Morrowind is fantastic, but its position in the ESO storyline feels wrong

drkfrontiers

I recently purchases the Morrowind Chapter because I wanted me a Nix-Ox pony! (when it was on special)

I'm amazed at all the hard work that when into this - truly amazing. Definitely worth mah monies.

But,

At level 24 running around Vvadenfell I started to feel a bit out-of-place. Let me explain...

Unless I had played before .. I would've had no clue where I was supposed to go.

And at Level 24, I still had no idea about my special "no soul" status which I previously got from the start.

So feeling like a doppelganger I wayshrined my lizardy tail to Khenarthi's Roost, because that just felt right for me, but now I felt like I was way too shiny for the Level 3's sprinting around.

My tail sagged ever so little, I tell yee.

So finally made my own way to Aldiron amid blood-soaked battles of wrath & epic adventure, because I just knew that's where I needed to be; kinda like a Khajiit knows to depend on charity!

But I'm pretty sure ... if I didn't know I would probably still be hopping across Vvadenfell with mah trusty pony.

SUDDENLY!

I meet this benefactor dude that turns out to be a beasty that sucks me into Cold Harbour, right... and I'm like Level 24... and again sprinting over poor itsy Level 3s!! The injustice.

It then dawned on me... the fragile fabric on my mind, does not know if I'm Arthur, Martha or just ..

~ Leave-No-Scraps - a friendly Argonian in search of a grand adventure.

Huyen

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

logarifmik

Concept of wayshrining in Morrowind seems out of place to me, when you start the game with fresh character on the boat to Vvardenfell. Devs made a decent transportation system on the island, so why not to force new-comers to use it instead of wayshrines, and make wayshrines only usable by those who lost they souls already. Why? Well, because Lord Corvus Direnni said that in order to use wayshrines as portals traveler's mortal soul must be "unmoored from the Mundus" (check "Wayshrines of Tamriel" by Beredalmo the Signifier for more details on the subject).

As for how well quests connect into story... They are not connected well, in my opinion. If you try to dive into the history, roleplay it and at the same time finish all possible content, your only possible solution would be a character like Billy Milligan or someone very close to him. For now from the scenario point of view ESO looks like Fargo TV series, where each new expansion season connects with previous story very loosely. But it still good, yes?

Besides and slightly out of subject, before Morrowind Chapter arrived some people told that during character creation players would be able to choose where to start: in Vvardenfell or on Continent in the initial alliance zone. Only rumors, I suppose.

N00BxV1

I hate having to start a new character in Vvardenfell, but since I own Morrowind now I'm forced to. I just want to do the main game first and then dlc after or when ready. Call it what you will but Morrowind is just dlc - it adds nothing to the base game. You can go to an alliance zone and totally forget Morrowind even exists because it adds nor changes anything. I bet when the new dlc - ahem chapter - comes they'll probably make it the starting zone and just create more confusion and break muh immersions even more.

Please give me the option to start this stuff when ready like the other dlc, don't force it on me...

Chilly-McFreeze

N00BxV1 wrote: »

I hate having to start a new character in Vvardenfell, but since I own Morrowind now I'm forced to. I just want to do the main game first and then dlc after or when ready. Call it what you will but Morrowind is just dlc - it adds nothing to the base game. You can go to an alliance zone and totally forget Morrowind even exists because it adds nor changes anything. I bet when the new dlc - ahem chapter - comes they'll probably make it the starting zone and just create more confusion and break muh immersions even more.

Please give me the option to start this stuff when ready like the other dlc, don't force it on me...

Besides splitting hairs about how a new class is adding nothing to the base game ... could you please elaborate how an expansion should alter, rather than add to, the game? I think it's called "Chapter" for a reason, mainly because it ties so loosely to the base game's main story.

idk

It's merely a new story line arc. It comes after the initial story but Zos made a good decision to not remove the initial story since so much of the game centers around it.

Not a big deal.

N00BxV1

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

N00BxV1 wrote: »

I hate having to start a new character in Vvardenfell, but since I own Morrowind now I'm forced to. I just want to do the main game first and then dlc after or when ready. Call it what you will but Morrowind is just dlc - it adds nothing to the base game. You can go to an alliance zone and totally forget Morrowind even exists because it adds nor changes anything. I bet when the new dlc - ahem chapter - comes they'll probably make it the starting zone and just create more confusion and break muh immersions even more.

Please give me the option to start this stuff when ready like the other dlc, don't force it on me...

