A discussion on PvE Access and Gear Sets

Kalgert

So there was a comment in a thread that shall be unmamed that rather stood out for me, as something that had made me ponder:

I think this is one of the biggest myths of ESO currently and it is going to be even more so after Summerset. This and the actual importance of "perfect gear" on the DPS result.

You only need "multiple sets of specific gear" if you want to play at Hodor, Mechanically Challenged and other guilds' level. It definetly helps if you are after Tick-Tock Tormentor or Immortal Redeemer. But it is definetly not necessary for completing it.

We see those guilds doing trials, then Andy S, LHZ and others doing vMA in 25 minutes and think "we need that gear" first, instead of "I need to memorize the spawns and attacks just like they do".

The DPS required to complete those contents is MUCH LOWER than most people think. Because some guilds will ask for 40k solo dummy parses doesn't mean a group with 30-32k won't manage to complete it. It will take longer, it won't be as clean, but definetly can.

There are groups completing Maw right now with 200k less group DPS than the top groups.

Again, having the "perfect setup" helps, but the actually DPS/mathematical limit to actually complete the content is not as high as some people make it seem.

There are worlds of people not in the level of those top guilds/vMA/vDSA groups/players completing that very same content.

This stood out to me, as I essentially am of the belief that to really get anywhere close in to being considered "Worthy" of doing harder PvE content, you would have to go through a rigorous preparing process of doing dungeons on normal to get certain pieces of gear, before you would even be allowed entry in to Veteran Dungeons, let alone doing Trial runs.

But apparently I am incorrect to think as such, that one isn't required to go through that and it is enough to have a decently fleshed out set to be able to go in to harder PvE content.

If that is the case, why am I getting chewed out for doing 10K DPS instead of 20-30k in Veteran dungeons?

AzraelKrieg

Because those people getting mad at you expect that in the trials they do and expect the same in vet dungeons even though it isn't required. Being geared enough to be able to a vet dungeon is enough to get through most of them, you don't need to be in fully legendary gear and have a perfect rotation for dungeons

Feanor

Doing 10k DPS instead of 20 or 30 has nothing to do with gear and everything with how you use your skills. People are getting mad at you because nobody likes to carry others. It’s not that hard to reach 20k DPS, and that’s why most people don’t settle for much less in dungeon runs.

Shad0wfire99

10k dps is a serious rotation problem, not a gear problem.

zaria

The reason for the high dps demand in trial groups is that the members manage it and they have enough players in group / guild to do trials then they want. it might also be the wish for an thigh knit group there you know everybody.

If you join an newer guild its much easier to get in.

Peekachu99

Kalgert wrote: »

So there was a comment in a thread that shall be unmamed that rather stood out for me, as something that had made me ponder:

I think this is one of the biggest myths of ESO currently and it is going to be even more so after Summerset. This and the actual importance of "perfect gear" on the DPS result.

You only need "multiple sets of specific gear" if you want to play at Hodor, Mechanically Challenged and other guilds' level. It definetly helps if you are after Tick-Tock Tormentor or Immortal Redeemer. But it is definetly not necessary for completing it.

We see those guilds doing trials, then Andy S, LHZ and others doing vMA in 25 minutes and think "we need that gear" first, instead of "I need to memorize the spawns and attacks just like they do".

The DPS required to complete those contents is MUCH LOWER than most people think. Because some guilds will ask for 40k solo dummy parses doesn't mean a group with 30-32k won't manage to complete it. It will take longer, it won't be as clean, but definetly can.

There are groups completing Maw right now with 200k less group DPS than the top groups.

Again, having the "perfect setup" helps, but the actually DPS/mathematical limit to actually complete the content is not as high as some people make it seem.

There are worlds of people not in the level of those top guilds/vMA/vDSA groups/players completing that very same content.

This stood out to me, as I essentially am of the belief that to really get anywhere close in to being considered "Worthy" of doing harder PvE content, you would have to go through a rigorous preparing process of doing dungeons on normal to get certain pieces of gear, before you would even be allowed entry in to Veteran Dungeons, let alone doing Trial runs.

