CP 10-150: What's the point?

GimpyPorcupine

What exactly is the point of even having CP 10-150 gear and the associated materials anymore? And do new players even worry about gear in these levels? Those I've talked to just stay in L50 or MAYBE CP10 Training gear until 160 so they can start working on the sets for their desired builds.

At this point, it's just useless garbage and wasted skill points in crafting trees. It would be nice if they could find a way to get rid of it.

Obviously, there would be a lot of technical difficulties to iron out, but it would eliminate bloat for seasoned players and grind for new players.

Sky_WK

Agreed

Guarlet

It's fine. Those CP levels fly by quick enough anyway.

VaranisArano

Its largely a hold over from pre-One Tamriel days when players were in their vet rank gear for much longer. When vet 16 gear became CP 160, all of the lower tiers of CP gear became much more condensed and less necessary.

Jhalin

A vet rank remnant, that's all it is

CaffeinatedMayhem

For new players who don't go to Max CP immediately when they hit 50? Ya know, people who still have to wear that armor until they hit 160?

Oh right, the only "real" players are max...nothing lower worth playing, yaddayadda. Learn the world is bigger than just you.

Tandor

It's no different than leveling from 1-50 or from 160 plus. It's part of playing the game, and while those who just want to grind from 1 to the CP cap in 10 minutes might complain about it, they'd soon complain if they went instantly to the cap and then had no means of progressing beyond that. The sooner people start playing a MMO for the journey rather than the destination the more they're likely to enjoy it and stop complaining firstly that it's all too much to get to the cap and secondly that they've nothing to do when they reach it.

PlagueSD

GimpyPorcupine wrote: »

What exactly is the point of even having CP 10-150 gear and the associated materials anymore? And do new players even worry about gear in these levels? Those I've talked to just stay in L50 or MAYBE CP10 Training gear until 160 so they can start working on the sets for their desired builds.

At this point, it's just useless garbage and wasted skill points in crafting trees. It would be nice if they could find a way to get rid of it.

Obviously, there would be a lot of technical difficulties to iron out, but it would eliminate bloat for seasoned players and grind for new players.

Um, new players that don't have a Max CP character on their account? They will need to upgrade gear regularly when they get CP levels as they will have to grind through to CP160. Staying in LV50 gear until CP160 will SERIOUSLY affect their gameplay...unless they're getting carried through content.

Besides, with my max-level crafter, I don't even get the lower tier mats anymore unless I do the daily crafting quests.

rustic_potato

thatlaurachick wrote: »

For new players who don't go to Max CP immediately when they hit 50? Ya know, people who still have to wear that armor until this hit 160?

Oh right, the only "real" players are max...nothing lower worth playing, yaddayadda. Learn the world is bigger than just you.

It is true but given the way the exp curve works those gear you craft lasts for 1 random dungeon? During vet ranks each level had some play time before the next tier of mats and gear were used. Condensing some of the lower CP tiers would benefit these players.

The_Brosteen

The gear levels and mats between 10cp and 150cp is the prime example about how zos can implement major changes and not really think it all the way through, and you end up with awkward remnants of how things were. Ya I'm also looking at you resource/keep guard bubble I can't cc break.

srfrogg23

How else are you going to get to 160?

ofSunhold

See also: provisioning recipes, alchemy solvents, and way too many potency runes. It's just what happens when systems change organically over time. Messy holdovers.

The easiest fix would be to jump people from lvl 50 to CP 160 instead of CP 10 - and then just remove all that crap from the game, poof. Inelegant, but easy. I imagine what will happen instead is absolutely nothing, and we just live with the messiness.

Hluill

So, like half the crafting tiers are between Champion Points one and one-fifty?

I've only taken one of my players that far and it was confusing trying to keep track of materials for upgrades.

And yeah, it seemed faster than levels one through fifty, though that's when One Tamerial started.

Mazbt

Yeah I'm open for any sort of streamlining on their end because I feel there is some redundancies in there.

geonsocal

GimpyPorcupine wrote: »

What exactly is the point of even having CP 10-150 gear and the associated materials anymore?

jedtb16_ESO

Tandor wrote: »

It's no different than leveling from 1-50 or from 160 plus. It's part of playing the game, and while those who just want to grind from 1 to the CP cap in 10 minutes might complain about it, they'd soon complain if they went instantly to the cap and then had no means of progressing beyond that. The sooner people start playing a MMO for the journey rather than the destination the more they're likely to enjoy it and stop complaining firstly that it's all too much to get to the cap and secondly that they've nothing to do when they reach it.

^this...

i find myself agreeing with tandor again, perhaps i need counselling.

Turelus

So much of the VR legacy stuff is wonky with how all the changes happened.

Personally I would still like to see CP go away or become a non-combat based system (more like SWTOR's Legacy system).

Recremen

It was probably easier to do it this way coding-wise than to figure out what the heck to do with all the old materials and then implement it. It's really not that big of a hassle for me but I have the craft bag and can let the goods sit around until I care to deal with them. Maybe just vend them for gold at some point.

Nova Sky

FWIW, sub-160 materials do sell in guild stores and zone chat. None of it is particularly valuable, but I've seen some stuff go as high as 1,000 gold for 25 mats.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Jhalin wrote: »

A vet rank remnant, that's all it is

Legacy garbage. Should all be removed.

