Joy's New and Improved Guide to Beating Maelstrom Arena

kerp

Locriana wrote: »

Please, if anyone can, be more specific how you are burning these crystals, because it isn't just dots gonna do it.

What Mundas? Lover or apprentice?
What skills for a pet sorc work here?

I'm using liquid lightning, blockade of storms, harness magicka, vol familiar, ele drain (which I've tested on skeleton and it really adds a lot of free dps, even using Lover stone) hardened Ward, power surge, and crushing shock only for interrupt. Boundelsss storm.

@Locriana
Well, I made it with petsorc with 2 pets after Summerset.
Necro + Spinner + Grothdarr, all gold, all divines, for the final round nirn front and sharpened backbar, both lightning Spinner staves.
Mage Mundus
About 20 attributes on health, blue food, about 22k health and 49-50k magicka. Purple jewelry, two rings transmuted to Swift (definitely much more comfort in the pillars stage, it's almost as if you have Haste Sigil). All armor and jewelry with Magicka enchants, staves with Lightning.
Skills:
Front: Elemental Blockade, Empowered ward, Volatile Familiar, Twilight Matriarch, Inner Light + Elemental Rage
Back: Liquid Lightning, Daedric Prey (or Elemental Susceptibility for rounds 7-8), Volatile Familiar, Twilight Matriarch, Power Surge + Storm Atronach (never use this one in vMA).

The final round:
if your ulti is full:
1. Call 2 pets, Power Surge, Elemental Blockade, Liquid Lightning, pulse, (the boss appears in the middle), Daedric Prey, ward, heavy attack and block the skull.

if not: rez at shrine, fill the ulti, return, you already have the pets, go on with Power surge.

2. Boss teleports: bash, ulti (with 22k and ward you don't have to go away from the boss' DoT circle), pulse, some AoE, circle around the Guard. Boss is 65-70% and goes up, Crema Guard is dead.
3. Go near a glowing portal and kill the daedroth. If there are healers can kill them too. But if you are too slow the Crema Guard will appear.

Up:
1. Power Surge (can be done before climbing too), Elemental Blockade, ward, step aside from the comet and block. Don't have to look at the boss. Can start pulse too, depends how away you have to go to escape the comet circle.
2. Liquid Lightning, Daedric Prey, pulse and go here and there trying to use Grothdarr damage. Can cast some Heavy attack, but escaping the comet circles is the first priority. Renew Blockade, ward, pulse and Liquid lightning, it takes 20-30 secs per crystal to break. Just escape from comets and reapply dots, pulse and ward. Of course, take care for the wall and hide behind it. Behind it you can still use Liquid Lightning, pulse and Daedric Prey.
3. After 1st wall run to the second crystal, you'll have to block the boss twice, so after the first block just look at the boss, escape the comets and block him for the second time. Then the same - apply Power Surge, ward, DoTs and pulse.
4. Normally here I fall down, kill a daedroth (if you are fighting near a portal and the daedroth dies you can climb even if the Guard is still alive) and then take the last clystal, have to block one skull and the wall moves slow.

Back down:
1. Ward, return to the ground, Power Surge, get the Defence and Power Sigils.
2. Attack the boss, take care for the gold ghosts only if they are around the boss and can raise his defenses. Don't care about the walkers.
3. Wait the boss to teleport and throw your ulti and everything you have. Here Defense Sigyl helps a lot, can do this without Power too. Here the important thing is to throw the ulti just after the teleport, if you are too slow the boss will teleport and your Elemental Rage will fall in the empty ground. If needed wait for him to teleport again (this time I think the Crema Guard apperas too), this is not a problem, you have 30secs for the Defense and Power sigils and the boss is dead in 10secs if he is under your ultimate.
4. This is enough, the boss is dead.

Made 5-6 runs, the first was with Elemental Susceptibility only, now I use only Daedric Prey and only nirn staff. Got nice Maelstrom Inferno infused staff and now it is on my backbar, elem blockade and Liquid Lightning are switched. No other changes.

With this setup I make about 25K on the dummy while filling my ulti (displayed as 20-22k after the battle because I just run away when my ulti is full and additional 10secs are added to the time).
You are more experienced than me, I have never tried vet trial.

Joy_Division

Locriana wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

@Locriana

It sounds like to me that for whatever reason, you are not being efficient with your time at the Crystals. If you up there for a third time, then something can be done better with the approach if you have max CP.

OK that 300 CP Dragonknight isn't speced out for max damage and it kills the three crystals in one go. I look at the footage again and I am using 5 DoTS (Ash Cloud, Wall of Elements, Burning Embers, Burning Breath, Flames of Oblivion), I do not chase walls (so I am always DPSing rather than sprinting/moving), and not a single second is wasted doing things like looking at boss, unnecessary movement, etc. It's instinctual so it's not going to be easy for an inexperienced player to replicate, but it can be done.

First, thank you for your thoughtful reply.

Having more dots is obviously a good thing. (Can't wait to get my Magblade up there. But she's having trouble on the ice flows. For some reason that's the tough one, so far, for her.)

Everyone tells me to keep camera focused on the boss up top in the final round. Not that I do that, there is too much going on. It's tough enough avoiding the circles and not getting snared. How do you not move when a comet circle is under your feet and you must? Do you stay around one crystal? I guess not if you are putting dots on them all, unless they are ranged dots. I know the wall pretty much comes close to that first crystal on the left. I generally throw a dot and ele drain on the first crystal to the left, then proceed counter-clockwise to the next one and do the same with my other dot. Sparky (the familar) goes after whichever one I heavy attack of course. His choice if I don't do that.

OK, try to help you out here as best I can

I don't keep the camera on the boss. I also have done this so many times I have an intuitive feel when his skull attacks come and I can *hear* them so all I do is peek at him once in a while. That skull attack is the biggest threat so you have to be aware of it. He attacks a few seconds after you come up and then twice in-between the walls.

You can't stand still, that's how you avoid the comet: so, yeah, you got to watch your feet, move, and know when the skull attacks come. It isn't easy to keep track of all that, but with experienced you'll get a feel for it and then it won't be so hard.
Until then, it's going to be difficult because it's hard doing all that and while being efficient without that intuitive feel.