Besides splitting hairs about how a new class is adding nothing to the base game ... could you please elaborate how an expansion should alter, rather than add to, the game? I think it's called "Chapter" for a reason, mainly because it ties so loosely to the base game's main story.

I'm not saying it should alter the main game, or that I want it to. I'm simply saying it doesn't alter it - so why am I forced to begin my journey there. If I didn't own Morrowind then I'd have no problem because I'd be able to first experience the whole losing soul etc plot. But since I do own it, now I have to use wayshrines/etc to go find an actual starting zone and begin the real story.

Ermiq

I totally agree with all above.
I was quite frustrated when I saw they've made Vvardenfell the starting point. And I was very confused when I was playing Morrowind myself with my brand new Warden.
Although I understand that they did this because they had to make new Warden's leveling interesting (and I'm appreciate this), but as part of the rest game it looks quite queerly.
Also, old zones visuals looks outdated and boring when you've seen Vvardenfell before them. I'm pretty shure that every new player who started ESO with Morrowind did notice that something wrong here.
It would be better if Morrowind was made as a classic expansion. New zone, new adventures for experienced players. Or starting point would've been optional. Or maybe Wardens should've been starting in Vvardenfell (with some special starting quest line) while others could've been starting as usual. Anyway, the current Vvardenfell status is not good.

Xundiin

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

idk wrote: »

It's merely a new story line arc. It comes after the initial story but Zos made a good decision to not remove the initial story since so much of the game centers around it.

Not a big deal.

The Morrowind story arc actually comes before the main story arc with Wrothgar following. If you play through the whole game like that it makes much more sense. Especially if you look at it from a new player point of view. Morrowind you still have your soul, you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time that sweeps you up into becoming the usurpers champion.

When you finally travel back to the main land the quest starts where you are sacrificed and your soul is taken.

drkfrontiers

Xundiin wrote: »

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

idk wrote: »

It's merely a new story line arc. It comes after the initial story but Zos made a good decision to not remove the initial story since so much of the game centers around it.

Not a big deal.

The Morrowind story arc actually comes before the main story arc with Wrothgar following. If you play through the whole game like that it makes much more sense. Especially if you look at it from a new player point of view. Morrowind you still have your soul, you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time that sweeps you up into becoming the usurpers champion.

When you finally travel back to the main land the quest starts where you are sacrificed and your soul is taken.

I guess looking back at my Oblivion, Skyrim days, this actually does make sense. Thanks.

Koensol

Totally agreed OP. ESO's main story is fubar if you ask me.

dodgehopper_ESO

I think the universe got cracked by the plane-meld, and quite possibly Meridia is driving in another wedge with her alternate-timeline-possibility-musings. All the while Clavicus, Hermaeus, Mephala, Boethiah, Nocturnal & Dagon have managed to create more than a few troubles for Nirn. Azura acts as your friend as well but lets face it she's Daedra and I don't trust that one either. I'm worried we're all gonna get Zeroed out like the Dwemer by this.

TheShadowScout

drkfrontiers wrote: »

Morrowind is fantastic, but its position in the ESO storyline feels wrong

...that depends how you go about it.

If you start anew with Morrowind... thenyeah, it does indeed feel somewhat wrong.

If you play morrowind with an old character... it feels completely -right-

...

...and that is why my two new wardens are currently questing through the mainstory, and left Vvardenfell right after arriving, did their benefactor encounter and coldharbour vacation to go into questing feeling -right- with just a curious case of amnesia where they will swear every oath they never were in Vvardenfell in the first place...

And... ZOS really could have saved themselves the Morrowind tutorial, and let new wardens start in coldharbour as well, that would have fixed so many issues... even tho it was a bit fun to play. Kiiiinda wish they had incorporated both tutorials... start at shipwreck, escape slavers isle, just to be "rescued" by friendly sailors... who then turn out to be worm cultist, drug you and... queue "mannimarco sacrifice" intro and coldharbour wakeup call...
...or even better, have various different intros... I loved how in Dragon Age:Origins you got to play different intros depending on your race, to give people a bit of background on their choosen people... and then end up in the same place with all. That would have been soooo nifty for altaholics... if you had a small intro depending on your alliance for example...
...Pact characters could start with the slaver shipwreck, fightiong through their stronghold like the Morrowind intro, then unbeknownst hitching a ride with a cultist ship as outlined above...
...Covenant might have a fontier stronghold besieged by imperials, trying to escape through mountain passes to spread the word, then getting captured and handed over to the cultists as prime candidate for sacrifice and coldharbour tutorial...
...Dominion could get a high sea maormer attack, getting their ship sunk by a sea serpent and cast adrift clinging on a piece of wreckage, with once again a high sea rescue by cultists pretending to be friendly, and eventual drugging and carting off to be sacrificed for the coldharbour intro...
...Imperial players might simply get an shortcut into coldharbour since they sort of already are in cult hands with how mannimarco kinda controls the remains of the empire, and could have an "dodge daedric incursion" thing instead... trying to escape through some imperial sewers, only to be caught in the end anyways...
...
Oh, well. All the nifty things we could have had...
...guess we just will have to shed a tear for what could have been, and make the most of what is!

