Summerset questline is POLITICAL (very slight ***SPOILER***)

isailandshootub17_ESO

So I'm about 15 minutes into the questline, and I'm already getting bored with the preachy vibe about immigration and world politics... A bunch of grumpy, clearly out of touch, elitist, entitled, Altmer are upset that they are letting the other races into Summerset.

I get it. Racism bad. Diversity good. Thanks for the morality lesson.

For future reference, I would prefer not to be preached to by game designers and artists.

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

In any case, I was under the impression that we were supposed to stay away from religion and politics on these threads; so it would seem counterintuitive to create such an overtly political storyline.

Outside of this, I'm loving the DLC. Beautiful. Excellent voice acting, gorgeous settings, a new skill line... This is where game designers and artists shine (that is, the field in which they are in fact a professional).

DenMoria

I don't think it's political. It's just the Altmer being the Altmer. I mean, honestly, I'm born and bred and that's simply the way we are. The Queen is a fool.

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

So I'm about 15 minutes into the questline, and I'm already getting bored with the preachy vibe about immigration and world politics... A bunch of grumpy, clearly out of touch, elitist, entitled, Altmer are upset that they are letting the other races into Summerset.

I get it. Racism bad. Diversity good. Thanks for the morality lesson.

For future reference, I would prefer not to be preached to by game designers and artists.

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

In any case, I was under the impression that we were supposed to stay away from religion and politics on these threads; so it would seem counterintuitive to create such an overtly political storyline.

Outside of this, I'm loving the DLC. Beautiful. Excellent voice acting, gorgeous settings, a new skill line... This is where game designers and artists shine (that is, the field in which they are in fact a professional).

Lazarus_Rising

You know this was lore since the start of Elder Scrolls and have nothing to do with the current political Situation.

Altmer tend to hate all other races including other elf-races. They hate that their "perfect" "beautiful" land is corrupted by strangers. It can be seen as they would include these racism topics but as a long term elder scrolls lore fan i must say they are exactly as they are described. I would even say they are far to friendly.

Kiralyn2000

How is this new to you? It's like every high elf plotline in the history of fantasy.

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

Yes.

This was already a theme in the earlier Altmer zones, which were made years ago. And in earlier Elder Scrolls.

RaddlemanNumber7

Everything is political, if you want it to be.

Robo_Hobo

It's just coincidence, the Altmer have always been known to be this way, so we knew there would be these topics in the quests when we would finally visit it, since back when the first Pocket Guide to the Empire came out in 1998 and all the information it had about the various races and cultures.

But don't worry, the questline digs deeper than just Altmer isolationists pretty quickly after the first few quests in the storyline. It's still a lighter element at certain parts of the rest of the main quest line, but never the focus of the storyline from there on.

VaranisArano

I mean, the storyline opens up the homeland of the high elves who are pretty famously snooty, xenophobic, and share an awful lot of cultural backgrounds with the Dunmer. I'm not sure what you were expecting, if the Veiled Heritance on relatively open Auridon was any hint.

To me, Summerset tries to invoke a lot of aspects from TES III Morrowind with throwing you into a rather alien, unwelcoming, and xenophobic culture that doesn't really appreciate having their sanctuary filled with outlanders expecting the natives to change how things have always been done. I dont think Summerset reaches the depth of TES 3-it really can't, being a single zone in an MMO. But I think it does a much better job than the Morrowind Chapter does of evoking that feeling you get integrating into a foreign TES culture.

Which is to say that the immigration and racism messaging might be a little too on the nose for,you, and that's fine. But I see this as ground the TES series has covered before in both Morrowind and Skyrim, so I'm not surprised to see it crop up again as we see the homeland of the Altmer, the Veiled Heritance, and eventually the future Thalmor of Skyrim's era.

AVaelham

The Altmer always had a rather xenophobic view on other races, you can see it in the other Elder Scrolls games as well, even though they're part of the Septim Empire or doing their own thing with the Third Aldmeri Dominion. I don't think they were very happy with other races populating their lands in the Third Era either.

This has nothing to do with our current political situation in the real world.

