Werewolf suggestions and fixes

Chrlynsch

I've been playing as a werewolf in PVP and PVE from release. Werewolf has come a far way since then, this I have experienced first hand, though there can still be some quality of life adjustments.

Pursuit: Add Snare immunity (not for fighters guild abilities or gap closers). Before the 100% speed cap was added wolves had the ability to at the very least out run or run down opponents. Now not so much.

Werewolf bleeds on light attacks. Add a bleed to their heavy attack as well (melee axes have separate light and heavy bleed dots). This will increase long-term dps, as well as increased aoe effectiveness, without increasing werewolf's currently strong burst capabilities.

Devour restores some stamina and magic as well as health. Make the ability a channel that restores 2k a second as well as 6sec in form. This channel may be interrupted by interruption abilities/hard cc, as well as bashing. A werewolf can continue to devour as long as a corpse is present. This is an improvement on the now or nothing that is currently available.

Fixes:

-The werewolf bugged timer that starts you with a one sec transformation
-Pack leader direwolves not respawning after werewolf dies and respawns or dies and is resurrected. (This is defining feature of this morph). Look at overall speed of the direwolves especially in combat. They keep up while out of combat, sending them to attack seams as though they sink into a slow motion action move charge.
-Damage immunity during transformation.
-Claws of "Blank" (aoe) does not hit roll dodging targets.

RouDeR

Dont worry , they are not gonna do anything of what u wrote cuz its reasonable .
But most likely they will break the light attack / heavy attack succsessful hit even more .

Strider_Roshin

Werewolves are a joke. They're so underwhelming it's pathetic. Want to convince me to become a werewolf again? Make them the best ST DPS in the game, and give us stam regen passively again.

Want to see how intimidating werewolves are?

Skip to the 1 minute mark of this video, and take note of our reaction when the werewolf transforms.

https://youtu.be/Pyye0zA27PM

Arciris

1. Werewolf speed cap should be the same as a mount: we cannot mount in WW form and it is a beast that sprints in all 4. So if someone wants to build a speedy wolf, that should be allowed.
2. Using synergies should be possible in WW form. There should be a different key for "devour" than "X" (default). Possibly make it work like Blade of Woe and the vampire feed: if there's a corpse around, x will cause devour, if not, x will activate whatever synergy appears.
3. WW should have a taunt: whether it is by wearing a specific set or an ability morph.

Chrlynsch

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Werewolves are a joke. They're so underwhelming it's pathetic. Want to convince me to become a werewolf again? Make them the best ST DPS in the game, and give us stam regen passively again.

Want to see how intimidating werewolves are?

Skip to the 1 minute mark of this video, and take note of our reaction when the werewolf transforms.

https://youtu.be/Pyye0zA27PM

Going to have to disagree with you on the fact that werewolves are underwhelming pathetic.

I do think the wolves you faced were not going to come out on top of that fight regardless of what they did or ultimate they used.

I defiantly do not think passive unslotted regeneration is the correct path either... we have been down that path before, and it was abused. The focus should be to add benefits to the transformation, until the transformation becomes desirable.

dsalter

give werewolf form minor protection
allow werewolf speed to cap at mount speed
allow all weapon passives to work from claws (some work and some dont, example 2 handed sword damage works, 2 handed axe dont)
allow heavy attack to benifit from the bleed
claws of *blank* and it's morphs dont lock onto a target anymore but now a cone same as 2handed carve

cjhhickman39

Very good ideas. How about teeth of the pack : a frontal cone that unleashes a pack of phantom wolves that hit for (x) damage and maul for (y) damage over (z) seconds

geonsocal

werewolf should have a larger character appearance - at least troll size...

Chrlynsch

dsalter wrote: »

give werewolf form minor protection
allow werewolf speed to cap at mount speed
allow all weapon passives to work from claws (some work and some dont, example 2 handed sword damage works, 2 handed axe dont)
allow heavy attack to benifit from the bleed
claws of *blank* and it's morphs dont lock onto a target anymore but now a cone same as 2handed carve

Speed may cause issues in CTF battlegrounds.

Are you certain two hand sword passive carries through to wolf? My tests in the past did not alter damage.

QuebraRegra

werewolf needs a taunt

IlCanis_LupuslI

a experienced ww with the right setup can create havoc in pvp and should not be sniffed at. But the Werwolf is imo one of the most hard builds to master with all its flaws.

Chrlynsch

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

a experienced ww with the right setup can create havoc in pvp and should not be sniffed at. But the Werwolf is imo one of the most hard builds to master with all its flaws.

