@zos: arctic blast/polar wind need a rework

Lynx7386

These abilities heal 10% of your max health instantly and 10% over 10 seconds, totaling 20% of your max health over 10 seconds.

Compare that to dragon blood: 33% of your missing health instantly recovered. Can you imagine how bad dragon knight self healing would be if dragon blood was nerfed by 13% and took 10 seconds to achieve full effect? Nobody would use it - and that problem exists for polar wind and arctic blast right now.

The heal isn't sufficient to be used as an emergency heal when tanking, and the damage on arctic blast is negligible, really only useful for extra chances to apply chilled.

I'd like to see this ability changed, and have a couple possible suggestions:

1. Improve the heal amount and duration. Of this isn't meant to be a burst heal, make it something like 5% of your max health every 2 seconds for 20 seconds, with polar wind effecting all nearby allies rather than only one.

2. If the healing can't be improved, rework it as a damage ability. I would love to see it function like an ice version of hurricane, gaining radius and power over time - and hell, that could still allow one morph to heal in the area and one to deal damage

pieratsos

Lynx7386 wrote: »

These abilities heal 10% of your max health instantly and 10% over 10 seconds, totaling 20% of your max health over 10 seconds.

Compare that to dragon blood: 33% of your missing health instantly recovered. Can you imagine how bad dragon knight self healing would be if dragon blood was nerfed by 13% and took 10 seconds to achieve full effect? Nobody would use it - and that problem exists for polar wind and arctic blast right now.

The heal isn't sufficient to be used as an emergency heal when tanking, and the damage on arctic blast is negligible, really only useful for extra chances to apply chilled.

I'd like to see this ability changed, and have a couple possible suggestions:

1. Improve the heal amount and duration. Of this isn't meant to be a burst heal, make it something like 5% of your max health every 2 seconds for 20 seconds, with polar wind effecting all nearby allies rather than only one.

2. If the healing can't be improved, rework it as a damage ability. I would love to see it function like an ice version of hurricane, gaining radius and power over time - and hell, that could still allow one morph to heal in the area and one to deal damage

Not saying that the ability is good but comparing it with dragon blood doesnt make sense. Their scaling mechanics are very different. Dragon blood scales off missing health. 33% of missing health is not the same as 33% of max health. Not even close.

Masel

The skill is utter crap...

What wardens need is another single (or multiple) target ice dot that makes them somewhat comparable to other classes.

I'd suggest changing Arctic Blast into something unique and usable:

The current skill is
Envelop yourself in winter winds, healing for 10% of Max Health instantly and an additional 2% Health every 2 seconds over 10 seconds. Enemies in the area will take $1 Frost Damage every 2 seconds over 10 seconds.


With $1 being 4% of your maximum health.

I'd suggest changing this ability to scale with your maximum resource. And then I'd like it to be changed to function like this:

Envelop the target in freezing winds, dealing $1 damage and an additional $2 damage every two seconds to the primary target and $3 every two seconds to nearby enemies and healing you for the damage done to the primary target. Any enemy hit three times is immobilised for 4 seconds.

$1 should be 10% of your maximum resource, may it be stamina, magicka or health.
$2 should be 6% (instead of 4%) of your maximum resource.
$3 should be 4% of your maximum resource.

So with 40000 magicka the Base damage per cast (and the ability is freaking expensive) would amount to 13600 (4000+4*2400) per cast over 10 seconds to the main target and 10400 (4000+4*1600) to all other targets in the area. This is prior to CP etc. In PvP it wouldn't be as much of an issue as you can't spam it, it is cleansable and you'd need to stack a lot of resources to make it too strong, sacrificing a whole lot in other regions.

Would be a very unique ability that is not yet in the game.

Masel

pieratsos wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

These abilities heal 10% of your max health instantly and 10% over 10 seconds, totaling 20% of your max health over 10 seconds.

Compare that to dragon blood: 33% of your missing health instantly recovered. Can you imagine how bad dragon knight self healing would be if dragon blood was nerfed by 13% and took 10 seconds to achieve full effect? Nobody would use it - and that problem exists for polar wind and arctic blast right now.

The heal isn't sufficient to be used as an emergency heal when tanking, and the damage on arctic blast is negligible, really only useful for extra chances to apply chilled.

I'd like to see this ability changed, and have a couple possible suggestions:

1. Improve the heal amount and duration. Of this isn't meant to be a burst heal, make it something like 5% of your max health every 2 seconds for 20 seconds, with polar wind effecting all nearby allies rather than only one.

