The Dark Brotherhood...

madchuska83

...is the most annoying DLC ever. They lock the quests behind your DB level, which forces you to go through one of the worst grinds in history.

Loading screen after loading screen for 5-10 DB points and 1 daily that gives 10-20 DB points. These contracts from Elam require you to travel all over Tamriel. Every zone. So if you're a low level character expect to encounter even more significant travel times. If you do happen to have wayshrine unlocked you can still expect at least 4 loading screens for those 5-10 points. I think I'll just say "F this" on all other toons.

Congrats on creating something so off putting and still managing to charge money for it.

Kodrac

I've never finished DB for this very reason.

Nemesis7884

just abandon the repeatable until u get the killing sprees that give you 10 each and do 3-4 pf those....then its quite fast

vyndral13preub18_ESO

It is annoying. But it is what happens when a dev tries to half ass it. They don’t make enough content to last more then a day or two, but are to afraid to just bite the bullet and say yes we are selling 6 hours or so of content. Nope we will try to inflate our numbers with repeatable trash.

Remember the old days when repeatable trash was to get the extra unlocks. Like mounts and costumes? Now now we lock actual content behind repeatable trash and sell you mounts and costumes. How far we have come.

Valkysas154

There is a really good addon called - DarkBrotherhoodSpree -

http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1926-DarkBrotherhoodSpree.html

This will allow you to get the spree quest - kill 3 ppl in a area - gives 10 points in the guild so 5 quest = 1 level up for the guild
it wont show up in your addon section in game tho fyi

Also being a in a guild will help with porting by just porting to guild members instead

VaranisArano

I just equipped Darkstride gear so I could run the whole way to and from places and rejected everything that wasn't a spree quest. On a low level character, you'll only get the Kvatch, Anvil, and your faction zone sprees, so its not hard to knock them out while moving quickly once you know the wayshrines.

TheShadowScout

madchuska83 wrote: »

They lock the quests behind your DB level, which forces you to go through one of the worst grinds in history...

...and you think TG is any better? They are pretty much the same, really.

Still, if you do them after completing cadwells, its not such a big deal, really. (also because at that time you would have your legerdemain raised from all the "unprofessional" stealing and plundering you done during that time, which helps a lot in some cases!)

Which is why I think their "One Tamriel" decision to unlock all quests for everyone right away may not have been the best one... but eh.

One thing that -does- help is not trying to do them all at once. Do one TD/DB stage, then start on a new map in cadwells, or do Craglorn, or go lurk around Orsinium for a bit, then do some more thieving/murdering, then go to Cyrodil for some PvP, then do some more thieving/murdering, then visit Vvardenfell, then do some more thieving/murdering... etc. That way you'll raise your TG/DB level "en passant" and it never feels like too much of a grind...

What vexes me a little is that they didn't think to refit "relevant" quests with guild advancement. it would have been so neat if stealing those wine bottles in Stonefalls, ot those dwemer components in Auridion, or other theft-related quests gave your character some TG credit, or choosing to let the shadowscales have that fang of sithis or murder-for-hire related quests gained you some DB goodwill...

Hluill

Huh, I was wondering why my characters weren't being offered new quests...

Did I miss the dialogue when this was explained? "Come back after you level up."

Looks like I am not going to complete either of these DLCs then. I can only take so much of being a scummy character.

madchuska83

Suggestions for improvement; Make the Sanctuary a wayshrine and give 1 DB point for each citizen murdered with The Blade of Woe.

dodgehopper_ESO

I would like to see alternative stories to DB with Order of the Hour, and alternatives to thieves guild with the Iron Wheel of Taneth. I enjoy doing both TG and DB but I do feel it could use updates in the future. I liked having stealth missions in Morrowind and would to see more like that going forward for stealth play. What bothers me though is that the storyline forces you to ignore huge swaths of content or play something villainous. Alternative choices would be nice in the future.

opaj

Hluill wrote: »

Huh, I was wondering why my characters weren't being offered new quests...

Did I miss the dialogue when this was explained? "Come back after you level up."

Looks like I am not going to complete either of these DLCs then. I can only take so much of being a scummy character.

Mages and Fighters Guild follow the same rules. Of course, those two Guild skill lines tend to level up naturally through normal gameplay, so most people don't notice that the story quests are gated.

strangeradnd

madchuska83 wrote: »

Suggestions for improvement; Make the Sanctuary a wayshrine and give 1 DB point for each citizen murdered with The Blade of Woe.

That would give players 20+ points just for looting the Anvil castle, might be a little overly generous. I do think an alternate mechanic like fighters and mages guild have would be good though.