That long paragraph was a confusing mix of two things, sorry.

Pretty much all the preliminary rounds of the final stage are not bad for me to get through anymore, except round 4 is a beast. It was round 4 with the summoners of the bone colossus, which I felt was representative of the dps problem.
I simply do not understand how anyone gets all the Dremora Narkynaz (summoners) down fast enough. I was at the point last night where I knew exactly where they would spawn (and Sparky and/or infernal guardian can be a help there too, to catch them early) and I still could barely kill them before they start summoning. Inevitably a point comes when I must pay attention to the CG who is breathing down my neck, so to speak, and one summoner slips by and has been summoning a sec or two before I can get to them. It literally only takes one to summon that bone colossus. I have to kill the Bone Collosus every time. And not every time is a success.

Tonight I returned and guess what? The summoner spawn points were not the same. Only the first one was. So I have to re-learn them every time? Talking about round 4 here, still. Is this normal?

Considering that even if I do somehow manage to ever burn the crystals, the fact that I will have to come back down to another round of summoners I can't kill all of before the bone colossus, while dealing with all the boss mechanics, can you see how this looks impossible to me?

And thank you for pointing out the limitations for pet sorcs in Maelstrom. It's real.

OK, different stages. For the 4th round of the last stage, again it's about knowing the spawn points and DoTs help a lot here since the walkers are slow and go in a predictable path.

The hardest part is the 3rd set of spawns that includes a Deadroth. I save the yellow ghost explosion for it. IF you don't have the yellow ghosts, use the defensive sigal and us the explosion on the 5th spawn that has the Ogrim and two summoners spawn on opposite sides. Focus one of them down real quick. Aside from the Deadroth, nothing is that threatening and thus make sure you get the gold ghosts.

Actually, I do like that advice, though it's more a philosophy of play style than advice, and I share it.

I do skeleton parses, because it helps me understand which skills combine well with others, timing, and sequencing, and is good for my fingers getting used to where things are. And helps me test what happens if I change one aspect of my build, all other things being equal.
But I completely agree that actual in-game experience is being able to respond to circumstances as they arise. I reeeaaaly don't like the min-maxing style of play. I've played with plenty guys who go for the dummy parse to get 40k+ dps, then they are so squishy even with great healers that they are dead half the time. That's really 20k+ dps. Plus whatever his fellow deepser had to not do, in order to res him. I like to play a good, survivable build with enough dps for the content.

Efficient dps is what I'm after here as well, and really what I'm asking about. Along with whether there have been changes in the game, like more hit points for some of these 'adds'. Like the summoners.

Is the bone colossus really supposed to be able to spawn when only one summoner gets a few seconds to summon? One video I saw, and it was from a good source that has been helpful, said you only have to kill one of the summoners who are currently summoning in the center of the arena, but that is SO not true. At least not now.

I do have a mag DK, my first character, that I dusted off for Summerset, I may try her out with this. I'd love to replicate what you do, or at least learn from it, but I can't play that video. Apparently it's too long a chunk. If I scroll to the end it just churns forever and never plays. I'd have to watch all , what, 3 hours to get to the end, and that's not gonna work. I have a good connection so I don't know what's up with that. I've never seen it happen before. I'd really love to see what you do with the final stage.

Part of efficient DPs comes with experience in the arena and knowing when to go all out and when not to. Until you get that, it's going to be hard no matter what kind of build you use. So, patience, we've all gone through it.

Yeah the bone summoner spawns really quickly, they got to die. One of the nice thing about DKs is the Eruption cloud damages them AND snares them. But it's mostly about know where they spoawn so you can immediately go get them and be efficent doing so.

1. wave 1: one summoer spawns
2. wave 2: One summoner 1/4 of the arena to the left of the first
3. wave 3: one summoner spawns (this is the daedroth spawn). It's on the opposite side of wave 2 guy.
4. wave 4: easy round, build reosurces, get ghots. One spawns same spot.
5. wave 5: 2 spawn with the ogrim. they are on opposite sides of arena, which is why use gold ghost explosion here, it's hard to get to them both without it.

Not sure why you can't watch the video, I think it would really help. It is an little over an hour long on youtube. I like DK, most people who do this don't though. I dont use the Deep Breath skill, it's really good though for inexperienced players. DKs dont have the on-demand burst the sorcs do, so need to rely on DoTs and be a bit more patient.

Yes, I do need hardened Ward. Or empowered Ward, which is what I usually run because it lasts just long enough to res someone and it provides and extra 10% magicka regen. And with necro and a pet, hardened Ward is a huge shield, as it scales with magicka. Also it protects the pet. Sparky hardly ever dies if I'm using it. It also procs infernal guardian like crazy. I should probably remorph it back to empowered again...for the extra regen.
I've never talked to a sorc who didn't run Ward in Maelstrom, in vet raids, or any difficult content. Not one who survived. Lol.
I use harness magicka on back bar so I have a shield on each bar.
Tried your backbar resto idea, nirnhoned and golded it, it just doesn't work as well as Ward, harness, and power surge (which I also need to have any dps at all). Though I do think that's a pretty brilliant idea, to nirnhone a resto star, in order to give back some power to the dps skills on the bar.
Even leveled it just for this!
I'm quite dedicated to finishing this. It's become a thing for me.

But yes I think I do need daedric prey back on the bar. Boundless storm goes. Costs too much anyway. Someone suggested it for getting around up top.

Honestly, I've changed up skills and monster sets on all the harder boss rounds and have found that makes a big difference, because the mechanics of each stage benefit from different setups. At least for those who are struggling with it.

Now that I think about it, yeah prolly need it since I really have two shields with my mag characters (healing ward too).

I'm not sure how I'd approach this on a sorcerer right now TBH. When I did it pets were pretty bad, critical surge scaled of damage done (so you could get big heals) and frags stunned. I'm not sure. I PvP so much that I'm just used to running resto backbar, but no doubt other people would get higher scores than me. I think the pet build will seem easy once you get used to where all the spawns are, so hang with it.