2. If the healing can't be improved, rework it as a damage ability. I would love to see it function like an ice version of hurricane, gaining radius and power over time - and hell, that could still allow one morph to heal in the area and one to deal damage

Not saying that the ability is good but comparing it with dragon blood doesnt make sense. Their scaling mechanics are very different. Dragon blood scales off missing health. 33% of missing health is not the same as 33% of max health. Not even close.

While what you say is true, it doesn't change that the comparison holds.

Dragon blood is an instant emergency heal that saves you from needing a healer when used right, while polar window and morphs are horrendously expensive for the little help they are.

pieratsos

Masel92 wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

These abilities heal 10% of your max health instantly and 10% over 10 seconds, totaling 20% of your max health over 10 seconds.

Compare that to dragon blood: 33% of your missing health instantly recovered. Can you imagine how bad dragon knight self healing would be if dragon blood was nerfed by 13% and took 10 seconds to achieve full effect? Nobody would use it - and that problem exists for polar wind and arctic blast right now.

The heal isn't sufficient to be used as an emergency heal when tanking, and the damage on arctic blast is negligible, really only useful for extra chances to apply chilled.

I'd like to see this ability changed, and have a couple possible suggestions:

1. Improve the heal amount and duration. Of this isn't meant to be a burst heal, make it something like 5% of your max health every 2 seconds for 20 seconds, with polar wind effecting all nearby allies rather than only one.

2. If the healing can't be improved, rework it as a damage ability. I would love to see it function like an ice version of hurricane, gaining radius and power over time - and hell, that could still allow one morph to heal in the area and one to deal damage

Not saying that the ability is good but comparing it with dragon blood doesnt make sense. Their scaling mechanics are very different. Dragon blood scales off missing health. 33% of missing health is not the same as 33% of max health. Not even close.

While what you say is true, it doesn't change that the comparison holds.

Dragon blood is an instant emergency heal that saves you from needing a healer when used right, while polar window and morphs are horrendously expensive for the little help they are.

I didnt compare them in terms of overall performance. I said that the ability isnt good. The comparison doesnt hold in the way the abilities were compared. You cant say "imagine if dragon blood healed for 20% of missing health over 10 seconds" as if this makes it the same with arctic blast or whatever its name is doesnt make sense. 20% of max health is much stronger than 20% of missing health.

Lynx7386

I'd honestly rather just have a hurricane style effect, something like:

Arctic Wind
Surround yourself with a freezing storm, dealing 5% of your maximum health as frost damage each second to enemies within 6 meters. Lasts 15 seconds.

Morph: Arctic Blast
The storm builds in intensity every 5 seconds, gaining increased size and damage.
-At 5 seconds, it goes to 7% max health / 8 meters
-at 10 seconds, it goes to 10% max health / 10 meters

Morph: Polar Wind
The storm also heals allies within 6 meters for 5% of your max health per second.

Metafae

Let's not copy hurricane.

I'd say make one morph be for tanks and their self healing needs, so find a way to make it work for a tank.

It's current functionality isn't too bad if it were to get a buff. Something like healing 20% of max health and an additional 2% of your max health every 1 second for 10 seconds, also heals 1 nearby ally for 10% of your max health on cast.
This would essentially double it's healing potential and make it competitive, while not over powering it's ally healing ability.

As for the damage morph, how about making it so that it has a small radius of 6 meters. The ability should last for 10/12 seconds. The damage should scale off max magic/spell damage.
Deal X damage per second for 10 seconds, each consecutive hit to an enemy increases the damage by 10%

This makes it similar to hurricane, but the catch is you have to keep the target within 6 meters of you to get the full force of it going.

RavenSworn

I think it's a different kettle of fish @Lynx7386, wardens has access to more healing options than a DK does. It also does a secondary effect, even if it might not be as effective as dragons blood.

Artic blast procs chilled, deals damage and heals. That is very different from what dragon blood can do.

Lynx7386

RavenSworn wrote: »

I think it's a different kettle of fish @Lynx7386, wardens has access to more healing options than a DK does. It also does a secondary effect, even if it might not be as effective as dragons blood.

Artic blast procs chilled, deals damage and heals. That is very different from what dragon blood can do.

