The lack of Culanda Lacquer will negatively impact Summerset housing

Linaleah

right now, I'm getting culanda laquer about every third bag. you need 2 per furnishing. nuts. I was so happy that we got all these walls and floors and staircases. but with rarety of the laquers.. I'm not sure if I'll be able to build that custom house AND furnish it

Juju_beans

I just decided to use Redguard instead. Maybe down the line I'll make an Alinor piece or two.

anadandy

Carbonised wrote: »

Just did the 3 Summerset dailies, and only got 1 Culanda drop. One of the many, many faults in the shoddy implementation of this.
.

Same. The drop rate for patterns is decent but you can't make anything.

alenae1b14_ESO

The question is does this make it more economical in the long run to purchase the Alinor Crest Townhouse furnished?

Since each recipe apparently requires 2 Culanda lacquer. It will take months to craft the furnishings.

Jaraal

Linaleah wrote: »

right now, I'm getting culanda laquer about every third bag. you need 2 per furnishing. nuts. I was so happy that we got all these walls and floors and staircases. but with rarety of the laquers.. I'm not sure if I'll be able to build that custom house AND furnish it

Yeah, everybody was excited about the favorable drop rate on the new plans, but now they mostly go unused because of the poorly thought out style mat implementation. And the prices of the lacquers keep going up and up. Looks like a ploy to push the desperate housing enthusiasts to buy the mimic stones in the crown store.

Super disappointed with the increased focus on the cash shop with Summerset. From the gaudy, sleazy, endless ads between characters to the unprecedented deliberate bottleneck on style mats now, trying to get Elder Scrolls fans to part with their dollars like never before. A shame the franchise has been sold out to such an extent for marketing purposes.

TheRealPotoroo

One of the things that gets me is that this rare item is white and not purple. I've already mistakenly used it once.

XDark_One13 wrote: »

There are 3 summerset dailies?
I’ve done the world boss quest and the delve quest. What ane where is the third quest?

Battlereeve Tanerline. She gives a quest when you enter Alinor and her daily is to destroy 3 geysers.

Wreuntzylla

Jaraal wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

right now, I'm getting culanda laquer about every third bag. you need 2 per furnishing. nuts. I was so happy that we got all these walls and floors and staircases. but with rarety of the laquers.. I'm not sure if I'll be able to build that custom house AND furnish it

Yeah, everybody was excited about the favorable drop rate on the new plans, but now they mostly go unused because of the poorly thought out style mat implementation. And the prices of the lacquers keep going up and up. Looks like a ploy to push the desperate housing enthusiasts to buy the mimic stones in the crown store.

Super disappointed with the increased focus on the cash shop with Summerset. From the gaudy, sleazy, endless ads between characters to the unprecedented deliberate bottleneck on style mats now, trying to get Elder Scrolls fans to part with their dollars like never before. A shame the franchise has been sold out to such an extent for marketing purposes.

There are tons of threads in these forums about how making achievement related items rare, when there are so many achievements nowadays, is a bad idea.

As between scarce item plans that count towards an achievement and a scarce resource used to make the items, I think ZoS chose the right path this time.

Linaleah

Jaraal wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

right now, I'm getting culanda laquer about every third bag. you need 2 per furnishing. nuts. I was so happy that we got all these walls and floors and staircases. but with rarety of the laquers.. I'm not sure if I'll be able to build that custom house AND furnish it

Yeah, everybody was excited about the favorable drop rate on the new plans, but now they mostly go unused because of the poorly thought out style mat implementation. And the prices of the lacquers keep going up and up. Looks like a ploy to push the desperate housing enthusiasts to buy the mimic stones in the crown store.

Super disappointed with the increased focus on the cash shop with Summerset. From the gaudy, sleazy, endless ads between characters to the unprecedented deliberate bottleneck on style mats now, trying to get Elder Scrolls fans to part with their dollars like never before. A shame the franchise has been sold out to such an extent for marketing purposes.

the thing is though - you cannot use mimic stones to craft furniture - only gear, so rather it's to push people to just buy furnishings outright on crown store.

or something. i don't know.

Jaraal

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

There are tons of threads in these forums about how making achievement related items rare, when there are so many achievements nowadays, is a bad idea.

As between scarce item plans that count towards an achievement and a scarce resource used to make the items, I think ZoS chose the right path this time.

The problem is not with achievement furnishings. Every Alinor green, blue, and purple furnishing plan requires two Culanda lacquers. So, if you find a simple cup plan and want to make a cup, you'll be doing dailies for just a CHANCE at getting one of these mats, or you can spend 3k or more each.... if you find one for sale. That's just for one item. Want to fill a 700 slot house with Alinor furnishings? Get ready to spend months or years grinding quests or spending millions in guild traders.