ADarklore

I dunno... when I start a new character I finish the tutorial quest, and once I arrive in Morrowind, I go to the wayshrine and head to AD's Vulkhel Guard and accept the 'benefactor' quest and begin the main storyline... I have not even TOUCHED any quests in Morrowind with a new character. Someone new starting out would have no idea what it was like before, and would likely feel natural... those of us who have been playing for a period of time, it feels more natural to begin the Main Quest first. There is no 'right or wrong' way to play, which was what was great with One Tamriel.... go where we want, when we want, and quest how we want.

Jpk0012

We'll agree to disagree. I found the area to be empty and boring compared to the "free" world.

Enodoc

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

idk wrote: »

It's merely a new story line arc. It comes after the initial story but Zos made a good decision to not remove the initial story since so much of the game centers around it.

Xundiin wrote: »

The Morrowind story arc actually comes before the main story arc with Wrothgar following. If you play through the whole game like that it makes much more sense. Especially if you look at it from a new player point of view. Morrowind you still have your soul, you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time that sweeps you up into becoming the usurpers champion.

When you finally travel back to the main land the quest starts where you are sacrificed and your soul is taken.

All of the above are true. For an old character, Morrowind happens after the Main Quest. For a new character, Morrowind happens before the Main Quest. In lore, unless anyone has evidence to the contrary, it is reasonable to assume that both Morrowind and the Main Quest happen in 2E 582, with Orsinium and the other DLCs happening in 2E 583.

Stovahkiin

That’s because ZOS dun screwed up with their expa — no — DLC. Why do things the normal way if you could do it a really dumb way that *might* get more people to pay you?

duendology

Hmm.. I bought Morrowind when it was recently on sale. And I noticed it became the starting point for pretty much all the races now...and I don't think it's a goo idea. I don't like it.

NOW, it somehow explains though the extremely low drop rate of all items/recipes/blueprints...don;t you think?

mb10

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

Erm...No they arent?
There are no dark anchors in Morrowind for a reason.

Morrowind is happening a year or two AFTER the main story line. Molag Bal is finished in ESO by this stage.

You would know this if you completed the Orsinium quest line and speak to Varen again as what he tells you is the beginning of whats happening in Morrowind.

heaven13

TheShadowScout wrote: »

...that depends how you go about it.

[snip]
...or even better, have various different intros... I loved how in Dragon Age:Origins you got to play different intros depending on your race, to give people a bit of background on their choosen people... and then end up in the same place with all. That would have been soooo nifty for altaholics... if you had a small intro depending on your alliance for example...

...Pact characters could start with the slaver shipwreck, fightiong through their stronghold like the Morrowind intro, then unbeknownst hitching a ride with a cultist ship as outlined above...
...Covenant might have a fontier stronghold besieged by imperials, trying to escape through mountain passes to spread the word, then getting captured and handed over to the cultists as prime candidate for sacrifice and coldharbour tutorial...
...Dominion could get a high sea maormer attack, getting their ship sunk by a sea serpent and cast adrift clinging on a piece of wreckage, with once again a high sea rescue by cultists pretending to be friendly, and eventual drugging and carting off to be sacrificed for the coldharbour intro...
...Imperial players might simply get an shortcut into coldharbour since they sort of already are in cult hands with how mannimarco kinda controls the remains of the empire, and could have an "dodge daedric incursion" thing instead... trying to escape through some imperial sewers, only to be caught in the end anyways...

...
Oh, well. All the nifty things we could have had...
...guess we just will have to shed a tear for what could have been, and make the most of what is!

