Wizard Riposte or not

teladoy

I'm preparing a build for Battlegrounds for my Warden Frost Tank and i was thinking to use the Wizard Riposte set, till i realize that the Minor Main status can also by applied with abilities of the Ice Staff.

The thing is that Elemental Force II gives me a 100% chance to apply chilled to enemies and chilled applies Minor Maim (Decrease damage done by 15%).

A thing to consider is that Elemental Force II gives me a 100% chance to apply chilled over the next values:

•Weapon enchants 20%
•Standard ability 10%
•Area of effect abilities 5%
•Damage over time abilities 3%
•Area of effect damage over time abilities 1%

Now i have to decide if it makes sense to use this set or something else, if i'm gonna use an Ice Staff in both bars and skills like lemental Blockade, skills of Winter embrace with the passive Glacial presence II and etc.

teladoy

No help at all?

Lexxypwns

You also get 200% increased chance to apply chilled from your winters embrace skills. The issue is, this RNG is based on each target in your aoes.

Best bet is to do a few dummy parses using only aoe frost skillsand check your maim uptime. Then extrapolate that to figure out how reliable that’s going to be to proc.

From there you then compare the theoretical uptimes of each source of main then compare the added uptime on maim from Wizards versus wearing a different defensive armor set.

Remember to account for wizards applying to people who you can’t hit with your aoes to proc, is ranged enemies.

Leandor

teladoy wrote: »

The thing is that Elemental Force II gives me a 100% chance to apply chilled to enemies and chilled applies Minor Maim (Decrease damage done by 15%)

Re-read the tooltip. it increases "by 100%", which in ESO lingo means that the original chance to apply is doubled.

De facto, you will need a charged frost staff to reliably apply minor maim with blockade. Frost Warden may be different in that class skills apply it and you have the passive that triples the chance to proc it.

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has. It's your choice if you prefer another 5-piece bonus over having a reliable and high uptime maim.

I do agree though that frost warden is probably the best class to not use Riposte.

Beardimus

I can't help with your specifics, but all ill add is personally i like riposte for BG / noCP.

Oh and what Lexxy says up there is bang on for approach, he knows his stuff

brandonv516

If you run a Charged Ice Staff with Wall of Elements and Destructive Reach, my opinion is that you don't need Riposte. I love Riposte on non-ice Staff builds though.

I know Templar and Warden are apples and oranges, but I use this staff type on my Templar - it procs a lot and I feel it's noticeable. It allows me to run Transmutation instead.

The double snare doesn't hurt much either!

teladoy

Leandor wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

The thing is that Elemental Force II gives me a 100% chance to apply chilled to enemies and chilled applies Minor Maim (Decrease damage done by 15%)

Re-read the tooltip. it increases "by 100%", which in ESO lingo means that the original chance to apply is doubled.

De facto, you will need a charged frost staff to reliably apply minor maim with blockade. Frost Warden may be different in that class skills apply it and you have the passive that triples the chance to proc it.

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has. It's your choice if you prefer another 5-piece bonus over having a reliable and high uptime maim.

I do agree though that frost warden is probably the best class to not use Riposte.

Why do I need it charged? My plan is to use poisons and let the chilled status get triggered using the skills that do frost damage. Is that not okay?

exeeter702

teladoy wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

The thing is that Elemental Force II gives me a 100% chance to apply chilled to enemies and chilled applies Minor Maim (Decrease damage done by 15%)

Re-read the tooltip. it increases "by 100%", which in ESO lingo means that the original chance to apply is doubled.

De facto, you will need a charged frost staff to reliably apply minor maim with blockade. Frost Warden may be different in that class skills apply it and you have the passive that triples the chance to proc it.

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has. It's your choice if you prefer another 5-piece bonus over having a reliable and high uptime maim.

I do agree though that frost warden is probably the best class to not use Riposte.

Why do I need it charged? My plan is to use poisons and let the chilled status get triggered using the skills that do frost damage. Is that not okay?

Because in order to compete with the minor maim uptime wizards maintains, you will need charged staff to go along with frost skills.

SugaComa

Wizards riposte would be a better option as it applies to those attacking you not you attacking them ... If your attacking them chances are they're on the defence so not doing you much damage as it is ... But other players are... Apply minor main to these could be a life saver

teladoy

exeeter702 wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

The thing is that Elemental Force II gives me a 100% chance to apply chilled to enemies and chilled applies Minor Maim (Decrease damage done by 15%)

Re-read the tooltip. it increases "by 100%", which in ESO lingo means that the original chance to apply is doubled.

De facto, you will need a charged frost staff to reliably apply minor maim with blockade. Frost Warden may be different in that class skills apply it and you have the passive that triples the chance to proc it.

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has. It's your choice if you prefer another 5-piece bonus over having a reliable and high uptime maim.

I do agree though that frost warden is probably the best class to not use Riposte.

Why do I need it charged? My plan is to use poisons and let the chilled status get triggered using the skills that do frost damage. Is that not okay?

Because in order to compete with the minor maim uptime wizards maintains, you will need charged staff to go along with frost skills.

Seems that better go with both, wizards set and warden skills.

