Non-NB Invisibility Skill

Zeromaz

This is one of the worst ideas i’ve read on this forum. No.... and if you can’t figure out why, then me explaining it to you will be of no benefit.

Ragnarock41

Zeromaz wrote: »

This is one of the worst ideas i’ve read on this forum. No.... and if you can’t figure out why, then me explaining it to you will be of no benefit.

And why do you think that? Because cloak would no longer be a nightblade exclusive? Or because cloaking would be potentially too strong on another class?

I would like to discuss this idea but I kind of feel like you're just a salty nightblade main.

Templars did not cry because alliance purge does what their exclusive class ability does, Dks did not cry when ZOS made spell wall as a basically perfected version of wings(and especially when it costed 100 ultimate, it was easier to keep spell wall up than keeping wings up)
And recently they reworked fighters guild crossbow into something similar to Dk chains. The iconic DK chains. Yet I don't remember any DK coming up and saying ''this is a horrible idea because this gives non DK classes a chance to become viable tanks''.

So I ask again, What is so bad about other classes having a weaker, more clunky cloak? With the right requirements(5 medium at least, and costs something similar to shuffle to balance it out) it would just be perfect. Or it could be a balance nightmare, but without trying, nobody can know.


Sorry but your game knowledge is really not that good enough that you can say things like ''this idea is bad because I said so''.

Do you remember when you called exaggeration on 20k vigor then never replied to that thread again when I posted alcast's 23k vigor tooltip? You still haven't replied back to that post mate. Are you really that new to this game or are you just trying to farm agrees?

Anyways, my point is;

stop making comments like ''this is the worst idea ever'', while you clearly don't know what is a possibility and what is not.

And remember, it is okay not to know everything.

Betsararie

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Zeromaz wrote: »

This is one of the worst ideas i’ve read on this forum. No.... and if you can’t figure out why, then me explaining it to you will be of no benefit.

And why do you think that?

Probably because there would be a large number of players running around invisible? What do you want this to be, Elder Ghosts Online?

I agree with Zeromaz. This is one of the worst ideas I've read on this forum in my time here. Considering cloak is one of the most irritating mechanics I have seen present in any game, the idea is preposterously bad.

Ragnarock41

Blanco wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Zeromaz wrote: »

This is one of the worst ideas i’ve read on this forum. No.... and if you can’t figure out why, then me explaining it to you will be of no benefit.

And why do you think that?

Probably because there would be a large number of players running around invisible? What do you want this to be, Elder Ghosts Online?

I agree with Zeromaz. This is one of the worst ideas I've read on this forum in my time here. Considering cloak is one of the most irritating mechanics I have seen present in any game, the idea is preposterously bad.

So are you trying to say that cloak is overperforming? Otherwise why would everyone use a gimped version of what nightblades have, and especially with a medium armor requirement like shuffle does?

Betsararie

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Blanco wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Zeromaz wrote: »

This is one of the worst ideas i’ve read on this forum. No.... and if you can’t figure out why, then me explaining it to you will be of no benefit.

And why do you think that?

Probably because there would be a large number of players running around invisible? What do you want this to be, Elder Ghosts Online?

I agree with Zeromaz. This is one of the worst ideas I've read on this forum in my time here. Considering cloak is one of the most irritating mechanics I have seen present in any game, the idea is preposterously bad.

So are you trying to say that cloak is overperforming? Otherwise why would everyone use a gimped version of what nightblades have, and especially with a medium armor requirement like shuffle does?

Well, there is a solid argument it's overperforming. I've long been an advocate of some sort of limitation on successive casts of cloak, whether that be in the form of a nerf similar to the streak nerf, or another type of nerf.

Personally, an implementation such as this would change the game far too much on a fundamental level for me to ever consider it. I suppose I just prefer defensive measures that don't involve simply disappearing for a couple of seconds.

Maryal

Like it or not, cloak (invisibility) IS the NB's defense, so no, you can't have it (as a skill).

There are two basics that make up a decent class defense (I'm talking class skills). For the purpose of this post, I'll refer to these two basics as a class's 'defensive paring' skills.

The first is the class needs a way to heal themselves (and I'm not talking about some wimpy HOT).
The second is some sort of skill that can be used to help the healing skill do it's thing.

For example, having a class skill to shield yourself from further damage while the heal is doing its thing, OR purging multiple DOTs so the heal can actually make your health bar go up (Templar / Warden (<-- who can spam their netch at no cost for a multi-purge effect), or being able zoom-zooming to create distance from combat or to get LOS so the heal can do it's thing. NBs don't have a class shield, they don't have a class purge (anymore), they don't have the zoom-zoom ... what they have is cloak.

Instead of having a class shield, or a class purge, or a class zoom-zoom skill that can be used to help the healing skill do it's thing, NBs have cloak. There are pros and cons with each type of defensive paring skills, but in the end, the pro's and con's pretty much balance out. Unfortunately, many of us suffer from the 'grass looks greener on the other side' syndrome. The defensive skill paring some other class has, well, we complain about it, but we secretly want it, such as an invisibility skill.

The problem is that if you give other classes the NB's invisibility skill, then the NB ends up being at a disadvantage (defensively speaking) compared to other classes (because other classes would then have two options (each with it's own pros and cons) of which defensive paring type of skill to use.

I am specifically talking about class skills, because class skills generally work in synergy with the class passives. If your bar is fill up with weapon skills (for example), then any skill used on that bar contains none of your class passives (such as sword-n-board). Or, there are things like the alliance war skill 'purge' ... but the cost is prohibitively high.

Ragnarock41

Blanco wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Blanco wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Zeromaz wrote: »

This is one of the worst ideas i’ve read on this forum. No.... and if you can’t figure out why, then me explaining it to you will be of no benefit.

And why do you think that?

Probably because there would be a large number of players running around invisible? What do you want this to be, Elder Ghosts Online?

I agree with Zeromaz. This is one of the worst ideas I've read on this forum in my time here. Considering cloak is one of the most irritating mechanics I have seen present in any game, the idea is preposterously bad.

So are you trying to say that cloak is overperforming? Otherwise why would everyone use a gimped version of what nightblades have, and especially with a medium armor requirement like shuffle does?

Well, there is a solid argument it's overperforming. I've long been an advocate of some sort of limitation on successive casts of cloak, whether that be in the form of a nerf similar to the streak nerf, or another type of nerf.

Personally, an implementation such as this would change the game far too much on a fundamental level for me to ever consider it. I suppose I just prefer defensive measures that don't involve simply disappearing for a couple of seconds.

fair enough. I can not disagree with that. Considering I've pretty much given up hope on this game's PvP part, I would say this post is nothing more than wishful thinking. But you have to understand that nightblades aren't so powerful just because of cloak. They have the strongest and fastest stamina spammable in the game, with also the strongest ST ultimate with best cost effectiveness.

I've witnessed stamblades playing their class like it is a brawler, with heavy armor and lots of healing. It was pretty strong actually. The days of nb being a weakling that needs cloak to survive are over.

Rianai

As a NB i like the idea. Would be a buff actually, because i have Mark, so it means those who use an invisibily skill are just wasting a bar slot vs me.

shinikaze

I do agree on a purge version of cloak somewere within thief guild skill like. 8k magicka cloak ftw!