So, what traits came out on top?

Bobby_V_Rockit

Welp, Horns of The Reach hit you PC folk about 24 hours ago, and included a surprise twist in the natch potes regarding trait and mundus adjustments.

So, my question is (for us console peasants with two weeks of farming ahead), what traits ended up coming out on top? Is infused + precise DW still the way to go or is more obscure like nirnhoned and charged?

Curious to see what us puny stam DDs will be recommended to use now that TFS AND Spriggan's Thorns got hit.

AcadianPaladin

My pet magsorc with Julianos, Necropotence, sharpened lightning staff took a small hit in magicka (Necro), a notable hit in penetration (sharpened) and a notable hit in crit% (Thief mundus). So she dropped the sharpened staff and went to precise. Like most sorcs, she depends on high crit% for self heals so that had to take priority. End result is loss of penetration.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

My pet magsorc with Julianos, Necropotence, sharpened lightning staff took a small hit in magicka (Necro), a notable hit in penetration (sharpened) and a notable hit in crit% (Thief mundus). So she dropped the sharpened staff and went to precise. Like most sorcs, she depends on high crit% for self heals so that had to take priority. End result is loss of penetration.

I run a mag sorc with no crit bonuses and have 56k max magic and just the base 42% crit and have no trouble getting crit surge to proc every second. Have sharpened staff and everything. Completed vMA with just base crit too, through a 20k empowered ward is pretty sweet.

Morgul667

I think it is too early to say for sure

Sylphex

Using sharpened depends on the rest of your setup and if it's PvE, it depends on your team, more specifically your tanks. If they are running Alkosh, Crushing Glyph, if it's Infused, Torug's etc... For anything dual wield that isn't a vma weapon, I would say you're looking at definitely one infused weapon with weapon/spell dmg. As a console peasant as well, I'd say a nirnhoned main hand and infused off hand. Or you can try precise but it didn't end up getting buffed. If you're amongst a group of less organised players, or perhaps rolling solo, sharpened will probably still be the way to go.

Bobby_V_Rockit

So what I'm hearing is, traits actually ARE situational now and we need to consider what we are happy to sacrifice. I personally need a high crit chance for self heals so precise is almost a must on at least one weapon, but not so squishy I need defending.

Nirnhoned and precise it is!

Beardimus

Console peasant too, however I think the update is still that things are situational to content and what you make your build around. That said the Shadow nerf (on top of Crit nerf) is going to lessen some diversity. but that aside the gap should still be in a few % on setups rather than a storming clear cleader like the Theif / Sharp combo now

Remag_Div

I saw in another thread that Apprentice is the best for Magicka users now.

SoLooney

since the nerf of shadow and a bigger nerf to thief. stamina pulls better numbers with warrior from what i heard. dw will be double infused or infused and precise. backbar bow, heard nirn, precise, sharp, and infused all pull very similar numbers

Not sure on mag, those are trickier

Betsararie

Been hearing sharpened is still workable in PvP, was running it last night and my damage was decent along with the newly buffed apprentice mundus. In the meantime can go spinners to make up for the lost pen.

Bobby_V_Rockit

I'm stam sorc currently running 5x VO and depending on my mood either NMG, Spriggan or Hundings. Guess I dont need to farm anything after all!

TheDoomsdayMonster

Blanco wrote: »

Been hearing sharpened is still workable in PvP, was running it last night and my damage was decent along with the newly buffed apprentice mundus. In the meantime can go spinners to make up for the lost pen.

Sharpened should still be good in PvP; afterall, Defending got nerfed to the same degree as Sharpened, so it balances out...

Heck, if you are running Sharpened, you may even cause more damage than before if people start to turn away from Defending in favor of another trait on their defensive bar...

TheDoomsdayMonster

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

My pet magsorc with Julianos, Necropotence, sharpened lightning staff took a small hit in magicka (Necro), a notable hit in penetration (sharpened) and a notable hit in crit% (Thief mundus). So she dropped the sharpened staff and went to precise. Like most sorcs, she depends on high crit% for self heals so that had to take priority. End result is loss of penetration.

I got to admit, I am thinking hard on going with Precise on all of my Weapon Traits as well...

The 4% crit loss might not sound like much, but it does make a difference; especially over the long haul...

Betsararie

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Blanco wrote: »

Been hearing sharpened is still workable in PvP, was running it last night and my damage was decent along with the newly buffed apprentice mundus. In the meantime can go spinners to make up for the lost pen.

Sharpened should still be good in PvP; afterall, Defending got nerfed to the same degree as Sharpened, so it balances out...

Heck, if you are running Sharpened, you may even cause more damage than before if people start to turn away from Defending in favor of another trait on their defensive bar...

yeah that's a good observation.

Honestly my damage is remotely the same in PvP (playing mag sorc), my build wasn't hit too hard by the nerfs.

The main thing is oblivion damage is unusable now, switched to a flame damage glyph on my sharp inferno staff and people are dropping at remotely the same pace as last patch.

Was hearing a streamer today say nirned is good in PvP after the patch, will be looking into that more.

Also would want to hear more on the infused/oblivion damage combination.

Malic

Blanco wrote: »

Been hearing sharpened is still workable in PvP, was running it last night and my damage was decent along with the newly buffed apprentice mundus. In the meantime can go spinners to make up for the lost pen.

it still works, its largely dependent on if you are in a CP campaign and what your pen investment is there, along with mundus and set bonus.

