Update 47 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/680228
QUIT HOMOGENIZING THE GAME!!!
Abysswarrior45
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Please take a look at the changes to each class with this upcoming chapter and give back class identity. Dks especially, thank you! -__-
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Abysswarrior45✭✭✭✭SydneyGrey wrote: »People are never happy.
If critics didn't exist, no changes would ever be made and the world would be a pile of ***. Do you disagree and believe everything should be the same? Sounds pretty boring if you ask me.7 -
duendology✭✭✭✭✭I am tired of this kind of threads...PC/NA
- Redguard StamBlade dps ["bowtard" crafty girl who likes spinning with daggers too.]
- Breton SorcMag dps [She's got an identity crisis, but I believe in her.]
- Dunmer Templar dps/healer [she's a healer, then again she likes inferno staff too...]
And..
- High Elf SorcMag dps [It's quite possible his daddy was a Nord.]
I am an old-fashioned Goth5 -
Abysswarrior45✭✭✭✭duendology wrote: »I am tired of this kind of threads...
Don't click on it. Quite simple, really.12 -
PlagueSD✭✭✭✭✭
✭Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Please take a look at the changes to each class with this upcoming chapter and give back class identity. Dks especially, thank you! -__-
How do you expect to balance the different classes. Pretty soon we'll just have 1 class and balance will have been achieved.0 -
Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Please take a look at the changes to each class with this upcoming chapter and give back class identity. Dks especially, thank you! -__-
NBs in disguise.0 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Honestly, people hating alot on the DK changes.
They gave him a few heals, they shifted some buffs around, and they gave him a snare clear.
Why are you complaining?8 -
SydneyGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭My characters have been nerfed and nerfed, and nerfed again over the past year. I'm happy they'll be buffed this time around. So excited for this patch.4 -
Sabbathius✭✭✭✭Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Please take a look at the changes to each class with this upcoming chapter and give back class identity. Dks especially, thank you! -__-
How do you expect to balance the different classes. Pretty soon we'll just have 1 class and balance will have been achieved.
On a serious note, this is a viable option. Just kill classes and let people cherrypick what they need for any given situation. At that point we'll just be talking about tuning individual skills, and class rivalry will be nonexistent. We'll never again see "NB OP!" or "Nerf Sorc!" threads from people who just lost to one. We'll still see "Nerf Snipe!", but it's baby steps, and also easier to deal with. Of course ZOS won't do that, because new classes (especially P2W kind, not saying Warden is, just in theory) are such an excellent monetization tool. But if they wanted a semblance of balance, removing classes is a viable way to do it.
EVE Online is a prime example. There's no classes in the game, anyone can fly any ship and use any weapon, and all races are identical (give or take). Is it homogenized? On paper, yes. In practice, there's way more variety. Like back when races mattered in that game, everyone was Achura as a combat pilot, you just gimped yourself too badly otherwise. And in ESO, we see that with Altmer for Magicka and Redguard for Stamina. But after race impact was tuned way down to almost nil in EVE, we saw a much, much better distribution of races (less homogenized population). And at the same time, there's a lot less whining going on, and issues are easier to fix if some individual item is overperforming.Edited by Sabbathius on April 3, 2018 8:23PM4 -
Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This is what they wanted since launch I thought, the idea every class can do every roll well enough to be an option.@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."3 -
Abysswarrior45✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Honestly, people hating alot on the DK changes.
They gave him a few heals, they shifted some buffs around, and they gave him a snare clear.
Why are you complaining?
Do you play ESO? Wings are a snare removal without snare immunity which is useless since everything snares in PVP especially in outnumbered/solo situations. Heals are nice but not needed and were completely unnecessary. Sorcs have been given the same CC dks have but at a greater range, wardens have been given the reflect that dks have but its better in every way...Edited by Abysswarrior45 on April 3, 2018 8:21PM0 -
Cadbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭duendology wrote: »I am tired of this kind of threads...
I like these kind of threads
Just relax, grab some popcorn, and enjoy until thread lock"If a person is truly desirous of something, perhaps being set on fire does not seem so bad."0 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Honestly, people hating alot on the DK changes.
They gave him a few heals, they shifted some buffs around, and they gave him a snare clear.
Why are you complaining?
Do you play ESO? Wings are a snare removal without snare immunity which is useless since everything snares in PVP especially in outnumbered/solo situations. Heals are nice but not needed and were completely unnecessary. Sorcs have been given the same CC dks have but at a greater range, wardens have been given the reflect that dks have but its better in every way...
