Dps metrics on ps4?

RayneHalo

Maybe I missed it but is there a way to see how much damage each person did on ps4?

O_LYKOS

Like in a trial and such?

Negative, I believe pc users have addons for such things.

RayneHalo

Maybe for Christmas ZOS would add it lol

Kel

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Zer0oo

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

If you do not tell players in some kind of may how good they are in their role they will never improve. As dd your role is to do as much damage per sec as possible while staying alive and doing mechanics(a dead dd = worst dps). Skeleton tests are nice but they are expensive(especial for new players), kinda boring and do not show how well you do in a real fight with mechanics.

Yes you can complete dungeons will absolute terrible dps but this is still no reason not to show players their dps. Dps is the easiest way too see if you did well and compare yourself to other dds. If you don't want others to see it, just don't share it. You have low dps you can think how to improve yourself. You have high dps, good job.

Ohhgrizyyy

Zer0oo wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

If you do not tell players in some kind of may how good they are in their role they will never improve. As dd your role is to do as much damage per sec as possible while staying alive and doing mechanics(a dead dd = worst dps). Skeleton tests are nice but they are expensive(especial for new players), kinda boring and do not show how well you do in a real fight with mechanics.

Yes you can complete dungeons will absolute terrible dps but this is still no reason not to show players their dps. Dps is the easiest way too see if you did well and compare yourself to other dds. If you don't want others to see it, just don't share it. You have low dps you can think how to improve yourself. You have high dps, good job.

Exactly, Its easy to do alot of dps at something not trying to kill you hack lol

Kel

Zer0oo wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

If you do not tell players in some kind of may how good they are in their role they will never improve. As dd your role is to do as much damage per sec as possible while staying alive and doing mechanics(a dead dd = worst dps). Skeleton tests are nice but they are expensive(especial for new players), kinda boring and do not show how well you do in a real fight with mechanics.

Yes you can complete dungeons will absolute terrible dps but this is still no reason not to show players their dps. Dps is the easiest way too see if you did well and compare yourself to other dds. If you don't want others to see it, just don't share it. You have low dps you can think how to improve yourself. You have high dps, good job.

#1) You can already tell who's doing thier job or not in a role without pointing to something and saying..."See everyone! Look how bad this player is!" That doesn't encourage someone to get better. That encourages someone to avoid that content. And is it your job to "tell other players how good they are"? No...it is not. As far as the skeleton goes, why else do people scream about skeleton tests here on the forum if they serve no purpose? How have we played so long on the ps4 without seeing what other players are doing and telling them how to improve? Again, worrying about how others play boggles my mind. Everyone complains about how casual the game is and cookie cutter builds, so sure, lets tell everyone exactly how to play and what they should be doing. You can help players without showing them arbitrary numbers. Done it for years now, why fix what isn't broken?
#2)If only there was some kind of Player Versus Player mode where you could test your skills and build against other players in some kind of competition to compare yourself against others of like minded players, instead of a player vs.environment mode where the purpose is to kill bosses and move on.
Oh wait......

Zer0oo

jabrone77 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Zer0oo wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

If you do not tell players in some kind of may how good they are in their role they will never improve. As dd your role is to do as much damage per sec as possible while staying alive and doing mechanics(a dead dd = worst dps). Skeleton tests are nice but they are expensive(especial for new players), kinda boring and do not show how well you do in a real fight with mechanics.

Yes you can complete dungeons will absolute terrible dps but this is still no reason not to show players their dps. Dps is the easiest way too see if you did well and compare yourself to other dds. If you don't want others to see it, just don't share it. You have low dps you can think how to improve yourself. You have high dps, good job.

