Instead of animation cancelling.....
LittlePinkDot
✭✭✭✭✭
I had an idea thats less annoying and less boring than animation cancelling. How about they just make % attack speed a trait for armour and weapons. And % faster cast rate for magicka skills. Allow 2 traits per piece.
Speed should be determined by stats.
Diablo 2 had it right.
Speed should be determined by stats.
Diablo 2 had it right.
5
-
Morvane✭✭✭✭LittlePinkDot wrote: »I had an idea thats less annoying and less boring than animation cancelling. How about they just make % attack speed a trait for armour and weapons. And % faster cast rate for magicka skills. Allow 2 traits per piece.
Speed should be determined by stats.
Diablo 2 had it right.
this trait existed in 2014-16 and was totally useless
RIP Weighted (now Decisive)DC Dunmer Sorcerer since 2014
@morvayn54, PC/EU1 -
LittlePinkDot✭✭✭✭✭Hmmm.. but there was still the whole animation cancelling wasnt there? If I hold down the button for a particular skill... it should keep firing at the rate of my attack speed without me having to let go of the button and reapply it.1
-
Elusiin✭✭✭✭✭How about we keep speed the way it is, for the sake of balance, and then end animation canceling...13 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TheNightflame wrote: »There used to be the weighted trait
Yep. One of the less desirable traits.
Though I will say about AC, I have not found it annoying. Certainly nothing about it to make combat boring.
We know it is here to stay for a long time. Two changes during the past year added much benefit to the most basic part of AC and the devs understood it would.Edited by idk on December 8, 2017 12:47AM0 -
SirAndy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Or they could just make the animations match the actual cast/cooldown/whatever timer and get rid of animation canceling ...
17 -
SkoomaHooverSoul ShrivenAye i'm very opposed to animation cancelling.
It looks rubbish and makes the pvp into more of a spam contest rather than a fight. It makes combat less dynamic I think would be the way to word it.
However as a way to fix it, I don't think this will solve the problem at hand.0 -
Betsararie✭✭✭✭✭
✭Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
16 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
I like animation canceling and can do it well, but it's no way more fluid.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.11 -
Knootewoot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
It does take skill, but it does not make the game more fluid or enjoyable. Instead the opposite. Combat feels like a clunky chore each time you attack something. I rather no use it and don't do it while questing. But I have to if I do trials or PvP to get my dps in the right area. Also the barswapping and cancelling so you cannot see what others use as skill in PvP is dumb because how can you react to something you don't see.
This is my opinion though and I know a lot don't agree. But weaving is good imho but cancelling entire animations is bad coding.٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶
"I am a nightblade. Blending the disciplines of the stealthy agent and subtle wizard, I move unseen and undetected, foil locks and traps, and teleport to safety when threatened, or strike like a viper from ambush. The College of Illusion hides me and fuddles or pacifies my opponents. The College of Mysticism detects my object, reflects and dispels enemy spells, and makes good my escape. The key to a nightblade's success is avoidance, by spell or by stealth; with these skills, all things are possible."19 -
Betsararie✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I don't think that makes any sense, it increases the fluidity of combat because it allows you to cast quicker. Therefore fluidity is increased. So I can tell you I don't agree with youKnootewoot wrote: »Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
It does take skill, but it does not make the game more fluid or enjoyable. Instead the opposite. Combat feels like a clunky chore each time you attack something. I rather no use it and don't do it while questing. But I have to if I do trials or PvP to get my dps in the right area. Also the barswapping and cancelling so you cannot see what others use as skill in PvP is dumb because how can you react to something you don't see.
This is my opinion though and I know a lot don't agree. But weaving is good imho but cancelling entire animations is bad coding.