I play ESO. I dont play PVP.
And this seems like a PVE focused patch, which is long overdue.
Feels nice to be on this side of the nerfs for a change.6 -
DMuehlhausen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is what they wanted since launch I thought, the idea every class can do every roll well enough to be an option.
Yeah, but the thing is that isn't going to make more healers or tanks. That is play style and personality types. It would be better if each class felt unique. Even if only Templars and Sorcs can heal and only DKs and Templars could tank etc.
The other reason it doesn't matter is unless you just say there is no class here are all your skills MIN/MAXers are still going to figure out the best build and that is what people will want to play.1 -
Abysswarrior45✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Honestly, people hating alot on the DK changes.
They gave him a few heals, they shifted some buffs around, and they gave him a snare clear.
Why are you complaining?
Do you play ESO? Wings are a snare removal without snare immunity which is useless since everything snares in PVP especially in outnumbered/solo situations. Heals are nice but not needed and were completely unnecessary. Sorcs have been given the same CC dks have but at a greater range, wardens have been given the reflect that dks have but its better in every way...
I play ESO. I dont play PVP.
And this seems like a PVE focused patch, which is long overdue.
Feels nice to be on this side of the nerfs for a change.
Funnily enough the game was advertised around PvP and its the reason many bought the game. Furthermore, PvP has gotten worse with every patch after IC so this is yet another PvE focused patch. I love people who say PvE content is broken and then follow up with a "I don't PvP." You haven't seen broken until you've played in Cyrodiil for a significant amount of time and watched it devolve into the mess it is now where skill is actually irrelevant!2 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Honestly, people hating alot on the DK changes.
They gave him a few heals, they shifted some buffs around, and they gave him a snare clear.
Why are you complaining?
Do you play ESO? Wings are a snare removal without snare immunity which is useless since everything snares in PVP especially in outnumbered/solo situations. Heals are nice but not needed and were completely unnecessary. Sorcs have been given the same CC dks have but at a greater range, wardens have been given the reflect that dks have but its better in every way...
I play ESO. I dont play PVP.
And this seems like a PVE focused patch, which is long overdue.
Feels nice to be on this side of the nerfs for a change.
Funnily enough the game was advertised around PvP and its the reason many bought the game. Furthermore, PvP has gotten worse with every patch after IC so this is yet another PvE focused patch. I love people who say PvE content is broken and then follow up with a "I don't PvP." You haven't seen broken until you've played in Cyrodiil for a significant amount of time and watched it devolve into the mess it is now where skill is actually irrelevant!
PVP has got worse after every patch despite alot of them being PVP centric.
Yeah maybe we need more PVE patches if it's state is going to deteriorate no matter what they do. If it's a lost cause, why try, especially when that disparity between players killed, and monsters killed looms like a specter
Edited by Doctordarkspawn on April 3, 2018 8:29PM1 -
Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
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I agree with all that. But that doesn't mean Nightblade tanks, DK healers etc. shouldn't have more options to be better in the role if they want to play that.DMuehlhausen wrote: »This is what they wanted since launch I thought, the idea every class can do every roll well enough to be an option.
Yeah, but the thing is that isn't going to make more healers or tanks. That is play style and personality types. It would be better if each class felt unique. Even if only Templars and Sorcs can heal and only DKs and Templars could tank etc.
The other reason it doesn't matter is unless you just say there is no class here are all your skills MIN/MAXers are still going to figure out the best build and that is what people will want to play.
Edit: For example I am levelling a Templar Tank ATM. Do you know how nice it will be to join groups and not get trash talk because I can't chain? I can finally do the one thing which my class couldn't and everyone hated all tanks but DK for. I can play the character I enjoy and have fun, sure I may never have all the advantages of DK from shields etc. but at least I can do the base expectations now.Edited by Turelus on April 3, 2018 8:29PM@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."3 -
srfrogg23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I’m more curious than anything. What’s the OP talking about? I haven’t seen the patch notes yet.0 -
FlamingBeard✭✭✭✭✭DMuehlhausen wrote: »This is what they wanted since launch I thought, the idea every class can do every roll well enough to be an option.
Yeah, but the thing is that isn't going to make more healers or tanks. That is play style and personality types. It would be better if each class felt unique. Even if only Templars and Sorcs can heal and only DKs and Templars could tank etc.