Thank you and I will try to do that. I have a lot of videos of old epic failures, but managed to get through those stages by reviewing them myself. This one may call for more expert critique.

I'm glad to hear that three times should not have to happen because it's grueling and disheartening.
But I really think they must've upped the hit points on those crystals. I hope instead it's just something I'm doing wrong.

I did check a couple patches ago if they adjusted any of the health, they didn't. We all got frustrated on that last fight so don't worry too much. Easy to say I know, but once you get a feel for it, the arena is much easier.

Locriana

Thanks for the suggestions, @Merlin13KAGL. Most of of these things I'm aware of and try to apply, but it certainly doesn't hurt to review them. The crystal advice is more than welcome, considering I don't get up there enough to practice doing it.

I've retooled as a non-pet sorc, which looks good as far as being able to get more skills on the bar when needed, and also to get more critical hits which means more deeps and more heals.

However. NOTHING HELPS ME WITH THE !&%#*#! DREMORA NARKYNAZ SUMMONERS. I have to keep doing round 4 to get to the final boss, coming back from day to day, so you'd think I'd have found SOMETHING that works.

Is ANYONE HERE a sorc of any variety who is able to prevent the summoners from raising the BONE COLLOSUS.
If so, can you post a video, or tell how you do it?

This is a major psychological (and actual, I'm certain) hurdle toward completing the final boss also. Because if and when I ever clear the crystals, I know I'm coming back downstairs to summoners, and I can't prevent them doing their thing and making it SO much more difficult when I'm at my most fatigued. And ruining the attempt as I most likely will not be able to deal with that at that point.

Everyone just says 'kill the summoners before they raise the bone collosus', at though that were a simple matter. I just can't do it. After so many tries. Any one of them bends down for even a few seconds, and the thing will come out at its appointed time.

Please some advice on how to do that?

Locriana

I missed this page before my post about 50 min ago, and just wanted to say thank you @Joy_Division and @kerp I will review what you say in depth!

@Joy_Division THANK YOU for detailing those spawn points for summoners, I figured out all but the last one, that two spawn on opposite sides. One seemed to come out of nowhere. And, the other night when I was in there awhile, the spawn positions were off I'm pretty sure. This thing gets bugged sometimes. It helps to restart entire game.

Also, for the summoners? Two words. Rune Prison. Well and one more, Overload. Well and two more, Mages wrath. You can kill those guys pretty fast with any two of that combo. Mages wrath is enough if they've been walking through wall of elements on their way to the circle. I didn't even have Rune Prison morphed and it stopped them long enough to kill, even if they made it to the circle, every one. First time ever no bone Collosus!
Helps to have room for useful skills!

Also switched to Engine guardian so I can use blue food, because I can't get enough health without pets otherwise. The random regen is kind of scary but I've seen Deltia using it and it seems to help him out on final boss.

It gets really expensive changing up glyphs for all the monster set combos, which provide different stats, and still not enough health really, except when I use Valkyn Skoria. Which has its limitations.

swift ring(s) seem like a GREAT idea @kerp

Not a pet build at the moment, decided to try using Julianos with Destruction Mastery (from dragon star). I gives you 2316 magicka (purple) on #5 with destro staves equipped, and one each of mag,icka crit, and spell damage. An all-round good balance with Julianos. With still over 40k magicka to power the Ward.

I did a series of tests to see if I could get enough spell pen to go with apprentice mundus instead of lover. Found a sharpened staff to put on the bar with inner light and my main dps skills. Buffs and on back bar. Got rid of ele drain because it was too distracting to rely on it and inner light seemed a passive dps boost. Works better for me.

A little CP re-arranginging for more penetration and it seems pretty good. Keeping in mind that practice dummies have about 18k resistance, and it's said that 12k penetration is what's best in Maelstrom because most things ar around that mark. All I know is I'm burning down the CG's faster, and.....

I burned down one crystal! Got knocked off and was happy to see it almost dead when I came back up!
The trick for me seemed to be staying around the first one, weaving back and forth to avoid the puddles. And having a lot more dps than I did before, with less complication.

These little successes are to be savored.


Oh and @kerp , vet trials are a completely different experience -- almost the opposite of vet Maelstrom. I'm having to adapt to a very different way of approaching things. It's interesting of course, but different. I've spent a lot more time doing trials than Maelstrom. I didn't even know it was there for ages. Trials you get heals, debuffs, and tanks. Maelstrom you don't. In Trials, you often have a definite role as part of a team, so people count on you to fulfill that. And you count on them to fill other roles. Very interconnected.
Both are mechanics heavy, but in Maelstrom you have to fulfill every role yourself, and all the bad guys are all after YOU, and all at the same time. And adds are considerably more dangerous.

Merlin13KAGL

@Locriana Sounds like you're making progress! I'd offer up two more things on the summoners, and a third, less obvious suggestion too.

Learn the spawns, esp for the summoners. I know this is easier said than done, especially when you can get turned around easily with everything going on. Use the 'gate' as your reference point and that will help a bit.

Ideally, you want to be damaging and snaring them for the duration of their walk, long before they get to center circle. So, look for them, drop Wall / LL the length of their path and they'll be down or close to it by the time they arrive. If there are two coming out at once, you can drop your AoE on the first, then go over and single target the second. If nothing else, do a full heavy attack. Don't cut it short. The windup is longer than a LA, but the overall damage is much higher, and if you're using lighting wall and the add is concussed, they'll get knocked down briefly, buying you a little more time.

Second, if you're still getting nervous at them getting close, use your ult if you must. You can drop Ele Rage on two at once, you can slot Soul Strike (World line) for a cheap hard hitting single target that will be ready to go again quickly. You've already figured out Overload hits hard too.

The last, which may help with the first, go to your video settings and turn up your gamma a bit. On my setup, gamma is down all the way, and when it's dark, it's dark. Adjusting the gamma up will make things that blend in (summoners, archers with taking aim, and argonians) stand out a bit more. Faster you find them, faster you kill them.

