So where did your ESO money go to if not to Zenimax?

Davor

I know we are all passionate about ESO otherwise we wouldn't be here.

I am curious if I am alone or not. I am not liking the practices that Zenimax is doing. For example on Friday the 13th they put out the special horse. (forgot the name sorry.) That is not what upset me because it was to have fun and get in the mood. What upset me is the price. $40 Canadian? That is what half the cost of the game. So is Zenimax telling me it takes that much work and effort to make that horse? I mean it takes more hours to make the actual game, more people. So shouldn't the main game be like $1000 then?

Yes I understand, it's a business and a product will bear what the customers will bear. But this just upset me for some reason. So here I am about to buy crowns to get quite a few stuff. Thing is, seeing how Zenimax likes to price these things, a $40 which really shouldn't be more than $5 but find $20 acceptable, is that I took my money and bought a full fledged game. After all if I am getting so little for my money I may as well get something is about the same price or even double and get like 1000X more in content and work hours for it.

So anyone else out there like me. You like/love/passionate about ESO but don't spend money on it because of Zenimax practices? If so, I am curious how much money Zenimax is loosing because of their practices. Yes I know you can't loose what you don't have, but then again, companies can make a profit of 10 million one year and the next year make 8 million in profit and say they lost 2 million dollars.

So how much is Zenimax not getting from you? I

Beardimus

Buy your crowns in a sale. Then everything is in essence half price.

They factor that into their pricing strategy, and know impulse people will pay full whack. So they win

Others, like me, buy in sales and only buy items that are in sales for double dip discounts

Casdha

Think of it like a Playstation or an Xbox, those companies don't make a profit off of the hardware and they may even loose money at first. They make their money off of what they sell to go with it.

Zenimax doesn't make hardware they make an MMO, The crown store is the product to make profit and the chapters are upgrades to keep the original product at full value. (Would Playstation or Xbox still be a thing if they never upgraded?)

Side note: I'm a PC player and I have owned an XB1 for about 2 or 3 years now. I'm a gold subscriber and I have bought exactly one game that did not come free with that subscription.

ESO I am a plus subscriber and I have bought nothing from the crown store outside of what I get with the crowns that come with my subscription. However, I have bought every upgrade or chapter.

Do I need to go on? Hope this helps

dennissomb16_ESO

For me it is the "chapters" model that has made me look elsewhere. I realize most people are happy with the model and that is cool but for me I have taken that potential money and ESO+ money and have simple bought future games (in this case WoW next expansion and Camelot Unchained even though it will not be out until 2019)

Davor

I tried buying crowns on sale but I have a thing called a wife. When I save the money, she spends it. It always seems the sales are on a non pay week. LOL.

Oh I understand how businesses work. It just upsets me like that Zenimax is just "flaunting" better word or not, on what they can sell. Just like with Games Workshop years ago, they think their product is a Ferrari when really it's people who buy Chevys and Fords and Toyotas who are really buying their product.

In other words they are charging Ferrari prices for their work when in reality the product they are producing is really Walmart quality. In other words the work they are doing is really made to be sold low and lots of instead of sold high and sell few.

Maybe Bethesda has just spoiled me with all the content they put out for the price they sell. :P

ak_pvp

I like the current cosmetic trend. People complain about gambling, but it keeps the base game/content nice and cheap and not P2W. And its basically opt in only. Is it expensive, yeah, but its your choice to be the shiniest.

Davor

dennissomb16_ESO wrote: »

For me it is the "chapters" model that has made me look elsewhere. I realize most people are happy with the model and that is cool but for me I have taken that potential money and ESO+ money and have simple bought future games (in this case WoW next expansion and Camelot Unchained even though it will not be out until 2019)

Just like me. Money that would have went to Zenimax has gone to other games now. Thing is, if I am playing other games, how will I be spending money on ESO then?

Davor

ak_pvp wrote: »

I like the current cosmetic trend. People complain about gambling, but it keeps the base game/content nice and cheap and not P2W. And its basically opt in only. Is it expensive, yeah, but its your choice to be the shiniest.