It was a big nerf, from what I am seeing, i admit freely I am not a time sink tester but crit might be king, but the amount of impen out in cyro still makes sharpened effective. I dont know about pve.

Chelo

Remag_Div wrote: »

I saw in another thread that Apprentice is the best for Magicka users now.

It is...

These are base stats (no buffs):

Minno

My pvp build took a hit defensively due to defending nerfs. I found that the following solved the defending holes:
- 1pc pirate gold + defending + 23 LA focus = 2408 which is exactly the value lost.
- lady mundas = 2752 spell/physical.


This of course assumes resistance is important to you over shield strength or you like to run anti-meta like I do and don't mind losing out on a two piece valkyn proc.

You can also supplement with Hardy/elemental defender, but I think sealing up resistance then adding mitigation is better than adding only mitigation, especially if PvP folks can still get penetration debuffs on you; you'll need the extra mitigation from some armor to help offset the hardy/ele defender nerfs from a few patches ago.

Just my two cents.

Edit: if you run vanilla LA armor, you'll be facing physical DMG enemies that will be doing tool tip DMG on you. Adding Hardy is still a great way to reduce the DMG to you, but you should still utilize the other side of the equation to get much needed protection.

For example, if I'm at 11k physical armor, and an enemy hits me for 6k but has 11k penetration, I'll need 43 points into Hardy to do the same defense as 22k armor. This assumes only Hardy and armor is quickly calculated.

FakeFox

For me Infused with lover turned out to be best with staffes, bows and twohanders. For dual wield it was infused + sharpend with warrior/apprentice. I mostly did self-buffed testing on target dummies so far so I can turn out differently in groupplay.

HeathenDeacon

i really wondering how to deal with the Sharp nerf in non cp pvp still without the pen star.

TheDoomsdayMonster

You know, I was running some tests with different weapon traits, and the difference in your ability to take damage when going from a Defending weapon to a Precise weapon is very significant; its significant enough to give me pause...

When you do the math (5160/663=7.78%) you appear to only lose about 8% of your defensive capability, but it practice it feels like a lot more; you can immediately feel the difference in your damage soak...

Going from Defending to Precise absolutely makes you more squishy; squishy enough that I am actually thinking about standing pat and keeping a Defending Staff on my healing bar despite the reduction in Defensive capability it'll have...

Minno

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

You know, I was running some tests with different weapon traits, and the difference in your ability to take damage when going from a Defending weapon to a Precise weapon is very significant; its significant enough to give me pause...

When you do the math (5160/663=7.78%) you appear to only lose about 8% of your defensive capability, but it practice it feels like a lot more; you can immediately feel the difference in your damage soak...

Going from Defending to Precise absolutely makes you more squishy; squishy enough that I am actually thinking about standing pat and keeping a Defending Staff on my healing bar despite the reduction in Defensive capability it'll have...

I'm in the same boat. In fact, I'm willing to say, if you use LA you shouldn't add any crit weapon traits. You'll be at the 45-50 using a least one set that has one spell crit bonus. Defensive or sharpened might be better if your looking for defense or don't have 10k penetration. Otherwise charged could be a contender, since using a lighting enchant will add some much needed debuffs for you otherwise not included in skills/abilities.

Narvuntien

Infused, Nirnhoned, Sharpened, Precise. I feel. Sharpened and Infused are swapped for PVP.
Nirnhoned might be the best all round now
Charged can be good (mag sorc) in an organised group but only you can be the one applying concussed since it doesn't stack.

I tested and Shadow is still better for me than Warrior as a Gankblade in PVP.

DarkMatter909

Chelo wrote: »

Remag_Div wrote: »

I saw in another thread that Apprentice is the best for Magicka users now.

It is...

These are base stats (no buffs):

Man i wish we could get my character stat sheet to look like that on console.

kaithuzar

That build needs work imo.
There is no penetration & no regen...
I feel like sharpened is a must w/o lover mundus
The sharpen nerf was too strong, penetration is more important now I feel.
For back bar, powered hasn't been doing bad.
I think infused is only good if you are using torugs.

Minno

kaithuzar wrote: »

That build needs work imo.
There is no penetration & no regen...
I feel like sharpened is a must w/o lover mundus
The sharpen nerf was too strong, penetration is more important now I feel.
For back bar, powered hasn't been doing bad.
I think infused is only good if you are using torugs.

If it's in reference to the screen shot, idk if his guild is a gank or bombblade. If it's a more "brawly" nightblade, I agree his Regen and penetration is lacking. But you can drop sharpened for another trait, if you have LA and 70+ points into spell erosion to get 10k. Otherwise sharpened/lover is still good.

Lover> apprentice> shadow \mage>thief is what the editor is telling me for my build in order of best effective spell power number.

But mage boost shields, thief/shadow/lover not counted during shield fights, apprentice equals 2856 mag (12 mag per 1sd) and helps to burst shields. So it's all contextual.

Edit: and for templars, it makes no sense to boost crit DMG if you can get an easy 10% from spear skill and another from 23pts in elfborn. So shadow seems useless. I'd say Lover/apprentice> mage>thief. If you are a Breton, mage isn't bad either, especially if you slot inner light to boost it higher.