#1) You can already tell who's doing thier job or not in a role without pointing to something and saying..."See everyone! Look how bad this player is!" That doesn't encourage someone to get better. That encourages someone to avoid that content. And is it your job to "tell other players how good they are"? No...it is not. As far as the skeleton goes, why else do people scream about skeleton tests here on the forum if they serve no purpose? How have we played so long on the ps4 without seeing what other players are doing and telling them how to improve? Again, worrying about how others play boggles my mind. Everyone complains about how casual the game is and cookie cutter builds, so sure, lets tell everyone exactly how to play and what they should be doing. You can help players without showing them arbitrary numbers. Done it for years now, why fix what isn't broken?
#2)If only there was some kind of Player Versus Player mode where you could test your skills and build against other players in some kind of competition to compare yourself against others of like minded players, instead of a player vs.environment mode where the purpose is to kill bosses and move on.
Oh wait......

Gratz you missed the point.

So far no new player i meet stopped playing because of low dps but they instead ask for tips to improve. There is also no shaming since at the moment only you can see how much dps you did. And dps is still the easiest way to see if other players are better than you in PvE.


PvP and comparing dps in PvE are so completely different that comparing on thing to the other in term of player skill is kinda pointless.

zaria

O_LYKOS wrote: »

Like in a trial and such?

Negative, I believe pc users have addons for such things.

We have combat metric, it shows your dps and group dps. Its pretty much says the all in group dungeons, healer and tank tend to do 10-20%.

SammyFable

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Because Time Trial achievements exist. Because leaderboards exist. That's why DPS matters. If you don't mind a boss fight to take an hour instead of five minutes. If you don't mind not completing a raid within a certain time frame and having to try completely anew on a different day. Then go ahead and don't try to improve yourself. You are as free to play as you like while not knowing if you get better as others are that want to know if they get better.

Kel

SammyFable wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Because Time Trial achievements exist. Because leaderboards exist. That's why DPS matters. If you don't mind a boss fight to take an hour instead of five minutes. If you don't mind not completing a raid within a certain time frame and having to try completely anew on a different day. Then go ahead and don't try to improve yourself. You are as free to play as you like while not knowing if you get better as others are that want to know if they get better.

How are these things accomplished now without the dps meters?
You guys act like this is somehow needed. How are you doing these things now, if a dps meter is so needed? You can improve how you've always improved in the game without a silly meter.
Yes, dps matters. Your dps in comparison to other players? Not so much. PvE is about teamwork, not showing off your bigger number. Maybe that player is just better than you, and no amount of improvement will close that gap.
And let's not pretend players are suddenly going to have some high ground and not use them to exclude. Played too many MMO's to even give that idea credibility.
The game has been fine without them and will continue to be fine without them.

Kel

Zer0oo wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

Zer0oo wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

If you do not tell players in some kind of may how good they are in their role they will never improve. As dd your role is to do as much damage per sec as possible while staying alive and doing mechanics(a dead dd = worst dps). Skeleton tests are nice but they are expensive(especial for new players), kinda boring and do not show how well you do in a real fight with mechanics.

Yes you can complete dungeons will absolute terrible dps but this is still no reason not to show players their dps. Dps is the easiest way too see if you did well and compare yourself to other dds. If you don't want others to see it, just don't share it. You have low dps you can think how to improve yourself. You have high dps, good job.

#1) You can already tell who's doing thier job or not in a role without pointing to something and saying..."See everyone! Look how bad this player is!" That doesn't encourage someone to get better. That encourages someone to avoid that content. And is it your job to "tell other players how good they are"? No...it is not. As far as the skeleton goes, why else do people scream about skeleton tests here on the forum if they serve no purpose? How have we played so long on the ps4 without seeing what other players are doing and telling them how to improve? Again, worrying about how others play boggles my mind. Everyone complains about how casual the game is and cookie cutter builds, so sure, lets tell everyone exactly how to play and what they should be doing. You can help players without showing them arbitrary numbers. Done it for years now, why fix what isn't broken?
#2)If only there was some kind of Player Versus Player mode where you could test your skills and build against other players in some kind of competition to compare yourself against others of like minded players, instead of a player vs.environment mode where the purpose is to kill bosses and move on.
Oh wait......

