MagNB vs Magdk from a magnb perspective

Datthaw

Hello eso community, so here is what I'm having problems with.... WINGS!

I main a magnb and have always run a destro resto play style. The one class that just completely destroys me is a magdk who can keep up wings. I find myself just light attacking and keeping up ward with the occasional resto heavy. Especially with the buff from 3-6 seconds on wings.

Now I know some people will just be like why don't you dw? But that's really my favorite pla style for magnb.

My setup atm
5 Julianos fb
5 necro bb
2 skoria

FB / impale - mercy - cripple - funnel - flame reach - incap ult

BB / healing ward - leeching strikes - cloak - degeneration - shadow image - meteor ult (only like lvl 47 resto staff will probably drop incap move meteor to Fb and resto ult back when time comes)

I'm looking for some tips or tricks other destro/resto magnb players use when they are dueling or find themselves in a 1v1 with a magdk. Because I'm outta good ideas.

lynog85

Apply cripple when possible,shield stack and weave on resto, count 6 after wings and soul harvest into a bow when possible. Fear every six secs if wings are being spammed. Its tedious but you will eventually get them. Only garbage mdks use wings so its just a matter of time if you play it right against them.

Datthaw

lynog85 wrote: »

Apply cripple when possible,shield stack and weave on resto, count 6 after wings and soul harvest into a bow when possible. Fear every six secs if wings are being spammed. Its tedious but you will eventually get them. Only garbage mdks use wings so its just a matter of time if you play it right against them.

I have been finding I might need to drop flame reach for fear, but there goes a skoria dot, but that's a problem for another time.
So you say weave on resto, does resto staff not reflect from wings? I have noticed resto heavy gets through things like npc bubbles.
I do have a couple buddy's who main magdk so I can get them to help me test this out in duels.

lynog85

Datthaw wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

Apply cripple when possible,shield stack and weave on resto, count 6 after wings and soul harvest into a bow when possible. Fear every six secs if wings are being spammed. Its tedious but you will eventually get them. Only garbage mdks use wings so its just a matter of time if you play it right against them.

I have been finding I might need to drop flame reach for fear, but there goes a skoria dot, but that's a problem for another time.
So you say weave on resto, does resto staff not reflect from wings? I have noticed resto heavy gets through things like npc bubbles.
I do have a couple buddy's who main magdk so I can get them to help me test this out in duels.

Resto wont reflect bro no. Ill usually cripple then the wings start to come out. Ill fear put weakness to elements on and entropy. Swap bar resto weave with shields until i hear the bow proc. Time it right so you know wings are down, soul harvest then fear bow. Get a scoria proc aswell and not much survives

VaranisArano

lynog85 wrote: »

Apply cripple when possible,shield stack and weave on resto, count 6 after wings and soul harvest into a bow when possible. Fear every six secs if wings are being spammed. Its tedious but you will eventually get them. Only garbage mdks use wings so its just a matter of time if you play it right against them.

From the perspective of a magDK, if those wings are winning the fight, they aren't garbage, are they? They aren't a good counter to every situation, but when they are the appropriate counter, they're pretty great. (For the MagDK)

But also from the perspective of magDK, if those wings are what's causing the problem, keep the pressure up with non-reflectable attacks. You can pressure me into forgetting to spam, or pressure me into running out of resources to spam wings. The fears will be really annoying, since I have to break off what I'm doing to respond. Overall I agree that wearing them down is a good tactic.

WacArnold

Wings vs a magblade is bs people will say go force pulse but that is crap. Its complete bs that one skill can reflect evey attack a destro magblade has.
I dont see wings so much in open world, but in duels is garbage complete garbage.

Calboy

WacArnold wrote: »

Wings vs a magblade is bs people will say go force pulse but that is crap. Its complete bs that one skill can reflect evey attack a destro magblade has.
I dont see wings so much in open world, but in duels is garbage complete garbage.

Run concealed weapon?

lynog85

VaranisArano wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

Apply cripple when possible,shield stack and weave on resto, count 6 after wings and soul harvest into a bow when possible. Fear every six secs if wings are being spammed. Its tedious but you will eventually get them. Only garbage mdks use wings so its just a matter of time if you play it right against them.

From the perspective of a magDK, if those wings are winning the fight, they aren't garbage, are they? They aren't a good counter to every situation, but when they are the appropriate counter, they're pretty great. (For the MagDK)

But also from the perspective of magDK, if those wings are what's causing the problem, keep the pressure up with non-reflectable attacks. You can pressure me into forgetting to spam, or pressure me into running out of resources to spam wings. The fears will be really annoying, since I have to break off what I'm doing to respond. Overall I agree that wearing them down is a good tactic.

I never said the wings were garbage mate. I said most mag dks using them are garbage.

Koolio

The exact reason I went DW/Resto. After a few failed fights against them I switched. Especially when I kill those people on every other class I had.

kaithuzar

I've had luck with sap & grothdar but you could probably throw in path of darkness or twisting.
Also shade helps to stay at range.
Ultimately magdk is an up close fighter, so you just have to be better at it than them or keep your distance. It really helps to be a dunmer with fire resist in this case if you are vamp.

Datthaw

Update. I have changed my gear setup because shadow image is still broken. Image won't activate if I'm out of los, which is how you want to use the dang thing.

I'm now running a reposte/transmutation setup and I have dropped flame reach for fear and image for refreshing path.

Since the gear and skill changes along with the advice from @lynog85, I have successfully won and competitively lost battles with wing spam magdk now. Refreshing path is also an amazing skill vs them because the turtle up so much. The dot and hot is amazing vs them I have found.