Exactly my point, it isn't really needed as a heal (especially not in the current underpowered state) because we have other much better healing options. I would rather see it turned into a better tanking and damage tool. If the arctic blast morph did more damage in a larger radius for longer period of time (even at the cost of the healing component) it would be more useful to tank wardens. That area damage is enough to help pick up enemies in aoe packs (I run grothdar/eruption on my dk tank for that very reason, you may not be pulling 40k dps as a tank but in aoe situations having that damage does help with aggro to a pretty fair degree), and having it deal damage more frequently over a longer duration (say, every 1 second instead of every 2, and for 12+ seconds instead of 10) means it will be more likely to proc chilled on enemies, helping with maim and immobilize uptime.

For the other morph, healing is fine, but it should be a larger heal for both the user and allies, and it should effect a larger area and more than just one ally. How often do you only have one other person in your group? Or even one melee person? Pretty rare for me; trials and dungeons have from 3-11 other people, very often clustered up around you, that could benefit from the healing component of polar wind if it worked for more than a single ally.

Currently the heal amount of this ability and its morphs does not make it competetive with any other heal at the warden's disposal, and it's no more efficient than those other options either. Right now the only use for this ability at all is the chance to proc chilled and deal a meager amount of area damage with arctic blast - and that leaves the base ability and one morph completely trivial and useless.

Seraphayel

Masel92 wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

These abilities heal 10% of your max health instantly and 10% over 10 seconds, totaling 20% of your max health over 10 seconds.

Compare that to dragon blood: 33% of your missing health instantly recovered. Can you imagine how bad dragon knight self healing would be if dragon blood was nerfed by 13% and took 10 seconds to achieve full effect? Nobody would use it - and that problem exists for polar wind and arctic blast right now.

The heal isn't sufficient to be used as an emergency heal when tanking, and the damage on arctic blast is negligible, really only useful for extra chances to apply chilled.

I'd like to see this ability changed, and have a couple possible suggestions:

1. Improve the heal amount and duration. Of this isn't meant to be a burst heal, make it something like 5% of your max health every 2 seconds for 20 seconds, with polar wind effecting all nearby allies rather than only one.

2. If the healing can't be improved, rework it as a damage ability. I would love to see it function like an ice version of hurricane, gaining radius and power over time - and hell, that could still allow one morph to heal in the area and one to deal damage

Not saying that the ability is good but comparing it with dragon blood doesnt make sense. Their scaling mechanics are very different. Dragon blood scales off missing health. 33% of missing health is not the same as 33% of max health. Not even close.

While what you say is true, it doesn't change that the comparison holds.

Dragon blood is an instant emergency heal that saves you from needing a healer when used right, while polar window and morphs are horrendously expensive for the little help they are.

Dragon Blood is a bad emergency heal. As a Warden you have an entire tree devoted to healing (and you've got even a Stamina morph heal as well) so if you need a sufficient healing skill take Mushrooms.

Nevertheless Arctic Wind does need a rework.

Datthaw

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

DarkAedin

We Wardens dont need another heal.
We do however, need a better dot for pve viability.....

Datthaw

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals? And on top of that the ultimate is almost spammable with shimmer shield and heroic slash.

Gtfo

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

lucky_Sage

maybe if the made the winters embrace the dmg skill line and animal companions the utilty/stamina skill line the class would of worked better. if they of the frost staff increasing spell pen not trying to force frost tanking because they thought a frost tank would be cool but it failed.

Datthaw

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

Lynx7386

lucky_Sage wrote: »

maybe if the made the winters embrace the dmg skill line and animal companions the utilty/stamina skill line the class would of worked better. if they of the frost staff increasing spell pen not trying to force frost tanking because they thought a frost tank would be cool but it failed.

I disagree, frost tanking has worked out very well for me. Perfect backbar weapon for any tank.

Dyride

Assuming 35k max health, the DK has to be below 25k health before GDB meets the equivalent initial heal from Arctic Wind. If you include the HoT then the DK has to be below 14k.

Also the Warden is healing a nearby Ally with Polar Wind or chilling.

Lynx7386

Dyride wrote: »

Assuming 35k max health, the DK has to be below 25k health before GDB meets the equivalent initial heal from Arctic Wind. If you include the HoT then the DK has to be below 14k.

Also the Warden is healing a nearby Ally with Polar Wind or chilling.

And when do you use dragon blood above 50% health?

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Datthaw

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

KingShocker

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.

