A perfect balanced pvp game

Medakon

I saw a post about a plan to stop zergs from @Deep_01, and this gave me a great idea.

What if a pvp mode doing the following:

Premade build, and gear setup.
A Champion arena where you do not select you own build, gear, potions, or stats. Once you enter this Arena, you have the option to select between pre-made 4-5 different setups. This would be interesting as it would be easy to balance for zenimax. Maybe even a random mode, where your setup is selected randomly? And this arena could be 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, OR 1v1v1, 2v2v2, 3v3v3.

Additionally, you select if you wanna select between 3 different modes, which also has different leaderboards.

Mode 1: Damage Dealer, Damage Dealer, Damage Dealer
Mode 2: Damage Dealer, Damage Dealer, Tank
Mode 3: Damage Dealer, Healer, Tank

Thought?

Deep_01

This is what battlegrounds could be, with option to select game's parameters.

Huyen

If you can make a way to implement this setup as well for Cyro, it would solve the balance issues by a lot (not all tho).

kyle.wilson

Maybe FPS are your thing. That's how they all work.
Maybe it would be good for quick games when you don't have much time available.

Motherball

I like the idea and would definitely try it. Many players that enjoy pvp in rpg settings are not looking for a fair fight in my experience. If you are searching for clean, balanced pvp, many shooter games offer a more level playing field.

Zvorgin

This sounds terrible and takes all the creativity out of builds and the diversity of PvP. Sure there are meta chasers, but there are a lot who don't.

TBois

This sounds horrible. This is still an rpg. I only really PvP, and my favorite part is developing strong custom builds. If your suggestions were implemented across the board for PvP, I don't believe I would be the only one leaving the game.

Bouldercleave

People always scream balance, balance, balance - until they get it.

The strong players get bored and the weak players get frustrated

Both wind up leaving.

Runschei

If ZOS picks up this idea and sends it live I'll quit for sure.

geonsocal

for myself - building characters and testing them against other folks is a large part of the fun...

granted that includes getting stomped a bunch, but, it also includes coming out on top from time to time...

life isn't fair - why should a video game be

VaranisArano

I guess I understand where some of you prefer this style. Its certainly balanced...at the expense of playing how you like.

Personally, I'm perfectly happy to play PVP on my main toon, who's a very non-optimized MagDK playing a healer in PVP. I'm free to build as overpowered as I like, or more likely, as underpowered as I am.

Honest question here: is it normal for games that have a huge variety in how people can build characters like ESO to implement pre-made builds for PVP? Or are those usually in different types of games?

Ackwalan

So you are looking for an online checkers game.

PlagueSD

Medakon wrote: »

I saw a post about a plan to stop zergs from @Deep_01, and this gave me a great idea.

What if a pvp mode doing the following:

Premade build, and gear setup.
A Champion arena where you do not select you own build, gear, potions, or stats. Once you enter this Arena, you have the option to select between pre-made 4-5 different setups. This would be interesting as it would be easy to balance for zenimax. Maybe even a random mode, where your setup is selected randomly? And this arena could be 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, OR 1v1v1, 2v2v2, 3v3v3.

Additionally, you select if you wanna select between 3 different modes, which also has different leaderboards.

Mode 1: Damage Dealer, Damage Dealer, Damage Dealer
Mode 2: Damage Dealer, Damage Dealer, Tank
Mode 3: Damage Dealer, Healer, Tank

Thought?

Congratulations!!! You just described a MMOBA. Unfortunately, ESO is an MMORPG.

Agalloch

Separate pvp and pve/ problem solved

And pls, I don't want ESO to become Call Of Duty

Vapirko

I’d rather have some imbalance than pre made sets in cyrodiil.

Shadzilla

Customization and variety of players certain builds is probably one of the biggest factors of not just this game, but every mmo... Throwing that out the window will never even be considered by ZOS, nor should it.

MakoFore

id play it. i think bg needs a *** ton more modes for it to be viable.
non cp
cp
template
and custom

VaranisArano

Good news. We already have custom cp and non-cp. Its called Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds. Though I wish that ZOS was providing Battlegrounds for both CP and non-CP.

Girl_Number8

TBois wrote: »

This sounds horrible. This is still an rpg. I only really PvP, and my favorite part is developing strong custom builds. If your suggestions were implemented across the board for PvP, I don't believe I would be the only one leaving the game.

Yes, and Yes I agree 100%!! This would make PvP sooo boring *yawn If this ever happened.

I think Op needs BGs with cp enabled "oh wait!" they did that. There see problem solved, enjoy.

Girl_Number8

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People always scream balance, balance, balance - until they get it.

The strong players get bored and the weak players get frustrated

Both wind up leaving.

I thought they were screaming nerf, nerf, nerf, then buff, and everyone quickly has to find a chair. The one left standing ZoS kills your build. Get it the one left standing gets nerfed. Then all the poor little snowflakes can't get that really cool monster helm because there is no one there to keep aggro on the boss, lol.

Sylosi

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People always scream balance, balance, balance - until they get it.