But apparently I am incorrect to think as such, that one isn't required to go through that and it is enough to have a decently fleshed out set to be able to go in to harder PvE content.

If that is the case, why am I getting chewed out for doing 10K DPS instead of 20-30k in Veteran dungeons?

10K dps is what most tanks do with all the CP and gear creep these days; throw on Skoria or any dps Monster set and you can push that needle further. 20K is bare minimum for CP capped “dps”, and burn is necessary for nearly all of the DLC dungeons. I did Falkreath with a 264 sorc yesterday, but no one kicked or cared because he was competent and clearing bosses/ adds.

Peekachu99

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

Because those people getting mad at you expect that in the trials they do and expect the same in vet dungeons even though it isn't required. Being geared enough to be able to a vet dungeon is enough to get through most of them, you don't need to be in fully legendary gear and have a perfect rotation for dungeons

Good luck clearing Falkreath’s last boss (pure dps race) or Vet Mazz or most of the DLC dungeons with a leet team of 10K dpses. Why put yourself through that level of stress?

Edit: Also ZOS has acknowledged the power creep and need for burn is real—CP 300 in Summerset for all DLC dungeons (still should be closer to 450, I think).

zaria

Peekachu99 wrote: »

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

Because those people getting mad at you expect that in the trials they do and expect the same in vet dungeons even though it isn't required. Being geared enough to be able to a vet dungeon is enough to get through most of them, you don't need to be in fully legendary gear and have a perfect rotation for dungeons

Good luck clearing Falkreath’s last boss (pure dps race) or Vet Mazz or most of the DLC dungeons with a leet team of 10K dpses. Why put yourself through that level of stress?

Edit: Also ZOS has acknowledged the power creep and need for burn is real—CP 300 in Summerset for all DLC dungeons (still should be closer to 450, I think).

Ok its increased, nice. Still an cp160 will still be in training gear, at cp300 you except two sets, gold weapons and some experience running vet dungeons.

VaranisArano

They are yelling at you because, no offense, my pure tank does 6K DPS single-target. 10k DPS on a Damge Dealer is fine in a normal dungeon - not amazing - but fine. For comparison, my stam sorc DPS/tank does 9-10k DPS single target (huge AOEs though) while tanking, so that may be something to consider when you look at your 10k DPS.

10k DPS is sorta okay for most non-DLC vet dungeons, like you'll complete it eventually, but it turns that dungeon into a grind - and makes DPS checks like City of Ash II pretty difficult. So its not really fine. 10K DPS on a damage dealer in a Vet dungeon is on the low end of the spectrum. I've got a stam sorc DD who hits around 22K DPS after I looked up a proper damage rotation (I need more practice with it, for sure) - and even that's low compared to what some players can manage.

As a damage dealer for Vet Dungeons, you really do need to be working on getting your DPS up over 10k. Otherwise, you won't be pulling your weight and mechanics take longer than they should. With Vet dungeons, the slower the DPS, the longer the fight and more chances there are for someone to miss a mechanic and die.

If you are on PC, I recommend the Combat Metrics addon so you can see your percentage of the group DPS, instead of just your DPS count.

Bottom line is, at 10k DPS you are fine for normal dungeons. But you are underperforming as a DD in a Vet Dungeon. Sure, you can complete the vet dungeon, probably, eventually, if its not a DLC or a DPS check dungeon and your group is willing to put up with the slow run. I'm not surprised your groups are complaining.


What can you do to fix it?

Since you don't want to deal with your gear, focus on rotation. Go look up a solid rotation for your class and practice it. It really does make a difference. I had a self-made rotation that was comfortable on my stam sorc and I was getting 16K DPS. Pretty decent, right? Finally looked up a proper rotation that made good use of multiple DOTs, AOEs, and buffs and got up to 22k DPS without much practice. Proper rotation makes a huge difference - the gear is more about supporting and buffing that rotation. (That stam sorc has on Spriggan and Hunding's Rage, so no dungeon runs needed.)