The opening borders thing was just used as a plot device for us to be able to access Summerset and not be thrown into the dungeon for entering illegally

Ostacia

Politics is inescapable - it's in everything you do, your philosophy of life, how you treat people. You can find it everywhere if you look for it (and even when you don't). Don't sweat it too much *smile*

VaranisArano

Remember too that Queen Ayrenn treating the Khajiit and Bosmer like equals is a radical notion that provokes multiple assassination attempts from her Altmer subjects.

And even then, no one turns a hair when she's like "I'd rather trust the ruby throne to an Altmer infant than a human."

DeadlyRecluse

I don't find "racism bad" to be a particularly charged political statement.

DenMoria

Just those two words? Weird. While it may be a fact of life for we Altmer, it is still not a reality that we wish to admit to. We would rather consider that we are simply better. Which we are, of course. And more attractive, taller, more talented, more intelligent and better dressed.

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

I don't find "racism bad" to be a particularly charged political statement.

JamuThatsWho

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

So I'm about 15 minutes into the questline, and I'm already getting bored with the preachy vibe about immigration and world politics... A bunch of grumpy, clearly out of touch, elitist, entitled, Altmer are upset that they are letting the other races into Summerset.

I get it. Racism bad. Diversity good. Thanks for the morality lesson.

For future reference, I would prefer not to be preached to by game designers and artists.

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

In any case, I was under the impression that we were supposed to stay away from religion and politics on these threads; so it would seem counterintuitive to create such an overtly political storyline.

Outside of this, I'm loving the DLC. Beautiful. Excellent voice acting, gorgeous settings, a new skill line... This is where game designers and artists shine (that is, the field in which they are in fact a professional).

You must be new to Elder Scrolls.

Enrif

I would rather say it's bad timing to put up Summerset in the Spotlight at this time in world politics.

Maybe they should have gone with Elsweyr.

Drug Junkies and Thieving. this never will steer any world politics

NickStern

You most definitely are READING to much into it or are blinded by your own view of things.

This is the lore of Elder Scrolls has been for a very long time.
An expansion like this takes years of planning and design in no way could they have created it to mirror RL politics in the last year.

Acrolas

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
- George Santayana

blacksghost

Life imitates art.

Kagukan

I follow politics very closely and didn't feel like the story had any in my face real life political bias.

Tholian1

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

So I'm about 15 minutes into the questline, and I'm already getting bored with the preachy vibe about immigration and world politics... A bunch of grumpy, clearly out of touch, elitist, entitled, Altmer are upset that they are letting the other races into Summerset.

I get it. Racism bad. Diversity good. Thanks for the morality lesson.

For future reference, I would prefer not to be preached to by game designers and artists.

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

In any case, I was under the impression that we were supposed to stay away from religion and politics on these threads; so it would seem counterintuitive to create such an overtly political storyline.

Outside of this, I'm loving the DLC. Beautiful. Excellent voice acting, gorgeous settings, a new skill line... This is where game designers and artists shine (that is, the field in which they are in fact a professional).

What’s wrong with that? If you agree with the message, then what is the problem? If you disagree with the message, will it change your mind? If not, then what is the problem?

Art is filled with morality lessons. Agree or disagree with the artist and move along.

DenMoria

Either that or so blinded by our glory that he is unable to process his thoughts appropriately. We tend to do that to the lesser races.

JamuThatsWho wrote: »

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

So I'm about 15 minutes into the questline, and I'm already getting bored with the preachy vibe about immigration and world politics... A bunch of grumpy, clearly out of touch, elitist, entitled, Altmer are upset that they are letting the other races into Summerset.

I get it. Racism bad. Diversity good. Thanks for the morality lesson.

For future reference, I would prefer not to be preached to by game designers and artists.

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

In any case, I was under the impression that we were supposed to stay away from religion and politics on these threads; so it would seem counterintuitive to create such an overtly political storyline.

Outside of this, I'm loving the DLC. Beautiful. Excellent voice acting, gorgeous settings, a new skill line... This is where game designers and artists shine (that is, the field in which they are in fact a professional).

You must be new to Elder Scrolls.

isailandshootub17_ESO

What an interesting series of responses.

I'm aware of some of the High Elf lore, that they prefer themselves to the other races. I realize that if you wanted to create a story in which you could create a morality play about immigration and racism, you'd have to use the Altmer. I'm just thinking that they might have used a slightly different storyline other than immigration, since that is the major political issue about which most of the world is quite split.