The strong players get bored and the weak players get frustrated

Both wind up leaving.

Only if your matchmaking is trash, meanwhile, LoL, DOTA 2, Overwatch, etc all games with balance on another level compared to the joke that is ESO. all have more players than even the biggest MMORPG (or even most of the big MMORPGs put together).

VaranisArano

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

I thought they were screaming nerf, nerf, nerf, then buff, and everyone quickly has to find a chair. The one left standing ZoS kills your build. Get it the one left standing gets nerfed. Then all the poor little snowflakes can't get that really cool monster helm because there is no one there to keep aggro on the boss, lol.

Is this why sorcs never get nerfed cause they have streak and the minor expedition from Hurricane? Mind blown.

PlagueSD

Sylosi wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People always scream balance, balance, balance - until they get it.

The strong players get bored and the weak players get frustrated

Both wind up leaving.

Only if your matchmaking is trash, meanwhile, LoL, DOTA 2, Overwatch, etc all games with balance on another level compared to the joke that is ESO. all have more players than even the biggest MMORPG (or even most of the big MMORPGs put together).

Citation? Also, those games you listed are MMOBAs. I personally find them boring as hell after about 2 hours.

Also, there's complaining going on in ALL games about balance. It's not just ESO.

Overwatch:
https://www.heroesneverdie.com/2017/10/9/16434790/overwatch-balance-team-development-controversy-mercy

DOTA 2:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.843194-Lets-talk-about-DotA-2-and-its-balancing-issues

League of Legends :
https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/O3NHEY3g-lets-discuss-balance-and-counterplay

Doctordarkspawn

TBois wrote: »

This sounds horrible. This is still an rpg. I only really PvP, and my favorite part is developing strong custom builds. If your suggestions were implemented across the board for PvP, I don't believe I would be the only one leaving the game.

Yes, and it is the RPG aspect of it that eternally makes it unbalanceable. Because they are not just balancing for one side of the game, but PVP and PVE both.

Self defeating.

Doctordarkspawn

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People always scream balance, balance, balance - until they get it.

The strong players get bored and the weak players get frustrated

Both wind up leaving.

Hence why it's not worth investing. Why create a game-mode by, where your logic, when done right, drives people away?

Girl_Number8

VaranisArano wrote: »

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

I thought they were screaming nerf, nerf, nerf, then buff, and everyone quickly has to find a chair. The one left standing ZoS kills your build. Get it the one left standing gets nerfed. Then all the poor little snowflakes can't get that really cool monster helm because there is no one there to keep aggro on the boss, lol.

Is this why sorcs never get nerfed cause they have streak and the minor expedition from Hurricane? Mind blown.

Nah, it's because I think they need at least two playable classes, lol.

Though I would really like to see some crippled classes buffed. It's more fun to play them all.

GrigorijMalahevich

You suggest no counterplay and no diversity - ni thank you

Beardimus

I've said from the start they needed an Arcade mode campaign in Cyro

Pick a template DD/Healer/Tank - certain skills, pickup gear like a FPS. It would have given the casuals somewhere to play rather than dumbing down the whole game like they seem to want to with ridiculous proc sets etc.

Also the pros could have worked out who really was the best skill wise.

I wouldn't have gone there, i prefer the mmorpg / theory craft etc but i could we it appealing to many that picked the game up cheap and went off it due to the effort.

Sylosi

PlagueSD wrote: »

Sylosi wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People always scream balance, balance, balance - until they get it.

The strong players get bored and the weak players get frustrated

Both wind up leaving.

Only if your matchmaking is trash, meanwhile, LoL, DOTA 2, Overwatch, etc all games with balance on another level compared to the joke that is ESO. all have more players than even the biggest MMORPG (or even most of the big MMORPGs put together).

Citation? Also, those games you listed are MMOBAs. I personally find them boring as hell after about 2 hours.

Also, there's complaining going on in ALL games about balance. It's not just ESO.

Overwatch:
https://www.heroesneverdie.com/2017/10/9/16434790/overwatch-balance-team-development-controversy-mercy

DOTA 2:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.843194-Lets-talk-about-DotA-2-and-its-balancing-issues

League of Legends :
https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/O3NHEY3g-lets-discuss-balance-and-counterplay

CItation? You mean for player numbers? Go look it up last time I checked LoL had 65 million players, Overwatch (which is a shooter not a MOBA) had 20 million, etc. (this may come as a shock but successful games are not normally shy about giving out their player numbers)

People complain about balance in any game, but I said it is on another level not that is perfect, I mean they are dedicated PvP games so balance is all centered on that, not some half-arsed compromise between PvE & PvP, some only have one mode, so again balance is all on that, same thing with how regular balance is in a lot of PvP games, in some you get a balance patch every 4-5 weeks with a minor patch in addition to that in between at the 2 week mark, ESO (and MMORPGs in general) are simply a million miles off.

Which is why " strong players get bored and the weak players get frustrated" is an idiotic notion, in any decent game, strong players don't face weak players outside of the rare exception, because ithat makes for trash tier PvP for all involved.