Gratz you missed the point.

So far no new player i meet stopped playing because of low dps but they instead ask for tips to improve. There is also no shaming since at the moment only you can see how much dps you did. And dps is still the easiest way to see if other players are better than you in PvE.


PvP and comparing dps in PvE are so completely different that comparing on thing to the other in term of player skill is kinda pointless.

There is a huge difference between a player asking for help and you telling them they need help. No amount of numbers on some meter are going to help a player that doesn't want to improve, and since we're giving blanket statements, I've never meet a player who decided to improve because of a meter.
It's PvE, the goal is to down bosses. If you can't, then you look at problems/solutions. How has this been done up to now without a meter?
Again, you're looking at a point of view that you're not going to show numbers, and that's great. I've played many other games where that is not the case...at all...not even close.
And from the posts I've seen in this forum, talking about "If you don't have this CP amount, don't do dungeons" or "If you don't run a skeleton test, don't run dungeons" to think it's going to be magically better in ESO.
Sorry.
You want to help someone who asked for help, you can point to skills/CP allotment/rotation. Tell them to run a skeleton test before and after to see improvement. You don't need to point to a meter to do that.

LadyNalcarya

jabrone77 wrote: »

show previous quotes

SammyFable wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Because Time Trial achievements exist. Because leaderboards exist. That's why DPS matters. If you don't mind a boss fight to take an hour instead of five minutes. If you don't mind not completing a raid within a certain time frame and having to try completely anew on a different day. Then go ahead and don't try to improve yourself. You are as free to play as you like while not knowing if you get better as others are that want to know if they get better.

How are these things accomplished now without the dps meters?
You guys act like this is somehow needed. How are you doing these things now, if a dps meter is so needed? You can improve how you've always improved in the game without a silly meter.
Yes, dps matters. Your dps in comparison to other players? Not so much. PvE is about teamwork, not showing off your bigger number. Maybe that player is just better than you, and no amount of improvement will close that gap.
And let's not pretend players are suddenly going to have some high ground and not use them to exclude. Played too many MMO's to even give that idea credibility.
The game has been fine without them and will continue to be fine without them.

Addons like Combat Metrics are actually very helpful, if you want to improve your dps, compare different setups etc.
As for people being excluded, people who dont want to participate in dps tests etc can just join more casual guilds. Not every guild demands high dps. I wouldnt call it "exclusion", its just... Lets say, different people have different approach to the game. I dont think that a player who doesnt really care about dps would be happy to play with "hardcore" players, even if they wont comment on his or her dps.
I even think that visible group dps would help against pug elitists, because it would expose so many of them. Its not a secret that many of those "elitist" players are actually bad and the only reason why theyre so demanding is because they want to be carried by other players.

Kel

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

SammyFable wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Because Time Trial achievements exist. Because leaderboards exist. That's why DPS matters. If you don't mind a boss fight to take an hour instead of five minutes. If you don't mind not completing a raid within a certain time frame and having to try completely anew on a different day. Then go ahead and don't try to improve yourself. You are as free to play as you like while not knowing if you get better as others are that want to know if they get better.

How are these things accomplished now without the dps meters?
You guys act like this is somehow needed. How are you doing these things now, if a dps meter is so needed? You can improve how you've always improved in the game without a silly meter.
Yes, dps matters. Your dps in comparison to other players? Not so much. PvE is about teamwork, not showing off your bigger number. Maybe that player is just better than you, and no amount of improvement will close that gap.
And let's not pretend players are suddenly going to have some high ground and not use them to exclude. Played too many MMO's to even give that idea credibility.
The game has been fine without them and will continue to be fine without them.