Anotherone773

Id say DB is the most annoying storyline ive encountered so far. Im doing it on my main right now, sort of. Its frustrating so i dont focus on it a lot. By time you get DB leveled enough to get to the next quest in the story you have done forgot the story, so it kills any hope of immersion.

The only reason im doing it is because there is a skill or two i want besides BoW for my thief and also the skill points. It is kind of a terrible setup when compared to the storylines in the rest of the game that ive encountered so far.

strangeradnd

I actually found it to run pretty quickly. It is only 50 points per level. You get 10 - 20 per quest section completed, 10 -20 for sacraments, ( if you take your time and find both targets first then eliminate them in the proper order you will usually get the 20) and 5 - 10 per contract.(you can opt into to 10 every time) Under the worst circumstances you usually start 10 points in leaving 40, so one sacrament and one contract each over 2 days is the longest it should take to level and that would be stretching it out as you will likely get more points and can run extra contracts.

Juju_beans

Hluill wrote: »

Huh, I was wondering why my characters weren't being offered new quests...

Did I miss the dialogue when this was explained? "Come back after you level up."

Looks like I am not going to complete either of these DLCs then. I can only take so much of being a scummy character.

No different than mages guild and fighters guild. Find books to level up (mages) and then you get quests when you hit a certain rank. Same with Fighter's..do dolmens and level up.

VaranisArano

opaj wrote: »

Hluill wrote: »

Huh, I was wondering why my characters weren't being offered new quests...

Did I miss the dialogue when this was explained? "Come back after you level up."

Looks like I am not going to complete either of these DLCs then. I can only take so much of being a scummy character.

Mages and Fighters Guild follow the same rules. Of course, those two Guild skill lines tend to level up naturally through normal gameplay, so most people don't notice that the story quests are gated.

Yeah, I never knew those were gated by faction reputation, probably because I kill a bunch of Daedra/find books normally. Good to know!

exiars10

What is even worse is I don't understand why Spree even exists?

ASSASSIN =/= SERIAL KILLER

It's the same s... like those AC games where you are just serial killer.

Mass murdering people is not assassination!
I don't understand why devs think that mass slaughter of innocent people is same as assassination.

I despise this DLC so much and refused to buy it even for 500 crowns. I'll finish it only for skills (ESO Plus), but I refuse to do Sprees.

VaranisArano

It really is a missed opportunity to not let us gain DB points from murdering with the Blade of Woe. The Blade of Woe is hands down my favorite part of the DLC. If I'm going to get credit for killing three random citizens in a certain city, I really wish I could get credit for killing a bunch of people. But I suppose ZOS was trying to maintain the idea that the Dark Brotherhood aren't actually wanton murderers.

Ha, my Dark Brotherhood Silencer is totally a wanton murderer, with or without faction credit.

Jarryzzt

Oh please.

The DB skill lines is one of the easiest guild lines to level precisely because you can just roll one DB contract after another. True, some of them require that you unlock new waypoints by - gasp, shudder - riding a horse for two minutes or - that horror of horrors - ride a boat. Still miles easier than even TG (unless you spec into pickpocketing, of course).

Classic whine thread, this.

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What is even worse is I don't understand why Spree even exists?

The point is to terrorize the populace of Town N by randomly murdering some of its members. True, this is not a classic assassination with a named target, however it is not outside of the realm of competency and services of a given assassins' guild. [Besides which, you really do not want to use the "serial murderer" comparison. An assassin is arguably worse, since the classic serial killer is psychologically ill, whereas the assassin chooses to do what he or she does.]

Rather, the immersion problems I would point to have to do with the fact that a) there are implied to be many cells and potentially dozens if not hundreds of trained assassins running around a medieval fantasy setting, and b) anyone with access to some fresh body parts, some Nightshade and a dagger can order a hit on anybody else in the world and only the Dark Brotherhood will know about it.

Immediately this implies manifold issues:

- The world's population and population density have to be pretty bloody high to sustain regular activities of these assassins.

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To wit, if one assumed a mere 100 assassins killing 1 person per month each, that's 1200 people per year. Which might not sound like a lot, but in the context of medieval history would have been more than enough to exterminate the top 50 noble families in both England and France to a man, woman, child and beloved pet. Possibly twice over. Every year.
- There is literally nothing to stop any and every nobleman and noblewoman from ordering hits left and right. Brothers fighting over an inheritance, barons over land, courtiers over influence, et cetera. Village neighbours over cows, even.