You have to have a quick reaction time.... anyone who is killing you fast is using animation cancelling, some to a greater extent than others0 -
Apache_Kid✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
I wouldn't say it increases the enjoyment factor for me at all but you are right in the fact that takes skill. Actually, it's like the only thing in this game that requires any amount of skill. I'm not the biggest fan of it but it's necessary to have some separation of the players based on skill. It sucks that not everyone can do it successfully due to reaction time or ping (I'm not even the best at it myself but I get better at it every time i practice). Take away animation cancelling and the skill factor goes away over night. Nothing else in this game is actually even remotely difficult in terms of combat in my opinion.1 -
SugaComa✭✭✭✭✭Animation canceling should reduce damage done simple as ... It should cancel the damn ability
If I throw a punch in real life then change to a a kick before it lands this know as faint to make my opponent guard incorrectly allowing the next hit to fully connect if I land it
This should apply to the game
"Invisible" undefendable damage should not be a thing in any game that has PvP11 -
Sigtric✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This is going to end up like all other AC threads.
People who don't understand why it exists, regardless of it being initially intended or not will continue to say 'just get rid of it'.
People who like it will say get good.
I will say, it's not going anywhere because it simply can not be removed. In order to do so the dynamic and reactive portions of combat in this game would stop working. Want to block an attack? You're going to have to wait for that animation to finish. Want to dodge roll? Yep, waiting again. Need to barswap for your ohshitimgoingtodiesaveme skill? Wait for that animation to finish.
Animation cancelling as a DPS "mechanic" was seemingly unintended, but certain combat actions in this game work on a priority so that you can quickly react to the fight. AC as a DPS function exists as a side effect because of this.
They would have to be changed to remove the DPS aspect, and combat in ESO would take a big hit. You think AC makes combat clunky? Just go force yourself to play with out it. Wait for each light attack to finish because you hit one of your hotkeys. No blocking or interrupting the target in front of you until that light attack is fully complete. No barswap off your bow bar until volley hits the ground. Wait for it.
Stormproof: Vibeke - 50 EP mDragonknight | Savi Dreloth - 50 EP Magsorc | Sadi Dreloth - 50 EP Magblade | Sigtric Stormaxe - 50 EP Stamsorc | Valora Dreloth - 50 EP Magplar | Sigtric the Unbearable 50 EP Stam Warden
Scrub: Chews-on-Beavers - 50 EP DK Tank | Vera the Wild - 50 EP magicka Warden | Sigtric the Axe - 50 EP Dragonknight Crafter | Sigtric the Blade - 50 EP Lost Nightblade | Sigtric the Savage - 50 EP magicka Templar | Vibeka Shadowblade - 50 Ep Stealthy Ganky Nightblade |
Show Me Your Dunmer
[/center]11 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Knootewoot wrote: »Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
It does take skill, but it does not make the game more fluid or enjoyable. Instead the opposite. Combat feels like a clunky chore each time you attack something. I rather no use it and don't do it while questing. But I have to if I do trials or PvP to get my dps in the right area. Also the barswapping and cancelling so you cannot see what others use as skill in PvP is dumb because how can you react to something you don't see.
This is my opinion though and I know a lot don't agree. But weaving is good imho but cancelling entire animations is bad coding.
1. Animation canceling is enjoyable to a great many players. Those interested in doing max damage enjoy it since it's part of it. Yes, I understand it's your oppinions.
The most basic part of animation canceling gas received a strong buff this year so Zos is promoting it.
2. every instant skill has the same cool down (actually it's a GCD) before it ca be canceled. It's merely the animations are longer than the cool down. It's not bad coding and could easily be fixed though Zos isn't interested in shortening the animations.0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Knootewoot wrote: »Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
It does take skill, but it does not make the game more fluid or enjoyable. Instead the opposite. Combat feels like a clunky chore each time you attack something. I rather no use it and don't do it while questing. But I have to if I do trials or PvP to get my dps in the right area. Also the barswapping and cancelling so you cannot see what others use as skill in PvP is dumb because how can you react to something you don't see.
This is my opinion though and I know a lot don't agree. But weaving is good imho but cancelling entire animations is bad coding.
1. Animation canceling is enjoyable to a great many players. Those interested in doing max damage enjoy it since it's part of it. Yes, I understand it's your oppinions.
The most basic part of animation canceling gas received a strong buff this year so Zos is promoting it.