Addons like Combat Metrics are actually very helpful, if you want to improve your dps, compare different setups etc.
As for people being excluded, people who dont want to participate in dps tests etc can just join more casual guilds. Not every guild demands high dps. I wouldnt call it "exclusion", its just... Lets say, different people have different approach to the game. I dont think that a player who doesnt really care about dps would be happy to play with "hardcore" players, even if they wont comment on his or her dps.
I even think that visible group dps would help against pug elitists, because it would expose so many of them. Its not a secret that many of those "elitist" players are actually bad and the only reason why theyre so demanding is because they want to be carried by other players.

I'm asking because this is brought up specifically for ps4 that's never had addons or dps meters, yet these things get accomplished. How so if dps meters are so needed? Skeleton tests before and after tweaks can already show improvements...no need for meters there. Where is this needed?
And I've never seem a guild exclude for dps. Most guild runs that take low dps are for teaching skills and mechanics with low pressue. The exclusion comes more into play for pugging. Guild runs are always the way to go, no doubt. Pugs and guild runs are a diffrent story, though. You can't argue that will be abused there.

jaschacasadiob16_ESO

jabrone77 wrote: »

They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.

You are not excluding people. You are selecting the right people to do something.
And that's what you do every moment of your life: you have choices. You want choices. And you pick what you think it's best.

And honestly, if you do 9k dps, you should spend time improving and learning (practicing rtations, farming gear, upgrading skills, watching guides) rather than wasting someone else's time (unless they want to).

LadyNalcarya

jabrone77 wrote: »

show previous quotes

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

SammyFable wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Because Time Trial achievements exist. Because leaderboards exist. That's why DPS matters. If you don't mind a boss fight to take an hour instead of five minutes. If you don't mind not completing a raid within a certain time frame and having to try completely anew on a different day. Then go ahead and don't try to improve yourself. You are as free to play as you like while not knowing if you get better as others are that want to know if they get better.

How are these things accomplished now without the dps meters?
You guys act like this is somehow needed. How are you doing these things now, if a dps meter is so needed? You can improve how you've always improved in the game without a silly meter.
Yes, dps matters. Your dps in comparison to other players? Not so much. PvE is about teamwork, not showing off your bigger number. Maybe that player is just better than you, and no amount of improvement will close that gap.
And let's not pretend players are suddenly going to have some high ground and not use them to exclude. Played too many MMO's to even give that idea credibility.
The game has been fine without them and will continue to be fine without them.

Addons like Combat Metrics are actually very helpful, if you want to improve your dps, compare different setups etc.
As for people being excluded, people who dont want to participate in dps tests etc can just join more casual guilds. Not every guild demands high dps. I wouldnt call it "exclusion", its just... Lets say, different people have different approach to the game. I dont think that a player who doesnt really care about dps would be happy to play with "hardcore" players, even if they wont comment on his or her dps.
I even think that visible group dps would help against pug elitists, because it would expose so many of them. Its not a secret that many of those "elitist" players are actually bad and the only reason why theyre so demanding is because they want to be carried by other players.

I'm asking because this is brought up specifically for ps4 that's never had addons or dps meters, yet these things get accomplished.
And I've never seem a guild exclude for dps. Most guild runs that take low dps are for teaching skills and mechanics with low pressue. The exclusion comes more into play for pugging. Guild runs are always the way to go, no doubt. Pugs and Lee and Lee diffrent story, though. You can't argue that will be abused there.

Yes there's no addons but the old Bloodspawn test and the new skeleton test are still available. Its just less convenient, you dont have full information.
Well, veteran raiding guild usually ask for boss parses. A lot of guilds dont, of course.
And like I said, visible dps numbers will just show that oh-so-tough pug elitists arent actually that strong. I saw quite a few of them and since I'm on pc I can see total group dps and my dps percentage... Lets say that usually those guys are well below average.

Kel

jaschacasadiob16_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.

You are not excluding people. You are selecting the right people to do something.
And that's what you do every moment of your life: you have choices. You want choices. And you pick what you think it's best.

And honestly, if you do 9k dps, you should spend time improving and learning (practicing rtations, farming gear, upgrading skills, watching guides) rather than wasting someone else's time (unless they want to).