Linaleah wrote: »

the thing is though - you cannot use mimic stones to craft furniture - only gear, so rather it's to push people to just buy furnishings outright on crown store.

or something. i don't know.

Correct, but you can use crown mimic stones to craft basic Sapiarch gear to decon.... for a CHANCE to extract a Culanda lacquer. Thus the cash to make furnishings angle.

Geekgirl

Jaraal wrote: »

Correct, but you can use crown mimic stones to craft basic Sapiarch gear to decon.... for a CHANCE to extract a Culanda lacquer. Thus the cash to make furnishings angle.

This bothers me.

It is not an acceptable workaround for players to purchase with money the potential to get a certain material for deconstruction. This is different than the gamble crates, in my eyes, as you aren’t needing what’s in the crate, you’re buying it for the chance at something you might not have but don’t “need”.

You need the mat to make the furnishings.

You buy a gem, make a style and then HOPE to get what you NEED to make something else?

Yeah, no.

Consider the precedent for the future if we use this option vs. continuing to request that the material needed is available in a slightly more consistent way.

Androconium

Carbonised wrote: »

First of all, let me start up on a positive note, the droprate for Summerset furnishing plans is actually quite decent, already there are plenty of plans for sale, including lots of purples. People still try and take up to 1M for these at sellers, but I imagine that price will soon drop a lot, when more and more plans are put up for sale and no one buys them for that price. That was a nice decision, ZOS, instead of leaving them as rare unicorns like Vvardenfell plans at release.

Now for the main point of this post, the lack of the style mat, Culanda Lacquer, will negatively impact the Summerset housing and funiture market in the forseeable future. A point I already brought up on the PTS, but which didn't get that much attention, and none from the devs.
Vvardenfell plans required Obsidian as style mat, Alinor plans require 2 of these Culandas for each and every item. Why is this a bad idea? The source of Culanda is extremely restricted, only dropping from the 3 daily quests in Alinor and from no other place whatsoever. Even now when these dailies are heavily farmed, the Culanda price on PC-EU is already around 2k per item, and even increasing currently. There was a drop in price from release until today, but now they are again increasing somewhat. Why? Because people are finally catching up on the fact that these items are very limited, plus we are finally beginning to know a number of the new furnishing plans, and want to craft the items for ourselves or to sell.

Vvardenfell furnishings were kept in dark elf style mat, Obsidian, which also served as a great gold sink. Most furniture crafters bought Obsidian by the thousands at NPCs in order to craft, which was gold out of the economy. It also meant you could always craft these items, when you had the recipe and the other mats. Obsidian wasn't the bottleneck.
Clockwork City was different, now it was 1 style mat, Tempered Brass, per item. Tempered Brass dropped from 2 dailies, plus a lot of gear you found was in the Apostle style, which also dropped Brass. The recent anniversary event also poured a lot of Brass into the megaservers. Even with all these channels for Brass, the price was well over 500 per item before the anniversary event, and around 300 now. Brass is reasonably available, while still worth something.

What about Summerset/Alinor? It's now 2 Culandas per item, and no sets drop in this motif whatsoever, and you cannot get Culandas anywhere else than by doing the dailies. Right now there's a frenzy in dailies as people try and collect the Sapiarch motifs, what happens when that becomes old, the flow of Culanda into the playerbase will be little more than a trickle, while every recipe will require double the amount of style mats than CWC did. Prices of 5k per mat wouldn't be unthinkable. That's 10k just to craft a tiny cup, not even mentioning the cost of the other mats.
Who is going to pay 10k plus fee for a cup? No one. The furniture market for these items will be extremely limited, and the items will be heavily overpriced, so only the very rich players will buy them. This is bad for furniture sellers, it is also bad for the casual players who want to decorate their houses, but don't have the crafting skill or plans for it, and who now have to pay tens of thousands for every cup, chair or plate. It is even bad for the housing people who don't intend to sell furniture. With a 700 item limit of a large house, and every item costing 2 Culandas, that's 1400 Culandas just to decorate 1 house, assuming you want to keep it in that racial style. With a few thousand gold per Culanda, that's easily a handful of million gold - only for the style mats! Few people have that kind of money to throw away. Or you could do 1400 dailies. I don't know which is worse.