2. every instant skill has the same cool down (actually it's a GCD) before it ca be canceled. It's merely the animations are longer than the cool down. It's not bad coding and could easily be fixed though Zos isn't interested in shortening the animations.
Best part of AC is that you can bypass those animations and each one can be different. Makes it feel like you are changing a spell.
Bad part of AC, the game was originally intended to use animations+sounds to given how you react to attacks. Sneaking in a quick LA+spell and bar swapping to hit a defensive spell leaves no time to react aside from doing AC yourself. I'd be willing to bet that tank builds grew in popularity because a majority of players couldn't AC fast enough to react to other AC users, so they decided it was more fun to take DMG and wait for players to run out of resources lol.
Not saying it's fluid or right or wrong. Just pointing out how it doesn't really fit in the design intent for the game's animation system. It would be cool to see threads suggesting how to make AC fiy with this intent, instead of removing it. Till then, we will always have these threads.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual1 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
I don't think that makes any sense, it increases the fluidity of combat because it allows you to cast quicker. Therefore fluidity is increased. So I can tell you I don't agree with youKnootewoot wrote: »Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
It does take skill, but it does not make the game more fluid or enjoyable. Instead the opposite. Combat feels like a clunky chore each time you attack something. I rather no use it and don't do it while questing. But I have to if I do trials or PvP to get my dps in the right area. Also the barswapping and cancelling so you cannot see what others use as skill in PvP is dumb because how can you react to something you don't see.
This is my opinion though and I know a lot don't agree. But weaving is good imho but cancelling entire animations is bad coding.
You have to have a quick reaction time.... anyone who is killing you fast is using animation cancelling, some to a greater extent than others
The half animations when switching bars/rolling or light/heavy attacks look clunky, and they are really the only way to shave off time. Block cancelling is only beneficial on 1/2 abilities due to the games ICD.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.0 -
Getern✭✭✭Another thread from ppl who still didn't learn to play.
It literally hurts my eyes.
First of all, ability to animation cancel is one of few really things that requires skill and it isn't even difficult or something.
Also its very satisfying and lookin badass
1 -
RebornV3x✭✭✭✭✭
✭Animation Canceling fine but at the same time its dumb that this is even a thing thoXbox One - NA GT: RebornV3x
I also play on PC from time to time but I just wanna be left alone on there so sorry.0 -
Gan Xing✭✭✭✭This is going to end up like all other AC threads.
People who don't understand why it exists, regardless of it being initially intended or not will continue to say 'just get rid of it'.
People who like it will say get good.
I will say, it's not going anywhere because it simply can not be removed. In order to do so the dynamic and reactive portions of combat in this game would stop working. Want to block an attack? You're going to have to wait for that animation to finish. Want to dodge roll? Yep, waiting again. Need to barswap for your ohshitimgoingtodiesaveme skill? Wait for that animation to finish.
Animation cancelling as a DPS "mechanic" was seemingly unintended, but certain combat actions in this game work on a priority so that you can quickly react to the fight. AC as a DPS function exists as a side effect because of this.
They would have to be changed to remove the DPS aspect, and combat in ESO would take a big hit. You think AC makes combat clunky? Just go force yourself to play with out it. Wait for each light attack to finish because you hit one of your hotkeys. No blocking or interrupting the target in front of you until that light attack is fully complete. No barswap off your bow bar until volley hits the ground. Wait for it.
As much as I would like to agree with you, there are many skills that are odd that if you don't animation cancel at the right time, you have to let it run to the end before you can block. I've experienced this with Templar Jabs. In PvE when I'm tanking, i'm also doing DPS, so when I see the game mechanic rear up for a Heavy Attack, sometimes it's after I already started jabs and sometimes, despite attempting to block the damage, I don't and end up dying. It is weird because sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. That goes for a lot of other skills that despite having an "Instant cast" you have difficulty animation cancelling it.Gan Xing - Crafting Nightblade
Elrana Tinuviel - Hybrid Dragonknight
Elentári Peregrine - Sorcerer "bank"
Rán Xīng - Hybrid Templar
Laurïsil Imlachwen - Stamina Templar
Helotë Tinuviel - Hybrid/Magicka Warden
Odin banker - obv banker
Yan of the Red Mountain - lvl 3 DK - not sure when I will work on em
Seeks the unusual and unique playstyles...3 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SkoomaHoover wrote: »Aye i'm very opposed to animation cancelling.