How is your choice not exclusion? Because you say it that way, doesn't mean that's truth. You guys are talking like this is all vet trial stuff, acting like this won't be used in regular normal dungeon pugs by players too busy worried about dps numbers and not enough about downing the boss and progressing through the dungeon.
And who's saying improvement is a bad thing? Of course it is.
In that case, a comprise. If self improvement is really truly the goal, just have personal dps meters. Just for yourself..no group numbers. If it's just for improvement sake, why is it so important that you need to know what your group is doing? All you need to see is what you're doing then try to improve it, right? That's the argument? Ok, then just show your personal number and decide if you want to share or not. Its not a competition..pve is about teamwork, not having a bigger number. Other than that, you're using it to exclude...sorry...make a choice, about who gets the privilege of being in your magnificent presence.
I'm done with this topic. Have a good day everyone. But how would you know? There's no meter for a good day...

RayneHalo

Lol I just wanted to see how I compared to other members of my group or when playing with friends. I do decent on a test dummy but feel that's not 100% acurate compared to actual group events.

dday3six

jabrone77 wrote: »

show previous quotes

jaschacasadiob16_ESO wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.

You are not excluding people. You are selecting the right people to do something.
And that's what you do every moment of your life: you have choices. You want choices. And you pick what you think it's best.

And honestly, if you do 9k dps, you should spend time improving and learning (practicing rtations, farming gear, upgrading skills, watching guides) rather than wasting someone else's time (unless they want to).

How is your choice not exclusion? Because you say it that way, doesn't mean that's truth. You guys are talking like this is all vet trial stuff, acting like this won't be used in regular normal dungeon pugs by players too busy worried about dps numbers and not enough about downing the boss and progressing through the dungeon.
And who's saying improvement is a bad thing? Of course it is.
In that case, a comprise. If self improvement is really truly the goal, just have personal dps meters. Just for yourself..no group numbers. If it's just for improvement sake, why is it so important that you need to know what your group is doing? All you need to see is what you're doing then try to improve it, right? That's the argument? Ok, then just show your personal number and decide if you want to share or not. Its not a competition..pve is about teamwork, not having a bigger number. Other than that, you're using it to exclude...sorry...make a choice, about who gets the privilege of being in your magnificent presence.
I'm done with this topic. Have a good day everyone. But how would you know? There's no meter for a good day...

Why do people get the ‘privilege’ of inclusion no matter the case? We might as well make other players invisible because it’s easy to see how a dps is performing based on their positioning and the skills they use.

People are going to be jerks, but that isn’t always the best argument against something. Players willing to harass others about their play, with do it no matter what. Random grouping is random, and you’ll get jerks on both sides. Why should I have to put up with a “light attacks only bow build”, but they get to be insulated from criticism?

One of the hardest swipes at anything other than causal play for console ESO was ZOS’s willful exclusion of relevant player performance feedback. Just because people are able to complete content doesn’t mean there aren’t players turned off by the extra mile they had to and even still have to travel in order to improve competitively in ESO.

Massive_Stain

Sweet, the closest thing we have on ps4 is the target centurion for group tests. Before every vmol, my group is required to group test and send me screenshot of their individual score.

Etrella

jabrone77 wrote: »

show previous quotes

SammyFable wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Because Time Trial achievements exist. Because leaderboards exist. That's why DPS matters. If you don't mind a boss fight to take an hour instead of five minutes. If you don't mind not completing a raid within a certain time frame and having to try completely anew on a different day. Then go ahead and don't try to improve yourself. You are as free to play as you like while not knowing if you get better as others are that want to know if they get better.

How are these things accomplished now without the dps meters?
You guys act like this is somehow needed. How are you doing these things now, if a dps meter is so needed? You can improve how you've always improved in the game without a silly meter.
Yes, dps matters. Your dps in comparison to other players? Not so much. PvE is about teamwork, not showing off your bigger number. Maybe that player is just better than you, and no amount of improvement will close that gap.
And let's not pretend players are suddenly going to have some high ground and not use them to exclude. Played too many MMO's to even give that idea credibility.
The game has been fine without them and will continue to be fine without them.

