Been away a year, when people say PROC sets, do they mean our Monster 2pc sets or something else?

Mureel

After all that PVPers and buying Monster sets and complaints about PVEing to get them etc, I hope it's not that...enlightenment please?

Or are our Spell Power Cure and Worm sets being nerfed?

What are these proc nerfs people are asking for?

Tell me things!

casparian

They mean sets that do a large amount of damage on proc.

Literally speaking, tons of sets are proc sets (i.e., they have effects that proc under certain conditions). But the term is typically reserved for sets with damage procs.

Mureel

casparian wrote: »

They mean sets that do a large amount of damage on proc.

Literally speaking, tons of sets are proc sets (i.e., they have effects that proc under certain conditions). But the term is typically reserved for sets with damage procs.

So things like the Valkyn Skoria set will be nerfed after having already been nerfed in the past? People complained about it proc'd too much before - and it was nerfed then (mainly again, PVPers complaining).

I am aware there are tonnes of proc sets, but I do not know why nerf talk is on the table unless it's mainly PVPers and then, I still don't understand it.

DeadlyRecluse

The way people tend to use it in this game is any armor/gearset that produces damage.

Viper, Skoria, Red Mountain, Widowmaker, Overwhelming Surge, Grothdar, Velidreth, etc.


Technically, a proc is an effect with a chance to trigger based on a condition (so Viper, Spawn of Mephala, Knight Slayer aren't technically proc sets, as there is no random chance--they don't proc,they just are), and Bloodspawn, Combat Physician, and Bogdan ARE technically proc sets), but that doesn't match the colloquial use in this game.

Karm1cOne

Most people were upset at sets like viper or red mountain. Procs that did fairly high damage, with no criteria to proc them.

Mureel

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

The way people tend to use it in this game is any armor/gearset that produces damage.

Viper, Skoria, Red Mountain, Widowmaker, Overwhelming Surge, Grothdar, Velidreth, etc.


Technically, a proc is an effect with a chance to trigger based on a condition (so Viper, Spawn of Mephala, Knight Slayer aren't technically proc sets, as there is no random chance--they don't proc,they just are), and Bloodspawn, Combat Physician, and Bogdan ARE technically proc sets), but that doesn't match the colloquial use in this game.

Yes I have all monster sets, worm cult and SPC for my healer, and so I understand the name.

I would like to know why the nerf talk?

I read people saying they need to GO (lol why?) and YAY they get nerfed next patch! (Why? xD ).

Mureel

Karm1cOne wrote: »

Most people were upset at sets like viper or red mountain. Procs that did fairly high damage, with no criteria to proc them.

Oh ok!

So is it only those type being nerfed or all?

TequilaFire

No the devs are leaving Skoria alone for now as it was balanced before and is easily avoidable if paying attention at all.
You will still see crying about Skoria but for once the devs made the right choice.
The crying mostly comes from salty players that used the other OP stam proc sets that just want a nerf to Skoria because their set got a nerf.

Shushu_H

I recently actually got back into the game and understand that people are saying proc sets take less skill because it's the armor doing work and not the player.

DeadlyRecluse

Mureel wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

The way people tend to use it in this game is any armor/gearset that produces damage.

Viper, Skoria, Red Mountain, Widowmaker, Overwhelming Surge, Grothdar, Velidreth, etc.


Technically, a proc is an effect with a chance to trigger based on a condition (so Viper, Spawn of Mephala, Knight Slayer aren't technically proc sets, as there is no random chance--they don't proc,they just are), and Bloodspawn, Combat Physician, and Bogdan ARE technically proc sets), but that doesn't match the colloquial use in this game.

Yes I have all monster sets, worm cult and SPC for my healer, and so I understand the name.

I would like to know why the nerf talk?

I read people saying they need to GO (lol why?) and YAY they get nerfed next patch! (Why? xD ).

The nerf talk is primarily centered around damage dealing proc sets.

Someone calculated out the relative value of Viper, for instance, and found it was equal to something like 600 weapon damage (the damage from the 5piece) in a pretty typical PvP fight. That's insane, and the bonus is (currently) delivered in the form of pretty hard to avoid burst.

