hybrid builds are complete garbage, or something like that, and therefore the mix between magicka and stamina would fail?

Right now, the META is to push your damage stat as high as possible - raise your killpower, wipe the floor with everything at breakneck pace. Even at expense of your health stat, the megakillers will tell you to do that, then gain your HP through multi-stat armor enchantments farmed from imperial city. And it works too. (which makes me wish they would add mechanics to all endgame content that insta-kill people who have not at least, say, 15 attribute points in their health... but then, I would love to hear the wailing of despair from all the min/maxxers this would cause, so I may be biased here)

Way back when, there were softcaps, and after a certain point, putting attribute points into your main stat was not as effective anymore, encouraging people to spread them around, which made hybrids a lot more viable.
Ah, the good old days...
Bring back attribute softcaps! Make hybrids competetive again!

Hybrid characters are -still- viable. I know, I have one or two. But... they just won't be as effective. You can still do all the normal content, but you will likely loose a lot in cyrodil and never make any leaderboards. Still, there are people (like me) who don't care about that anyhow, so...
More annoying, you will perform underwhelmingly in dungeons, and if you go with a piece of sh... uhm... a random pick-up group, some might have unkind words concerning your character choices. Heck, that can happen even if you don't have the "most effective race" for your build... easy solution - don't group with such douc... uhm... people. As long as you only dungeoncrawl with friends who don't mind taking a little longer and fighting a little harder...

keidser wrote: »

An arcane sword can be spellcrafted into being light as nothing, and sharp as a regular sword, therefore making sense for a magic based hero/champion/whatwewannacallit.

...and then with the mages weak muscles behind it will do about as much damage as a plastic toy sword. Good for honor duels, but when fighting monsters, well...
Swords do their damage through three things... the keenness of their edge, and the speed and power of their swing. Latter are derived from the weapons weight (heavier weapons tend to strike harder, but are a bit harder to swing thanks to their weight), and the musclepower behind it. (swords also have other important properties, like strength of their construction materials, but that does not really add to the damage, it just keeps you from seeing your sword break in the middle of battle because it was made of pig iron or something like that. Oh, and metter baterials allow a balde to keep that keen edge for longer too.)

Reduce the weight, you get a weapon that is quicker to wield, does less damage, and will have difficulties getting through armor (try piecing plate mail with an fencing foil sometime). Oh, and it might break when you try a parry against someone coming at you with a battle axe.
There is a reason fencing foils and epees have not become common until after firearms have displaced battleaxes, yes?

Same thing with a "sword made for weak nerdy mages".

keidser wrote: »

...then I think a sword can be infused with arcane (or anything else, really) and used by a fictional character and match the same amount of pain inflicted from the swing of a sword.

...you do realize that you just described all the usual swords in ESO?
"a sword can be infused with arcane..." - yes, through rune enchantments.
"...and match the same amount of pain inflicted from the swing of a sword" - well, duh, a sword will match a sword.

Point being, a swung sword will still do its damage through the muscles that swung it.
Yes, enchantments can increase this - but for -everyone-. And then the burly warrior -again- delivers more pain per blow when his enchanted sword gets swung with more muscle then the mages enchanted sword, dealing the same enchantment damage, but way more physical damage. It already works like that in ESO - a all-stamina character will have a higher weapon damage with swords then an magica character.

Thus the magica character will once more rely on spells...
...and yes, they could be spells that magic up swords of light. In tamriel, they call it "Dawnbreaker", and it costs a nice pile of ulti to use...

keidser wrote: »

My question for you is, do you really think that having some kind of magicka based melee weapon is such a bad idea, that for the love of all that's anything, shouldn't be implemented in this game to satisfy a good percentage of the players?

I really don't mind a magica based melee weapon (as I noted, there are -several- abilities that fill that slot) - as long as it makes sense within the logic of the game, and not just is taking a muscle powered weapon and make it magica without any logic behind it.
Thus I did post my weapon ideas, which include two magica weapons (or one and a half, depending how you look at it) for such occasions.

keidser

YarYar wrote: »

The issue that I see is currently magicka is set up to give you class options while stamina gives you weapon options. I'd be all for the introduction of more magicka weapons if stamina was given the option of stamina morphs for every class skill, not just the small handful currently available.

Honestly, if this happened... then everything would be fine for me and the need for magicka melee weapons would be minimal for me.