Don't forget the resource passive. Throw grove down where you have the most teammates and you'll get back a good chunk of stam and mag.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

KingShocker wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.

Don't forget the resource passive. Throw grove down where you have the most teammates and you'll get back a good chunk of stam and mag.

You can only get the 250 Stam or mag once a second. No matter how many teammates you heal. So the best you can hope for is 1500 resourses over 6 seconds from one morph or 2750 over 11 seconds from the other. That is not a lot. IF you heal them, generally you will have them fill up by the second or third tick too. So much less then the max.

Lynx7386

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

Datthaw

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Lynx7386

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Are you at all familiar with tanking? When does a tank ever need a heal over time? This ability is in the tanking tree for the class, but it is not useful for tanks. The only time a tank ever uses a heal on themselves is in an oh-sh!t situation where the healer can't do his job. A heal over time is not going to do you any good there.

Datthaw

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Are you at all familiar with tanking? When does a tank ever need a heal over time? This ability is in the tanking tree for the class, but it is not useful for tanks. The only time a tank ever uses a heal on themselves is in an oh-sh!t situation where the healer can't do his job. A heal over time is not going to do you any good there.

Which brings me back to my main point... warden already has a burst heal

Own

Lynx7386 wrote: »

These abilities heal 10% of your max health instantly and 10% over 10 seconds, totaling 20% of your max health over 10 seconds.

Compare that to dragon blood: 33% of your missing health instantly recovered. Can you imagine how bad dragon knight self healing would be if dragon blood was nerfed by 13% and took 10 seconds to achieve full effect? Nobody would use it - and that problem exists for polar wind and arctic blast right now.

The heal isn't sufficient to be used as an emergency heal when tanking, and the damage on arctic blast is negligible, really only useful for extra chances to apply chilled.

I'd like to see this ability changed, and have a couple possible suggestions:

1. Improve the heal amount and duration. Of this isn't meant to be a burst heal, make it something like 5% of your max health every 2 seconds for 20 seconds, with polar wind effecting all nearby allies rather than only one.

2. If the healing can't be improved, rework it as a damage ability. I would love to see it function like an ice version of hurricane, gaining radius and power over time - and hell, that could still allow one morph to heal in the area and one to deal damage

I couldn't get it to be useful for the short time I played magden. I was thinking it should be a 2 second ticking HoT (Also)

Lynx7386

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Are you at all familiar with tanking? When does a tank ever need a heal over time? This ability is in the tanking tree for the class, but it is not useful for tanks. The only time a tank ever uses a heal on themselves is in an oh-sh!t situation where the healer can't do his job. A heal over time is not going to do you any good there.

Which brings me back to my main point... warden already has a burst heal

To which heal are you referring? Fungal growth, that cone heal that costs way too much for the amount healed? Maybe budding seeds, which has to be cast twice, taking up two global cooldowns? Healing thicket, an ultimate?

Datthaw

Spores, you want a skill reworked into a burst heal when you already have one it's just dumb, sorry it is. Why not rework spores.

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Datthaw wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

You want a burst heal for warden use the damn mushroom.... I mean they have one, and another heal on timer, and a heal on light attacks. Asking for things we dont need

Fungal growth costs 4.6k magic or 3.9k Stam and then only heals for like the ten percent anyways. Polar wind costs 3.8k, gives me a 5-9k heal, with only ~34k health cuase lol percentage healing amps and ticks for 5 more times, which basically procs my monster helm off cooldown, sentinel of rekugums, very underrated set. So really the only thing I would want is to have the secondary heal of polar wind have a larger range and give the same hot that the healing get has.

So you're saying a burst heal, one hot, one heal tick with light and heavy weaves, one heal that procs when you take damage, a large aoe burst heal that gives major defile and a large aoe heal ultimate is not enough heals?

Gtfo

first, lol at the bold.


this is for a tank, not a healer. there is no other heal that a warden tank can use, that will heal the tank and no one else as good as polar wind for as cheap. my warden tank uses polar wind, leaching vines and that is it. all the other heals in the warden tool kit are garbage for a tank. cost too much and heal too little or are not guaranteed to heal you in the case of Lotus Flower and morphs, which a terribad skill in the first place. hell, the only reason i use leaching is to proc the passive resource return from Nature's Gift.


lets go over the healing line with an eye for tank or healer use.


