Looking for some CC for my warden. (PVP)

Casul

Ok so I was looking at my kit for my stam ward and found out I'm missing some soft cc. So here's what I got.

Dw.
Shrouded dagger (just love this ability, but could replace with cutting dive or another spam ability)
Subterranean assault (love this one too)
Rending slash (dot pressure and snare)
Shuffle (easy access to it via main bar)
(Flex slot, was thinking gripping shards for a spam immobilize + snare.)
Werewolf (or FD depending on circumstance)

S&B
Vigor
Flex slot (was running retreating maneuver)
Soothing spore (this then Vigor to benefit from the major mending)
Shimmering shield (absorb some of the magical damage + ultimate building)
Radiant mage light (great for preventing nightblade cloaks etc)
Healing thicket (great heal)

So badically I need an immobilize, I see only 2 for stam ward. Gripping shard or bear trap. But they both have delays which sucks. Also missing a heavy CC but I could drop maneuver for invasion and get a gap closer +CC. Is there a soft CC immobilize I'm missing?

Waffennacht

So I love Invasion + Gripping Shards. They have to break free and roll dodge. That's really all I have to add

Casul

I never though of that actually. Maybe I can put Vigor on my main bar and run invasion and gripping. That would be great as a resource drain combo. Good idea!

Defilted

Gripping shards is great. Run it on my Mag Warden PVP build.

Koolio

I use poisons for my soft cc on a lot of characters.

Casul

Poisons are also an option but my main bar is designed around benefitting from enchants so I would ideally like to avoid poisons. But. I could run them on my back bar easily. Hmm.

Wanna be really mean.

1.Invasion (hard cc)
2.Gripping (soft cc)
3.Resource poison (pressure)
4.???
5.Profit???

Jade1986

use powerbash with the poison morph?

scipionumatia

shulk, bird of prey, poison inject,LA, draining shot, *bar swap* invasion, LA, gripping shards, dawn breaker.
that should do it. if theyre standing after that run lol

Casul

scipionumatia wrote: »

shulk, bird of prey, poison inject,LA, draining shot, *bar swap* invasion, LA, gripping shards, dawn breaker.
that should do it. if theyre standing after that run lol

Sounds effective but unfortunately my super requires DW and S&B for the extra 2 slots. I'm running a 5/5/2 build.

Lexxypwns

Invasion is a really terrible CC and gap closer. You want to be able to time your CC for an opportune moment during burst phases or consistenly on cool down not just when you have created spacing to use invasion.

I run reverb for duels, but open world DBoS is enough hard CC usually since you can pack so much burst.

Casul

Probably go for reverb then. Or maybe I could run S&b both bars but I will miss shrouded blade badly.

ChunkyCat

Gripping shards, reverb bash, shielded assault.

I successfully use all three on my stam warden.

Casul

I have a flex slot if I take off soothing spore and just run tree and vigor. So maybe I can use all 3.

scipionumatia

is vigor a better heal than spore? ive seen many people running both for the major mending on spore to buff vigor but seems to me you really only would need spore?

Trinotops

I personally wouldn't use shrooms at all. I think it is a terrible heal and vigor plus trees (especially with shimmering shield) should provide all of the survivability you need.

Casul

Spore to me seems like it has a 8k cost instead since typically to get the really good heals (10k+) you need to crit with major mending on. So maybe having the tree give you mending and using Vigor will be enough.

Datolite

What is a 'soft CC' exactly and what are some examples for different classes/weapons?

Adenoma

@Lexxypwns , what're you running for stamwarden? I've been enjoying 5x bone pirate, 5x fury (might switch to 7th Legion) and 2x blood Spawn (may go to troll king) for dw/S&B in no-CP. I've enjoyed fury charging up while I'm sitting in my trees that I can more or less drop on cooldown. I've been running quick cloak for the mobility and actually dropped any CC outside of DBoS after finding reverberating bash a little unnecessary unless I was dueling.

Normally playing solo or 2-4 man groups.