Sparr0w

20-25k is really easy to achieve wearing purple gear, with plenty of regen & no farming dungeons (Spriggans/NMG & Hundings) I hit that at CP200 but am used for 'weaving' and button combo's from other games.

Just make sure you're weaving LA/HA between skills & keep up an AoE or two.

But yeh unless the boss has mechanics requiring high DPS then anyone can compete if they don't mind doing it for a bit longer. I've done trials before with no CP dps pulling 5-10k at most & no CP healers. Cleared without wipes.

Kalgert

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

10k dps is a serious rotation problem, not a gear problem.

Excuse me, but I call that false.

I'm currently playing a Stamina Nightblade (Cliche, I know), using a bow and dual wielding. My bow attacks have pretty good burst (But apparently burst does not equal acceptable damage done), and can deal with packs quite well, and while melee I spam one main ability, mix in light and heavy attacks where needed, and yet I still don't break past 10k, despite doing everything that should be considered "Correct" in a rotation.

What else is there to turn on then, as opposed to what gear I am using and what setup I have with my CP's?

Yes, a rotation is one part of the course when it comes to dealing damage, but it is clear to me that a majority of it comes down from the gear, and gear itself requires spreadsheets (At least, that is the impression I am getting). That makes no sense to me.

VaranisArano

Kalgert wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

10k dps is a serious rotation problem, not a gear problem.

Excuse me, but I call that false.

I'm currently playing a Stamina Nightblade (Cliche, I know), using a bow and dual wielding. My bow attacks have pretty good burst (But apparently burst does not equal acceptable damage done), and can deal with packs quite well, and while melee I spam one main ability, mix in light and heavy attacks where needed, and yet I still don't break past 10k, despite doing everything that should be considered "Correct" in a rotation.

What else is there to turn on then, as opposed to what gear I am using and what setup I have with my CP's?

Yes, a rotation is one part of the course when it comes to dealing damage, but it is clear to me that a majority of it comes down from the gear, and gear itself requires spreadsheets (At least, that is the impression I am getting). That makes no sense to me.

PVE DPS is all about layering damage on top of itself. So most stamina DPS have a very standard Bow back bar: Endless Hail, Rearming Trap, Caltrops, Posion Injection to really amp up those DOTs, before swapping over to their front bar for more DOTs and single target spammables from dual wield and class abilities. In melee fights, I'm still dropping all my AOEs and DOTs because those damage sources add up enormously over time. The only time you need to spam one ability is when the boss is in execute range.

Here's a build I'm looking at, but really those skills I listed are pretty standard for Stam DPS - they're on my stam sorc, for example. https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-nightblade-build-for-pve/

Personally, I saw the biggest change in my DPS come when I got a proper rotation, not from getting meta gear.

Thorstienn

"Mix in light and heavy attacks where needed" is your problem, and why posters are meaning by rotation. Rotation in this game is not only the activation of your abilities in and appropriate order (I.e. buff, apply DoTs, spam, repeat), it's also light attack weaving/animation cancelling (The 2 are really the same). Light attacks need to be going off between (almost simultaneously) every ability. It's a feature(unintentional originally) the game developers have embraced fully and content is created (DPS checks) with it in mind.
NOTE: It is never explained or demonstrated in-game, so you can be forgiven for not knowing, it is all over the forums and in YouTube videos though so is often considered (unfairly) a "l2p" issue.
None of this is meant as an attack, and all stated in the nicest possible way.

MLGProPlayer

10k DPS is awful and indicates a rotation problem, as others have said. You can hit 20-30k on every class with crafted gear.