The solution is rather simple. The recipes should have been changed from Culanda to Adamantite, like Vvardenfell plans require Obsidian. The use of Culanda is inappropriate even from a lore perspective. Culanda is for Sapiarch motif, a specific faction of scholars on Summerset. Why would all the Altmer recipes call for Sapiarch related items? What do Sapiarchs have to do with household cups and plates? If ZOS insists on keeping the Culanda, they should at least be decreased to 1 per item, like the CWC recipes.
However, ZOS rarely goes back and changes mat requirements in plans, even when they are way out of balance or reason.
So what could they do instead? Make the Gryphon zone set in Summerset drop in Sapiarch motif, so you can decon it for a chance for Culanda. Right now, the 3 zone sets in Summerset drop in Ebonshadow, Psijic and Ancient Elf motif. Why on earth did you make the final set Ancient Elf instead of Sapiarch? Again look at Vvardenfell, or even CWC. Vvardenfell has 3 overland sets that drop in the 3 House motifs, Hlaalu, Telvanni and Redoran. CWC has 3 sets, 1 in Ebonshadow and 2 in Apostle, which you can decon for Brass. The Vanus set from Summerset is in Psijic which you can decon for mat, but it makes no sense from any perspective to have the Gryphon set in Ancient Elf. Following the logic that Sapiarch style mats are needed for cups and pots, this set should drop in Sapiarch motif as well, as this apparently is ZOS' "default" Alinor/Altmer mat. Ancient Elf is also another word of Ayleid, which is why the Palladium is used in Ayleid furniture crafting, it has nothing to do with Summerset or Alinor. At least making the Gryphon set drop in Sapiarch instead of Ancient Elf would release a few more Culanda into the economy.
Ideally, Culanda mat parts would also be found on the overland map, from node harvesting and killing mobs. Make it 1/10th of a mat, just like you can find Viridian Dust all over Vvardenfell, and combine 10 of them into a Volcanic Viridian style mat. This would again at least make people able to farm a bit of these mats without sourcing the entire mat behind daily quests, which currently aren't enough to feed the demand, even when the dailies are farmed like crazy, and which will be only a trickle of mats later on, when farming slows down and people already have the Sapiarch motif.

Long post, but I wanted to give a detailed explanation about this, so as to not get dismissed as "just yet another whine post". This isn't mere complaining, I'm trying to put down some suggestions as to how to make Summerset furniture crafting more viable and sustainable, both for the personal houseowner, as well as the furniture seller, and by extension, the playerbase at large.
I foresaw this on the PTS, and already, a week into the update, with dailies being farmed heavily, we see a large demand for Culandas, driving up the prices which are already increasing. Anyone who does trade or knows the server economy will know that this trend will only increase as more and more people get to know the recipes and want to craft or sell. The problem is only going to increase, unless more sources of Culandas are made available, or the recipes possibly changed.

Time is money.

The more time you spend doing this; the more money Mr Wonder Woman makes.

Coatmagic

alenae1b14_ESO wrote: »

The question is does this make it more economical in the long run to purchase the Alinor Crest Townhouse furnished?

Since each recipe apparently requires 2 Culanda lacquer. It will take months to craft the furnishings.

^^ right there is WHY xD bwhahahah!

Carbonised

In between the endless grind for Culandas, the endless grind for furnishing recipes I still lack (a handful Dwemer, 3 Ayleid, many Clockwork), the endless grind for jewelrycrafting upgrade mats, and the impossible grind for Summerset foul achievement fish, my enthusiasm about this whole Chapter is quickly going down the drain.

Couldn't even manage much hype for the ESO showcase this E3, cause it's going to be exactly the same disappointments as the DLCs we've had for years now. A one-sided and heavy focus on RNG rewards and miniscule droprates, that either force you into the overpriced Crown Store or grind boring content like an unpaid extra job.

Meanwhile, we're supposed to bite on daily reward drops, twitch crates, level up rewards and what other cheap tricks that further dilutes the RPG flavour, which was very thin to begin with.

Perhaps it's time to get out before getting my feet stuck even further into the muck, I'm very tired of getting disappointed and let down every time new content is released in this game.

funnyridr

This just sounds more like a millennial complaining about not getting everything handed to them on a silver platter to me. Honestly, this is a company that needs to make money to keep people employed with an elder scrolls shell. I believe just about every game made in the industry does similar things to keep the doors open. They don't get paid if they don't make you play and possibly buy their crap. You either grind, or pay them. I, for one, am not opposed to putting work in for something I want in a leisure activity such as a video game.

Kiralyn2000

funnyridr wrote: »

This just sounds more like a millennial complaining about not getting everything handed to them on a silver platter to me.

Ah, this brings back memories of trashposts on the WoW forums.

"Um, the price of items in the raid shop is perhaps a bit high?"

"Oh, so you want them to mail you a complete set of raid gear when you log in, eh!?!?!"