Brutusmax1mus

Adenoma wrote: »

@Lexxypwns , what're you running for stamwarden? I've been enjoying 5x bone pirate, 5x fury (might switch to 7th Legion) and 2x blood Spawn (may go to troll king) for dw/S&B in no-CP. I've enjoyed fury charging up while I'm sitting in my trees that I can more or less drop on cooldown. I've been running quick cloak for the mobility and actually dropped any CC outside of DBoS after finding reverberating bash a little unnecessary unless I was dueling.

Normally playing solo or 2-4 man groups.

Why quick cloak over birds of prey? The aoe reduction?

Lexxypwns

Adenoma wrote: »

@Lexxypwns , what're you running for stamwarden? I've been enjoying 5x bone pirate, 5x fury (might switch to 7th Legion) and 2x blood Spawn (may go to troll king) for dw/S&B in no-CP. I've enjoyed fury charging up while I'm sitting in my trees that I can more or less drop on cooldown. I've been running quick cloak for the mobility and actually dropped any CC outside of DBoS after finding reverberating bash a little unnecessary unless I was dueling.

Normally playing solo or 2-4 man groups.

I run fury+shackle with 1x Kra'gh 2h/ice destro open world. It's something a pal helped me throw together that excels at killing big numbers with a small group. For duels I run 2h/SnB so I've got reverb as my CC

Don't drop fury for 7th legion, fury is about 365228 times better. Your burst window doesn't come up as soon, but when it's up you can just burst burst burst.

Laquey

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Invasion is a really terrible CC and gap closer. You want to be able to time your CC for an opportune moment during burst phases or consistenly on cool down not just when you have created spacing to use invasion.

I run reverb for duels, but open world DBoS is enough hard CC usually since you can pack so much burst.

I'm having a different experience with invasion and combinging it with low slash and Bird of prey I'm quite easily able to step out to 3 yards, its minimum range, then use it since I'm moving at 130% to their 40%. Invasion is also good for delivering CC after animation canceling a Shalk followed by bird with dodge rolls during an opponents burst attempts and allows you to set up the same burst chain from "hidden", standing or dodge roll with shalk + bird + invasion as it puts you right in their face for LA + Ultimate or LA + Instant + Bash.

I can put a minimum 55K+ tooltip burst behind an invasion with just the LA + Instant + bash, against most people this puts then in execute / panic range so they must CC break and either dodge or shield and depending on class it's followed up by birds or 2H execute back bar which has infused oblivion on it.

My setup is 5 Automaton 1H&S (4 on 2H back bar), 5 Bone Pirate and 2 Selenes.

Front bar (1H&S):
Low Slash, Shalk, Bird, Shield Charge, Bird of Prey, Dawnbreaker.

Back bar (2H):
Netch, Ice Fortress, AoE Execute, Vigor, Flex Slot, Trees.

I choose Automatons over fury because of the burst set up from stealth and fury needs 13 crits to exceed it's damage level. Personal preference I guess but I feel Auto is a litte more flexible and fury tends to suffer from the roll dodge defense as all stuff misses you and you drop your buff.

Selenes is also good with this build as it only works on Melee direct damage so it generally triggers during your burst / execute attempts.

YVMV

Lexxypwns

Laquey wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Invasion is a really terrible CC and gap closer. You want to be able to time your CC for an opportune moment during burst phases or consistenly on cool down not just when you have created spacing to use invasion.

I run reverb for duels, but open world DBoS is enough hard CC usually since you can pack so much burst.

I'm having a different experience with invasion and combinging it with low slash and Bird of prey I'm quite easily able to step out to 3 yards, its minimum range, then use it since I'm moving at 130% to their 40%. Invasion is also good for delivering CC after animation canceling a Shalk followed by bird with dodge rolls during an opponents burst attempts and allows you to set up the same burst chain from "hidden", standing or dodge roll with shalk + bird + invasion as it puts you right in their face for LA + Ultimate or LA + Instant + Bash.

I can put a minimum 55K+ tooltip burst behind an invasion with just the LA + Instant + bash, against most people this puts then in execute / panic range so they must CC break and either dodge or shield and depending on class it's followed up by birds or 2H execute back bar which has infused oblivion on it.

My setup is 5 Automaton 1H&S (4 on 2H back bar), 5 Bone Pirate and 2 Selenes.