Nice point. I never saw it that way. Keeping the base game cheap and not P2W. Thank you so much for bringing that up.

Always good to see another perspective. That is why I made this post. Again thank you for it. I might not like it still but at least I can understand a bit. Still don't like it, but t least I can understand.

Cpt_Teemo

ak_pvp wrote: »

I like the current cosmetic trend. People complain about gambling, but it keeps the base game/content nice and cheap and not P2W. And its basically opt in only. Is it expensive, yeah, but its your choice to be the shiniest.

Well each state is now cracking down on gambling boxes whatsoever on online content games included, so probably just a matter of time before every game changes there ways

SBC

My money goes to beer until they have a crown sale, then I'm gonna throw my wallet at it. I have almost 20k crowns rotting on console since I switched, so I need to catch up now =(

Edit: to clarify...there will still be beer regardless.

WhiteCoatSyndrome

I bought myself my first-ever set of PnP gaming dice. The rest is going towards the RL house fund for now.

Narvuntien

Yeah the base game would realistically cost $1000

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhWGQCzAtl8&t=2s

I only bought the crowns for the DLCs (and bought morrowind on sale at half price).. they were pretty all great so I am happy with my purchase. I would suggest just not buying things if you don't have the money. I never even considered buying the elk or whatever it was, I just don't have the money to burn on such things. But some people do and its their money they can spend that money.

The artists do a really amazing job for the game, I mean holy wow the art in this game. Then their art directly converted into dollars to pay their salaries through the crown store.

WillhelmBlack

Horse Armour

SBC

Narvuntien wrote: »

Yeah the base game would realistically cost $1000

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhWGQCzAtl8&t=2s

I only bought the crowns for the DLCs (and bought morrowind on sale at half price).. they were pretty all great so I am happy with my purchase. I would suggest just not buying things if you don't have the money. I never even considered buying the elk or whatever it was, I just don't have the money to burn on such things. But some people do and its their money they can spend that money.

The artists do a really amazing job for the game, I mean holy wow the art in this game. Then their art directly converted into dollars to pay their salaries through the crown store.

Great video

sylviermoone

dennissomb16_ESO wrote: »

For me it is the "chapters" model that has made me look elsewhere. I realize most people are happy with the model and that is cool but for me I have taken that potential money and ESO+ money and have simple bought future games (in this case WoW next expansion and Camelot Unchained even though it will not be out until 2019)

Soooo... ESO's expansions upset you so much that you bought another game's expansion? And now you're taking your optional sub to a mandatory sub game?

I don't get it.

Kiralyn2000

Davor wrote: »

What upset me is the price. $40 Canadian? That is what half the cost of the game. So is Zenimax telling me it takes that much work and effort to make that horse?

No, they're telling you it's a special cosmetic luxury. Not that it took 2/3rds of the effort to make as it takes to make a game.

Just like "designer" jeans that cost $400 didn't take much more effort to make than $30 utilitarian ones.


Personally, I prefer when cosmetics are overpriced rather than actual functional game packs (DLC, classes, skill lines, etc). Why? Because useful game content is something people might actually "need", as opposed to cosmetic items. Overpricing the actual game parts of the game is much more reprehensible than charging $100 for a diamond-studded bikini (in some other MMOs, of course )



...that's not to say that I think all luxuries (cosmetics, houses, pets...) should be overpriced. People enjoy that stuff, and you need to have a range of them so that everyone can have some fun with it.

generalmyrick

Davor wrote: »

I know we are all passionate about ESO otherwise we wouldn't be here.

I am curious if I am alone or not. I am not liking the practices that Zenimax is doing. For example on Friday the 13th they put out the special horse. (forgot the name sorry.) That is not what upset me because it was to have fun and get in the mood. What upset me is the price. $40 Canadian? That is what half the cost of the game. So is Zenimax telling me it takes that much work and effort to make that horse? I mean it takes more hours to make the actual game, more people. So shouldn't the main game be like $1000 then?