It looks rubbish and makes the pvp into more of a spam contest rather than a fight. It makes combat less dynamic I think would be the way to word it.
However as a way to fix it, I don't think this will solve the problem at hand.
You couldnt be further off:
Dynamic: 1.(of a process or system) characterized by constant change, activity, or progress.
Animation canceling is what makes ESO combat dynamic in the first place. It gives you the ability to immediately react to changing circumstances. AC is also the exact opposite of spamming abilities. It is the number one aspect of combat that requires skill and separates good players from bad players. Removing AC from the game would result in exactly what you are saying you want to avoid.5 -
LittlePinkDot✭✭✭✭✭Yes Ive noticed if I light attack then do a skill attack quickly and keep doing that, enemyies die fast, but it still is annoying that I have to play like that.
Its no wonder "weighted" trait was changed, it wouldve been broken the whole time. Increase attack speed shouldve made animations go faster according to how much attack speed you had. But theres obviously only 1 speed for the animations.0 -
Betsararie✭✭✭✭✭
✭Some people don't have time to wait for each little animation to finish, so for us, it's definitely a nice thing to be able to make use of.0 -
SaintSubwayy✭✭✭✭✭
✭Or they could just make the animations match the actual cast/cooldown/whatever timer and get rid of animation canceling ...
so in simple words, "rek good players by removing the one thing that made them better then alot of other players"?
No tyvmPC EU
vAA HM / vHRC HM / vSO HM / vMoL HM / vHoF HM / vAS HM / vCR HM / vSS HM / vKA HM
Flawless Conqueror / Immortal Redeemer / Dawnbringer / Griphon Heart / Master Angler / Spirit Slayer1 -
Betsararie✭✭✭✭✭
✭Or they could just make the animations match the actual cast/cooldown/whatever timer and get rid of animation canceling ...
Whenever games/series do this, the game always becomes less fun and less about skill. This has happened in many games before, where they remove the skillful animation cancelling aspect of the combat in the sequel. The series becomes garbage. Players like me will move on to another game that is still fun.
Waiting for the cooldown to tick down like a little baby is not that fun, and lessens the need for precise reaction times.
For big time gamers like me who have been big into games for a long time, I can tell what requires skill and what doesn't. Animation cancelling is one of the best things about our combat.0 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Knootewoot wrote: »Animation cancelling adds to combat and increases the overall fluidity and enjoyment factor.
The problem is... it requires skill. So you end up with threads like this.
It does take skill, but it does not make the game more fluid or enjoyable. Instead the opposite. Combat feels like a clunky chore each time you attack something. I rather no use it and don't do it while questing. But I have to if I do trials or PvP to get my dps in the right area. Also the barswapping and cancelling so you cannot see what others use as skill in PvP is dumb because how can you react to something you don't see.
This is my opinion though and I know a lot don't agree. But weaving is good imho but cancelling entire animations is bad coding.
The thing is, Animation cancelling WAS smooth in the past. ZOS’s updating of animations made them disgustingly clunky.
With the exception of a few combos (Snipe was and still is very clunky, Wrecking Blow was and still is animation cancellable in a way where you can use a skill immediately as the impact hits, etc) the past animations were significantly better in all content and scenarios. Only ZOS can make the game way clunkier and perform much worse overtime.
Edited by Vaoh on December 8, 2017 11:56PM1 -
Gan Xing✭✭✭✭Or they could just make the animations match the actual cast/cooldown/whatever timer and get rid of animation canceling ...
Whenever games/series do this, the game always becomes less fun and less about skill. This has happened in many games before, where they remove the skillful animation cancelling aspect of the combat in the sequel. The series becomes garbage. Players like me will move on to another game that is still fun.