I really love this idea. It would have been amazing. As an altaholic, I think this would have made me actually enjoy starting a new character. As it stands, I do Coldharbour (even though you can skip it)because of loot and earning a few levels and getting familiar with a new class but I generally am 'ughing' during the whole thing and not paying attention to what anyone is saying. Having a pre-Coldharbour experience based on alliance would be more enjoyable, I think!

Elsonso

I agree that Morrowind fractured the story line in ESO and made it a muddy mess. The alternate starting point does not integrate well with the rest of the game.

logarifmik wrote: »

Concept of wayshrining in Morrowind seems out of place to me, when you start the game with fresh character on the boat to Vvardenfell. Devs made a decent transportation system on the island, so why not to force new-comers to use it instead of wayshrines, and make wayshrines only usable by those who lost they souls already. Why? Well, because Lord Corvus Direnni said that in order to use wayshrines as portals traveler's mortal soul must be "unmoored from the Mundus" (check "Wayshrines of Tamriel" by Beredalmo the Signifier for more details on the subject).

Yes, you should only be able to resurrect at a wayshrine prior to the Wailing Prison. No wayshrine fast travel. However, can you even imagine the whining and complaining that would go on in here if characters could not use wayshrines? The original Morrowind was a walking simulator, and people already complain that Cyrodiil is a horse simulator. They would be crying like stuck pigs about "Elder Slow Online".

Korah_Eaglecry

mb10 wrote: »

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

Erm...No they arent?
There are no dark anchors in Morrowind for a reason.

Morrowind is happening a year or two AFTER the main story line. Molag Bal is finished in ESO by this stage.

You would know this if you completed the Orsinium quest line and speak to Varen again as what he tells you is the beginning of whats happening in Morrowind.

The Dark Anchors dont disappear because you stopped Molag Bal. In Wrothgar the Dolmens are still being constructed because the wing of the Worm Cult that is incharge of constructing them are out of contact with the core Cult.

The reason we dont see Dolmens in Morrowind is likely due to Vivecs presence on the island. He and Molag Bal at one point were involved and when it ended. It ended with Vivec leaving with quite a bit of Molag Bal in hand. So its much more likely that Molag Bal didnt want to test fate and possibly drag Vivec into the conflict early enough to interfere with his plans.

The thing about a Dragon Break, and all the shenanigans that occur is that not only can multiple things be happening at once but time itself and the timeline of events can be scrambled. Your Vestige may have stopped Molag Bal prior to going to Morrowind but My Vestige went to Morrowind before heading off to stop Molag Bal. Neither is wrong, and in the end the results are the same.

Iccotak

one thing I'll hand to WoW.
Major expansions change what is going on in the world overall

Shawn_PT

While I understand that taking every new player to the newest expansion of the game, one which brought so many new people in no less, sounds like a good dea, I think having two tutorials and two 'main' questlines is weird. With my newest characters I get out of the Morrowind tutorial, go back to my 'favorite' starter areas to quest and I'm getting told my soul is missing, that I survived that wreck, or that the NPCs can't influence me for some reason, and it makes no sense. Maybe tie both tutorials so that when you get out of the Firemoth tutorial your soul gets taken immediately, instead of giving us the option to wander into situations where NPCs act as if it's gone when storywise it's not.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

The problem is for a story driven experience the story time line doesn’t make sense unless you force it to make sense. Just a casualty of One Tam.

dodgehopper_ESO

Enodoc wrote: »

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

idk wrote: »

It's merely a new story line arc. It comes after the initial story but Zos made a good decision to not remove the initial story since so much of the game centers around it.

Xundiin wrote: »

The Morrowind story arc actually comes before the main story arc with Wrothgar following. If you play through the whole game like that it makes much more sense. Especially if you look at it from a new player point of view. Morrowind you still have your soul, you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time that sweeps you up into becoming the usurpers champion.

When you finally travel back to the main land the quest starts where you are sacrificed and your soul is taken.

All of the above are true. For an old character, Morrowind happens after the Main Quest. For a new character, Morrowind happens before the Main Quest. In lore, unless anyone has evidence to the contrary, it is reasonable to assume that both Morrowind and the Main Quest happen in 2E 582, with Orsinium and the other DLCs happening in 2E 583.

Wouldn't it be nice if we all had a choice?

mb10

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

Erm...No they arent?
There are no dark anchors in Morrowind for a reason.

Morrowind is happening a year or two AFTER the main story line. Molag Bal is finished in ESO by this stage.