Hey man, why all the hate towards the dummy? Its something that was implemented to help players, and it HAS in fact helped the players. I know stuff started dying alot faster after much practice with it. It was not only implemented to test you dps, but as a means to try new builds, sets etc and partially give you an idea how they would perform in lets say a Vet trial (Partially because knowing mechanics is the other half of the equation), but if you want to go into Vmol or Vhof everytime you want to try or test your new build, then by all means buddy go ahead. Just saying your team might not be too happy about that. Cheers

Kel

Etrella wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

SammyFable wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

Because Time Trial achievements exist. Because leaderboards exist. That's why DPS matters. If you don't mind a boss fight to take an hour instead of five minutes. If you don't mind not completing a raid within a certain time frame and having to try completely anew on a different day. Then go ahead and don't try to improve yourself. You are as free to play as you like while not knowing if you get better as others are that want to know if they get better.

How are these things accomplished now without the dps meters?
You guys act like this is somehow needed. How are you doing these things now, if a dps meter is so needed? You can improve how you've always improved in the game without a silly meter.
Yes, dps matters. Your dps in comparison to other players? Not so much. PvE is about teamwork, not showing off your bigger number. Maybe that player is just better than you, and no amount of improvement will close that gap.
And let's not pretend players are suddenly going to have some high ground and not use them to exclude. Played too many MMO's to even give that idea credibility.
The game has been fine without them and will continue to be fine without them.

Hey man, why all the hate towards the dummy? Its something that was implemented to help players, and it HAS in fact helped the players. I know stuff started dying alot faster after much practice with it. It was not only implemented to test you dps, but as a means to try new builds, sets etc and partially give you an idea how they would perform in lets say a Vet trial (Partially because knowing mechanics is the other half of the equation), but if you want to go into Vmol or Vhof everytime you want to try or test your new build, then by all means buddy go ahead. Just saying your team might not be too happy about that. Cheers

/facepalm....
I said there was a skeleton for these tests therfore a dps meter isn't needed.
Did you even read my post, or just feel like jumping in?
I'm fine with the dummy being there. This isn't about the dummy. The dummy makes the point of the thread (damage meter for dps improvement) irrelevant.
You are saying the same thing I am...
Here, second sentence in....

"Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test."

Do me a favor and try going back and actually reading what I wrote.

/cheers

kylewwefan

I think you can buy the dummy’s with crowns from the housing editor.

many people become obsessed with beating on this target skeleton. Don’t become one. Make A reasonable goal, and use that like a benchmark.

You’ll see many players flock to the Sorc because they’re easy to get decent damage with a dead simple rotation.

swirve

Its crazy this game does not have damage done measures outside a dummy that has zero mechanics.

Even a top 3 DDs list would be interesting.

People who talk about exclusion based on DD should run with players who are not idiots.

Izaki

Ohhgrizyyy wrote: »

show previous quotes

Zer0oo wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

If you do not tell players in some kind of may how good they are in their role they will never improve. As dd your role is to do as much damage per sec as possible while staying alive and doing mechanics(a dead dd = worst dps). Skeleton tests are nice but they are expensive(especial for new players), kinda boring and do not show how well you do in a real fight with mechanics.

Yes you can complete dungeons will absolute terrible dps but this is still no reason not to show players their dps. Dps is the easiest way too see if you did well and compare yourself to other dds. If you don't want others to see it, just don't share it. You have low dps you can think how to improve yourself. You have high dps, good job.

Exactly, Its easy to do alot of dps at something not trying to kill you hack lol

Dummy parses aren't representative of real combat. Not at all. And they aren't meant to be. They are basically a "skill test" showing how much DPS a given player would do in an environment where there are no mechanics happening at all.