VaranisArano

Thorstienn wrote: »

"Mix in light and heavy attacks where needed" is your problem, and why posters are meaning by rotation. Rotation in this game is not only the activation of your abilities in and appropriate order (I.e. buff, apply DoTs, spam, repeat), it's also light attack weaving/animation cancelling (The 2 are really the same). Light attacks need to be going off between (almost simultaneously) every ability. It's a feature(unintentional originally) the game developers have embraced fully and content is created (DPS checks) with it in mind.
NOTE: It is never explained or demonstrated in-game, so you can be forgiven for not knowing, it is all over the forums and in YouTube videos though so is often considered (unfairly) a "l2p" issue.
None of this is meant as an attack, and all stated in the nicest possible way.

Not to diminish what you are saying, but light attack weaving (firing a light attack in between skills) is now a part of the Level Up Advisor's tips. So the devs really are embracing, and teaching, this rotation mechanics for DPS.

LeagueTroll

10k people are the ones who not even try and just want to be carried.
If you think 20k groups dps is enough for the most basic stuff like blood spawn, go try it u will see.
Game has a lot dps race that no one give a fu-ck anymore because it is so easy to pass the req.

MakeMeUhSamich

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

10k DPS is awful and indicates a rotation problem, as others have said. You can hit 20-30k on every class with crafted gear.

^^^ This.

Katahdin

Kalgert wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

10k dps is a serious rotation problem, not a gear problem.

Excuse me, but I call that false.

I'm currently playing a Stamina Nightblade (Cliche, I know), using a bow and dual wielding. My bow attacks have pretty good burst (But apparently burst does not equal acceptable damage done), and can deal with packs quite well, and while melee I spam one main ability, mix in light and heavy attacks where needed, and yet I still don't break past 10k, despite doing everything that should be considered "Correct" in a rotation.

What else is there to turn on then, as opposed to what gear I am using and what setup I have with my CP's?

Yes, a rotation is one part of the course when it comes to dealing damage, but it is clear to me that a majority of it comes down from the gear, and gear itself requires spreadsheets (At least, that is the impression I am getting). That makes no sense to me.

I main stam blade as well. 10K is terrible, sorry
SNB is the hardest to master top dps with.
I am still trying to improve mine.

In dungeons you rely lot on stacking damage over time, not burst because in a fight with a boss with 3M health burst is not sustainable.

Rotation, passives, CP, attributes, max stam, resource management, gear and even your enchants all contribute to your dps numbers. If you're falling short, you need to make adjustments to some or all of the above.

Sting864

Thorstienn wrote: »

"Mix in light and heavy attacks where needed" is your problem, and why posters are meaning by rotation. Rotation in this game is not only the activation of your abilities in and appropriate order (I.e. buff, apply DoTs, spam, repeat), it's also light attack weaving/animation cancelling (The 2 are really the same). Light attacks need to be going off between (almost simultaneously) every ability. It's a feature(unintentional originally) the game developers have embraced fully and content is created (DPS checks) with it in mind.
NOTE: It is never explained or demonstrated in-game, so you can be forgiven for not knowing, it is all over the forums and in YouTube videos though so is often considered (unfairly) a "l2p" issue.
None of this is meant as an attack, and all stated in the nicest possible way.

DPS checks are a myth... Let's take it down to a simpler level...[SPOILERS] In one of the first mages' guild quests, you are presented with the choice of pushing some guy off a tower or not... Say you do... the guy's dead and can't help you fight your way up to the boss... your "DPS checks" on those mobs are a lot higher because that guy can't help you.... since he's dead... and you have to do all the damage... But say you let him live, and he's imprisoned with you, and can help you fight your way up to the boss... you're "DPS checks" are much smaller because he's helping you do damage... (admittedly not a bunch but he's also serving as a meat shield...)...[/SPOILERS]

Juju_beans

Obtaining BIS gear is not going to magically make your dps go from 10K to 30K.

I'm in Hundings/Spriggans and can do 25K-30K reliably. But it wasn't the gear because I got that when I hit cp160 and did 10K damage.