You would know this if you completed the Orsinium quest line and speak to Varen again as what he tells you is the beginning of whats happening in Morrowind.

The Dark Anchors dont disappear because you stopped Molag Bal. In Wrothgar the Dolmens are still being constructed because the wing of the Worm Cult that is incharge of constructing them are out of contact with the core Cult.

The reason we dont see Dolmens in Morrowind is likely due to Vivecs presence on the island. He and Molag Bal at one point were involved and when it ended. It ended with Vivec leaving with quite a bit of Molag Bal in hand. So its much more likely that Molag Bal didnt want to test fate and possibly drag Vivec into the conflict early enough to interfere with his plans.

The thing about a Dragon Break, and all the shenanigans that occur is that not only can multiple things be happening at once but time itself and the timeline of events can be scrambled. Your Vestige may have stopped Molag Bal prior to going to Morrowind but My Vestige went to Morrowind before heading off to stop Molag Bal. Neither is wrong, and in the end the results are the same.

@Korah_Eaglecry

Okay so what about Hews Bane and the Gold Coast? There are no dolmens there either.

Either way, the threat of Molag Bal is over. Reading journals in Wrothgar and Morrowind, the dates shown are different to the rest of Tamriel because the events are happening after the main story line.

Varen clearly states a new threat is coming when the gates of Clockwork city are reopened so to my original point, which was the Morrowind and main story line are NOT happening simultaneously is undeniable a fact.

TheUndeadAmulet

This exact same thing happened to me. I had recently done everything I could do in Vvardenfell (except trial and most world bosses) so I was like "Alrighty then! Back to the base game!"

Completing the tutorial area of my alliance is like a ritual for me. I did that then traveled to the mainland expected the prophet to appear so I can start the "main" quest and get some skill points. Instead there was just like OP said. Benefactor, get kidnapped go to cold harbour. Except that I'm level 25.

Felt weird with all the newbies running around.

Edited because "h-o" is censored for some reason

Ermiq

I just suddenly realized that main story and Morrowind story are two different stories, and it happens with two different players.
I'll explain.
In Pact alliance story line there is a character Naryu Virian. Aaaand there is the same character in Morrowind. Buuuuut our character cannot recognise her somehow. We ask her who she is in Pact aliance quest in Deshaan and we ask her the same in Vvardenfell. And both times we meet her, she also doesn't recognise us.
Very bad, ZOS, completely broken storytelling.
I'm dissapointed.

Xundiin

Enodoc wrote: »

Huyen wrote: »

Its because Morrowind and the main storyline as basicly happening at the same time. True, the intro could be better towards new players, but thats ZoS.

idk wrote: »

It's merely a new story line arc. It comes after the initial story but Zos made a good decision to not remove the initial story since so much of the game centers around it.

Xundiin wrote: »

The Morrowind story arc actually comes before the main story arc with Wrothgar following. If you play through the whole game like that it makes much more sense. Especially if you look at it from a new player point of view. Morrowind you still have your soul, you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time that sweeps you up into becoming the usurpers champion.

When you finally travel back to the main land the quest starts where you are sacrificed and your soul is taken.

All of the above are true. For an old character, Morrowind happens after the Main Quest. For a new character, Morrowind happens before the Main Quest. In lore, unless anyone has evidence to the contrary, it is reasonable to assume that both Morrowind and the Main Quest happen in 2E 582, with Orsinium and the other DLCs happening in 2E 583.

The problem with that statement is where a new character enters the game. if you had a choice I would agree that it depends on where you started as a player. But all new characters are made and start in Morrowind. Which means that for the sake of a continuing storyline, the events of Morrowind would have to come first.

I know ESO devs stand on it depends on the character age, but it doesn't make sense considering that some characters taht are in both the new and old areas of the game don't recognize you. Which is an oversight by them, but it could be added as more proof that the Morrowind events actually do take place before the main game.

logarifmik

lordrichter wrote: »

Yes, you should only be able to resurrect at a wayshrine prior to the Wailing Prison. No wayshrine fast travel. However, can you even imagine the whining and complaining that would go on in here if characters could not use wayshrines? The original Morrowind was a walking simulator, and people already complain that Cyrodiil is a horse simulator. They would be crying like stuck pigs about "Elder Slow Online".

They will not, because of the traveling system that exists in Vvardenfell. Well, at least they shouldn't. When I first played Morrowind, I only traveled on boats and silt striders, and I got to say that it is quite convenient.