@TheShadowScout
You miss my point entirely with the "arcane infused weapons" and mock it with "that is already in the game". You are talking weapon enchants that give a small damage boost on hit with a cooldown. I'm talking a complete change of the weapons physical nature (since it will be transformed to something out of this world).

I see your points, and what you mean with what you say about "not making sense". I can see it from your point of view, although it seems a bit narrowminded. I tried to explain how it would make sense from my point of view since this is a fantasy setting where you can bend the rules all you want, as long as you back it up with some kind of story. And honestly? That's pretty easy. If we were talking sense, then wearing armor that GIVES stamina is really off...

You've made your point. We don't agree (or somewhat don't), and lets see if other players has opinions or ideas that could make builds more versatile.

Atm, I think YarYars idea of having all, or most, class skills have a "convert to stamina" option would be really cool.

TheShadowScout

keidser wrote: »

I'm talking a complete change of the weapons physical nature (since it will be transformed to something out of this world).

And that is the problem - your concept if taken this way is something that does not exist in TES lore, will not exist in any TES games set in a later time period, and has not been heard of in legels of that later time period.

keidser wrote: »

I tried to explain how it would make sense from my point of view since this is a fantasy setting where you can bend the rules all you want, as long as you back it up with some kind of story...

...and there is the fault in your thinking.
That sort of thing works in a -new- fantasy setting, or in your solo game where you can install mods without having to pay attention to the lore of the world.
But in an -established- fantasy setting, people have to stop and think what would be iffy with the already existing lore of the setting, instead of going like "Do whatever because magic"...

But we both made our points, and I suppose we can just agree to disagree here

keidser wrote: »

Atm, I think YarYars idea of having all, or most, class skills have a "convert to stamina" option would be really cool.

I don't.
Mostly because, as I stated before, "stamina skill" means (mostly) muscle-powered ability. And no matter how hard you flex your muscles, it doesn't make fireballs appear. No, not even in a DragonballZ setting, even there they tend to explain the "martial arts magic" with chi/ki/prana control, which is more or less the eastern take on magica, astral energy, supernatural power, psionics, the force, whatever you want to call it...

Thus... in my opinion... "fighters", aka stamina characters, are -supposed- to rely more on "realistic-ish" and "martial-artsy" hack-and-slash weapon skills, while "casters" aka magica characters, are -supposed- to rely more on those "balls of fire from their eyes and bolts of lighting from their ar... uhm... hands?" flashy magical class/guild skills.

If you ask me, what stamina characters should get is an expansion of each weapon skill line with a couple new active abilities for them to switch it up and gain more build flexibility.
That and way more weaponjs skill choices, like I keep saying: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/371862/additional-weapon-skill-ideas-mk-ii
...and maaaaaybe a "martial arts" guild skill line that would be useful for stamina characters. With lots of passives and "combat support" type skills that any stamina character could find worth slotting, no matter what weapon they might use.

And magica characters... just got a nifty new skill line with Psijic, and could get more of the sort. There are soooooooo many neat spells NPCs use that get me all green with envy and purple with vexation at not being able to take them for my caster characters... if ZOS found ways to give us such spells to refit for our favorite characters... heck, I'd shell out on an expansion just for that!

Thestephenmcraeub17_ESO

Yes to melee range magicka weapons. Yes to more class stam morphs. Yes to more build diversity. How is that a bad thing?

(and while we're at it, how about some magicka morphs of 1h&s abilities to go with our shiny new melee range 1h magicka weapons? Then we can turn frost staves back to damage weapons instead of tank weapons, and restore balance to the force. Or Nirn, or whatever)

TheShadowScout

Thestephenmcraeub17_ESO wrote: »

Yes to melee range magicka weapons. Yes to more class stam morphs. Yes to more build diversity. How is that a bad thing?

...you are talking about enabling both stamina and magica characters use the -exact same- weapons and class skills through "magica melee weapons" and "stamina morph class skills" and talk about diversity in the same breath???
THAT is how this is a bad thing!

I would much rather see more options for stamina builds (aka, more more weapon skill lines to choose from and more stamina-support guild lines, and maybe even more abilities per weapon skill line), and more options for magica builds (aka, more magica weapon skill lines, more magica support guild lines and perhaps even a fourth class skill line with several choices to "specialize" in).

