If sloads is going to stay in the game

ezio45

Lets at least make is fair for everyone

have each tick do 4.3% of the players health

6k dealt over time/ 20k average sorc/nbs health is .3 * 100 = 30% of their health bar

30/7 ticks of sloads is 4.28

so each tick of sloads needs to do 4.3% of that platers health if it is going to effect everyone equally

ezio45

players*

Gilvoth

or you could just adjust your build to counter the set like the rest of us.

ezio45

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

or you could just adjust your build to counter the set like the rest of us.

no need to, if it does fixed damage based on health everyone is effected equally

ezio45

also if some players need to adjust their builds if they want to counter it, why shouldnt other builds have to also? broken but balanced for all

Judas Helviaryn

You have a twisted sense of balance. Sload's is going to affect harshest the people who have no self sustainability, no survival skills. In PVP, this set, among others, emphasizes to newer players the importance of taking care of your own self healing and survivability in adverse situations.

I've been killed by Sload's precisely once, in a non-CP battleground, and it hasn't harmed me since.

Adjust your build, learn to play, and stop trying to nerf the game just because you can't keep up.

ezio45

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

You have a twisted sense of balance. Sload's is going to affect harshest the people who have no self sustainability, no survival skills. In PVP, this set, among others, emphasizes to newer players the importance of taking care of your own self healing and survivability in adverse situations.

I've been killed by Sload's precisely once, in a non-CP battleground, and it hasn't harmed me since.

Adjust your build, learn to play, and stop trying to nerf the game just because you can't keep up.

I can think of nothing more balanced than something that effects all classes and play styles by the same percent

If we really want to balance things we could make it defile and negate healing too, since some classes dont have access to the defile debuff or a decent instant heal that doesnt require the heal to be double bar'd or have someone stand in your aoe

Judas Helviaryn

ezio45 wrote: »

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

You have a twisted sense of balance. Sload's is going to affect harshest the people who have no self sustainability, no survival skills. In PVP, this set, among others, emphasizes to newer players the importance of taking care of your own self healing and survivability in adverse situations.

I've been killed by Sload's precisely once, in a non-CP battleground, and it hasn't harmed me since.

Adjust your build, learn to play, and stop trying to nerf the game just because you can't keep up.

I can think of nothing more balanced than something that effects all classes and play styles by the same percent

If we really want to balance thing we could make it defile and negate healing too, since some classes dont have access to the defile debuff or a decent instant heal that doesnt require the heal to be double bar'd or have someone stand in your aoe

Your idea of balance seems to be the lazy kind. The boring, poorly thought out, game killing kind.

Homogenization.

Every class has its perks and its quirks, strengths and weaknesses, and removing those in favor of this bastardized concept of balance will remove all flavor from the game. A sorcerer shouldn't be indistinguishable from a dragonknight in capability, and neither should an archer and a spellblade, a caster and a brawler, I could keep going.

If you are even mildly clever, or even just attentive to the mechanics breakdowns the more well-connected players publish for your benefit on a regular basis, you will find a way around these limits and become a better player for it. The benefit being you won't be bogged down by silly things like this set, and have more time to enjoy the game.

It's better than complaining.

EDIT: Here's some reading material for you. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CompetitiveBalance

ezio45

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Judas Helviaryn wrote: »

You have a twisted sense of balance. Sload's is going to affect harshest the people who have no self sustainability, no survival skills. In PVP, this set, among others, emphasizes to newer players the importance of taking care of your own self healing and survivability in adverse situations.

I've been killed by Sload's precisely once, in a non-CP battleground, and it hasn't harmed me since.

Adjust your build, learn to play, and stop trying to nerf the game just because you can't keep up.

I can think of nothing more balanced than something that effects all classes and play styles by the same percent

If we really want to balance thing we could make it defile and negate healing too, since some classes dont have access to the defile debuff or a decent instant heal that doesnt require the heal to be double bar'd or have someone stand in your aoe

Your idea of balance seems to be the lazy kind. The boring, poorly thought out, game killing kind.

Homogenization.

Every class has its perks and its quirks, strengths and weaknesses, and removing those in favor of this bastardized concept of balance will remove all flavor from the game. A sorcerer shouldn't be indistinguishable from a dragonknight in capability, and neither should an archer and a spellblade, a caster and a brawler, I could keep going.