Additionally, because damage procs don't scale off of your stats, they enable a pretty terrible playstyle of stacking 3 damage procs and getting all your gear bonuses to fire right away. Alternatively, you can stack defensive sets and 1 damaging procset, then just turtle up and trigger that proc set for consistent damage while being extremely tanky--you see that a lot with tremorscale builds--they deal an obscene amount of damage for 5/7 heavy builds with 2x defensive sets.

The nerfs were posted in some PTS patch notes, the highlights that I remember:

Viper will be a 4 second DOT instead of burst
Selene's will be more delayed and have a ground telegraph
Red Mountain will spawn a volcano (lol) that will spit a fireball, instead of directly dealing damage
Tremorscale will have a delay before the damage hits

There were some other adjustments as well.

Mureel

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

The way people tend to use it in this game is any armor/gearset that produces damage.

Viper, Skoria, Red Mountain, Widowmaker, Overwhelming Surge, Grothdar, Velidreth, etc.


Technically, a proc is an effect with a chance to trigger based on a condition (so Viper, Spawn of Mephala, Knight Slayer aren't technically proc sets, as there is no random chance--they don't proc,they just are), and Bloodspawn, Combat Physician, and Bogdan ARE technically proc sets), but that doesn't match the colloquial use in this game.

Yes I have all monster sets, worm cult and SPC for my healer, and so I understand the name.

I would like to know why the nerf talk?

I read people saying they need to GO (lol why?) and YAY they get nerfed next patch! (Why? xD ).

The nerf talk is primarily centered around damage dealing proc sets.

Someone calculated out the relative value of Viper, for instance, and found it was equal to something like 600 weapon damage (the damage from the 5piece) in a pretty typical PvP fight. That's insane, and the bonus is (currently) delivered in the form of pretty hard to avoid burst.

Additionally, because damage procs don't scale off of your stats, they enable a pretty terrible playstyle of stacking 3 damage procs and getting all your gear bonuses to fire right away. Alternatively, you can stack defensive sets and 1 damaging procset, then just turtle up and trigger that proc set for consistent damage while being extremely tanky--you see that a lot with tremorscale builds--they deal an obscene amount of damage for 5/7 heavy builds with 2x defensive sets.

The nerfs were posted in some PTS patch notes, the highlights that I remember:

Viper will be a 4 second DOT instead of burst
Selene's will be more delayed and have a ground telegraph
Red Mountain will spawn a volcano (lol) that will spit a fireball, instead of directly dealing damage
Tremorscale will have a delay before the damage hits

There were some other adjustments as well.

Oh just that? Seems like more geared toward stamina players, IIRC - but OK then.

Thank you!

ookami007

Generally, when people refer to proc sets, they are referring to armor sets or monster 2-piece sets that do high damage at once. They stack these so that when the attack in PvP, the recipient takes the skill or heavy attack damage and the damage from the proc sets all at once.

For instance, you can technically wear 2 full armor sets and 1 monster set (shoulders/head) + (chest,legs,waist,boots,gloves) + (ring, ring, necklace, right hand, left hand).

So, let's say you choose:

Selene monster set
When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Viper Sting
Your Melee Attacks deal 6720 Poison damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Red Mountain
When you deal damage with a Weapon ability, you have a 10% chance to deal an additional 8400 Flame Damage. This effect can occur once every 2 seconds.

If you're a NB, you attack from stealth with Ambush... you could potentially do Ambush damage (which varies) but let's say 2400 + 12000 from Selene + 6720 from Viper + 8400 from Red Mountain for a whopping 2400+12000+6720+8400 = 29,520 which is enough to kill most characters outright and even if it doesn't kill them outright, with the element of surprise, they can get another one or two hits in before that and that's assuming they aren't proc'ing poisons or weapon enchantment (poison or disease) which would add another few thousand.

That's why people get upset in PvP. These cheese builds pretty much take any sort of skill out of the equation when they attack from surprise. And even out of surprise, they do huge burst damage by stacking these proc sets.