The other reason it doesn't matter is unless you just say there is no class here are all your skills MIN/MAXers are still going to figure out the best build and that is what people will want to play.
This isn’t very accurate. I know plenty of people who don’t like healing because they dislike Templar’s aesthetic and playstyle, as well as many would-be tanks who would prefer to use a Nightblade/Templar/Warden/Sorcerer if they were anywhere near as viable as Dragonknight at tanking.1 -
DMuehlhausen✭✭✭✭✭
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I agree with all that. But that doesn't mean Nightblade tanks, DK healers etc. shouldn't have more options to be better in the role if they want to play that.DMuehlhausen wrote: »This is what they wanted since launch I thought, the idea every class can do every roll well enough to be an option.
Yeah, but the thing is that isn't going to make more healers or tanks. That is play style and personality types. It would be better if each class felt unique. Even if only Templars and Sorcs can heal and only DKs and Templars could tank etc.
The other reason it doesn't matter is unless you just say there is no class here are all your skills MIN/MAXers are still going to figure out the best build and that is what people will want to play.
Sure, but even now Sorcs, and NBs can heal effectively (in 4 mans) never seen a DK healer probably exist but rare. So they can do it, but because they aren't the "META" people don't do them. Making these changes won't change that cause there will still be a "best" one out there.
I'm with you, if there was a way to make feel unique, and still fill all roles essentially the equally I'm down, but sadly just like PvE and PvP it just isn't a balance that is achievable.0 -
Abysswarrior45✭✭✭✭I’m more curious than anything. What’s the OP talking about? I haven’t seen the patch notes yet.
Let me assist you with the known changes SO FAR. Threads like this exist to create further changes. https://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/89e1in/summerset_update_18_teaser_a_recap_of_last_weeks/?st=JFJRF712&sh=4be75fac0 -
Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
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@srfrogg23 no patch notes yet, but those who went to ZOS were allowed to talk about what they saw. Alcast has a good TL;DR fo the skill changes.I’m more curious than anything. What’s the OP talking about? I haven’t seen the patch notes yet.
https://alcasthq.com/eso-summerset-isles-changes-pre-pts/@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."0 -
Panomania✭✭✭✭There arent any, because nothing as yet is written in stone. Its very early to be kvetching about this type thing, but it happens with every major patch/change....and quite often it ends up nowhere near what people thought it was going to be.
But thats the nature of the majority of the MMO playerbase, and humanity in general these days: they arent happy unless they can be a victim.Edited by Panomania on April 3, 2018 8:32PMThe opinions of others should always be heard, especially if they dont agree with your own! But you always reserve the right to laugh at them.0 -
Abysswarrior45✭✭✭✭There arent any, because nothing as yet is written in stone. Its very early to be kvetching about this type thing, but it happens with every major patch/change....and quite often it ends up nowhere near what people thought it was going to be.
But thats the nature of the majority of the MMO playerbase, and humanity in general these days: they arent happy unless they can be a victim.
Further changes occur because of threads like these! Thats why people make them.
[Edited for bashing]Edited by ZOS_Mika on April 9, 2018 1:53PM1 -
Sabbathius✭✭✭✭Abysswarrior45 wrote: »Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Honestly, people hating alot on the DK changes.
They gave him a few heals, they shifted some buffs around, and they gave him a snare clear.
Why are you complaining?
Do you play ESO? Wings are a snare removal without snare immunity which is useless since everything snares in PVP especially in outnumbered/solo situations. Heals are nice but not needed and were completely unnecessary. Sorcs have been given the same CC dks have but at a greater range, wardens have been given the reflect that dks have but its better in every way...
I think our picture is incomplete. The Update 18 preview also states that the way snares work will change. Major snares will get shorter, minor ones will be longer. So, perhaps, having a way to deal with snares won't be such a big deal. Also, new jewelry traits, in theory you can give yourself ~10-30% movement speed passive with jewelry alone. Which will significantly reduce the impact of snares. Also Psijic line will give everyone easy access to Major Expedition, regardless of class, and we don't even know what the morphs are.0 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This is what they wanted since launch I thought, the idea every class can do every roll well enough to be an option.
I couldn't agree more. Nobody should roll a class and discover a year later, "OMG, I made the worst mistake of my life!"
Classes should have their own distinct identity, but they should also be as capable of tackling any content in the game as well as any other. For example, I don't think it's good if people think they MUST have a Sorc or a Nightblade to complete VMA.#CAREBEARMASTERRACE3