One responder made a good point that it is illegal for non-high elves to enter Summerset, and so in order to explore the island, there needed to be some means of entering it legaly, which would likely create some sort of turmoil as we see in the questline. I agree with this and thought it was a good point. However, they might certainly have done so without so many direct and overt political references. I mean, some of the dialogue seems like it came directly from mainstream news.

So in case you didn't catch it, I realize the Altmer are historically elitist, its well established in the lore. But what is not therefore apparent is that we much recapitulate the scenarios of certain immigration issues which are quite at the forefront of many things in Europe and in America in the past few years. Furthermore, the opinion is decidedly one-sided. I'd prefer such a political issue not to find its way into my video games. But if they do, I'd at least like something more than caricatures (or at least not daedra-worshiping murderers) to be used as the foil for the protagonist.

One responder mentioned the dictum "Life imitates art." I agree. That's why I want to be cognizant of the philosophy of the artists which I am enfranchising.

Thanks for the kind and fair responses.

zaria

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

How is this new to you? It's like every high elf plotline in the history of fantasy.

Perhaps I am reading too much into this. Is it just coincidence that the main storyline of this DLC has to do with a major hot topic in world politics?

Yes.

This was already a theme in the earlier Altmer zones, which were made years ago. And in earlier Elder Scrolls.

This, now the scary part: the Altmer's are the good elves, yes they are racists and bigots but they neither enslave or eat others races. Morrowind Island is not part of the EP because of enslavement of Argonians who was critical for holding the EP southern front, if not friendly the AD would welcome them with open arms and roll EP up.
Yes this was still an major operation but failed because of Altmer arrogance and racism.
For Bosmer this one want to remind silent in memory of all they have eaten.
Note that 700 year later Bosmer cannibalism is a joke like viking raids is today, this probably involved and high number of battalion level discussion clubs using warhammers as their main argument over centuries.
you could still buy any race at an well stocked slave marked in Morrowind, 700 years latrer

DenMoria

You do realize that this entire story was written long, long before all of this became headline news, yes?

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

What an interesting series of responses.

I'm aware of some of the High Elf lore, that they prefer themselves to the other races. I realize that if you wanted to create a story in which you could create a morality play about immigration and racism, you'd have to use the Altmer. I'm just thinking that they might have used a slightly different storyline other than immigration, since that is the major political issue about which most of the world is quite split.

One responder made a good point that it is illegal for non-high elves to enter Summerset, and so in order to explore the island, there needed to be some means of entering it legaly, which would likely create some sort of turmoil as we see in the questline. I agree with this and thought it was a good point. However, they might certainly have done so without so many direct and overt political references. I mean, some of the dialogue seems like it came directly from mainstream news.

So in case you didn't catch it, I realize the Altmer are historically elitist, its well established in the lore. But what is not therefore apparent is that we much recapitulate the scenarios of certain immigration issues which are quite at the forefront of many things in Europe and in America in the past few years. Furthermore, the opinion is decidedly one-sided. I'd prefer such a political issue not to find its way into my video games. But if they do, I'd at least like something more than caricatures (or at least not daedra-worshiping murderers) to be used as the foil for the protagonist.

One responder mentioned the dictum "Life imitates art." I agree. That's why I want to be cognizant of the philosophy of the artists which I am enfranchising.

Thanks for the kind and fair responses.

Merlin13KAGL

What? You think a media company is slipping in their view analogous to a real world current event scenario?

That would be a first.

Iccotak

"SKYRIM IS FOR THE NORDS!!" oh wait different game...

AlnilamE

Enrif wrote: »

I would rather say it's bad timing to put up Summerset in the Spotlight at this time in world politics.

Maybe they should have gone with Elsweyr.

Drug Junkies and Thieving. this never will steer any world politics

Please stop racially profiling the Khajiit. :-P

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

What an interesting series of responses.

I'm aware of some of the High Elf lore, that they prefer themselves to the other races. I realize that if you wanted to create a story in which you could create a morality play about immigration and racism, you'd have to use the Altmer. I'm just thinking that they might have used a slightly different storyline other than immigration, since that is the major political issue about which most of the world is quite split.