It was learning a new rotation, weaning myself off a big health pool and practice, practice, practice.

strangeradnd

Elite gear is a bit over rated and is only critical if you are looking for top scores. You can pretty easily get any of several sets of gear that will help get you where you need to be without worrying about having the best gold gear out there. As with others I agree that the 10k is a bit low for some of the vet content. You can clear most things at that level but your group needs to know what they are doing and must be patient, if you PUG it, forget it, it won't fly most of the time. From the sound of it you don't currently use much of a rotation and finding one that works for you will give you your biggest improvement. Even something as simple as using a couple AoE attacks then swapping your spam attack and light attacks a few times before you need to renew your AoEs can make a big difference. You can find good rotation suggestions everywhere if you want to look for one that works for you. Just as important is where your cp points are allocated, making sure you have things like good penetration so you can get more out of an attack can go a long way.

With all that said, I am not telling you how to play. If you like your current set up and are not interested in making changes, good for you, enjoying what you are doing matters more than meeting others requirements. Just remember some things will be harder and some people won't understand. I refuse to use 3rd person when I play and I know it makes some things harder and not everyone understands but it is what it is and I enjoy it more, and that is the only thing that matters.

VaranisArano

Sting864 wrote: »

Thorstienn wrote: »

"Mix in light and heavy attacks where needed" is your problem, and why posters are meaning by rotation. Rotation in this game is not only the activation of your abilities in and appropriate order (I.e. buff, apply DoTs, spam, repeat), it's also light attack weaving/animation cancelling (The 2 are really the same). Light attacks need to be going off between (almost simultaneously) every ability. It's a feature(unintentional originally) the game developers have embraced fully and content is created (DPS checks) with it in mind.
NOTE: It is never explained or demonstrated in-game, so you can be forgiven for not knowing, it is all over the forums and in YouTube videos though so is often considered (unfairly) a "l2p" issue.
None of this is meant as an attack, and all stated in the nicest possible way.

DPS checks are a myth... Let's take it down to a simpler level...[SPOILERS] In one of the first mages' guild quests, you are presented with the choice of pushing some guy off a tower or not... Say you do... the guy's dead and can't help you fight your way up to the boss... your "DPS checks" on those mobs are a lot higher because that guy can't help you.... since he's dead... and you have to do all the damage... But say you let him live, and he's imprisoned with you, and can help you fight your way up to the boss... you're "DPS checks" are much smaller because he's helping you do damage... (admittedly not a bunch but he's also serving as a meat shield...)...[/SPOILERS]

Its {spoiler} and {/spoiler} except you reaplce the {} brackets with [] brackets, FYI.

And overland questing DPS checks aren't really a thing. Vet City of Ash II would like to inform you that DPS checks in vet dungeons are a different matter.

Thorstienn

VaranisArano wrote: »

Not to diminish what you are saying, but light attack weaving (firing a light attack in between skills) is now a part of the Level Up Advisor's tips. So the devs really are embracing, and teaching, this rotation mechanics for DPS.

Did not notice that on my 1 new time through, bit I guess that would be a start. Thanks.

Sting864 wrote: »

DPS checks are a myth... Let's take it down to a simpler level...[SPOILERS] In one of the first mages' guild quests, you are presented with the choice of pushing some guy off a tower or not... Say you do... the guy's dead and can't help you fight your way up to the boss... your "DPS checks" on those mobs are a lot higher because that guy can't help you.... since he's dead... and you have to do all the damage... But say you let him live, and he's imprisoned with you, and can help you fight your way up to the boss... you're "DPS checks" are much smaller because he's helping you do damage... (admittedly not a bunch but he's also serving as a meat shield...)...[/SPOILERS]

Maybe "DPS check" wasn't the best term.
What I'm getting at are things like FG2 boss killing the adds (doable with enough rezzing), BC2 Daedroth filling the room with fire; Last boss infinite Daedroth adds, ICP 1 shot Flesh Atronachs. These are mechanics that require a certain amount of DPS.

Nestor

Kalgert wrote: »

while melee I spam one main ability, mix in light and heavy attacks where needed, and yet I still don't break past 10k, despite doing everything that should be considered "Correct" in a rotation.

@Kalgert

Spamming one ability is not a rotation.