(I'll add a fourth here.) If you do think you're going to not be able to get the summoners down and you have ult up, wait and just let the summon happen. Wait for the colossus to be fully formed and use the gold ghost explosion if you have it, Ele Rage if you don't. It will be enough to burn the colossus and the remaining summoners down.

If you have none of the above options, lay down your AoE's, shield up, and kite for all you're worth. The fire rain that happens can be avoided if you can stay ahead of it and the colossus will die to your DoTs as it chases you. When they run out, cast them in front of you and just keep going.

Best of luck. I suspect a clear is in your very near future.

kerp

Locriana wrote: »

Not a pet build at the moment, decided to try using Julianos with Destruction Mastery (from dragon star). I gives you 2316 magicka (purple) on #5 with destro staves equipped, and one each of mag,icka crit, and spell damage. An all-round good balance with Julianos. With still over 40k magicka to power the Ward.

@Locriana
I started two pets build when I watched that 1-bar vMA video (this one). It looks so easy there, and you have ward, attacking and healing pet, and no rotation at all, so you can concentrate on the action. In the real life it's a bit harder, but I made it using this thread and the video above. With two destro staves and more skills, because ele blockade and ward (plus two pets and Inner Rage) is a bit extreme for me

Now I almost don't use healing from the Matriarch if I keep the ward and Surge up so maybe I will remove it and use some other skills next time.

PS. IMO for petsorc is easier to make it - you put ele blockade, liq lightning and pulse, plus daedric prey, then run away from the comets and let the pets and DoTs do the work for you.

rumple9

Still wiping on last boss for a month. Saving it for orsinium event on Thursday so if I do it will get double drop. Fingers crossed !

Locriana

Making some steady progress with my non-pet build. Golded Julianos and Destruction Mastery. I may switch out Destruction Mastery for Mother’s Sorrow just for grins. I now get through all the early rounds of the final stage pretty quickly. Summoners no longer much of a problem as I discovered rune cage and knowing spawns helps a lot here. Learning to keep my eye on gold ghosts which does speed things along if you have a stun like that.

It’s now really down to the final boss problems. I can get upstairs pretty easily with no sigils if I have destro ulti ready. And I can burn crystals much faster with this setup. I have inner light on main hard hitting bar, and a sharpened staff there. (I’ve switched to apprentice mundus and putt more points into spell pen).
I switch out rune cage for boundless storm for final round, it helps a lot upstairs. Learning the pattern of comet drops and skirting them. It’ll s probably help with ghosts if I ever get to that part of the final round.

The thing is getting kicked off the top. I’m not really sure how that happens every time. Not sure when I have to get behind the wall, and when it’s just he’s throwing skulls and I should’ve blocked.,this is not something you can practice doing or observing without many repetions or exhausting effort. (I guess I should add that I’m chronically ill and it takes a lot out of me to do what it takes to get up top so many times, and fight for my life whenever I get thrown off, over and over. Yes I do take breaks.)

I don’t find I’m able to keep an eye on the boss as much as some suggest, so knowing the timing and sequence here would be helpful. When to get behind the wall and when it’s blockable skulls. Which one does he do first? What’s the telegraph for each (if I manage to glance at him)?

I notice that if I stay around the first crystal to the left, the wall come by there at some point while I’m dodging comets and dps-ing the crystal. Is that when I should get behind it? There have been times I have burned the crystal before that happens, and times that it still needs work. Seems a waste of time to follow the wall when I don’t need to yet.

Is it a good idea to use shooting star up there on another crystal?
I’ve tried overload up there on the crystals and when it crits it packs a punch. Also recharges some magicka. But it seems maybe just dropping a shooting star would be quicker than the light attacks you do with overload. Thing is, I’d I get knocked off top while shooting star is active up there, I’m not sure it’s still doing damage...

If I save ulti for when I get kicked off, at least it’s available right away when I die and respawn. Otherwise I have to spend a life running around and recharging my ulti...

I grab the healing sigil before I go up if I can. I find I can stay up there awhile with power surge either way as long as I avoid getting knocked off.

When knocked off and you’ve maybe burned down one crystal, is it advisable to take the shield sigil then? Or will you be sorry later...


A lot of questions I know but maybe helpful to everyone struggling to answer these. Especially sorcs.

Locriana

kerp wrote: »

Locriana wrote: »

Not a pet build at the moment, decided to try using Julianos with Destruction Mastery (from dragon star). I gives you 2316 magicka (purple) on #5 with destro staves equipped, and one each of mag,icka crit, and spell damage. An all-round good balance with Julianos. With still over 40k magicka to power the Ward.

@Locriana
I started two pets build when I watched that 1-bar vMA video (this one). It looks so easy there, and you have ward, attacking and healing pet, and no rotation at all, so you can concentrate on the action. In the real life it's a bit harder, but I made it using this thread and the video above. With two destro staves and more skills, because ele blockade and ward (plus two pets and Inner Rage) is a bit extreme for me

Now I almost don't use healing from the Matriarch if I keep the ward and Surge up so maybe I will remove it and use some other skills next time.

PS. IMO for petsorc is easier to make it - you put ele blockade, liq lightning and pulse, plus daedric prey, then run away from the comets and let the pets and DoTs do the work for you.

@kerp I changed my build because I wasn’t finding that the pets did the work for me. I was getting too little dps with all that on my bar and no boosts. I may go back but so far I’m working with the non-pet and inner light is available on one bar, which affects things whenever you change to it. Back bar for support skills — interrupt, boundless storm, harness magicka, power surge...liquid lightning is there too so I have an aoe dot on each bar. Plus it gets stronger when I switch back to main bar that has inner light.

I really don’t see how you get along without crushing shock. Sometimes I just can’t get to the caster fast enough to bash. And no power surge or inner light? My dps goes to crap and I can’t burn things fast enough, plus then Matriarch is a must on both bars for heals. I don’t make a dent in the crystals without these skills, and there is more danger from crem. Guards because they hang around longer. Wasn’t working for me, even though pet sorc has been my main character since the beginning. Maybe your luck is better, but I don’t need them running after the low-priority adds when I need them on high priority targets. And I don’t always have time for a heavy attack to direct them, or want to have to watch out for what the heck they are doing.

