Campaign scoring is broken

barshemm

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

usmguy1234

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

I like the changes. Ep zerging has hit critical levels on Xbox na on both cp campaigns. Guess you might have to split your defences and not zerg everything to wild abandonment.

VaranisArano

They updated the underdog bonuses for scoring, I guess this is the fruit.

Goshua

usmguy1234 wrote: »

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

I like the changes. Ep zerging has hit critical levels on Xbox na on both cp campaigns. Guess you might have to split your defences and not zerg everything to wild abandonment.

Ok but if we take your scrolls when you have no population, youwe have three keeps to defend all day and the points.

Jadokis

guessing it has to do with scrolls. It's unfortunate, yeah.

usmguy1234

Goshua wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

I like the changes. Ep zerging has hit critical levels on Xbox na on both cp campaigns. Guess you might have to split your defences and not zerg everything to wild abandonment.

Ok but if we take your scrolls when you have no population, youwe have three keeps to defend all day and the points.

I think it was an attempt by Zos to passively combat the complaints about alliances pvdooring less populated alliances. It puts emphasis on home keeps/scrolls. DC is just as bad...I just had to take the opportunity to pick on EP just because. I've seen many times DC will own the map so to speak but our home keeps will look like a McDonald's playground with all the yellows and reds.

Deep_01

Form an orange alliance and get back the scrolls.

Vilestride

I have not played yet. Is this due to scroll changes or underdog bonus? Is there a way to confirm?

Minalan

If you can’t keep your Scrolls, you don’t deserve to have them. Period. Now they’re actually worth something.

barshemm

usmguy1234 wrote: »

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

I like the changes. Ep zerging has hit critical levels on Xbox na on both cp campaigns. Guess you might have to split your defences and not zerg everything to wild abandonment.

So uh you mean

Minalan wrote: »

If you can’t keep your Scrolls, you don’t deserve to have them. Period. Now they’re actually worth something.

Now they're worth more than the entire map. You can turtle on 3 keeps and win.

Vilestride

Mmm in a sense I agree. If the change is going to mean factions will have to opt for strategical control and better prioritize their captures and defenses vs just mass control I am entirely ok with that. In this way you can't just send a 24 man to go capture resources and win, you are going to have to prioritise your large groups to more critical objectives or you will simply fall behind. This is positive in my opinion.

That being said if it is bugged or something or the underdog changes aren't working as intended then yes, that should be fixed.

Anrose

Vilestride wrote: »

Mmm in a sense I agree. If the change is going to mean factions will have to opt for strategical control and better prioritize their captures and defenses vs just mass control I am entirely ok with that. In this way you can't just send a 24 man to go capture resources and win, you are going to have to prioritise your large groups to more critical objectives or you will simply fall behind. This is positive in my opinion.

Say whaaaaaa
If this is the case, maybe it will breathe some life back into the Alliance War and a bit less emphasis on farming. I would love to feel that sense of urgency again.

usmguy1234

barshemm wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

I like the changes. Ep zerging has hit critical levels on Xbox na on both cp campaigns. Guess you might have to split your defences and not zerg everything to wild abandonment.

So uh you mean

Minalan wrote: »

If you can’t keep your Scrolls, you don’t deserve to have them. Period. Now they’re actually worth something.

Now they're worth more than the entire map. You can turtle on 3 keeps and win.

Just like people turtle one keep to keep emp? It'll be interesting to see how it goes. I think if you turtle emp and lose your scrolls, you shouldn't be able to win the campaign, yet this happened a lot in the past. Matter of fact EP did this in shor last just last cycle and had nearly 1000 points on second place.

Beardimus

Anrose wrote: »

Vilestride wrote: »

Mmm in a sense I agree. If the change is going to mean factions will have to opt for strategical control and better prioritize their captures and defenses vs just mass control I am entirely ok with that. In this way you can't just send a 24 man to go capture resources and win, you are going to have to prioritise your large groups to more critical objectives or you will simply fall behind. This is positive in my opinion.

Say whaaaaaa
If this is the case, maybe it will breathe some life back into the Alliance War and a bit less emphasis on farming. I would love to feel that sense of urgency again.

Spot on. I'm glad scrolls mean something. And we actually are going to have obvious common goals rather than pros AP farming folks randomly.

Avaglaor

It seems that the new system made it worse for PC EU, now AD can get even more from the morning capping....

WillhelmBlack

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

Yes. More points for defending your home keeps, it was in the patch notes. Looks like either DC read them or EP are massively overpopulated and zerging everything in sight, or both.