Rotations, at their core, are simply:

1. Activate Buff Skills
2. Lay down AoE's
3. Use Damage Abilities until you need to activate Buffs or AoE's again. All the while weaving light or heavies in between skills. Note the weaving is more for resource preservation/recovery than for damage, although the damage helps for sure.

Here is a set up for each bar

Dualwield Mainbar Bow-second bar
Slot 1: Killer’s Blade Slot 1: Endless Hail
Slot 2: Deadly Cloak Slot 2: Rearming Trap
Slot 3: Surprise Attack Slot 3: Poison Injection
Slot 4: Rending Slashes Slot 4: Razor Caltrops
Slot 5: Relentless Focus Slot 5: Leeching Strikes
Ultimate: Flawless Dawnbreaker Ultimate: Incapacitating Strike

Here is how you apply the skills in a rotation

Make sure to activate Relentless Focus, Deadly Cloak and Leeching Strikes before the fight begins.

Rearming Trap > Light Attack > Endless Hail > Light Attack > Poison Injection > Light Attack > Razor Caltrops > Incapacitating Strike (if rready) > Weapon Swap

Surprise Attack > Heavy Attack > Rending Slashes > Heavy Attack > Surprise Attack > LA > Surprise Attack > LA > Deadly Cloak > Restart

Activate the Spectral Bow whenever it is ready.

Execute Phase: Do not refresh Rending Slashes anymore and use Killers Blade instead of Surprise Attacks.

Skill Set and Rotation, All this courtesy of @Alcast

https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-nightblade-build-for-pve/

Anyway, practice this or something like it, and you will see some amazing DPS. I can hit 17 top 23K single target on my bow using a much simpler rotation than above, and on my DW, 23K to 30K using a different rotation than described above. Key is to:

1. Activate Buff Skills
2. Lay down AoE's
3. Use Damage Abilities until you need to activate Buffs or AoE's again. All the while weaving light or heavies.

Aurielle

10k DPS is abysmal, sorry. My tank does 7-8k DPS in Ebon/Seducer/Infernal Guardian (or Grothdarr, if I don’t want to accidentally aggro something). You shouldn’t only be doing 2k more DPS than a tank. Look up a rotation, practice it, and attempt vet dungeons again when you’re in the 15-20k range. 15k is still pretty bad, mind you, but at least it would make me a LITTLE less likely to gouge my eyes out. Aim for 20k, then aim for 30k when you’re comfortable in the 20-25k range.

Edit: after reading the OP’s replies, I’m starting to think this is a troll thread. Well-played!

Oreyn_Bearclaw

10k DPS means you are fundamentally doing something wrong. One of a few things are likely. Your build has an obvious flaw, or your rotation is being performed incorrectly, or its just bad to begin with.

No you dont need 40k Single target to complete any content in this game. Most of it can be done with about 25k. That said, there is a lot of stuff you arent going to complete with 10k.

Kalgert

I don't know why, but I am getting an odd uncomfortable, angry feeling from reading some of the comments here. Seriously, I am not getting anything from people just saying "10k DPS is bad lel sry" (Not literary like that, but definitely bordering on it), and honestly... I feel like I might as well give up on trying to be a DPS and just stick to being a Tank, or play a Magicka Sorcerer which seem to be one of the big hot things to play with. I mean, I might as well, if I want to do anything close to Veteran Dungeons (Especially as a Tank, where I just have to stay alive and also help the team stay alive)

Aurielle wrote: »

Edit: after reading the OP’s replies, I’m starting to think this is a troll thread. Well-played!

Oh. Okay. I am a troll then, just because of... I don't know why, you tell me, because you think I am a "Troll".

Yeah. You're a pretty disrespectful person.

AlnilamE

But on the other hand, several people in this thread have given you (and me) useful advice.

What I can tell you is that BiS gear won't fix our problem. I have that (give or take a trait change or two). My DPS still sucks because I have never bothered practicing rotations. I do it somewhat, as in, buff, AoE and then try to spam weave, but I know there is a LOT of room for improvement and that's what I'm going to work for now.