Yes I understand, it's a business and a product will bear what the customers will bear. But this just upset me for some reason. So here I am about to buy crowns to get quite a few stuff. Thing is, seeing how Zenimax likes to price these things, a $40 which really shouldn't be more than $5 but find $20 acceptable, is that I took my money and bought a full fledged game. After all if I am getting so little for my money I may as well get something is about the same price or even double and get like 1000X more in content and work hours for it.

So anyone else out there like me. You like/love/passionate about ESO but don't spend money on it because of Zenimax practices? If so, I am curious how much money Zenimax is loosing because of their practices. Yes I know you can't loose what you don't have, but then again, companies can make a profit of 10 million one year and the next year make 8 million in profit and say they lost 2 million dollars.

So how much is Zenimax not getting from you? I

invest it in dividend paying stocks!

its so cool to read your bank account and see that someone is paying you money!

boombazookajd

strippers and my nose

Elsonso

Davor wrote: »

So anyone else out there like me. You like/love/passionate about ESO but don't spend money on it because of Zenimax practices? If so, I am curious how much money Zenimax is loosing because of their practices.
So how much is Zenimax not getting from you? I

Yes. Money I would have spent on ESO now goes to others. I got tired of their hand in my pocket and started changing my spending habits way back last year. For 2017, and into 2018, this has mostly been avoidance. When I have had the opportunity to spend additional money with ZOS and Bethesda, I have simply not done so, or have spent less.

I all but stopped playing on PS4. That eliminated the need to purchase Crowns, or subscribe to ESO Plus, there. I bought Morrowind for PS4, but am not planning to buy Summerset.

I had a second account that I was planning to pick up ESO Plus on back in 2017, and decided against that. Instead of a 180 ESO Plus, I picked up 5500 Crowns for that account. On sale. Not planning to pre-order Summerset on that account, either.

My main account ESO Plus expires mid-year. Renewal is not a certainty, although it will get Summerset. I have been prepping for the last several months to drop ESO Plus on this account. That subscription money will go to another game, which I will not name. My allegiance goes to the game I pay a subscription for, and I only do one at a time. When that happens, ESO moves to "secondary game" status for me, which means I probably won't be spending any money on it, even if I do play.

ESO is still my favorite game, but I am really looking for a game where the studio and publisher are not squeezing blood from turnips. I don't feel that my money is well spent with ZOS/Bethesda. I feel like whatever I spend, they just want more. On top of that, what they are giving me does not always have a value that matches what I spend on it. Costumes that color poorly are a really big problem in this game. We get texture and mesh errors, oversights, and shortcuts that do not really meet the definition of "premium", and are never fixed. They sell limited time stuff that really isn't that much better than what is out there, but costs more. Loot boxes.

I figure there are enough out there willing to be squeezed that ZOS and Bethesda don't care what any one of us do, individually.

Dymence

You can't compare the game price vs cosmetic prices as cosmetics are pure luxury items. You don't need them and they don't affect the game in any way.

It'd be like comparing essential life items vs. those expensive designer clothings that you might want.

starkerealm

If you're asking, "would I be playing another MMO, if ESO wasn't here?" Probably not.

Davor wrote: »

I am curious if I am alone or not. I am not liking the practices that Zenimax is doing. For example on Friday the 13th they put out the special horse. (forgot the name sorry.)

The, Great Dark Stag, or something like that. I'll be honest, I'm not a fan of the elk, nor it's shadow version. But, it comes up for sale every Friday the 13th. If you do want it, it'll be up again on... *checks calendar* September 13th, 2019... well, that's a wait.

To be honest, I keep an eye on the crown store showcases, and I'm a little careful about what I pick up in them. There's also some reasonable patterns to follow. Really unique costumes on characters, like Naryu's and the Cinematic heroes will pop up eventually (and they did.) Raz's new outfit showed up in the Boston preview on a player character. Well, I guess I need to save some cash for that.

I also keep track of datamining. There's a Russian site that posts upcoming crown store data with each client update. It won't tell you where something's getting added, but you can see the preview thumbnails. So that helps. Once you control for that, it's all about patience, planning, and not chasing ever bauble that pops up.