Waiting for the cooldown to tick down like a little baby is not that fun, and lessens the need for precise reaction times.
For big time gamers like me who have been big into games for a long time, I can tell what requires skill and what doesn't. Animation cancelling is one of the best things about our combat.
Despite this, I think they still need to have a cooldown timer on certain abilities. I can't think of any off the top of my head, but I think there should be a cd on certain abilities, but not allGan Xing - Crafting Nightblade
Elrana Tinuviel - Hybrid Dragonknight
Elentári Peregrine - Sorcerer "bank"
Rán Xīng - Hybrid Templar
Laurïsil Imlachwen - Stamina Templar
Helotë Tinuviel - Hybrid/Magicka Warden
Odin banker - obv banker
Yan of the Red Mountain - lvl 3 DK - not sure when I will work on em
Seeks the unusual and unique playstyles...0 -
LittlePinkDot✭✭✭✭✭animation cancelling is actually quite easy with a ps4 controller. I realized most people in this thread are probably on PC, then I thought about how animation cancelling would be with a mouse and keyboard and realized I shouldnt complain, because with a mouse and keyboard its got to be the most annoying thing ever, I dont think my sanity could stand this game with a mouse and keyboard.0
-
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is going to end up like all other AC threads.
People who don't understand why it exists, regardless of it being initially intended or not will continue to say 'just get rid of it'.
People who like it will say get good.
I will say, it's not going anywhere because it simply can not be removed. In order to do so the dynamic and reactive portions of combat in this game would stop working. Want to block an attack? You're going to have to wait for that animation to finish. Want to dodge roll? Yep, waiting again. Need to barswap for your ohshitimgoingtodiesaveme skill? Wait for that animation to finish.
Animation cancelling as a DPS "mechanic" was seemingly unintended, but certain combat actions in this game work on a priority so that you can quickly react to the fight. AC as a DPS function exists as a side effect because of this.
They would have to be changed to remove the DPS aspect, and combat in ESO would take a big hit. You think AC makes combat clunky? Just go force yourself to play with out it. Wait for each light attack to finish because you hit one of your hotkeys. No blocking or interrupting the target in front of you until that light attack is fully complete. No barswap off your bow bar until volley hits the ground. Wait for it.
We can keep fighting the good fight but no one will listen to reason....
Its impossible to get through to these people of why AC exists in the first place.0 -
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is going to end up like all other AC threads.
People who don't understand why it exists, regardless of it being initially intended or not will continue to say 'just get rid of it'.
People who like it will say get good.
I will say, it's not going anywhere because it simply can not be removed. In order to do so the dynamic and reactive portions of combat in this game would stop working. Want to block an attack? You're going to have to wait for that animation to finish. Want to dodge roll? Yep, waiting again. Need to barswap for your ohshitimgoingtodiesaveme skill? Wait for that animation to finish.
Animation cancelling as a DPS "mechanic" was seemingly unintended, but certain combat actions in this game work on a priority so that you can quickly react to the fight. AC as a DPS function exists as a side effect because of this.
They would have to be changed to remove the DPS aspect, and combat in ESO would take a big hit. You think AC makes combat clunky? Just go force yourself to play with out it. Wait for each light attack to finish because you hit one of your hotkeys. No blocking or interrupting the target in front of you until that light attack is fully complete. No barswap off your bow bar until volley hits the ground. Wait for it.
As much as I would like to agree with you, there are many skills that are odd that if you don't animation cancel at the right time, you have to let it run to the end before you can block. I've experienced this with Templar Jabs. In PvE when I'm tanking, i'm also doing DPS, so when I see the game mechanic rear up for a Heavy Attack, sometimes it's after I already started jabs and sometimes, despite attempting to block the damage, I don't and end up dying. It is weird because sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. That goes for a lot of other skills that despite having an "Instant cast" you have difficulty animation cancelling it.
This is indeed true at times however is kind of a seperate issue.0