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Incidentally, land inheritance was a huge problem in the medieval world on account of a) no birth control to speak of and b) a limited amount of land that could actually be passed on. Untold thousands of miniature civil wars broke out as a result, especially where larger estates or entire city-states were involved. Here? Everyone calls in the Dark Brotherhood simultaneously and hilarity ensues.
- The amount of money that DB is siphoning from what is technically supposed to be a barely above sustainable-agriculture level economy is thus truly massive, at least potentially, yet somehow no-one notices (and tries to muscle in on the racket) nor is DB expanding into any other businesses beyond assassination (as would likely occur in reality).
- Meanwhile, DB happens to have a medieval equivalent of a centralized database on every single person who'd ever ordered a hit, ever, and if this does not scream blackmail material - or give the noble classes a reason to wish DB exterminated (the example of the Templars comes to mind, though that was mostly money and politics rather than blackmail) - I do not know what does.

And the list goes on. But, of course, this is more of a lore issue and less having to do with actual gameplay.

dodgehopper_ESO

exiars10 wrote: »

What is even worse is I don't understand why Spree even exists?

ASSASSIN =/= SERIAL KILLER

It's the same s... like those AC games where you are just serial killer.

Mass murdering people is not assassination!
I don't understand why devs think that mass slaughter of innocent people is same as assassination.

I despise this DLC so much and refused to buy it even for 500 crowns. I'll finish it only for skills (ESO Plus), but I refuse to do Sprees.

The Dark Brotherhood is not just an assassin guild. They are the equivalent of the Thuggee cult. Their strange religious practices compel them to murder or rather give them an excuse for what they already want to do. The DB is a bizarre organization. The Shadowscales as a subgroup are almost more understandable because they wage warfare on behalf of the Argonian king.

Ilsabet

I must be strange because I went ahead and did the TG tip board and DB contracts as easy little tasks I could hit off in rapid succession when I didn't feel like doing something that required an actual time investment. I always ended up far enough ahead in the skill line that I would be told to take a rest after finishing a story quest and then I turn around and someone's running up to me with the next mission.

Anotherone773

Jarryzzt wrote: »

Oh please.

The DB skill lines is one of the easiest guild lines to level precisely because you can just roll one DB contract after another. True, some of them require that you unlock new waypoints by - gasp, shudder - riding a horse for two minutes or - that horror of horrors - ride a boat. Still miles easier than even TG (unless you spec into pickpocketing, of course).

Its not that its hard, its mind numbing boring. The entire quest chain and dailies are pure torture. Its terrible compared to other quest lines. On top of that, the loot, outside of motifs, in the gold coast is complete garbage especially loot you get from any DB related quest. So i cant even get excited about " well at least i got some decent loot". Outside of BoW and one other skill and a few SP it is definitely pretty much a worthless DLC.

VaranisArano

Anotherone773 wrote: »

Jarryzzt wrote: »

Oh please.

The DB skill lines is one of the easiest guild lines to level precisely because you can just roll one DB contract after another. True, some of them require that you unlock new waypoints by - gasp, shudder - riding a horse for two minutes or - that horror of horrors - ride a boat. Still miles easier than even TG (unless you spec into pickpocketing, of course).

Its not that its hard, its mind numbing boring. The entire quest chain and dailies are pure torture. Its terrible compared to other quest lines. On top of that, the loot, outside of motifs, in the gold coast is complete garbage especially loot you get from any DB related quest. So i cant even get excited about " well at least i got some decent loot". Outside of BoW and one other skill and a few SP it is definitely pretty much a worthless DLC.

See, for me? The DLC is worth it for the Blade,of Woe alone. Plus, it makes the Justice System loot so much eaiser to get when you can pick, pick, stab NPCs.

Rohamad_Ali

So this is a loading screen thread then .

NyassaV

Astara tells you to do 2 or 3 contracts... I did 6 before the next main story quests was available. Like WTF?

VaranisArano

NyassaV wrote: »

Astara tells you to do 2 or 3 contracts... I did 6 before the next main story quests was available. Like WTF?

The quests unlock according to your reputation with the faction (the progress on the skill line). So how many contracts it takes depends on your faction reputation amd whether you do one murder (5 points), a spree (10 points), or a Black Sacrament (???, I cant stand the Black Sacraments).

Aesthier

I actually enjoyed Dark Brotherhood quite a bit. I had level 10 in the guild in about a week of play.

But I also pretty much completed the entire Litany of Blood as soon as I could open the Book.

Amphithoe

They make two stealth based DLC's and they don't fudging improve on the PVE stealth mechanics. It's a broken system based on RNG and not skill. I hate it so much but as a completionist, I suffer through them. I actually stopped playing the game for half a year after completing both TG and DB, I've heard many similar stories. I hope they consider remastering them.

ZOS_Ragnar

We have closed this thread as it has recently resurfaced. Often old threads can contain outdated information so we tend to close them when they pop back up.