Darkmage1337

@ZOS_BrianWheeler The 6 Elder Scrolls should be 5-points each, not 10-points each. 10-points per scroll per evaluation period is probably too far in one direction, if every single other objective is left at 1-point per. 5-points per scroll makes 1 scroll worth more than an entire Keep/Fort/Castle and its 3 respective resources. This is more reasonable, given that a faction will stack 6 scrolls at any time, especially on the under-populated campaigns like Shor and Sotha Sil (PC NA).

Vilestride

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler The 6 Elder Scrolls should be 5-points each, not 10-points each. 10-points per scroll per evaluation period is probably too far in one direction, if every single other objective is left at 1-point per. 5-points per scroll makes 1 scroll worth more than an entire Keep/Fort/Castle and its 3 respective resources. This is more reasonable, given that a faction will stack 6 scrolls at any time, especially on the under-populated campaigns like Shor and Sotha Sil (PC NA).

I think 10 points a scroll is fine. That being said I think the score for keeps needs to be raised to further mitigate the huge variance. (Someone correct me if such a change was made and I wasn't aware of it)

Scroll > Keep > resources.

Vilestride

Anrose wrote: »

Vilestride wrote: »

Mmm in a sense I agree. If the change is going to mean factions will have to opt for strategical control and better prioritize their captures and defenses vs just mass control I am entirely ok with that. In this way you can't just send a 24 man to go capture resources and win, you are going to have to prioritise your large groups to more critical objectives or you will simply fall behind. This is positive in my opinion.

Say whaaaaaa
If this is the case, maybe it will breathe some life back into the Alliance War and a bit less emphasis on farming. I would love to feel that sense of urgency again.

agreed. Old scroll runs were the best fights. Any objective that gives us a reason to be up in the hills behind chalman or the forests near brindle or where is going to have positive impact.

THAT BEING SAID! scrolls regaining their value is at the same time going to make them an even more effective farming tool! So I wouldn't get hung up on that aspect of it lol.

nomnomnomnomnapnomapnom

Goshua

Avaglaor wrote: »

It seems that the new system made it worse for PC EU, now AD can get even more from the morning capping....

That about sums up what actually happens to most servers. It would work if populations remained constant but they don't.

Sharee

Avaglaor wrote: »

It seems that the new system made it worse for PC EU, now AD can get even more from the morning capping....

Maybe now that one faction starts leading score by an order of magnitude someone at ZOS will smack their forehead and rethink the whole dynamic population caps thing...

Oh who am i kidding.

Ixtyr

The campaigns are unbalanced and the scores are wonky because the majority of players are doing the new content, grinding for Psijic or Jewelrycrafting, or otherwise. They aren't PvPing.

Y'all sitting here chicken littling on day one need to stop, take a breath, calm down, and see how it plays out over the coming weeks. People have been asking for score adjustments and low pop/low score bonus fixes for months, let's actually get some data before demanding everything gets reverted because X faction had one guild that decided to flip the map during off hours, okay?

barshemm

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

Yes. More points for defending your home keeps, it was in the patch notes. Looks like either DC read them or EP are massively overpopulated and zerging everything in sight, or both.

Actually at the time DC was 3 bars and EP was 2. AD was 2 bars and only pushing EP as well. We lost sej and brk.

WillhelmBlack

barshemm wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

Yes. More points for defending your home keeps, it was in the patch notes. Looks like either DC read them or EP are massively overpopulated and zerging everything in sight, or both.

Actually at the time DC was 3 bars and EP was 2. AD was 2 bars and only pushing EP as well. We lost sej and brk.

Looks like DC are playing the new game then.

barshemm

Ixtyr wrote: »

The campaigns are unbalanced and the scores are wonky because the majority of players are doing the new content, grinding for Psijic or Jewelrycrafting, or otherwise. They aren't PvPing.

Y'all sitting here chicken littling on day one need to stop, take a breath, calm down, and see how it plays out over the coming weeks. People have been asking for score adjustments and low pop/low score bonus fixes for months, let's actually get some data before demanding everything gets reverted because X faction had one guild that decided to flip the map during off hours, okay?

A faction with 3 keeps was getting twice the score of one who has 7 or 8. Can't remember if we had Drake at the time I posted this. This isn't about a flipped map.

I guess this will be great for ball groups though. You guys can farm scrolls and/or put them in a home keep and convince your faction to stack them giving you even more keeps to choose from for your game. You can even say you're playing objectives now instead of telling people how you don't do that anymore.