Yeah, no.

MLGProPlayer

The price is already down to 3-6k on PC/NA. Should be under 1k in a few weeks.

manavortex

I absolutely agree on this.

SantieClaws

This one has another idea perhaps yes.

Require that the green recipes require no lacquer, the blue ones require one piece of lacquer and the purple ones two yes?

Does this not sound at least a little wiser than the present arrangement?

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Logicbomb00

Dunno why you are all complaining.

The lacquer isn't meant for you. It's meant for the niche group of people who use ESO as a fun housing project. This Lacquer grind was designed specifically for them so they'd have something to (maybe whinge about) and do for many DLC's to come. The quest for Culanda!!

If you're not in the game for housing just stay the hell away from Sommerset houses / furnitures. You're obviously not a High Elf and if you are then you're a pathetically poor one and should get off the darn isle.

TheNuminous1

lol I love how yall are complaining about 3k laquer when so far on console they are aversging 10-15k each!

Linaleah

TheNuminous1 wrote: »

lol I love how yall are complaining about 3k laquer when so far on console they are aversging 10-15k each!

we are not complaining about the price. we are complaining about the rarity that causes aforementioned price. also, bear in mind, PC had a head start, and its STILL pricey because its such an unreliable pain to farm.

the only people I can see defending this nonsense are people who are not into housing themselves, and just like to profit of its rarity. and to you I say... highly painful suggestion of "where to go and what to do with yourselves" redacted.

IwakuraLain42

Carbonised wrote: »

In between the endless grind for Culandas, the endless grind for furnishing recipes I still lack (a handful Dwemer, 3 Ayleid, many Clockwork), the endless grind for jewelrycrafting upgrade mats, and the impossible grind for Summerset foul achievement fish, my enthusiasm about this whole Chapter is quickly going down the drain.

Couldn't even manage much hype for the ESO showcase this E3, cause it's going to be exactly the same disappointments as the DLCs we've had for years now. A one-sided and heavy focus on RNG rewards and miniscule droprates, that either force you into the overpriced Crown Store or grind boring content like an unpaid extra job.

Meanwhile, we're supposed to bite on daily reward drops, twitch crates, level up rewards and what other cheap tricks that further dilutes the RPG flavour, which was very thin to begin with.

Perhaps it's time to get out before getting my feet stuck even further into the muck, I'm very tired of getting disappointed and let down every time new content is released in this game.

This perpetual grind which simply masks over the spareness of the content released every 3-6 months (motif grind, mat grind, blueprint grind) is the reason why I'm moving away from ESO. A zone and a few quests every 6 months, 2 dungeons every 6 months designed by a sadistic mastermind are not something that keeps me interested any more.
I loved housing when it was released a year ago but all the grinding madness introduced with Morrowind soured that for me.

The sad truth is that ZOS isn't able to release challenging and rewarding content for the whole playerbase anymore. It either for the well connected elite players or the absolute casual players.

AlienSlof

Alastrine wrote: »

I bought the townhouse furnished just for this reason.. I loved the style but knew I would never be able to craft the stuff. I've bought a few patterns for walls and stairs for other houses and I'll save the Culanda I get for those but I won't be making too many lights or chairs etc.

^ This. ^

I bought the house furnished and at the time wondered if I did the right thing. 2 weeks on and I'm really glad I did. It's a lovely house.

MLGProPlayer

Linaleah wrote: »

TheNuminous1 wrote: »

lol I love how yall are complaining about 3k laquer when so far on console they are aversging 10-15k each!

we are not complaining about the price. we are complaining about the rarity that causes aforementioned price. also, bear in mind, PC had a head start, and its STILL pricey because its such an unreliable pain to farm.

the only people I can see defending this nonsense are people who are not into housing themselves, and just like to profit of its rarity. and to you I say... highly painful suggestion of "where to go and what to do with yourselves" redacted.

3-6k per item is not a lot. Let's say you use 100 of them. That's 300-600k. Housing is an expensive hobby in this game. An extra couple hundred thousand gold isn't a big deal.

And the price will obviously continue to fall. It will be under 1k in a few weeks.

NoTimeToWait

Right now trading and housing is the only reason I stay in ESO.

I am not into PVP, and PVE is discouraging lately (lagfest, overall class balance dissatisfaction etc).
One can do quests only so long (luckily I haven't depleted that resource yet, but long questing sessions could be problematic).

I like the amount of housing and furnishing options, I don't like that most of them are inaccessible to the most part of the playerbase. Currently I have spent millions of gold chasing my housing projects and haven't even completed a single one!