Saphayla

There is too much of it. A lot of the crafting materials in this game are between CP10 and CP 140, and they're useful only once per your entire account, because, if you make a new character and reach level 50, you don't have to grind to CP 160 again.

The first time I got to level 50, the time it took me to get from CP 10 to CP 160 was about 50% of the time it took to get from level 3 to level 50. I think that there are simply too many unnecessary materials. Make weapons and armor drop like food and solvents, every 50 CP instead of every 10 CP. We'd have CP 10 gear, CP 60 gear, CP 110 gear and CP 160 gear.

ThanatosLex

Armor cap 160 has been here for too long. New armor cap 500 CP
materials will have recovery again

CP 10 - 30 new CP 1 - 99
CP 40 - 60 new CP 100-199
CP 70 - 80 new CP 200 - 299
CP 90 - 140 new CP 300-399
CP 150 new CP 400 -499
CP 160 new CP 500

GimpyPorcupine

rustic_potato wrote: »

It is true but given the way the exp curve works those gear you craft lasts for 1 random dungeon? During vet ranks each level had some play time before the next tier of mats and gear were used. Condensing some of the lower CP tiers would benefit these players.

This exactly.

When Imp City DLC came out, they reset everyone's skill points when the new materials were introduced. When 1T came out, they converted to CP instead of VR and converted all the gear. So there's precedent for major overhauls. But they were left with a lot of bloat. And with each increase of the CP cap, the curve gets adjusted, meaning that going from CP10 to CP160 becomes even shorter. Add in the bonus enlightenment that new L50s get, and it takes what, maybe 3 days of casual gaming to hit 160?

Tandor wrote: »

It's no different than leveling from 1-50 or from 160 plus. It's part of playing the game, and while those who just want to grind from 1 to the CP cap in 10 minutes might complain about it, they'd soon complain if they went instantly to the cap and then had no means of progressing beyond that. The sooner people start playing a MMO for the journey rather than the destination the more they're likely to enjoy it and stop complaining firstly that it's all too much to get to the cap and secondly that they've nothing to do when they reach it.

I agree with this sentiment. I've leveled 14 characters to 50 by questing, dungeons, and playing the game.

OK, let me throw another angle on this. A new player who knows what build she wants is actually discouraged from questing in the zone where it drops until CP160. If I know I want to build a Werewolf using Salvation, I'll just skip Malabal Tor until I hit 160 so as not to get the throw-away pieces in a set I want.

ZOS is doing a lot to accommodate new players, which I think is a good idea for maintaining a large player base. I think getting rid of these extra tiers would further that goal.

Anotherone773

They could be condensed down.Cp10 -Cp100 as one material level and CP 100-to CP160 the last craft level, then lets start adding gear levels. maybe every 120-150 cp( assuming we keep the same crappy champion system.) Progression in this game is like a cold lava flow once you hit 160.

Chilly-McFreeze

What's up with the people that speak out for a gear cap increase? It would archieve absolutely nothing since the 1T scaling. Of course beside different fancy numbers and to *** up each and everyone over cp160

Anotherone773

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

What's up with the people that speak out for a gear cap increase? It would archieve absolutely nothing since the 1T scaling. Of course beside different fancy numbers and to *** up each and everyone over cp160

What scaling are you referring to? Please tell me its not "mob scaling" because mobs do NOT scale.

Kolache

It's a little bit of an eye-sore... it's a little bit unintuitive... but meh, not that big of a deal IMO.

If anything I'd probably just change the max level to 66 and convert everything appropriately.

WillhelmBlack

It was the bodge job of veteran rank removal.

VaranisArano

Anotherone773 wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

What's up with the people that speak out for a gear cap increase? It would archieve absolutely nothing since the 1T scaling. Of course beside different fancy numbers and to *** up each and everyone over cp160

What scaling are you referring to? Please tell me its not "mob scaling" because mobs do NOT scale.

One Tamriel scaled everyone up to CP 160 with battle-leveling. That's why new characters have awesome stats as compensation for their low level and why you gradually lose stats as you level and gain skills. The battle-leveling works off your level and the level/quality of your currently gear to scale you up to CP 160 while compensating as you gain more attributes and skills.

So I think they are saying that extending the gear cap wouldn't actually be an increase in power because ZOS would have to scale enemies to match the new gear cap and increase the battle-leveling for players under the gear cap accordingly. Therefore, the only reason to do it would be to make everyone over CP 160 grind for new gear.

Prof_Bawbag

The fact you get to CP60ish in a flash means making any sort of CP10 gear is a complete and utter waste of mats. Even if those mats are ultimately useless in their own right. Iirc, I got to CP80 in around 2hours with zero grinding. Was so long ago though.

AlnilamE

Tandor wrote: »

It's no different than leveling from 1-50 or from 160 plus. It's part of playing the game, and while those who just want to grind from 1 to the CP cap in 10 minutes might complain about it, they'd soon complain if they went instantly to the cap and then had no means of progressing beyond that. The sooner people start playing a MMO for the journey rather than the destination the more they're likely to enjoy it and stop complaining firstly that it's all too much to get to the cap and secondly that they've nothing to do when they reach it.

I get your point, but the OP is talking about the plethora of crafting materials that exist between CP 10 and CP 160. ZOS could easily streamline those into 2 intermediary tiers before you get to Ruby mats at CP 150. Or even just 1. I'm not in game right now, but if I remember correctly, there are 4 mat tiers between CP 10 and CP 140, and players don't really spend that much time at the lower CP levels to justify that.