Front bar (1H&S):
Low Slash, Shalk, Bird, Shield Charge, Bird of Prey, Dawnbreaker.

Back bar (2H):
Netch, Ice Fortress, AoE Execute, Vigor, Flex Slot, Trees.

I choose Automatons over fury because of the burst set up from stealth and fury needs 13 crits to exceed it's damage level. Personal preference I guess but I feel Auto is a litte more flexible and fury tends to suffer from the roll dodge defense as all stuff misses you and you drop your buff.

Selenes is also good with this build as it only works on Melee direct damage so it generally triggers during your burst / execute attempts.

YVMV

That's a fair point. I don't slot low slash so I often won't have a snare that guarantees me an opportunity to get a gap. I'm really interested and excited to try this out.

As for automaton, would hundings give more burst since subterranean assault is poison damage and doesn't benefit from automaton at all? Huge props for taking a non-meta set that caters more to your playstyle than just running what's BiS. I personally always prefer barely builds with good sustain and fury synergizes so well with that, but when it's not charged you really really lack healing and damage so you're very susceptible to getting burst hard by multiple players early in a fight and if you don't have ultimate up it's a struggle to survive with the low healing.

Casul

After reevaluating my setup I've come to a new build tell me what you think

5m 2h
2 tremor scale (may replace with either velidreth, malubeth, or engine guardian depending on how I feel )
5 hulking draugr
3 agility
2 shacklebreaker

Using sword and shield/2h my set is

Puncture
Subterranean assault
Invasion
Gripping shard
Evil hunter
Flawless DB

Ice fortress
Vigor
Rapid manoeuvre
Netch
Soothing spores
Healing thicket or permafrost depending on group vs solo pvp

Keep in mind stats will be different because I plan on running different food.

Currently with hp and stam food I get

27k hp
45k stamina
3.5k WD
45% crit
700 regen (lol way to low for me, but orzgas food should bump to 1300ish. Which is more reasonable.)
20k defenses
3k crit resistance (all impen except tremor helm.

Adenoma

@Brutusmax1mus , it gives more or less the same mobility as BoP and the AOE reduction is absurd. I'll get hit with a dawnbreaker and when you tally up all my reductions (heavy armor resists, quick cloak, minor protection, sometimes major protection) it will hit me for anywhere from 2-5k. That's pitiful for an ult. That ability basically makes templars roll over hard and gives so much survivability against skills you don't always consider like curse, endless fury proc, deep fissure, take flight, eye of the storm, etc.

It's my biggest draw to being dw over 2h and it does it by a mile.

Waffennacht

@BuildMan even 1300 is too low imo

Casul

@Waffennacht I could change theif mundus to serpent and get 1700ish? 38%ish crit?

Waffennacht

BuildMan wrote: »

@Waffennacht I could change theif mundus to serpent and get 1700ish? 38%ish crit?

That's getting there for regen, for crit it's up to you. I personally don't value crit that much in PvP because of so many sets that are out (impregnable, Transmutation, even Riposte kinda) so 38% is fine imo, but I know some people would say it's too low. I also gotta keep in mind your crit heals, so, there's that

Lexxypwns

BuildMan wrote: »

After reevaluating my setup I've come to a new build tell me what you think

5m 2h
2 tremor scale (may replace with either velidreth, malubeth, or engine guardian depending on how I feel )
5 hulking draugr
3 agility
2 shacklebreaker

Using sword and shield/2h my set is

Puncture
Subterranean assault
Invasion
Gripping shard
Evil hunter
Flawless DB

Ice fortress
Vigor
Rapid manoeuvre
Netch
Soothing spores
Healing thicket or permafrost depending on group vs solo pvp

Keep in mind stats will be different because I plan on running different food.

Currently with hp and stam food I get

27k hp
45k stamina
3.5k WD
45% crit
700 regen (lol way to low for me, but orzgas food should bump to 1300ish. Which is more reasonable.)
20k defenses
3k crit resistance (all impen except tremor helm.

Have you considered lava foot soup? It drops your health to 22k but keeps your stam the same and adds more regen than gold food.

cschwingeb14_ESO

5x shackle+Cameron's throne is probably going to be a lot more versatile that 3x agility and 2x shackle.