So I would say, don't worry too much about gear for now and try out some of the rotations that were advised (and then try to tweak them if it makes you feel more comfortable).

Do you have access to a target dummy? That should help.

zaria

VaranisArano wrote: »

Kalgert wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

10k dps is a serious rotation problem, not a gear problem.

Excuse me, but I call that false.

I'm currently playing a Stamina Nightblade (Cliche, I know), using a bow and dual wielding. My bow attacks have pretty good burst (But apparently burst does not equal acceptable damage done), and can deal with packs quite well, and while melee I spam one main ability, mix in light and heavy attacks where needed, and yet I still don't break past 10k, despite doing everything that should be considered "Correct" in a rotation.

What else is there to turn on then, as opposed to what gear I am using and what setup I have with my CP's?

Yes, a rotation is one part of the course when it comes to dealing damage, but it is clear to me that a majority of it comes down from the gear, and gear itself requires spreadsheets (At least, that is the impression I am getting). That makes no sense to me.

PVE DPS is all about layering damage on top of itself. So most stamina DPS have a very standard Bow back bar: Endless Hail, Rearming Trap, Caltrops, Posion Injection to really amp up those DOTs, before swapping over to their front bar for more DOTs and single target spammables from dual wield and class abilities. In melee fights, I'm still dropping all my AOEs and DOTs because those damage sources add up enormously over time. The only time you need to spam one ability is when the boss is in execute range.

Here's a build I'm looking at, but really those skills I listed are pretty standard for Stam DPS - they're on my stam sorc, for example. https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-nightblade-build-for-pve/

Personally, I saw the biggest change in my DPS come when I got a proper rotation, not from getting meta gear.

I agree on you with stamblade, and magsorc, both has serious dots.

However back an year ago then I was around cp250 I tried to increase my dps on magplar.
I used an simple one bar rotation, shards, wall of elements and spamming sweep until repeat.
I did around 12K, julianos and mother sorrow.
I switched to an bis rotation and dropped to 10k, the problem was that sweeps was so strong that dumping all the dots took so much time I could use sweeping. Note that this was pre morrowind so sustain was not much of an issue.
I even tested this with keyboard macro to get an predictable result.
Golden weapons and some other improvements helped but bis was still below 15, and the three button rotation beat it.
Found that Structured Entropy then spamming Vampire's Bane took me to 18K.

I was also healing some stuff by accident it worked well, result templar does not have any dps sets, she gave it to an alt downward in the chain.
And yes pug queues are far shorter

Doctordarkspawn

Feanor wrote: »

Doing 10k DPS instead of 20 or 30 has nothing to do with gear and everything with how you use your skills. People are getting mad at you because nobody likes to carry others. It’s not that hard to reach 20k DPS, and that’s why most people don’t settle for much less in dungeon runs.

People say this, but honestly, gear helps more than people let on.

I'd say it's a 40/60 split between gear and skills.

I'd also like to say it really is much harder than elitists make it out to be to reach that DPS. It's not just rotation based, ESO has so many spinning plates to manage compared to other MMO's.

Kalgert

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

Doing 10k DPS instead of 20 or 30 has nothing to do with gear and everything with how you use your skills. People are getting mad at you because nobody likes to carry others. It’s not that hard to reach 20k DPS, and that’s why most people don’t settle for much less in dungeon runs.

People say this, but honestly, gear helps more than people let on.

I'd say it's a 40/60 split between gear and skills.

I'd also like to say it really is much harder than elitists make it out to be to reach that DPS. It's not just rotation based, ESO has so many spinning plates to manage compared to other MMO's.

So I am not crazy to think the way I do? Well, that is a relief.

And it is really doubtful that doing high octane amounts of DPS is as easy as people say it is. If it were, I'd be doing more than 25-30k in AoE with my bow and more than 10-13k in melee.

So I have a feeling that certain people who commented here are being a little dishonest.