If you are even mildly clever, or even just attentive to the mechanics breakdowns the more well-connected players publish for your benefit on a regular basis, you will find a way around these limits and become a better player for it. The benefit being you won't be bogged down by silly things like this set, and have more time to enjoy the game.

It's better than complaining.

EDIT: Here's some reading material for you. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CompetitiveBalance

But if we are going to remove the unique defenses of certain classes but not others that seems like these classes will be unbalanced in terms of defense, is this ok? How are we to expect players to compete with each other fairly if one can take more damage from the other?

ezio45

if there is a way to bypass someones defense should that player not have a way to equally bypass their opponents defenses?

Radinyn

Why tanks should take more damage when they should take less.

ezio45

Radinyn wrote: »

Why tanks should take more damage when they should take less.

good question, well tanks defense is high resistance and health, if this set is balanced it will have to effect players the same by bypassing every builds defenses, the way it removes the defense of shields or clock., oblivion damage already bypasses resistance so now we just have tanks defense of higher health to deal with whick is fixed by the set doing a percentage of damage bases on health

because we cant have a set that leaves certain classes defenseless while others are fine

ezio45

and it doesnt do more damage it does equivalent damage

D0PAMINE

I put Sloads on my StamDK to try it out. I needed a way to counter higher health enemies who can out sustain me. I had to sacrifice some health and weapon damage but that's fine. Even if I don't win, I like my enemy to feel pressured.

Ectheliontnacil

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

ezio45

Radinyn wrote: »

Why tanks should take more damage when they should take less.

i also dont know why you would want to play a tank with the proposed set change, given that it bypasses your defenses and tanks sacrifice damage for those very defenses

Kinda like idk why you would want to play a sorc with a set like sloads that removes your defenses but your damage stays the same

ezio45

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

Gilvoth

D0PAMINE wrote: »

I put Sloads on my StamDK to try it out. I needed a way to counter higher health enemies who can out sustain me. I had to sacrifice some health and weapon damage but that's fine. Even if I don't win, I like my enemy to feel pressured.

that to me is the definition of skill.
attempting to counter and stay in the fight the best you can even though the fight seems really hard.
you planned, and strategised, sacrificed, and changed your methods to suit your opponents strengths and sought out his weaknesses.

CaptainBeerDude

So you think that someone who specs into health over damage should get hit harder by sloads?
Just using some randomish numbers if you take 6k damage with 20k health and do 20k dps how does that balance well if a tanky character takes 12k damage with 40k health doing 10k dps?

ezio45

CaptainBeerDude wrote: »

So you think that someone who specs into health over damage should get hit harder by sloads?
Just using some randomish numbers if you take 6k damage with 20k health and do 20k dps how does that balance well if a tanky character takes 12k damage with 40k health doing 10k dps?

idk maybe they need to alter there build like @dwemer_paleologist said. again idk why you would run a tank with the defenses of a tank being taken away with no increase damage, similarly idk why you would run a sorc with its damage remaining the same with a set that completely ignores its defense and likewise would place a dot on you for 30% of your max health

brandonv516

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

ezio45

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

were talking about balancing the set equally so it effects everyone, not other damage.We want this set to be able to effect everyone equally right? and not completely cripple only certain classes, right?

while were at it it should probably proc off receiving damage so it can equally effect high dodge roll builds, wouldnt want there defense over looked, because if we were fine with only certain classes having there defense ignored by something that would be hypocrisy. and have it negate healing because that is a main source of survivability for certain classes

brandonv516

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

were talking about balancing the set equally so it effects everyone, not other damage.We want this set to be able to effect everyone equally right? and not completely cripple only certain classes, right?

while were at it it should probably proc off receiving damage so it can equally effect high dodge roll builds, wouldnt want there defense over looked, because if we were fine with only certain classes having there defense ignored by something that would be hypocrisy. and have it negate healing because that is a main source of survivability for certain classes

I don't expect the set to NOT effect NBs. It should absolutely do damage to NBs while cloaked.

It should not negate cloak as it does not negate shields, blocking, healing, dodge rolling, etc.

ezio45

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

were talking about balancing the set equally so it effects everyone, not other damage.We want this set to be able to effect everyone equally right? and not completely cripple only certain classes, right?

while were at it it should probably proc off receiving damage so it can equally effect high dodge roll builds, wouldnt want there defense over looked, because if we were fine with only certain classes having there defense ignored by something that would be hypocrisy. and have it negate healing because that is a main source of survivability for certain classes

I don't expect the set to NOT effect NBs. It should absolutely do damage to NBs while cloaked.