Is there any other set that debuff enemies like wizard or duroks?

Leandor

@teladoy charged applies to skills. It is a trait. You can use it together with poisons

teladoy

Leandor wrote: »

@teladoy charged applies to skills. It is a trait. You can use it together with poisons

All skills that apply some status effects or only to weapon skill lines?

Leandor

teladoy wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

@teladoy charged applies to skills. It is a trait. You can use it together with poisons

All skills that apply some status effects or only to weapon skill lines?

Weapon skill line. But your warden skills are buffed by the warden passive anyways, so no need.

Lexxypwns

You guys are failing to compare Wizard’s to another defensive set in this scenario. Given that he’ll have a reasonable uptime on maim it will decrease the value offered by Wizards and therefore likely make Trans or Impreg better defensive set choices.

Again, this has to be tested for his specific build and playstyl

Peekachu99

Pointless on a Warden. Slot arctic winds and you can heal, dps AND maim.

VexingArcanist

Leandor wrote: »

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has.

When, if and only if you take a critical. I have been using Riposte and it does not gain my favor.

teladoy

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Pointless on a Warden. Slot arctic winds and you can heal, dps AND maim.

VexingArcanist wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has.

When, if and only if you take a critical. I have been using Riposte and it does not gain my favor.

Then guys what do you suggest me???? which set can i use instead or Wizard Riposte?

Lexxypwns

teladoy wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Pointless on a Warden. Slot arctic winds and you can heal, dps AND maim.

VexingArcanist wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has.

When, if and only if you take a critical. I have been using Riposte and it does not gain my favor.

Then guys what do you suggest me???? which set can i use instead or Wizard Riposte?

Transmutation

teladoy

Lexxypwns wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Pointless on a Warden. Slot arctic winds and you can heal, dps AND maim.

VexingArcanist wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has.

When, if and only if you take a critical. I have been using Riposte and it does not gain my favor.

Then guys what do you suggest me???? which set can i use instead or Wizard Riposte?

Transmutation

I'm a tank... my goal is to debuff, snare and stun enemies.

HackTheMinotaur

Skip wizards and do Dragon instead for reduced ultimate cost on Permafrost. Great PVP tank skill.

Once the other team notices you are wearing wizards they will just ignore you and stop attacking. Use heroic slash to apply maim plus minor heroism.

Leandor

teladoy wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Pointless on a Warden. Slot arctic winds and you can heal, dps AND maim.

VexingArcanist wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has.

When, if and only if you take a critical. I have been using Riposte and it does not gain my favor.

Then guys what do you suggest me???? which set can i use instead or Wizard Riposte?

Transmutation

I'm a tank... my goal is to debuff, snare and stun enemies.

Then go for Durok. Use frost skills for maim. Save your magicka for ult generation. Durok will defile them, you maim them, your team kills them.

teladoy

Leandor wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Pointless on a Warden. Slot arctic winds and you can heal, dps AND maim.

VexingArcanist wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Neither will ever have a 100% chance. Riposte has.

When, if and only if you take a critical. I have been using Riposte and it does not gain my favor.

Then guys what do you suggest me???? which set can i use instead or Wizard Riposte?

Transmutation

I'm a tank... my goal is to debuff, snare and stun enemies.

Then go for Durok. Use frost skills for maim. Save your magicka for ult generation. Durok will defile them, you maim them, your team kills them.

I'm using Durok's already i need another option... im watching sets all the day xD

HowlKimchi

Lexxypwns wrote: »

You guys are failing to compare Wizard’s to another defensive set in this scenario. Given that he’ll have a reasonable uptime on maim it will decrease the value offered by Wizards and therefore likely make Trans or Impreg better defensive set choices.

Again, this has to be tested for his specific build and playstyl

Yes that's exactly what I wanted to say as well.

If you're tanky enough and have a reasonable uptime, I would suggest going for a set that works well with your kit. You might also want to slot in an offensive set, so you're tanky, and still give enough pressure.

Check out winterborn, it's a damage set that also has it's own debuff. Also fits the theme of being an ice mage/tank.

HowlKimchi

Or you could also pump up your health since there are warden ice skills that scale off of max health. It could deal pretty decent damage with a high enough healthpool.

teladoy

HaruyukiHana wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

You guys are failing to compare Wizard’s to another defensive set in this scenario. Given that he’ll have a reasonable uptime on maim it will decrease the value offered by Wizards and therefore likely make Trans or Impreg better defensive set choices.

Again, this has to be tested for his specific build and playstyl

Yes that's exactly what I wanted to say as well.

If you're tanky enough and have a reasonable uptime, I would suggest going for a set that works well with your kit. You might also want to slot in an offensive set, so you're tanky, and still give enough pressure.

Check out winterborn, it's a damage set that also has it's own debuff. Also fits the theme of being an ice mage/tank.

I was watching this set but seems more suitable for a dps build since the 1-4 stats are more for damage.

But considering your opinion, I did yesterday some bgs and I think I need a touch more of tankiness and I believe I should sacrifice my idea of use only debuff sets and go duroks with pariahs.

I have to test it...