Lexxypwns

It should be noted that wall of elements really hurts melee builds. I wouldn’t run it solo open world, but it’s worth considering for duels imo.

I don’t like niche duel builds so I don’t personally run it; but you can get nice damage off wall of elements if a melee build has to deal with it then they can’t control the engagement as easily. Path is similar but less tooltip damage, doesn’t cause status effects, and can’t proc poisons or glyphs. Now, obviously path is great and you should be running it on most builds, stacked with woe you’ve got excellent pressure on builds that have to engage you at melee range. I believe @Subversus runs it though

Datthaw

Lexxypwns wrote: »

It should be noted that wall of elements really hurts melee builds. I wouldn’t run it solo open world, but it’s worth considering for duels imo.

I don’t like niche duel builds so I don’t personally run it; but you can get nice damage off wall of elements if a melee build has to deal with it then they can’t control the engagement as easily. Path is similar but less tooltip damage, doesn’t cause status effects, and can’t proc poisons or glyphs. Now, obviously path is great and you should be running it on most builds, stacked with woe you’ve got excellent pressure on builds that have to engage you at melee range. I believe @Subversus runs it though

Really? Wall of elements can proc poisons and glyphs? I would love to get unbalanced from lightning staff but then I lost single target buff from flame staff

lynog85

Datthaw wrote: »

Update. I have changed my gear setup because shadow image is still broken. Image won't activate if I'm out of los, which is how you want to use the dang thing.

I'm now running a reposte/transmutation setup and I have dropped flame reach for fear and image for refreshing path.

Since the gear and skill changes along with the advice from @lynog85, I have successfully won and competitively lost battles with wing spam magdk now. Refreshing path is also an amazing skill vs them because the turtle up so much. The dot and hot is amazing vs them I have found.

Good to hear youre having some success mate. The build youre using imo is more of a group play build. Lacks some burst. Have you ever tried winterborn skoria open world? So much fun. Suits that style of play too.

Datthaw

lynog85 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Update. I have changed my gear setup because shadow image is still broken. Image won't activate if I'm out of los, which is how you want to use the dang thing.

I'm now running a reposte/transmutation setup and I have dropped flame reach for fear and image for refreshing path.

Since the gear and skill changes along with the advice from @lynog85, I have successfully won and competitively lost battles with wing spam magdk now. Refreshing path is also an amazing skill vs them because the turtle up so much. The dot and hot is amazing vs them I have found.

Good to hear youre having some success mate. The build youre using imo is more of a group play build. Lacks some burst. Have you ever tried winterborn skoria open world? So much fun. Suits that style of play too.

Hmm that sounds interesting, I have been messing with an ice staff build but I've been finding it redundant with cripple as a snare also. But I guess ice clench and cripple together are good in 1vx situations. I started with it mainly because I looted an asylum iice staff, however I don't like using force pulse over funnel health.

Berenhir

Datthaw wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

It should be noted that wall of elements really hurts melee builds. I wouldn’t run it solo open world, but it’s worth considering for duels imo.

I don’t like niche duel builds so I don’t personally run it; but you can get nice damage off wall of elements if a melee build has to deal with it then they can’t control the engagement as easily. Path is similar but less tooltip damage, doesn’t cause status effects, and can’t proc poisons or glyphs. Now, obviously path is great and you should be running it on most builds, stacked with woe you’ve got excellent pressure on builds that have to engage you at melee range. I believe @Subversus runs it though

Really? Wall of elements can proc poisons and glyphs? I would love to get unbalanced from lightning staff but then I lost single target buff from flame staff

If you took flame reach off your bar, you don't have increased single target damage with a flame staff anymore

Datthaw

Berenhir wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

It should be noted that wall of elements really hurts melee builds. I wouldn’t run it solo open world, but it’s worth considering for duels imo.

I don’t like niche duel builds so I don’t personally run it; but you can get nice damage off wall of elements if a melee build has to deal with it then they can’t control the engagement as easily. Path is similar but less tooltip damage, doesn’t cause status effects, and can’t proc poisons or glyphs. Now, obviously path is great and you should be running it on most builds, stacked with woe you’ve got excellent pressure on builds that have to engage you at melee range. I believe @Subversus runs it though

Really? Wall of elements can proc poisons and glyphs? I would love to get unbalanced from lightning staff but then I lost single target buff from flame staff

If you took flame reach off your bar, you don't have increased single target damage with a flame staff anymore

Ahhhh shnap you're right.... rip

Well this just threw me for a loop, I duno how I missed that. Now I'm all disappointed lol

lynog85

Datthaw wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Update. I have changed my gear setup because shadow image is still broken. Image won't activate if I'm out of los, which is how you want to use the dang thing.

I'm now running a reposte/transmutation setup and I have dropped flame reach for fear and image for refreshing path.

Since the gear and skill changes along with the advice from @lynog85, I have successfully won and competitively lost battles with wing spam magdk now. Refreshing path is also an amazing skill vs them because the turtle up so much. The dot and hot is amazing vs them I have found.

Good to hear youre having some success mate. The build youre using imo is more of a group play build. Lacks some burst. Have you ever tried winterborn skoria open world? So much fun. Suits that style of play too.

Hmm that sounds interesting, I have been messing with an ice staff build but I've been finding it redundant with cripple as a snare also. But I guess ice clench and cripple together are good in 1vx situations. I started with it mainly because I looted an asylum iice staff, however I don't like using force pulse over funnel health.

It procs alot with just light attacks and wallofelements or reach tbh. I never swapped out funnel and it was great