From Dread Daedra Save Us

tyjoie

To me it seems the lyrics of this song are being misinterpreted too frequently. The lyrics state; schemer, hunger, hunter, pariah, scryer, destroyer, raver and twilight; attended the meeting with Sotha Sil. However, people seem to be confused as to who some of these labels refer to. Looking on lore pages, and on some discussions, the confusion seems to be surrounding who hunger refers to. The most common answer to this tends to be Boethia, considering she ate Trinimac, with Boethia being who is referenced as Hunger even on the lore wiki. However, I believe this to be wrong. To me, Boethia best suits as being schemer, and Molag Bal instead being hunger. Should Boethia instead be hunger, there really is no other good candidate for schemer. While I do think most lore nerds would agree with me on this, with it being misinterpreted even on the elder scrolls lore wiki, I felt the need to state my thoughts here. Additionally, while I know most people know this, twilight does not refer to Nocturnal, but Azura.

tl;dr: Schemer = Boethia, Hunger = Molag Bal, Hunter = Hircine, Pariah = Malacath, Scryer = Hermaeus Mora, Destroyer = Mehrunes Dagon, Raver = Sheogorath, Twilight = Azura.

Any thoughts?

p.s. I find it disturbing there is no reference to Ithguleior anywhere in any lore or elder scrolls material other than "Mourning the Dead".

Thogard

Molag bal is 100% the schemer. He is the lord of schemes.

tyjoie

Thogard wrote: »

Molag bal is 100% the schemer. He is the lord of schemes.

True, but Boethia is also the Prince of Plots. I frankly believe hunger would better fit Molag Bal's hunger for power more than it would describe Boethia, considering her eating of Trinimac was a one time event, and not something that characterizes her as a prince.

tyjoie

tyjoie wrote: »

Should Boethia instead be hunger, there really is no other good candidate for schemer.

I did a bit of a stupid here and overlooked Molag Bal when I posted. While he is the lord of schemes I still think Boethia a better candidate for Schemer as opposed to hunger.

Pink_Violinz

I mean, Boethia literally keeps daedra around named "Hunger". I really don't know what else would be Hunger, and Bal is definitely Schemes like Thogard says. It's practically in his job description.

"The Hunger is one of the many daedric servants of Daedra Lord Boethiah..." from the UESP

ThePrinceOfBargains

There shouldn’t be any confusion. The song literally says “the God of Schemes consumed [Gil-Var-Delle] all.” Molag Bal is the God of Schemes. Then the Schemer is mentioned first, as he’s the one that inspired the compact. Furthermore, it makes no sense to refer to Molag Bal by his title “God of Schemes,” then refer to Boethiah as the schemer two lines later.

Hunger is 100% Boethiah. Aside from eating Trinimac, her Daedric minions are even called “Hunger.”

tyjoie

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

There shouldn’t be any confusion. The song literally says “the God of Schemes consumed [Gil-Var-Delle] all.” Molag Bal is the God of Schemes. Then the Schemer is mentioned first, as he’s the one that inspired the compact. Furthermore, it makes no sense to refer to Molag Bal by his title “God of Schemes,” then refer to Boethiah as the schemer two lines later.

Hunger is 100% Boethiah. Aside from eating Trinimac, her Daedric minions are even called “Hunger.”

That is again true but it wouldn't be proper to refer to Boethia by the names of one of her minions. It would be like referring to Sheogorath as Seducer rather than Raver. Furthermore, the lyrics say 'the God of Schemes consumed it all'. Consume generally being a word associated with hunger and the consumption of food. In this case, Bal's hunger for power led to him consuming Gil-Var-Delle. The titles of Schemer and Hunger seem to me to be applicable to either of them.

Ratzkifal

It's only sad that Namira isn't "Hunger", because that is actually her thing. Namira wasn't on that meeting however, so naturally she can't be "Hunger".
On that note, I find it weird every other Daedra who wasn't on this council is wreaking havoc somewhere on Tamriel apart from Namira. Sanguine has a public dungeon at least.

AngelFires333

"Magicka fused the Lorkhan Blood To crystal red and strong
Then Wild Elves cut and polished it down To Chim-el Adabal."

I hear it like this...

Magicka fused the Lorkhan Blood To crystal red and strong
Then Wild Elves cut and polished it down then chilled and had a bong.

Demycilian

What of Sanguine? His domain implies an appetite and lust - hunger - for all sorts of things.

tyjoie

Ratzkifal wrote: »

It's only sad that Namira isn't "Hunger", because that is actually her thing. Namira wasn't on that meeting however, so naturally she can't be "Hunger".
On that note, I find it weird every other Daedra who wasn't on this council is wreaking havoc somewhere on Tamriel apart from Namira. Sanguine has a public dungeon at least.

Since the Remen Empire fell what was agreed in the Coldharbour Compact may not really matter as it was only valid until Morrowind's war with the Remen empire ended from what we can tell. I'm sure Namira would do something to take advantage of the chaos, whether or not we see it is up to ZOS.

ArcaneBlue

I am just going to say the song now is stuck in my head and will be for the rest of the day XD

tyjoie

Demycilian wrote: »

What of Sanguine? His domain implies an appetite and lust - hunger - for all sorts of things.

Sanguine simply wasn't there, and if he was he would probobly instead challenge Sheogorath for the title of Raver I'd say.