It's not about grind, I can do grind all right.
It's about ability to achieve things and reach goals. I want to be able to reach my goal and set another one, which is lately seems more unlikely.

It was okay before, because at least I knew that at some point I will have necessary recipes, resources, area and instruments to get what I want.
But if this practice of restricting access to the ONLY resource necessary for crafting furniture continues, I am not sure that I will be able to continue.
I dislike the practice, and hope that this topic will prevent ZOS from implementing this mechanic in future.

SantieClaws

This may best be summarised as saying that when life in Tamriel, or any particular aspect of the life, becomes more of a chore than a joy then it is in danger of ceasing to be appealing.

We live to discover new things, to be rewarded proportionally for the tasks we complete, to relax by our fishponds, to relax by stabbing elves or stabbing giant chickens.

Life in Tamriel should not feel like a job on an assembly line no. Do this, get this, repeat, do this get this, repeat.

Building a chair or two should not be so difficult.

We are not asking for all the world at our feet with no effort - of course not. Just to be able to do the things we enjoy without doing so much of things that we cease to enjoy after doing them 20 times already.

If the lacquer dropped from kills, if it could be found in ore nodes, fished up, found in chests, obtained from deconstruction, even in wardrobes - that would be a little better than this doing the same thing over and over again.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

kind_hero

I fully agree with this post.

I found some Alinor designs which I am able to craft, like one divider, wall parts, potted plants, but I barely have any culanda.
I made some items for me, but for sale, it is quite hard to sell these. The culanda rarity makes me to ask a higher price, but none wants to pay 10-20k for a furnishing item, unless they really really want it.

I am quite disappointed of how unrewarding is the furnishings crafting in ESO. It is nice that you can do stuff for you, but when you want to sell it, it can sit there for ages, or the real profit is quite low. When the expansion was new I was selling high elf carpets and tapestries with 1.8-2k gold, which seemed reasonable to me, now the prices are almost the mats cost, so I don't even bother. So I almost stopped investing time and resources in furnishings, because it is better to farm the money and buy them crafted from the traders than buy a very expensive recipe which will repay itself in months.

Crafters need recipes for desired items that are locked by a combination of achievements, so they can make some money, after investing time and resources in crafting. Right now it is easier to make money out of simple farming or fishing than any craft (jewelry will soon level itself)

ArvenAldmeri

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

TheNuminous1 wrote: »

lol I love how yall are complaining about 3k laquer when so far on console they are aversging 10-15k each!

we are not complaining about the price. we are complaining about the rarity that causes aforementioned price. also, bear in mind, PC had a head start, and its STILL pricey because its such an unreliable pain to farm.

the only people I can see defending this nonsense are people who are not into housing themselves, and just like to profit of its rarity. and to you I say... highly painful suggestion of "where to go and what to do with yourselves" redacted.

3-6k per item is not a lot. Let's say you use 100 of them. That's 300-600k. Housing is an expensive hobby in this game. An extra couple hundred thousand gold isn't a big deal.

And the price will obviously continue to fall. It will be under 1k in a few weeks.

The price will only go up as less and less people are doing the daily quests. Its not 3-6k per item, 6k is for the culanda used for it itself. Woodworking purple mats make it another 2k minimum, add another items to it and you are spending 50k for a table and only 4 chairs. And thats 5 items. Out of 600 in case of the large house in Alinor. Yeah, totally viable.

SolidusPrime

Great idea, and necessary in my opinion.

Jaraal

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

TheNuminous1 wrote: »

lol I love how yall are complaining about 3k laquer when so far on console they are aversging 10-15k each!

we are not complaining about the price. we are complaining about the rarity that causes aforementioned price. also, bear in mind, PC had a head start, and its STILL pricey because its such an unreliable pain to farm.

the only people I can see defending this nonsense are people who are not into housing themselves, and just like to profit of its rarity. and to you I say... highly painful suggestion of "where to go and what to do with yourselves" redacted.

3-6k per item is not a lot. Let's say you use 100 of them. That's 300-600k. Housing is an expensive hobby in this game. An extra couple hundred thousand gold isn't a big deal.

And the price will obviously continue to fall. It will be under 1k in a few weeks.

100 lacquers makes 50 items. So, seven million (not counting the price of the blueprints) to furnish a notable home in Alinor style? Pocket change for some, but I'm not that rich. And TBH, the price of the lacquers has been rising on PC. There are a limited number of dailies, so it's not like supply will magically increase somehow. And supply will eventually drop as the newness of the content fades, achievements are accomplished, and players move on to other things.

They need to make an alternative method of acquiring it. Add it to shell trove drops, or deconnable from zone sets, giant clam loot, treasure chest, pickpocketing, or something else.