Changing bars is much less a problem for me than relying on only pets and blockade. If you have a video I’d love to see your technique there. Maybe it’ll inspire me to try again.

Please my post above for my current final boss questions, if you have time. You probably know some of the answers since you’ve got through this. And thanks very much for your advice here.

kerp

@Locriana
The only nasty targets that have to be interrupted are the archers when they are one-shooting you (with bow raised and a red circle above the head), then I sprint and bash. And the final boss ofc but I am near him because of Grothdarr. BTW familiar can be used to stun too, the last pulse is stunning.

I have Inner Light on my front bar and Power Surge on my back bar. And I try not to use back bar at all - as fast as I can I cast the skill and change back to front to get full penetration (from Spinner) and the Inner Light passive. So I use my back bar only in "switch-cast-switch" style . Sometimes I switch so fast that the blockade is not cast at all, sometimes the second switch is not executed and when I try to renew my ward it does nothing (in the most cases when I am not on the right staff I just die).

Yesterday tried to record a video for you - to show you how I fill my ulti. About 6 mins Normally this whole thing is about 2-2.5 minutes - jump to the house, one minute for the dummy, exit the house, shrine is just outside, teleport to the Arena, gallop, may repair the armor, go back. There was an enormous lag when I was teleporting to my house but the boss was still waiting for me. Maybe I will upload it somewhere. The final round took more than one hour, died at least 10-15 times.

I posted that one bar petsorc video twice, here it is again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cafavdcH7po

Oops. My fault - before I posted the video as a link. Now I posted only the URL and here it is.

Merlin13KAGL

@Locriana let's see if we can answer some of these for you.

Locriana wrote: »

I don’t find I’m able to keep an eye on the boss as much as some suggest, so knowing the timing and sequence here would be helpful. When to get behind the wall and when it’s blockable skulls. Which one does he do first? What’s the telegraph for each (if I manage to glance at him)?

It's a timing thing. The more you do it, the more 'normal' it will feel. The telegraph for the throw is pretty typical.
He kind of pulls back one arm (as if to throw) and then launches the skull. The first one is going to happen within seconds after your arrival topside.

You'll have time to cast 3-4 skills, you'll probably see one, maybe two meteor AoE's and then you can expect the throw. The good news with this, is after that first meteor AoE, you can roll dodge by default and the timing will probably be about right for you to miss the first skull.

Until you're more familiar with the timing or seeing the animation, if your Stam bar is full, you can always just periodically roll dodge. You'll miss a throw or AoE or two by sheer accident because of the dodge immunity you'll be granted (it will dodge things about a second before and after you've actually dodged, so you can dodge preemptively and it will still credit it to you.)

Just make sure you keep enough stam to at least block/break free in case the dodge is unsuccessful. *(This also works on the archers Taking Aim, if you can't interrupt them in time. If all else fails, dodge and you just might avoid the hit.)

I notice that if I stay around the first crystal to the left, the wall come by there at some point while I’m dodging comets and dps-ing the crystal. Is that when I should get behind it? There have been times I have burned the crystal before that happens, and times that it still needs work. Seems a waste of time to follow the wall when I don’t need to yet.

Starting left is good, as it's right there when you go up. Lay down your DoTs, do the roll dodge towards the crystal and chip away.

After the first skull throw, that's when the wall will form. It will come almost a full circle before the next mechanic, so work on crystal #1 for a bit, then you can start heading counterclockwise to meet up with the wall.

Never chase it unless it's crazy close. You won't catch it, and you'll just burn what little stam you have in the process.

Meet up with the wall at crystal #3 (If you consider #1 the one you land at and count clockwise from there.) Don't sweat it if the first crystal isn't down yet. In fact, this might help you, as the wall only speeds up as crystals get destroyed.

You want to be behind the wall for what is effectively a 'stomp.' You will see the boss slowly raising up into the air. When he comes down hard, that's when the knockback would occur and that's when you want to be behind the wall.

The placement can be a little cantankerous, so make sure you're fully behind the wall. This is a good time to refresh your shield, surge, and you can even Heavy attack either crystal for some healing. You can cancel the HA midway if the wall is going to pass you, but this will make sure you're at full health in case you do get knocked downstairs.

Note: You'll generally have time to catch the wall going the opposite direction before he does his knockback. Couple things to be aware of while you're behind the wall: Don't get hung up on the crystals themselves, and watch out for and step around the meteor AoE's. Remember, you have the full thickness of the ring on which you can stand, so long as you're behind the wall.

After wall #1 gets destroyed, expect a couple more skull throws before the next stomp, first one coming shortly after the wall gets destroyed, similar to the timing when you first come up. Dodge or block, your choice, and keep chipping away.

What's important here is that you keep Shields and Surge going, you get behind the wall when you need to, and you keep chipping away at a crystal. Don't get caught up in needing to completely destroy a single one at a time, so long as at least one of them is taking damage.

(Surge coupled with Lightning Form is good here because the LF ticks will probably keep your health topped off simply by standing near the crystals, and the extra 5k resists will help you mitigate any damage you do eat.)

Is it a good idea to use shooting star up there on another crystal?
I’ve tried overload up there on the crystals and when it crits it packs a punch. Also recharges some magicka. But it seems maybe just dropping a shooting star would be quicker than the light attacks you do with overload. Thing is, I’d I get knocked off top while shooting star is active up there, I’m not sure it’s still doing damage...

If I save ulti for when I get kicked off, at least it’s available right away when I die and respawn. Otherwise I have to spend a life running around and recharging my ulti...

I grab the healing sigil before I go up if I can. I find I can stay up there awhile with power surge either way as long as I avoid getting knocked off.

When knocked off and you’ve maybe burned down one crystal, is it advisable to take the shield sigil then? Or will you be sorry later...

A lot of questions I know but maybe helpful to everyone struggling to answer these. Especially sorcs.

Any DoT you don't replace downstairs (recast of Wall of Elements, for instance) will continue to do damage on the crystal upstairs, even if you get knocked off. In fact, when the last crystal is close to breaking, you can actually DoT it up and jump down to a position of your choosing instead of getting knocked back into the lava. If you do this method, just understand that you may still have to contend with a Crem guard for a second or two, or if you've estimated wrong and the crystal does not break, you may have to go up one more time to finish it off.