Because diversity comes from more options, not from making the same old options available to more people...

keidser

TheShadowScout wrote: »

I would much rather see more options for stamina builds (aka, more more weapon skill lines to choose from and more stamina-support guild lines, and maybe even more abilities per weapon skill line), and more options for magica builds (aka, more magica weapon skill lines, more magica support guild lines and perhaps even a fourth class skill line with several choices to "specialize" in).

Or maybe give all classes a few more skills that are more stamina based.. Maybe just 1 skill with 2 morphs in each skill line. Just something that woud make stamina builds have more than the 2-3 stamina converts each class has. You don't have a lot of stamina options when choosing a class.

Fi'yra

If you want to go melee as magicka, play Templar or mDK

TheShadowScout

keidser wrote: »

TheShadowScout wrote: »

I would much rather see more options for stamina builds (aka, more more weapon skill lines to choose from and more stamina-support guild lines, and maybe even more abilities per weapon skill line), and more options for magica builds (aka, more magica weapon skill lines, more magica support guild lines and perhaps even a fourth class skill line with several choices to "specialize" in).

Or maybe give all classes a few more skills that are more stamina based...

Again, that's -not- the point of stamina classes.
As @Enodoc said elsewhere:

Enodoc wrote: »

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Stamina means an ability powered by a warriors mighty muscles and physical prowess. A sword well swung, a bow drawn and released, a quick stab with a dagger, a powerful bash with a shield, that sort of thing.

Magica means an ability powered by magical energy and the casters keen will. A bolt of lightning, a breath of fire, a golden healing light or a conjured creature to fight for its master.

Right, and this goes back to what I think the original design intention was - Weapon skills used Stamina, since they were based on physical skill, and Class skills used Magicka, since they were based on magical skill. (Staves are an odd one... let's not go there.)

I'd like to see ZOS go back to this rather than try to wave away how a conjuration spell, an alteration spell, a restoration spell, or a poison/disease effect is suddenly based on your physical energy levels rather than your magical energy levels.

...and that pretty much sums it up nicely.

Thus I say, expanding stamina characters should come with new "martial arts" type skills, not with making "magical" class skills stamina-based.

And expanding magica characters... with more magical skills to choose from. Possibly including more magica weapons, like runestones/wands for less range...

keidser

I just don't get why class skills have to be so much magicka and almost no stamina. Give a sorcerer a two handed sword in his hand, and suddenly he's just as a good a sword fighter as a dragon knight. You should think that the lore would give classes some different combat training that wasn't entirely based on magic. But then again, I don't have much knowledge about the lore. Some things just don't make sense to me in this game, gameplay wise.

It just seems that if you want to make a stamina character, then 2 dragon knights probably wouldn't be built very different from each other, if at all. It feels a bit like Diablo 1, where your starting class didn't do much for you. You could get all stats and skills anyway.

Whereas if you make 2 dragon knight magicka based characters, you get lots of different ways to use your skillpoints on class skills, and therefore they would most likely be very different from each other.



For example in DDO you have lots of options within each class. I can sit for hours planning and reading skills and all, but here it's very limited. ESO is still a really nice and goodlooking game, and I'm gonna spend a lot of hours questing, exploring etc. But I feel it's lacking something.

Oh well

josiahva

Thestephenmcraeub17_ESO wrote: »

Yes to melee range magicka weapons. Yes to more class stam morphs. Yes to more build diversity. How is that a bad thing?

(and while we're at it, how about some magicka morphs of 1h&s abilities to go with our shiny new melee range 1h magicka weapons? Then we can turn frost staves back to damage weapons instead of tank weapons, and restore balance to the force. Or Nirn, or whatever)

And you think frost is a DPS ability because why? Cold slows things down=CC=tanking. Sorry, cold has never been a damage element...its always been a CC element. Now its true...if frozen, you do take more damage, but its not the cold that caused the damage...its the impact AFTERWARDS that did.

I hate to burst your bubble, but no one used the ice staff BEFORE it was a tanking weapon for DPS and no one uses it for DPS now...the difference is that tanks DO use the ice staff now...the changes to the ice staff have INCREASED THE USE OF THE ICE STAFF, just not for DPS, because ice is NOT a DPS element as it stands now and never will be without a frostcaster class(Warden is NOT an ice mage class...its a DRUID class, just like Templar isn't a fire mage, even though they have a few fire damage abilities)