PSA: On Bait Comments.

A_Silverius

I knew something like this would happen but I would like to remind everyone to be careful of bait comments designed to trigger you. These trolls could cause good threads with constructive criticism and discussion to close like this one https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/415511/dissapointed-that-nocturnal-looks-like-a-budget-cosplayer/p11

A_Silverius

@zos_jesc Pretty pleeeease?

A_Silverius

Cenom

You can probably just create another in the same subject. Otherwise, these people will just start answering previous insults. It might be a good way to clean up and people who gave and took other's feedbacks, can implement on their own in a new and fresh way.

Aliyavana

Technicly the thread was one about my opinion about nocturnal, you can technicly open a poll about what the communities opinion is

Cadbury

I'm not a lore expert, but in Nocturnal's case, I assumed her face was always covered in shadow, making her appearance more creepy. So on some level, I understand why some find her current appearance lackluster.

I don't recall the mods ever bringing back a closed topic, as it's just easier to make your own if you feel passionate about the subject. Also, talking about previously closed topics may only incure the wrath of the mods and get this locked, too

WhiteCoatSyndrome

#DaedricPrinceOfPixelation

Rogue_Ghost

Aliyavana wrote: »

Technicly the thread was one about my opinion about nocturnal, you can technicly open a poll about what the communities opinion is

I have no problems "sexually objectifying" a completely made up character who doesn't even exist. Of the Deadric gods, she is definitely the most appealing - in my opinion at least.

It's not like she can #metoo. She doesn't even exist.

Side note - remember when # meant "pound" and not "hashtag"? So, whenever I see the #metoo call-sign - I always think to myself - "Well, that's what got people into trouble in the first place. Is it meant to be ironic?"

AlienatedGoat

Rogue_Ghost wrote: »

Aliyavana wrote: »

Technicly the thread was one about my opinion about nocturnal, you can technicly open a poll about what the communities opinion is

I have no problems "sexually objectifying" a completely made up character who doesn't even exist. Of the Deadric gods, she is definitely the most appealing - in my opinion at least.

It's not like she can #metoo. She doesn't even exist.

Side note - remember when # meant "pound" and not "hashtag"? So, whenever I see the #metoo call-sign - I always think to myself - "Well, that's what got people into trouble in the first place. Is it meant to be ironic?"

I don't even know what the hell happened to that thread.

It's like people got bored and decided to troll it with fake outrage.

geonsocal

late to the party...what exactly was the "issue" with nocturnal's image?

searched the web - is this her latest incarnation from summerset:



or, is this it:


edit: not sure which is the latest greatest - but - sure doesn't seem like she likes wearing much clothes...

AlienatedGoat

geonsocal wrote: »

late to the party...what exactly was the "issue" with nocturnal's image?

searched the web - is this her latest incarnation from summerset:

It looks like crap. Especially when compared to her own statue (and other in-game Daedric Prince models).

Cadbury

geonsocal wrote: »

late to the party...what exactly was the "issue" with nocturnal's image?

searched the web - is this her latest incarnation from summerset:



or, is this it:

I think the consensus was that they reused an asset for Nocturnal, rather than a unique model like the other Daedric Lords. Plus, her robe looks more "bathrobe-y" now.

davidj8291

A_Silverius wrote: »

I knew something like this would happen but I would like to remind everyone to be careful of bait comments designed to trigger you. These trolls could cause good threads with constructive criticism and discussion to close like this one https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/415511/dissapointed-that-nocturnal-looks-like-a-budget-cosplayer/p11

The thread closed because someone criticized the overlords. That’s it.

geonsocal

okay, now that I've looked over a few different images from skyrim to fan art to summerset - definitely a drop in quality...

seeing how she was originally designed to provide a little pixel eye candy in the game - I can appreciate folks disappointment...

A_Silverius

Aliyavana wrote: »

Technicly the thread was one about my opinion about nocturnal, you can technicly open a poll about what the communities opinion is

But your thread was very informative!

A_Silverius

Cadbury wrote: »

I don't recall the mods ever bringing back a closed topic

Damn I didn't know that.. Oh well

starkerealm

geonsocal wrote: »

late to the party...what exactly was the "issue" with nocturnal's image?

searched the web - is this her latest incarnation from summerset:

Technically, I think that's the crown store image for the Nocturnal Shrike costume. Though, that is her outfit. And, in answer to your question, the problem isn't the outfit itself, so much as how it looks when blown up across your screen. The texture isn't especially high res, which is fine, until you're (effectively) licking it. Unfortunately, during one specific sequence in Summerset, you're looking at a version that takes up way too much of the screen, for the overall asset quality. Outside of that, it's fine. Even on characters. But, in that specific context, things go pear shaped.