Save your Ults for downstairs, either to deal with the Crem guard if you still have lots of crystal time left upstairs, or to help burn the boss/summoners during the final phase. You can use Overload if you want to and have plenty of Ult, but it's not necessary. It's not about burst right now, it's more about finding a rhythm.

If you're keeping Surge going and some kind of damage, your health should stay good, even if all you get to do is heavy attack.

What I find a lot of people have difficulty with resource wise is they tend to panic and overcast. Let your Surge go the duration. Same with shield, for the most part, unless it's really low. This will help you have more time to DPS, mechanic, and you'll have more resources as a result. It takes some time to determine just how far you can afford to safely push it before refreshing. When in doubt, Surge, Shield, and Heavy attack. The shield will protect you, surge will heal you, and the full heavy will restore resources.

Locriana wrote: »

I really don’t see how you get along without crushing shock. Sometimes I just can’t get to the caster fast enough to bash. And no power surge or inner light? My dps goes to crap and I can’t burn things fast enough, plus then Matriarch is a must on both bars for heals. I don’t make a dent in the crystals without these skills, and there is more danger from crem. Guards because they hang around longer. Wasn’t working for me, even though pet sorc has been my main character since the beginning. Maybe your luck is better, but I don’t need them running after the low-priority adds when I need them on high priority targets. And I don’t always have time for a heavy attack to direct them, or want to have to watch out for what the heck they are doing.

Changing bars is much less a problem for me than relying on only pets and blockade. If you have a video I’d love to see your technique there. Maybe it’ll inspire me to try again.

Please my post above for my current final boss questions, if you have time. You probably know some of the answers since you’ve got through this. And thanks very much for your advice here.

A couple things here. First, your shield will eat a tick or two of this attack, so you have time to briefly sprint if you need to. You can also use Lightning Form for the little speed boost.

In a non-crushing build, or if you can't get to the skill fast enough, you can always roll dodge towards the boss. This will give you some brief immunity to the necrotic and give you time to get there to bash or crushing shock. Make sure the skills you need to survive are always in quick reach, usually on front bar. You can even double bar your shield if you have to.

The DPS you lose will be worth the survivability you gain.

Also, you can stay near the middle for the most part, so you have less distance to cover. You're probably getting closer to the boss than necessary, as hit box distances in this game are usually a lot bigger than you would expect it to be.

Doing the content without certain skills comes later when you're more comfortable and more familiar with the timing.

Regarding Pet aggro, go into your Controls and (re)bind Command Pet. You can always hold this key and Left click a target and your pets will go after the one of your choosing. Use this in circumstances where you have time to redirect them without using a heavy attack. I rebind this to Caps Lock, as it's in easy reach from the movement keys and my hand never has to shift. Pick a key that works best for you. (You can also Right Click and Command Pet to recall them for certain fights, but you won't need to worry about that here.) Use Command Pet in addition to the Heavy attack aggro, not just as a replacement for.

Finally, regarding taking certain sigils at certain times, there are a lot of variances there. Save them if you can, burn them if you must. I'd rather see you knock out every last sigil standing and survive than save one for later and have to redo the fight.

This entire round is about survivability more than anything else when you're first stating out. You still have to nuke Crem guards, you have to shield/heal damage topside, and you have to down summoners (and Crem guard again) in final phase.

Beyond that, so long as the boss doesn't get 3 ghosts, you literally have all the time in the world.

Take your time. Breathe. Focus on repeating the necessary mechanics, all the way up to the very last tick of health and you'll get there.

*One other thing that worked well for me at first, especially when I was having trouble with the Crem Guards was Streak on my overload bar. You can hit it a couple times for some distance, turn around and OL the guard down, repeating as necessary. This can be good if you have trouble with orbiting him while he's breathing fire in your face.

I hope this covers some of your questions and helps a bit.

As always, good luck, and let us know how you fare!

Last thing: Save a little stam so you can teabag the boss when it's done - he's one of the few that certainly warrants it.

@kerp , you're a braver soul than I. I wouldn't trust the game not to throw up on itself, porting out and back in, and not having to redo the entire stage.

FrancisCrawford

Does it make sense to use the standard "twins" -- in this case "triplets" -- strategy on the crystals, i.e. to damage them all to near destruction before actually finishing any of them off?

Merlin13KAGL

@FrancisCrawford it can. It depends on if you get a feel for if you'll be able to finish them off in one go or not.

The benefit to that method is that the walls will keep the original speed, making it easier to keep up with them. You can also time your own decent this way, too.

With so many doing runs right now, it does seem like it's taking its toll on the server, as things are even buggier than normal and response seems to be worse.

Not sure having two highly server intensive events overlapping was the best call.

FrancisCrawford

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

@FrancisCrawford it can. It depends on if you get a feel for if you'll be able to finish them off in one go or not.

Do they reset their health if you go back down?

Merlin13KAGL

@FrancisCrawford No, whatever damage (up to an including destruction) of the crystals remains. DoTs still active on crystals when you jump down will still remain, and can actually finish off the final crystal while you're already below.

It takes a bit of getting used to to know when this will work and about how long.

What will reset is the cumulative DoT you have from Soul Churn. This can be helpful, esp on Stam characters when Vigor might not be enough to keep up if you're having some trouble upstairs.

EDIT: *One other minor, less obvious benefit that can be used to advantage is when you do break a crystal, it will anger the boss and he'll pause his normal sequence for a few seconds while spouting Daedric profanities at you. You can use breaking a crystal, in some cases to give you a little more time to break yet another before he reengages in the normal fashion.

rumple9

No matter how many times I try I just cannot get past crystal stage

Merlin13KAGL

@rumple9 what specifically is causing you grief? Is the Dot killing you, knockback, meteor stuns? Crem guard / healer giving you issues below? Are you getting hung up on the environment when you get knocked into the lava? (Don't laugh, those perfectly placed stones aren't just there for ambiance and immersion.)