Fungal Growth and morphs are too expensive and heal too little to use on a tank, even on my healer i only use this skill for the 10% minor buffs, once every 20 seconds.

Budding Seeds is bad on a tank because it takes 2 casts to use and it only lasts for 6 seconds, this is also why i don't use that skill on my warden healer. maybe if Budding Seeds lasted for 12 seconds, with the option to get the burst any time in that 12 seconds, otherwise it is useless on a healer too, takes too much to keep up. this skill is basically the healing ritual (the clap heal from temps line) that you can place the ground, and in my opinion it is just as bad. the only thing good about it is the synergy.

Leeching Vines is the only skill from this line that i use on my tank, to provide resources from the passive and puts minor lifesteal on the boss most of the time, might actually try using blood altar here, because blood altar also provides a synergy for the group and puts minor lifesteal on everything in 28 meter range. for 33 or 47 seconds. that is a huge amount of time.

Lotus Flower and morphs are crap heals too, once a second IF you are light weaving, which on a tank or heal you can't really do, no guarantee that the tank will get the heal, the only reason i run this on my stamden is because i am too cheap to use good pots for major savagery. inner light is 100% better if you are using this skill for the major prophecy, ie Lotus Blossom, because it gives you 7% max mag, like 3 -4k my healer and 2% regen for having it on my bar. passively. much better then having to reapply the buff every 20 seconds.

Nature's Grasp and morphs are useless for a healer because you have to aim them and they only heal one or 2 targets, one of those being you , lol, 100% useless on a tank.

Secluded Grove and morphs are a noob trap, you really ought never to need that much healing from a ulti, you need to be using warhorn.


in conclusion, maybe one skill from this line is useful to me as a tank, the rest fall short. even on my full time healer, i only use one of them and that is not even for the heal itself, it is for the buff it provides my team. i have healed and tanked all the four man dungoens in the game on my warden as a tank and healer and beat them as a dps on my bow/bow stamden, you are greatly exaggerating the usefulness of the skill in this line.

Come play pvp and have these snb wardens just out heal/mitigate all your damage

First again, lol that you switch the subject once I explained my reasoning, from lol the heal skills to a specific niche case that really doesn't have to do with the op or my response.


Tell me what skills they are using from the green balance line. On my tank, I use all the winter embrace skills. Every single one is useful to a tank. Probably the biggest one I have seen people complain about in PvP is shimmering sheild. That skill alone shuts down a ton of damage, both from Stam toons in PvP and mag toons.


S/b is a huge factor in mitagation too, that skill line is great for tanking, obviously. So I am really not sure how a s/b warden is a any different from a templar using s/b or a dk using it outside of shimmering sheild.

My point here is polar wind could use a buff but I use it anyways because it is still the best guaranteed self heal a warden tank has. My secondary point is the green balance skill line is not that great from a healers prospective and is absolutely useless to a tank outside of a morph of one skill.

Uhhh.... op is comparing it to dragons blood. A busrt heal. I brought up the point that you have one. I guess that's not good enough for you. And this is combat mechanics so sorry that just saying "tank" wasn't enough, there are pvp tanks btw.

You're complaining about how you can't heal yourself properly on a tank because it dosent compare to dragons blood. That's is exactly what op is talking about. I just bring up the point that you have an entire skill tree based on heals. And plus that's what a frigging healer in pve is for.

You buff self heals EVEN MORE for warden and they will be completely broken pvp. And yes they use leeching vines, lotus flower, corrupting pollen, and the ultimate. Sometimes spores but normally Vigor instead. I'm not even going to get into the playstyle good wardens use because if you have ever pvp then you will know.

Actually what I'm (the op) is saying is that arctic wind and its morphs aren't sufficient to slot over other heals, and if the healing cannot be buffed then these abilities should be changed to something more beneficial for tanks.

That's because it's a heal over time, you compare it to dragons blood a burst heal..... your class already has a burst heal. If you want a more efficient burst heal, then rework the one you already have. I could say the same *** about malevolent offering for my magnb. It's not a oh *** save me heal, needs to be reworked.

Are you at all familiar with tanking? When does a tank ever need a heal over time? This ability is in the tanking tree for the class, but it is not useful for tanks. The only time a tank ever uses a heal on themselves is in an oh-sh!t situation where the healer can't do his job. A heal over time is not going to do you any good there.

and what is this? There is a "damage" "tank" and "healing" tree argument. Why would your classes best heal be in the tank tree and not healing