DuskMarine

yea this happens all the time they wont open it.

A_Silverius

geonsocal wrote: »

late to the party...what exactly was the "issue" with nocturnal's image?

searched the web - is this her latest incarnation from summerset:



or, is this it:


edit: not sure which is the latest greatest - but - sure doesn't seem like she likes wearing much clothes...

This is her latest incarnation from summerset:

Pixel_Zealot

A_Silverius wrote: »

geonsocal wrote: »

late to the party...what exactly was the "issue" with nocturnal's image?

searched the web - is this her latest incarnation from summerset:



or, is this it:


edit: not sure which is the latest greatest - but - sure doesn't seem like she likes wearing much clothes...

This is her latest incarnation from summerset:

ZOS_JesC

We closed the previous thread because it ventured into the realm of dev bashing which is clearly outlined in our forum rules as a violation. The topic itself tends to stear the conversation in that direction. We kept it open for at least 11 pages, most of which circled back to the same points so we felt it ran its course in terms of generating constructive feedback. The goal of the original thread was to be heard and for the length of time the thread was open I can say whom ever needed to see the thread probably saw it. I would issue caution with this thread because reposting the nocturnal argument here will force us to close this thread as well. A thread on the dangers of baiting / derailing comments however, could be very educational and is perfectly acceptable. I hope I was able to clarify.

A_Silverius

DuskMarine

ZOS_JesC wrote: »

We closed the previous thread because it ventured into the realm of dev bashing which is clearly outlined in our forum rules as a violation. The topic itself tends to stear the conversation in that direction. We kept it open for at least 11 pages, most of which circled back to the same points so we felt it ran its course in terms of generating constructive feedback. The goal of the original thread was to be heard and for the length of time the thread was open I can say whom ever needed to see the thread probably saw it. I would issue caution with this thread because reposting the nocturnal argument here will force us to close this thread as well. A thread on the dangers of baiting / derailing comments however, could be very educational and is perfectly acceptable. I hope I was able to clarify.

the thing is people wouldnt bash if not given a reason thats kindve where it spawns from unfortunately.

DenMoria

"Crawlers", "Insect Parts", "Minnow", etc.

Bait comments.

Tandor

ZOS_JesC wrote: »

A thread on the dangers of baiting / derailing comments however, could be very educational and is perfectly acceptable. I hope I was able to clarify.

@ZOS_JesC Unfortunately it's very difficult to discuss such issues without commenting on moderation which is itself totally against the forum rules !

My only concern about such matters is that it often seems that certain people (and most will know who they are) delight in laying bait and then when others fall for it the original poster reports them. Judging by how long this continues I can only assume that it's the people responding to the bait that are attracting the moderators' attention rather than those laying the bait. That would certainly form a useful part of any (now authorised) "thread on the dangers of baiting / derailing comments" but for the avoidance of doubt it might be sensible for any such discussion to be launched as an official stickied thread with clear guidelines as to what is acceptable together perhaps with a greater degree of flexibility as to what may be said within that discussion.

ZOS_JesC

We define Bashing in the rules as : Bashing and Slanderous Comments - We do not permit the bashing of individuals (including ZeniMax employees), groups, or other companies on our forums. We believe that doing so is neither constructive nor in spirit of our game and community.

While it's perfectly fine to say something like "I would have changed x,y,z about this armor set or model." It is not ok to say "This dev should be fired." These are just examples. In the future if forum member have any questions about the rules, why a moderator took action, or if their post/thread is acceptable to post, you can always PM a moderator and request assistance.

@Tandor In the case where you witness a thread derailing, you should report the derailing comments so a moderator can action those individuals appropriately, instead of "taking the bait". That way the baiting comments can be removed and the thread can continue.

Tandor

ZOS_JesC wrote: »

@Tandor In the case where you witness a thread derailing, you should report the derailing comments so a moderator can action those individuals appropriately, instead of "taking the bait". That way the baiting comments can be removed and the thread can continue.

Thanks for responding quickly, and I fully appreciate what you're saying. My concern, however, is that sometimes people respond unwittingly to bait that has been very deliberately laid. In those cases the more severe offence lies very definitely with the posters laying the bait, and yet they seem to carry on posting such topics and comments with impunity.