Are you running out of resources or having trouble burning the crystals down, catching the wall?

Give us a little more and maybe we can help.

rumple9

Mag pet sorc. Either running out of stamina so I miss a block/roll dodge or the soul churn dot kills me.

Feels like I'm too slow killing the crystals compared to the numerous videos I've watched but I just cannot get them down any quicker. 950 CP with everything gold, necro, IA and skoria. Their mundus and lightening staves.

I've tried jumping down after killing a crystal but the fall damage, crem guard and the clanfear with its 10k head but is just too much to take.

testd4n1

rumple9 wrote: »

Mag pet sorc. Either running out of stamina so I miss a block/roll dodge or the soul churn dot kills me.

Feels like I'm too slow killing the crystals compared to the numerous videos I've watched but I just cannot get them down any quicker. 950 CP with everything gold, necro, IA and skoria. Their mundus and lightening staves.

I've tried jumping down after killing a crystal but the fall damage, crem guard and the clanfear with its 10k head but is just too much to take.

It's important to keep at it and not get discouraged. My first clear I had 5 necro, 3 willpower and random staffs. All was purple except one staff was blue and most was not divines. Used the lady as I only had ~350CP. It was a struggle but doable. Make sure you keep 100% uptime on shield upstairs. HA for infal proc and maybe run tristat food or potions.

Merlin13KAGL

rumple9 wrote: »

Mag pet sorc. Either running out of stamina so I miss a block/roll dodge or the soul churn dot kills me.

Feels like I'm too slow killing the crystals compared to the numerous videos I've watched but I just cannot get them down any quicker. 950 CP with everything gold, necro, IA and skoria. Their mundus and lightening staves.

I've tried jumping down after killing a crystal but the fall damage, crem guard and the clanfear with its 10k head but is just too much to take.

If you're running out of stamina, you're probably doing some stam based things before you need to. It's also why Joy recommends tri-stat food while you're getting used to things. You won't lose that much health or magicka, but that extra stam can be a life saver (literally). You can also use trash stam pots if you need to, to replenish your pool.

Upstairs:

Meteor AoE: You can just step out of these, literally right to the edge and you'll be fine. You don't have to block, sprint, or dodge. You're probably sprinting here and there without realizing it and using up your stam. You can't dodge if your stam is too low, but you just need a sliver to be able to block.

Skull throws: Dodge if you can, block if you can't. I recommend dodge. Wait for the animation until you're used to the timing and you'll have a long enough period of immunity before and after the dodge (during, odd as it sounds, you're not actually dodging yet. That's an unintuive ZoS special, on that one.) The timeframe is pretty generous, so when it's close, dodge one time, and you'll probably be ok.

The Wall: You can short sprint if you feel you need to to meet up with it the opposite way it goes (counterclockwise). You don't have to block while your behind it. (Habits die hard, and I'm sure I've had every bad one at one point.) You can take a breather from damaging crystals and just focus on staying behind the wall if you need to during this time. You can pick up damage after the wall is destroyed.

I usually start out by going left of the first crystal and rotate the camera towards where I came in. That way, when I'm dodging the first skull, I'm already headed in the right direction to meet up with the wall.

The Crystals: DoTs and Heavy Attacks will do the trick. Thow Ele Drain on them if you have it and it will help with Magicka. If you do a HA, make sure you do a full heavy attack, let it go to completion, or you get no resources back.

Amidst all this, keep your surge up, keep your shield up (Empowered lasts a little longer, so has to be refreshed less). Let your shield go the full duration for maximum benefit. If you take a single tick of damage, it's no big deal, reshield, reSurge (if you need to), and Heavy Attack, if nothing else.

One last mildly advanced trick you can do regarding stam:

You can take the other morph of Dark Exchange, taking from your Magicka pool (assuming you have no mag resource issues) and giving you back stam and health.

Use the full width of the doughnut when topside. You can anywhere along there to avoid getting hung up on crystals or to go around meteors. If you stay closer to the middle, you can sometimes eat a skull and not get knocked completely off.

Points in the CP's that reduce Sprint, Break Free, and Block costs will help too.

Downstairs:
If you're comfortable with Overload, you can use Lightning Form, Streak, and OL attacks on Crem guards. Use streak to give you some distance, turn around and blast away. You can, of course, still use your normal stuff too. If CG gets close, rotate and repeat. Think of the downstairs like three points on a triangle, just keep kiting and killing this way, then you can switch to the clanfear.

Again, don't sprint. Aside from streak, you're not going to outrun the breath.

Assuming you've been knocked off, dodge back into the arena the direction away from the CG. This will get you out of the lava, give you a couple seconds of that immunity, and keep you from getting hung up on the BS rocks placed perfectly for the very reason to get you hung up.

Personally, I've always called BS on the fact that the CG can track you perfectly upstairs even though he can't see you.
ZoS doesn't bother checking the Z axis when checking position here or anywhere else. Their world, truly is flat, it seems.

Don't worry about being in the right spot for the clanfear to go back topside. Your goal here, first and foremost, is to survive. So ground DoTs and Heavy attacks while orbiting the CG and clanfear if your health is good and your shield are up. Surge will keep you alive, shields will eat your damage.

If you're not so good on health (CG fire is an stacking DoT), Hold block, shield up, and let your DoTs work on them. If you're gonna die, you're gonna die, so no point in saving your stam here. You can block cast things like Liquid Lightning and Wall of Elements, while eating 50% less damage from anything that does get through. Don't sweat it if you kill the clanfear too. Another one will always spawn.

Be at the right portal. They shift from time to time. If you see the glowing pad start to pulse towards the center, it's getting ready to go away. Look, instead, for the next one to light up, and kill the clanfear there. Again, you can Ele Drain and Heavy attack for resources before going topside again.

If all else fails, drop you Ult. You'll have time to rebuild it and a spent Ult is cheaper than restarting the round.

I also try to have Surge and Shield already going before I go up, in case it lags somewhat.

Remember it's not a DPS race when you're first trying to clear. It's about surviving and being methodical.