Now, if the demon elk was your jam, and you really wanted it, I can't fault you for being salty at all. If it was just, "that'd be neat," my recommendation, especially at that price, would be, "stick a pin in it, fish around, find the datamine threads, and look for stuff you really want, and plan accordingly, rather than chasing everything as it shows up."

jedtb16_ESO

sylviermoone wrote: »

dennissomb16_ESO wrote: »

For me it is the "chapters" model that has made me look elsewhere. I realize most people are happy with the model and that is cool but for me I have taken that potential money and ESO+ money and have simple bought future games (in this case WoW next expansion and Camelot Unchained even though it will not be out until 2019)

Soooo... ESO's expansions upset you so much that you bought another game's expansion? And now you're taking your optional sub to a mandatory sub game?

I don't get it.

^this...

and anyway what is eso money?

Marcus684

I don’t understand why these threads keep popping up? Why does anyone care what someone else spends their money on in-game if it’s not P2W? I have purchased exactly ZERO crowns because of I have too many RL things I have to spend my income on, but I don’t begrudge others their spending habits. In fact, people who buy crowns and crown store items allow cheapskates like me to keep playing. I do subscribe, but I don’t believe subs alone would support the cost of running this game, so they need the Crown Store. If you don’t want to pay their high prices, then don’t.

VaranisArano

Before ESO, I spent money on Skyrim, then Oblivion, then Morrowind.

After ESO, I will spend money on the next single-player Elder Scrolls game.

What can I say? I know my niche in the video game market.

dennissomb16_ESO

sylviermoone wrote: »

dennissomb16_ESO wrote: »

For me it is the "chapters" model that has made me look elsewhere. I realize most people are happy with the model and that is cool but for me I have taken that potential money and ESO+ money and have simple bought future games (in this case WoW next expansion and Camelot Unchained even though it will not be out until 2019)

Soooo... ESO's expansions upset you so much that you bought another game's expansion? And now you're taking your optional sub to a mandatory sub game?

I don't get it.

It is simple really. Perceived value is everything. The expansions that I purchase in other games are so much bigger then the chapters of ESO that I put my money towards the other games. I happily paid ESO+ when I was continuing to get all content for free. If their chapters were a true expansion then I would have also paid for them

Instead they are really simply DLCs that we pay on top of ESO+ and for that model I prefer to purchase larger expansions in other games that I still like

Danikat

For me it's fairly straight forward: If I think a product is worth the price then I buy it, if it costs more than I think it's worth then I don't.

Importantly there are two variables there. Some items I wouldn't get if ZOS paid me to take them because I dislike them that much. Others I'd pay more than I'd normally consider reasonable because I like them that much. But there's plenty of items I like but don't buy because they're over priced. (And some - the shadowghost mounts for example - where I'm pleasantly surprised and they actually cost less than I was intending to spend.)

BloodWolfe

I am sick of Zeni's practices too and have since cancelled my ESO+ sub and will no longer sub again or ever purchase crowns. I love this game but I hate ZO$'s shady and EA-style greed lately and I haven't spent money on an EA title in a very very long time and ZOS has now joined them and will never see my money again. I don't care if this stuff is cosmetic, it's still a ridiculous nickel and dime tactic and they've pushed me away. I understand profits need to be made but ZO$ has gone too far.

My money has gone back to Blizzard and I am currently back to WoW for my MMO game time, otherwise back to single player for me. Monster Hunter World was my first purchase this year and I pre-purchased WoW:BfA so so far this year ZO$ just lost $164 CAD (roughly, 2 games plus 1 sub) from me that Capcom and Bliz were happy to receive.

Everyones view of value is different and ZO$ has pushed me away. I have no issues paying for a sub because I want to support games I enjoy as long as I feel the value is still worth it and because of the absurd crown shop prices, crates (which I never once supported but especially the radiant apex mounts not even obtainable by gems for those who do buy the crates is total and utter BS), housing prices are the cost of 2 AAA games and they only ever make new ones as large overpriced ones, the outfit slots being 1500 crowns per slot per char, etc.... lots more but those are all I felt like complaining about for now. I have better things to do today.