Dummy parses do show the way that a specific player plays and it certainly helps people get better in terms of DPS. If someone can pull high numbers on a dummy, its pretty obvious that that person knows about certain mechanics of the game. Therefore, he has the potential to be very good in raids (obviously, this is where his situational awareness comes into play).

Izaki

Combat Metrics and Srendarr are the 2 addons that should be incorporated into the base game.

Combat Metrics is this:


Basically, it shows you your DPS, as well as your buff and debuff uptimes and it gives insight into which abilities do which percentage of your total DPS. It really helps newer players get better at the game and it helps veteran players understand where they made mistakes and it helps everyone fine tune their rotation and their CP to their playstyle.

Srendarr is a buff tracker. Now that thing that we have on consoles isn't a buff tracker. Its just some random icons that have some timer next to them. Srendarr gives you the ability to customize literally everything. You can whitelist and blacklist certain buffs or debuffs, you can move around the places where you want certain groups of buffs or debuffs to appear, etc.

These 2 addons should be part of the game. They just have to be.

DawnsLight65

zaria wrote: »

show previous quotes

O_LYKOS wrote: »

Like in a trial and such?

Negative, I believe pc users have addons for such things.

We have combat metric, it shows your dps and group dps. Its pretty much says the all in group dungeons, healer and tank tend to do 10-20%.

where do you see those on ps4?

alainjbrennanb16_ESO

skeleton dps test are only good to practice certain points, it does not help in trail settings, which is more about movement while getting the damage down, combat metrics is not correct all the time, do a la on dummy and see the time recorded

svendf

RayneHalo wrote: »

Maybe I missed it but is there a way to see how much damage each person did on ps4?

Be carefull what you wish for. It can bite you in the end.

zvavi

Necromancy, and quoting people from 2 years+ ago...

DawnsLight65 wrote: »

show previous quotes

zaria wrote: »

O_LYKOS wrote: »

Like in a trial and such?

Negative, I believe pc users have addons for such things.

We have combat metric, it shows your dps and group dps. Its pretty much says the all in group dungeons, healer and tank tend to do 10-20%.

where do you see those on ps4?

You don't, he/she is talking about an add-on on pc.

svendf

Zer0oo wrote: »

show previous quotes

jabrone77 wrote: »

I hope not.
Things like addons that show dps in other games started as a way to tweak your own personal performance. ESO already let's you do that with a skeleton test.
They quickly turned into a way to exclude players.
Try this...just see if bosses are dying. If things are progressing and no ones wiping groups, who cares about individual dps? Worry about your own performance and if things don't die, then address the reason why.
This need to constantly know what other players do...boggles my mind.
There's two reasons you want dps metrics....to show your epeen, or to justify kicking a player. Again, if there's no issue moving on there isn't a problem, and if there is, you can already tell who's not doing thier job without the need for hard numbers.
If you're going to use the bs reason of wanting to see your personal output, you can already do that with the skeleton.
Everyone you run with isn't going to be a min/maxer and not everyone is going to know about optimal gear sets or understand gear bonuses. Just the way it is. DPS metrics aren't going to teach those players about that stuff. It's going to cause players who are unsure about doing dungeons to not take part more than they are now and queue times go up higher.
No thank you. I'd like to encourage more players to run content, not a reason to exclude players.

If you do not tell players in some kind of may how good they are in their role they will never improve. As dd your role is to do as much damage per sec as possible while staying alive and doing mechanics(a dead dd = worst dps). Skeleton tests are nice but they are expensive(especial for new players), kinda boring and do not show how well you do in a real fight with mechanics.

Yes you can complete dungeons will absolute terrible dps but this is still no reason not to show players their dps. Dps is the easiest way too see if you did well and compare yourself to other dds. If you don't want others to see it, just don't share it. You have low dps you can think how to improve yourself. You have high dps, good job.

Some reasons to use this.

!. Find people to make it more easy for you to do content or to exclude them.
2. Find a nice carry
3. Kick people