Do away with racials?

Cladius30

What does everyone think with the posibility of getting rid of racials or just changing them in to things that don't effect your class choice or performance?

Stovahkiin

I think eso should have done what SWTOR did: each race has its own specific ability or something, but it’s really only a social thing and doesn’t affect combat.

(In other words, it’s only a cosmetic affect like momentos)

lazerlaz

The question is why? What is your thought process? Give me some more information before I answer

Jade1986

Every race can do everything. Some are just a little better at it than others. I have seen orc mag dks absolutely obliterate people, and altmer rangers do the same. Every race can do everything effectively. Some just are specialists.

O_LYKOS

no

WuffyCerulei

Tbh it should either be done away with, have weaker races be buff/changed, and/or have the stronger racial passives be nerfed. Probs the second tho. More so for DPS-related races. Almost every stamina dps is a redguard/khajiit and magicka dps an altmer.

Doctordarkspawn

Personally, and this is a gripe I've allways had with elder scrolls games, I'd like to pick my racials.

Come on, some characters just come from another culture. Not every Khajiit is born in Elsweyr.

Betsararie

no.

SisterGoat

I like my Argonian swim speed.

Animus-ESO

I 100 % agree with this OP. Not every argonian needs to be a healer, not every high elf needs to be a mage. Let us pick our starting bonuses.

Jade1986

WuffyCerulei wrote: »

Tbh it should either be done away with, have weaker races be buff/changed, and/or have the stronger racial passives be nerfed. Probs the second tho. More so for DPS-related races. Almost every stamina dps is a redguard/khajiit and magicka dps an altmer.

My stam dk melee is a bosmer , my stam warden archer I a bosmer, my mag nb is an argonian, what I'm trying to say is, not everyone uses what everyone uses.

ThePrinceOfBargains

Jade1986 wrote: »

Every race can do everything. Some are just a little better at it than others. I have seen orc mag dks absolutely obliterate people, and altmer rangers do the same. Every race can do everything effectively. Some just are specialists.

The problem is, most people don’t respect this. It’s annoying to deal with these people when playing a build that’s opposite of what’s expected of your race.

They have a point regardless. However good you are without the proper racials, you’d be even better with them. They need to do away with racials. They’re completely unnecessary and restrictive. Goes against what they wanted from OT.

WrathOfInnos

What would be given if the racial passives are taken away? This could be a big nerf to anyone who chose an optimal race for their build. I would have to vote no to any large sweeping nerfs, we've had more than enough of those in the last few updates.

If racial bonuses were replaced with a new category of passives that were equally powerful and accessible by everyone then I would be onboard.

Jade1986

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

Jade1986 wrote: »

Every race can do everything. Some are just a little better at it than others. I have seen orc mag dks absolutely obliterate people, and altmer rangers do the same. Every race can do everything effectively. Some just are specialists.

The problem is, most people don’t respect this. It’s annoying to deal with these people when playing a build that’s opposite of what’s expected of your race.

They have a point regardless. However good you are without the proper racials, you’d be even better with them. They need to do away with racials. They’re completely unnecessary and restrictive. Goes against what they wanted from OT.

I would say then to avoid those people. I get invited to trials and pvp guild raid groups with those toons. And I proved I am more Tha capable.

SydneyGrey

I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, it would be super nice to have a stamina character that actually had some decent stamina sustain that wasn't a Redguard or a Wood Elf. I'm trying to play an Orc right now, and the sustain is WAAAAAYYYY worse than my Redguard and Wood Elf characters. The difference is ridiculous. It would be nice if the races were a *little* more equal just so I don't feel like I *have* to play a Bosmer or Redguard if I want a non-tank stam toon.

On the other hand, I don't necessarily want the only differences between races to be cosmetic.

dodgehopper_ESO

I think they just need to make all racial passives available via enchantments. The next thing they need to do is take those passives and make them static numbers that do not scale based on percentages or multipliers. This would take some of the pain out of racial selection and make it less meaningful which would be a good thing.

Folks complain about adjustments made to racials because it would 'change what they originally intended them to be'. I hate to break it to those people but I've had to change builds on characters in a 180 degree fashion because of changes made to racials already. Builds that once had a stong niche got completely upended by past changes. Its already been done. The real problem is the game system completely changed a couple of times, and racials really didn't change much to match with it.

lazerlaz

Im an arognian nightblade. Have been for a couple years. Majority of the time solo or duo pvp and Grand Overlord on one of them. (Ya I got more than one Argonian nb lol). Take that information as you want but if you know how to play this game well enough your racials should not make or break you. Nightblade is known for dps for pvp and Argonian does NOT compliment dps increase. Shouldn't, and doesn't, matter. Just my experience.

SanderBuraas

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Personally, and this is a gripe I've allways had with elder scrolls games, I'd like to pick my racials.

Come on, some characters just come from another culture. Not every Khajiit is born in Elsweyr.

@Doctordarkspawn

I agree. My character is a Redguard and a mage, and I miss out on good stats. The problem is that resources like stamina and magicka affect damage and healing, whereas in the singleplayer games they don't. Either let us choose racial passives, or make them not affect combat. I prefer the latter.

HatchetHaro

I score-push trials with my Argonian DDs, I deal top-tier dps with them, and I'm doing really well in regards to scores, so I'm probably one of the best examples of "racials don't matter".

I still don't like it; I'm always plagued with the knowledge that I would be performing better if I was playing a meta race. Personally, instead of removing racial passives completely, I would change and add extra stats to balance the racial differences out for both stamina and magicka damage-dealing while keeping them unique to each race. Alas, balancing that for PvP would be another matter entirely.