Avaglaor

Ixtyr wrote: »

The campaigns are unbalanced and the scores are wonky because the majority of players are doing the new content, grinding for Psijic or Jewelrycrafting, or otherwise. They aren't PvPing.

Y'all sitting here chicken littling on day one need to stop, take a breath, calm down, and see how it plays out over the coming weeks. People have been asking for score adjustments and low pop/low score bonus fixes for months, let's actually get some data before demanding everything gets reverted because X faction had one guild that decided to flip the map during off hours, okay?

Well okay...
But what is happening in PC EU in that AD is getting all the scrolls/map every morning with 2 bars of population (the campaign is almost empty at 5-6 am), the new system is not going to stop that, even when everyone is back in cyrodiil.
And because we are collecting data, the point is that with the changes AD will get even more points than before, so instead of fixing the problem it makes it even worse for that specific situation.

Hammy01

I actually hope this helps even out the score making for more exciting finishes. Once a side zergs ahead on the score board a lot of people faction swap to the winning side. Making the final score even more lopsided in the end... and a boring campaign.
Maybe with the new scoring less people will flip sides and we can have better fights?

Ixtyr

barshemm wrote: »

Ixtyr wrote: »

The campaigns are unbalanced and the scores are wonky because the majority of players are doing the new content, grinding for Psijic or Jewelrycrafting, or otherwise. They aren't PvPing.

Y'all sitting here chicken littling on day one need to stop, take a breath, calm down, and see how it plays out over the coming weeks. People have been asking for score adjustments and low pop/low score bonus fixes for months, let's actually get some data before demanding everything gets reverted because X faction had one guild that decided to flip the map during off hours, okay?

A faction with 3 keeps was getting twice the score of one who has 7 or 8. Can't remember if we had Drake at the time I posted this. This isn't about a flipped map.

I guess this will be great for ball groups though. You guys can farm scrolls and/or put them in a home keep and convince your faction to stack them giving you even more keeps to choose from for your game. You can even say you're playing objectives now instead of telling people how you don't do that anymore.

And?

They made scrolls worth fighting over for the first time in years. That's a good thing. It gives people a reason to go after them, rather than give them away to enemy players in an effort to lose the aggro of the enemy factions.

Scroll point values are not going to fix the population disparity issues that already exist. No adjustment in scoring mechanics is going to magically make non-AD be organized in off hours on EU, or make DC/EP stop zerging the morning hours on NA. Does the new score system have issues? Yeah, sure, I wish it was more dynamic. My point is, don't condemn the changes when you've had less than 24 hours to actually experience them in the first place - and if you *do* want to condemn them, maybe instead of whining about it, offer constructive feedback and suggestions to fix, rather than starting snarky unconstructive "X is broken, guess we can just do Y and win lul" threads that contribute nothing to the conversation.

Potenza

barshemm wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

barshemm wrote: »

Vivec PC/NA. DC is backed up to their tri-keeps and Bruma. EP has most the map.

DC is getting 88 points next eval
EP is getting 50

So you can take 2 scrolls and faction stack your tri-keeps and win a campaign now.

I like the changes. Ep zerging has hit critical levels on Xbox na on both cp campaigns. Guess you might have to split your defences and not zerg everything to wild abandonment.

So uh you mean

Minalan wrote: »

If you can’t keep your Scrolls, you don’t deserve to have them. Period. Now they’re actually worth something.

Now they're worth more than the entire map. You can turtle on 3 keeps and win.

Well you gotta go get those scrolls now - cant let anyone keep them.

The entire dynamics is changed now. No more solo tanks running around just taking all the resources on the map for points - that is pointless now.

He who controls the scrolls wins.

adirondack

Ixtyr wrote: »

Y'all sitting here chicken littling on day one need to stop, take a breath, calm down, and see how it plays out over the coming weeks.

hehehe... chicken littling... (writes that one down)

Minno

Ixtyr wrote: »

The campaigns are unbalanced and the scores are wonky because the majority of players are doing the new content, grinding for Psijic or Jewelrycrafting, or otherwise. They aren't PvPing.

Y'all sitting here chicken littling on day one need to stop, take a breath, calm down, and see how it plays out over the coming weeks. People have been asking for score adjustments and low pop/low score bonus fixes for months, let's actually get some data before demanding everything gets reverted because X faction had one guild that decided to flip the map during off hours, okay?

Agree. Chill pill for all.