Mureel

ookami007 wrote: »

Generally, when people refer to proc sets, they are referring to armor sets or monster 2-piece sets that do high damage at once. They stack these so that when the attack in PvP, the recipient takes the skill or heavy attack damage and the damage from the proc sets all at once.

For instance, you can technically wear 2 full armor sets and 1 monster set (shoulders/head) + (chest,legs,waist,boots,gloves) + (ring, ring, necklace, right hand, left hand).

So, let's say you choose:

Selene monster set
When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Viper Sting
Your Melee Attacks deal 6720 Poison damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Red Mountain
When you deal damage with a Weapon ability, you have a 10% chance to deal an additional 8400 Flame Damage. This effect can occur once every 2 seconds.

If you're a NB, you attack from stealth with Ambush... you could potentially do Ambush damage (which varies) but let's say 2400 + 12000 from Selene + 6720 from Viper + 8400 from Red Mountain for a whopping 2400+12000+6720+8400 = 29,520 which is enough to kill most characters outright and even if it doesn't kill them outright, with the element of surprise, they can get another one or two hits in before that and that's assuming they aren't proc'ing poisons or weapon enchantment (poison or disease) which would add another few thousand.

That's why people get upset in PvP. These cheese builds pretty much take any sort of skill out of the equation when they attack from surprise. And even out of surprise, they do huge burst damage by stacking these proc sets.

LOL I should have known it was NB stealth gank cheese that was the problem *Why didn't anyone just say so?*

Thank you!

I was trying to figure out what it meant for my characters and what I need to do about it. Not my stealth cheese, not my problem I already feel like I'm not going to know wtf I'm doing, so that takes one mess out of the equation!

ookami007

Mureel wrote: »

ookami007 wrote: »

Generally, when people refer to proc sets, they are referring to armor sets or monster 2-piece sets that do high damage at once. They stack these so that when the attack in PvP, the recipient takes the skill or heavy attack damage and the damage from the proc sets all at once.

For instance, you can technically wear 2 full armor sets and 1 monster set (shoulders/head) + (chest,legs,waist,boots,gloves) + (ring, ring, necklace, right hand, left hand).

So, let's say you choose:

Selene monster set
When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Viper Sting
Your Melee Attacks deal 6720 Poison damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Red Mountain
When you deal damage with a Weapon ability, you have a 10% chance to deal an additional 8400 Flame Damage. This effect can occur once every 2 seconds.

If you're a NB, you attack from stealth with Ambush... you could potentially do Ambush damage (which varies) but let's say 2400 + 12000 from Selene + 6720 from Viper + 8400 from Red Mountain for a whopping 2400+12000+6720+8400 = 29,520 which is enough to kill most characters outright and even if it doesn't kill them outright, with the element of surprise, they can get another one or two hits in before that and that's assuming they aren't proc'ing poisons or weapon enchantment (poison or disease) which would add another few thousand.

That's why people get upset in PvP. These cheese builds pretty much take any sort of skill out of the equation when they attack from surprise. And even out of surprise, they do huge burst damage by stacking these proc sets.

LOL I should have known it was NB stealth gank cheese that was the problem *Why didn't anyone just say so?*

Thank you!

I was trying to figure out what it meant for my characters and what I need to do about it. Not my stealth cheese, not my problem I already feel like I'm not going to know wtf I'm doing, so that takes one mess out of the equation!

It's not just NBs. They just do it better than most. Any class with a skill that throws them at the enemy will work... Templar with Focused Charge or a Dragonknight with DragonLeap work too. Basically, you want something that allows you to launch from a distance (usually because you're stealthed) and deliver a melee attack so all your sets proc. Some sets that don't need melee to proc are just as good with bow or staff.

But the basic gist is... get in, kill them quickly and get out or move on.

Mureel

ookami007 wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

ookami007 wrote: »

Generally, when people refer to proc sets, they are referring to armor sets or monster 2-piece sets that do high damage at once. They stack these so that when the attack in PvP, the recipient takes the skill or heavy attack damage and the damage from the proc sets all at once.