I keep an eye on the forums and this game in hopes ZO$ will improve/change but I'm starting to lose hope on that. EA never did so doesn't look like ZO$ will. Hopefully, for ESO's sake ZO$ never goes P2W because I would hate to see the Elder Scrolls name in general be sullied by a company like ZO$ and their greed. I will stick to the single player TES games whenever TES6 arrives.

DocDova

Yup, overpriced But Many people buy them, So who are we to complain. Personally I would never spend any real money in game for cosmetic reasons/mounts/pets. I only have crowns received with plus membership and I am saving them to buy a notable house and then maybe a merchant.

Caligamy_ESO

Davor wrote: »

dennissomb16_ESO wrote: »

For me it is the "chapters" model that has made me look elsewhere. I realize most people are happy with the model and that is cool but for me I have taken that potential money and ESO+ money and have simple bought future games (in this case WoW next expansion and Camelot Unchained even though it will not be out until 2019)

Just like me. Money that would have went to Zenimax has gone to other games now. Thing is, if I am playing other games, how will I be spending money on ESO then?

Same here, I dropped ESO+ around when the Morrowind thing came up because I hated the business model change, and have no plans or desires to ever subscribe again. Now when I DO actually logon to ESO (like for the anniversary event for motifs.. lol) I just shake my head at the prices of new things like extra outfits, motifs, mounts, costumes that you just look at for the price of a full game that could bring you 1000s of hours of entertainment versus looking at something that does literally nothing. Some people are ok with that, and more power to them but for me it was the nail in the coffin I needed for this game to change me from hardcore every day player to casual maybe 4 short playtimes a year.

Syncronaut

Narvuntien wrote: »

Yeah the base game would realistically cost $1000

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhWGQCzAtl8&t=2s

I only bought the crowns for the DLCs (and bought morrowind on sale at half price).. they were pretty all great so I am happy with my purchase. I would suggest just not buying things if you don't have the money. I never even considered buying the elk or whatever it was, I just don't have the money to burn on such things. But some people do and its their money they can spend that money.

The artists do a really amazing job for the game, I mean holy wow the art in this game. Then their art directly converted into dollars to pay their salaries through the crown store.

Horible video. This is more realisic:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcebekI9F7g&t=2s

DoctorESO

Davor wrote: »

I know we are all passionate about ESO otherwise we wouldn't be here.

I am curious if I am alone or not. I am not liking the practices that Zenimax is doing. For example on Friday the 13th they put out the special horse. (forgot the name sorry.) That is not what upset me because it was to have fun and get in the mood. What upset me is the price. $40 Canadian? That is what half the cost of the game. So is Zenimax telling me it takes that much work and effort to make that horse? I mean it takes more hours to make the actual game, more people. So shouldn't the main game be like $1000 then?

Yes I understand, it's a business and a product will bear what the customers will bear. But this just upset me for some reason. So here I am about to buy crowns to get quite a few stuff. Thing is, seeing how Zenimax likes to price these things, a $40 which really shouldn't be more than $5 but find $20 acceptable, is that I took my money and bought a full fledged game. After all if I am getting so little for my money I may as well get something is about the same price or even double and get like 1000X more in content and work hours for it.

So anyone else out there like me. You like/love/passionate about ESO but don't spend money on it because of Zenimax practices? If so, I am curious how much money Zenimax is loosing because of their practices. Yes I know you can't loose what you don't have, but then again, companies can make a profit of 10 million one year and the next year make 8 million in profit and say they lost 2 million dollars.

So how much is Zenimax not getting from you? I

The game is continually growing and improving, so ZOS needs more than an initial one-time game purchase. I get your point about wanting to only pay $5-20, and that is perfectly fine, and ZOS has items in that price range. But they also have items at higher price points that other people are willing to pay. It doesn't mean everyone has to buy it.