One responder made a good point that it is illegal for non-high elves to enter Summerset, and so in order to explore the island, there needed to be some means of entering it legaly, which would likely create some sort of turmoil as we see in the questline. I agree with this and thought it was a good point. However, they might certainly have done so without so many direct and overt political references. I mean, some of the dialogue seems like it came directly from mainstream news.

So in case you didn't catch it, I realize the Altmer are historically elitist, its well established in the lore. But what is not therefore apparent is that we much recapitulate the scenarios of certain immigration issues which are quite at the forefront of many things in Europe and in America in the past few years. Furthermore, the opinion is decidedly one-sided. I'd prefer such a political issue not to find its way into my video games. But if they do, I'd at least like something more than caricatures (or at least not daedra-worshiping murderers) to be used as the foil for the protagonist.

One responder mentioned the dictum "Life imitates art." I agree. That's why I want to be cognizant of the philosophy of the artists which I am enfranchising.

Thanks for the kind and fair responses.

I think the timeline of developing such an expansion in a game of this size precludes any sort of intentional characterization of real life events. Remember that Summerset was *announced* on March 21, 2018. At that point, all these quests and plot had already been written and even voiced several months prior. They had no way of knowing this would sadly be a hot political topic within a month of release.

As you said yourself, there was no way the Atlmer were just going to let the other races just wander into Summerset without the Queen's decree. And the Altmer being the snooty high elves they are, they were not going to take this lying down either way. :-P

DenMoria

We're not "snooty". We're just better than the rest of you.
https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.E26fsZyVLz73KeA12MfIDQHaM2&pid=15.1&P=0&w=300&h=300

AlnilamE wrote: »

Enrif wrote: »

I would rather say it's bad timing to put up Summerset in the Spotlight at this time in world politics.

Maybe they should have gone with Elsweyr.

Drug Junkies and Thieving. this never will steer any world politics

Please stop racially profiling the Khajiit. :-P

isailandshootub17_ESO wrote: »

What an interesting series of responses.

I'm aware of some of the High Elf lore, that they prefer themselves to the other races. I realize that if you wanted to create a story in which you could create a morality play about immigration and racism, you'd have to use the Altmer. I'm just thinking that they might have used a slightly different storyline other than immigration, since that is the major political issue about which most of the world is quite split.

One responder made a good point that it is illegal for non-high elves to enter Summerset, and so in order to explore the island, there needed to be some means of entering it legaly, which would likely create some sort of turmoil as we see in the questline. I agree with this and thought it was a good point. However, they might certainly have done so without so many direct and overt political references. I mean, some of the dialogue seems like it came directly from mainstream news.

So in case you didn't catch it, I realize the Altmer are historically elitist, its well established in the lore. But what is not therefore apparent is that we much recapitulate the scenarios of certain immigration issues which are quite at the forefront of many things in Europe and in America in the past few years. Furthermore, the opinion is decidedly one-sided. I'd prefer such a political issue not to find its way into my video games. But if they do, I'd at least like something more than caricatures (or at least not daedra-worshiping murderers) to be used as the foil for the protagonist.

One responder mentioned the dictum "Life imitates art." I agree. That's why I want to be cognizant of the philosophy of the artists which I am enfranchising.

Thanks for the kind and fair responses.

I think the timeline of developing such an expansion in a game of this size precludes any sort of intentional characterization of real life events. Remember that Summerset was *announced* on March 21, 2018. At that point, all these quests and plot had already been written and even voiced several months prior. They had no way of knowing this would sadly be a hot political topic within a month of release.

As you said yourself, there was no way the Atlmer were just going to let the other races just wander into Summerset without the Queen's decree. And the Altmer being the snooty high elves they are, they were not going to take this lying down either way. :-P

Velvelya

Honestly, i'm like very political, and I really wasn't bothered by it. Did I notice it? sure but it wasn't as heavy handed as it seems OP picked up on.

DenMoria

I'm not political in the least so I wasn't even payng attention.

Velvelya wrote: »

Honestly, i'm like very political, and I really wasn't bothered by it. Did I notice it? sure but it wasn't as heavy handed as it seems OP picked up on.

EldritchPenguin

Art, including (but not limited to) video games, always has been and always will be political.

Xarico

zaria wrote: »

Note that 700 year later Bosmer cannibalism is a joke

Fortunately, not at all. It is alive and well, though of course it wouldn't be openly discussed or practiced in countries other than Valenwood.