For instance, you can technically wear 2 full armor sets and 1 monster set (shoulders/head) + (chest,legs,waist,boots,gloves) + (ring, ring, necklace, right hand, left hand).

So, let's say you choose:

Selene monster set
When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Viper Sting
Your Melee Attacks deal 6720 Poison damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Red Mountain
When you deal damage with a Weapon ability, you have a 10% chance to deal an additional 8400 Flame Damage. This effect can occur once every 2 seconds.

If you're a NB, you attack from stealth with Ambush... you could potentially do Ambush damage (which varies) but let's say 2400 + 12000 from Selene + 6720 from Viper + 8400 from Red Mountain for a whopping 2400+12000+6720+8400 = 29,520 which is enough to kill most characters outright and even if it doesn't kill them outright, with the element of surprise, they can get another one or two hits in before that and that's assuming they aren't proc'ing poisons or weapon enchantment (poison or disease) which would add another few thousand.

That's why people get upset in PvP. These cheese builds pretty much take any sort of skill out of the equation when they attack from surprise. And even out of surprise, they do huge burst damage by stacking these proc sets.

LOL I should have known it was NB stealth gank cheese that was the problem *Why didn't anyone just say so?*

Thank you!

I was trying to figure out what it meant for my characters and what I need to do about it. Not my stealth cheese, not my problem I already feel like I'm not going to know wtf I'm doing, so that takes one mess out of the equation!

It's not just NBs. They just do it better than most. Any class with a skill that throws them at the enemy will work... Templar with Focused Charge or a Dragonknight with DragonLeap work too. Basically, you want something that allows you to launch from a distance (usually because you're stealthed) and deliver a melee attack so all your sets proc. Some sets that don't need melee to proc are just as good with bow or staff.

But the basic gist is... get in, kill them quickly and get out or move on.

Yeah same diff though (In other words: Not affecting me or my playstyle, so I don't have to worry much about it, coming back to the game, when there's other stuff I need to handle ;-) )

DaGhostDS

ookami007 wrote: »

If you're a NB, you attack from stealth with Ambush... you could potentially do Ambush damage (which varies) but let's say 2400 + 12000 from Selene + 6720 from Viper + 8400 from Red Mountain for a whopping 2400+12000+6720+8400 = 29,520 which is enough to kill most characters outright and even if it doesn't kill them outright, with the element of surprise, they can get another one or two hits in before that and that's assuming they aren't proc'ing poisons or weapon enchantment (poison or disease) which would add another few thousand.

That's why people get upset in PvP. These cheese builds pretty much take any sort of skill out of the equation when they attack from surprise. And even out of surprise, they do huge burst damage by stacking these proc sets.

In pvp damage is halved so it will never be 29k, not to say players got armor/resist, shields, chance to dodge etc.

If you get hit for the full amount of an attack (after the 50% pvp reduction obviously) you're doing it wrong and shouldnt pvp.

DarkAedin

Its all dmg proc sets thats the issue.
Eso from the start pushed player skill. Then they made a ton of bad decisions that decimated the playerbase.
They then made tamriel 1, to bring in more players, and added dmg proc sets to shorten the gap between new players and pros. problem is that these sets can also be worn by smart players.
And in a game where player skill was something to work towards, the concept of dmg proc sets shouldnt exist. Bc , simply put, it literally takes no skill to light attack someone and get three 4k+ dmg procs off, and theres no counter play to it.

DarkAedin

Just to add. Imho all dmg prc sets, including monster sets should be completely removed from the game. And never brought back.
So many different issues stem from dmg proc sets that its less work to remove them rather then ballance around them.

Betsararie

Anything that procs and do damage.

Many are outright broken and in desperate need of a nerf. (and they're going to get one)

Judas Helviaryn

Proc sets are where nirnhoned used to be. At least.. you'd think so with all of the whining people make.

ArchMikem

"Whenever you do this kind of damage, you have a (x)% chance to do an additional (x) amount of Damage."

That's a Proc.