When you clear the last crystal and go into final phase (and you will!), keep doing the same thing. Surge, Shield, interrupt the boss as needed. Dodge if you must, block if you can't. Don't sprint unless it's in very short bursts.

You can burn the summoners or Rune Cage them, or you can just go for the boss. The key thing is you want to make sure you're collecting the gold ghosts, not him. You'll hear them, you'll see them. You don't generally have to chase them. They'll always come towards the boss, so just position yourself between and let them hit you.

Rinse and repeat. Keep your surge and shield going the entire time. If you can't do anything else, heavy attack. Deal with the Crem guard the same way as always, Ult is your friend. Keep chipping away at the boss.

When you get ghost #3, don't activate it immediately. Shield, Surge (seeing a pattern yet?), step out of any AoE you might be in, hold block, and hit the synergy. It's a channel, so it takes a second, and you don't want to die while you're trying to get it to fire off.

If the boss is low, focus him. If he's not so low, make sure the CG is down and damage the boss as much as you can. This is a judgement call that comes with experience.

Even if you don't kill the boss while he's stunned, don't panic. Just repeat the above until you collect your chest.

Don't get greedy. Be methodical and focus on surviving, and you will finish! (I have one memorable clear where we actually traded killing blows.)

Last thing, should you happen to get a Atro spawn, the Overload / streak combo can help you keep distance and stay out of the fire rain long enough to get him down.

Take your time, breath in between round and wipes (you're gonna have some).

@rumple9 You've got this! If you can get to this round, you can clear this round.

Hope some of this helps. Good luck, and let us know how it goes!

FrancisCrawford

I have a simple, practical question: I just took a character there for the first time and can't figure out how to get into vet mode. (The group finder is just giving me the "normal" option, and I can't think of how else to toggle it.) Does one have to do it once on normal mode on any given character before doing it in vet mode, or something like that? Or is my problem likely something completely different?

Joy_Division

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

I have a simple, practical question: I just took a character there for the first time and can't figure out how to get into vet mode. (The group finder is just giving me the "normal" option, and I can't think of how else to toggle it.) Does one have to do it once on normal mode on any given character before doing it in vet mode, or something like that? Or is my problem likely something completely different?

You do not have to do it on normal mode. Should be able to toggle the normal/vet option before going into the arena.

FrancisCrawford

Joy_Division wrote: »

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

I have a simple, practical question: I just took a character there for the first time and can't figure out how to get into vet mode. (The group finder is just giving me the "normal" option, and I can't think of how else to toggle it.) Does one have to do it once on normal mode on any given character before doing it in vet mode, or something like that? Or is my problem likely something completely different?

You do not have to do it on normal mode. Should be able to toggle the normal/vet option before going into the arena.

Perhaps, unlike the case for pledges, one has to make the normal/vet choice BEFORE accepting the quest. I'll test that next.

Edit: I think I figured it out. The "anteroom" areas count as part of the instance; one has to make one's choice before entering the whole area, rather than just before entering the arena stages themselves.

Merlin13KAGL

@FrancisCrawford you do have to have Vet selected before entering the instance.

If you have not yet accepted the quest, you can exit (just leave the oblivion portal to the other side if you walked in, or port anywhere else if you ported in. Change to Vet, go back and you're good to go.

If you have already started (not just quest accept, but actually started), you can abandon the quest and exit the area and the instance will reset in about 10-20 minutes, letting you go back in in Vet.

The client should be updated to remember your preferences for this kind of thing, but sadly they have not yet added that. (I've gone into Norms before a few times after they changed the list order.)

FWIW, one of the reasons they did the above is you can exit, change to Norm midway through the arena and it will let you continue where you left off for purposes of a clear. You cannot go from Norm to Vet the same way, however.

Good luck.

Earrindo

@Joy_Division
I just want to extend my thanks to you for your guide. Along with encouragement from my guild, and the added incentive of the double drops, I was finally able to clear vMA.
Not only that, but because I was so stoked after my first clear, I went on to clear it a second time, over just 3 days instead of the 8+ months my first run took (so much rage lol)
And this afternoon, after finishing my second clear, I was again so stoked, I went through and cleared everything including Voriak and was rewarded with my Maelstrom Bow I was hoping for.
I don't really do alts, and my main is a Stamden. So I wasn't really making this any easier for myself, but on each run, on each boss, I had your guide open and I could never have done it without your helpful, clear, and thoughtful suggestions and strategies.

So thank you for your time and effort in posting and maintaining this guide. Friendly encouragement is awesome, but a resource like this is what got me there in the end, and I wanted to extend my deepest appreciation.

rumple9

Finally did it - got 4 cruel flurry weapons due to the event. Thank you all for your help, especially the excellent post from @Merlin13KAGL above

MakeMeUhSamich

rumple9 wrote: »

Finally did it - got 4 cruel flurry weapons due to the event. Thank you all for your help, especially the excellent post from @Merlin13KAGL above

Congratulations!

Joy_Division

Earrindo wrote: »

@Joy_Division
I just want to extend my thanks to you for your guide. Along with encouragement from my guild, and the added incentive of the double drops, I was finally able to clear vMA.
Not only that, but because I was so stoked after my first clear, I went on to clear it a second time, over just 3 days instead of the 8+ months my first run took (so much rage lol)
And this afternoon, after finishing my second clear, I was again so stoked, I went through and cleared everything including Voriak and was rewarded with my Maelstrom Bow I was hoping for.
I don't really do alts, and my main is a Stamden. So I wasn't really making this any easier for myself, but on each run, on each boss, I had your guide open and I could never have done it without your helpful, clear, and thoughtful suggestions and strategies.

So thank you for your time and effort in posting and maintaining this guide. Friendly encouragement is awesome, but a resource like this is what got me there in the end, and I wanted to extend my deepest appreciation.

Glad to hear it!

Merlin13KAGL

Great job, @rumple9 ! It'll be a while before it gets easy (thanks, ZoS bugs), but it will get easier!

Well done!

FrancisCrawford

Just to be sure (I've seen this claimed elsewhere): Vitality bonuses are all about score, and have no practical effect on your success/failure in combat. Correct?