It should not negate cloak as it does not negate shields, blocking, healing, dodge rolling, etc.

it bypasses shields effectively negating them, does it not?

Vaoh

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

were talking about balancing the set equally so it effects everyone, not other damage.We want this set to be able to effect everyone equally right? and not completely cripple only certain classes, right?

while were at it it should probably proc off receiving damage so it can equally effect high dodge roll builds, wouldnt want there defense over looked, because if we were fine with only certain classes having there defense ignored by something that would be hypocrisy. and have it negate healing because that is a main source of survivability for certain classes

Nope, it will not hurt all classes equally. It’s negligible to some, and a hardcounter to others (mainly Mag). By design it could never be balanced.... at least when it’s so easily procced.

DuskMarine

ezio45 wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

or you could just adjust your build to counter the set like the rest of us.

no need to, if it does fixed damage based on health everyone is effected equally

its already balanced because its complete garbage.............the new meta in pvp is time stop spam.

brandonv516

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

were talking about balancing the set equally so it effects everyone, not other damage.We want this set to be able to effect everyone equally right? and not completely cripple only certain classes, right?

while were at it it should probably proc off receiving damage so it can equally effect high dodge roll builds, wouldnt want there defense over looked, because if we were fine with only certain classes having there defense ignored by something that would be hypocrisy. and have it negate healing because that is a main source of survivability for certain classes

I don't expect the set to NOT effect NBs. It should absolutely do damage to NBs while cloaked.

It should not negate cloak as it does not negate shields, blocking, healing, dodge rolling, etc.

it bypasses shields effectively negating them, does it not?

Nope. The shield remains up and can still prevent other types of damage.

ezio45

Taking any points way from this thread zos?

like maybe things that bypass unique class defenses make the class less desirable to play and leaves you to deal with those bypasses essentially missing part of that builds core

or maybe that having certain things that hurt certain types of builds is hypocritical and not fair or balanced?

or that if the type of effects that sloads has on certain classes were carried over to different classes it would about be laughable and unjustifiable?

Or that maybe unmitigatable damage is not good for the game because how classes mitigate damage is part of that classes identity, effectiveness and desirability?

ezio45

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

were talking about balancing the set equally so it effects everyone, not other damage.We want this set to be able to effect everyone equally right? and not completely cripple only certain classes, right?

while were at it it should probably proc off receiving damage so it can equally effect high dodge roll builds, wouldnt want there defense over looked, because if we were fine with only certain classes having there defense ignored by something that would be hypocrisy. and have it negate healing because that is a main source of survivability for certain classes

I don't expect the set to NOT effect NBs. It should absolutely do damage to NBs while cloaked.

It should not negate cloak as it does not negate shields, blocking, healing, dodge rolling, etc.

it bypasses shields effectively negating them, does it not?

Nope. The shield remains up and can still prevent other types of damage.

it does effect nbs worse, not arguing that, as far as damage from sloads is concerned it does bypass shield and 30% of nb or sorc health able to be removed every 6 seconds is ridiculous from one proc set that can constantly proc before it even expires and can stack

have been trying to prove with this thread how harmful this is to nb and sorcs and how if this was applied to other classes this set would be a joke and obviously need to be changed

ezio45

Vaoh wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It shouldn't break cloak, then I'm happy.

so what your saying is this set shouldnt remove peoples main defense?

It doesn't remove other defenses.

Shields can still shield other damage, block can still mitigate other damage, but cloak drops so you cannot cloak through other damage.

Some people hate NBs so much they don't even want to look at how inconsistent that concept is.

were talking about balancing the set equally so it effects everyone, not other damage.We want this set to be able to effect everyone equally right? and not completely cripple only certain classes, right?

while were at it it should probably proc off receiving damage so it can equally effect high dodge roll builds, wouldnt want there defense over looked, because if we were fine with only certain classes having there defense ignored by something that would be hypocrisy. and have it negate healing because that is a main source of survivability for certain classes

Nope, it will not hurt all classes equally. It’s negligible to some, and a hardcounter to others (mainly Mag). By design it could never be balanced.... at least when it’s so easily procced.

i agree it is unbalanced, can never be balanced thats why it has no place in the game as it will always significantly hurt certain classes more

srfrogg23

What if Zos went the GW2 route and just removed gear and CPs from pvp altogether? Then everyone will just have to rely on attribute allocation and skill selection.