MLGProPlayer

I hate racial passives in games. It's even worse when classes are gender locked.

I would have liked to play as a dark skinned mage in this game. Can't do that if you plan to min-max.

Solariken

As mentioned by @dodgehopper_ESO above, racial passives need to be a flat value and NOT a % modifier. That way, the boons retain a similar relative potency no matter how you spec your toon.

The Argonian potion and resist passives are hands down the best available because they are strong on every build type - very well designed. Too bad ZOS screwed the pooch on almost every other race.

MehrunesFlagon

This has to be the stupidest thing I've heard since I last heard Trump talk.

MLGProPlayer

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Personally, and this is a gripe I've allways had with elder scrolls games, I'd like to pick my racials.

Come on, some characters just come from another culture. Not every Khajiit is born in Elsweyr.

And we see plenty of powerful NPCs who don't belong to the right race (like bosmer mages and dark elf assassins). You can't tell me that absolutely no bosmer can be proficient mages or that no dark elves can be proficient with a blade because we see examples to the contrary everywhere.

Thogard

This has the potential to be a really juicy thread!

Alchemical

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I hate racial passives in games. It's even worse when classes are gender locked.

I would have liked to play as a dark skinned mage in this game. Can't do that if you plan to min-max.

This actually bothers me a lot too, because Redguards look fabulous in robes. And there are virtually white shades of Redguard, but there's not many darker skin tones for any of the other men races.

I'd be pretty upset if they nerfed my OP Argonian racials love that swim speed mmmm but over all I don't think the game would hurt from taking another pass at racials.

dodgehopper_ESO

Alchemical wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I hate racial passives in games. It's even worse when classes are gender locked.

I would have liked to play as a dark skinned mage in this game. Can't do that if you plan to min-max.

This actually bothers me a lot too, because Redguards look fabulous in robes. And there are virtually white shades of Redguard, but there's not many darker skin tones for any of the other men races.

I'd be pretty upset if they nerfed my OP Argonian racials love that swim speed mmmm but over all I don't think the game would hurt from taking another pass at racials.

You can make a dark skinned Imperial. I've done it. They won't be black but they'll be very dark. I haven't tried with Breton but I believe they can at best be 'tan' and with Nords they're all 1,000 shades of white. At first I wanted to reply to you that you can always be a dark Dunmer mage... (wish I had a trollface image to inject in here).

Argonians are great because they're useful but not in an OP kind of way, just a very cool kind of way. That's what racials should be. Right now it feels like a bit of ball and chain. I'm sure people would love to play an Altmer warrior, or a Redguard wizard and why not? It is well within theme for such to exist. Some of the great npc heroes of the series defy their racial stereotypes. There are Redguard necromancers - something anathema to their culture. There are Altmer warriors - we run into them all of the time. There is Shalidor. There's that 300 year old Redguard mage hanging out in a tree with the bosmer fella in Grahtwood. There is Lady Cinnabar of Taneth. The point is that there are lots of NPC's who buck the trend. The fun of playing a race like Nord or Argonian is that their passives generally give you the freedom to do whatever you want.

Mettaricana

Sold on the idea that way i can be what i want so tired of all bis stams being redguard and khajiit and all magicka bis altmer...

I know i can pick what i want but id just be gimping myself in the end. No racials atleast no stats affecting racials would be nice. Like keep bosmer reduced dmg from falls and the weapon or armor masteries but add something else to fill in blanks

Anrose

I love TES lore and things as much as many people here, but....

The “play as you like” crowd is getting a bit out of control here. ZOS is already homogenizing the classes to the point where class choice doesn’t even have to factor in to what you want to actually play. Taking racial passives out of the equation will just make everyone out there equally good at everything. That’s not how anything works.

Hard pass.

dodgehopper_ESO

Anrose wrote: »

I love TES lore and things as much as many people here, but....

The “play as you like” crowd is getting a bit out of control here. ZOS is already homogenizing the classes to the point where class choice doesn’t even have to factor in to what you want to actually play. Taking racial passives out of the equation will just make everyone out there equally good at everything. That’s not how anything works.

Hard pass.

1. Race is not class.
2. They have already mucked with racial balance many times in the past. I have friends in the game who permanently quit over this. I've also experienced having to completely remake a character because of it.
3. This is not play as you like but undermining the nonsense of making specific races the ONLY choice for certain top end gaming.
4. TES really isn't a 'class based' game to begin with. Its a skill based game designed by Classes which are nothing more than packets of 'favored skills'. This has been my experience from Morrowind onward. ESO bucks that trend. If I had my way this game would have no classes and be more about just 'skills'.
5. The suggestion that I, @Solariken and others have pointed out would still advantage Altmer mages and Redguard Warriors, but it would not make it the stark difference that it is. It is commonly held that in an mmo it is bad to make races overly different unless you lock races to certain classes. Additionally, in previous TES games your race mattered very little at the end game, to the point of being near worthless. Any build worked exceptionally well in any role.

MythicEmperor

No, but I wouldn't mind the reimplementation of soft caps so that if you work hard enough, any race can perform at its best, but you have an easier time on the 'optimum' race.

Nyx2

It should definitely matter what race you pick, you want unique races not just in appearance but their abilities. However with everyone trying to min/max their effectiveness, the choices often get very limited and the racials are too strongly leaning into either magic or stamina builds. This is very different from the main game in which you can be anything you want. Things like potion effectiveness, specific resistances, increased damage by missing % of health would all be unique without forcing you too much in one playstyle.

There would need to be more thought put into all that than "lets remove all racials" and I would still keep the current racials at least in a nerfed form to give slight advantages to min/maxing.