I agree here that an experienced werewolf player with the right build can be strong in the right situation. But using said gear in human form is limiting your potential.

The werewolf is a selfish ultimate/form and adds very little to the group play dynamic. This is why you see experienced or veteran players shy away from wolf play.

Werewolves have no way to keep each any other players alive. Even a ganking nightblade can use vigor, and can heal allies.

Let me put out some negitives:

Their heal is calculated from the wrong stats

They can't stealth

They can't mount

They can't heal eachother

They can't activate synergies

They can't resurrect allies

They can't put down siege

They can't remove snares/or any negative attacks

They have no reliable ability to pull night blades from stealth

Their abilities are some of the most expensive in the game

They are weak to poison and fighters guild abilities

The ultimate when leveled costs 300 ultimate. (One reason it shouldn't be free)?

Heavy attack returns 4k stamina... That's with the 100% return passive 25% heavy armor passive.

Their aoe damage is sub par / their single target damage is sub par

You loose half of your passives and half of the passive you gain are there to keep you in form


Now despite all these negatives I still enjoy playing the werewolf... maybe it is because I enjoy a challenge, or building outside the meta, but I think we can all agree werewolf is not where it needs to be.

davey1107

I don't know what you're talking about, they're tankier than DKs, they've been given unlimited dps, heals, wards and shields and they're clearly favored by the dev team, and handed everything they ask for without ever fearing nerfs.

Oh wait...werewolves? Sorry, I thought this was a magsorc thread.

Chrlynsch

davey1107 wrote: »

I don't know what you're talking about, they're tankier than DKs, they've been given unlimited dps, heals, wards and shields and they're clearly favored by the dev team, and handed everything they ask for without ever fearing nerfs.

Oh wait...werewolves? Sorry, I thought this was a magsorc thread.

Where is the authentic lol button when you need it?

mb10

I just have no idea why the heal cost magicka.

Needs to be converted to a stamina ability

QuebraRegra

mb10 wrote: »

I just have no idea why the heal cost magicka.

Needs to be converted to a stamina ability

supported

RouDeR

QuebraRegra wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

I just have no idea why the heal cost magicka.

Needs to be converted to a stamina ability

supported

Hell no , this will make WW OP as hell , its not the wolf fault that u SUCK building it properly . Tomorrow i will upload video with my personal open world WW build in action so u the betas can learn a thing or two .

Chrlynsch

RouDeR wrote: »

QuebraRegra wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

I just have no idea why the heal cost magicka.

Needs to be converted to a stamina ability

supported

Hell no , this will make WW OP as hell , its not the wolf fault that u SUCK building it properly . Tomorrow i will upload video with my personal open world WW build in action so u the betas can learn a thing or two .

Please enlighten us.

IlCanis_LupuslI

mb10 wrote: »

I just have no idea why the heal cost magicka.

Needs to be converted to a stamina ability

noooooo, make it use magica but make it Scale with wd and max stam

Jamini

Every werewolf build video I've seen has been one guy surfing a full raid of twelve or more and bursting down one person at a time with at least three others. There are no wolf 1vX, there are no good wolf 1v1, small play, or siege videos.

That enough should go to show how very *** awful werewolf is.

geonsocal

Jamini wrote: »

Every werewolf build video I've seen has been one guy surfing a full raid of twelve or more and bursting down one person at a time with at least three others. There are no wolf 1vX, there are no good wolf 1v1, small play, or siege videos.

That enough should go to show how very *** awful werewolf is.

good point...the werewolf is great for zerg surfing...going one on one or 1vX is really really hard, cause chances are you're receiving a bunch of health and stamina cost poisons while you're fighting...

werewolves are best for bursting folks down and enhanced maneuverability around the battlefield - goodness I love pounding from one enemy group to another

geonsocal

Any one crazy enough to come up with a light armor pvp werewolf build?

personally, I like to keep them in at least 5 heavy...

Chrlynsch

geonsocal wrote: »

Any one crazy enough to come up with a light armor pvp werewolf build?

personally, I like to keep them in at least 5 heavy...

I've tried prisoner's light armor. Synergy is pretty strong with the wolf.

Jamini

How to make wolf viable:

---

Werewolf Transformation - Cost reduced to 200 ultimate
Pack Leader - Cost reduced to 150 ultimate
Berserker - Cost reduced to 150 ultimate

Brutal Pounce - No change (Stam DPS morph)
Feral Pounce - Heals caster, Taunts, No minimum range, Health Scaling (Tank morph)

Hircine's Rage - Heal Scales from stamina (DPS morph)
Hircine's Fortitude - No change (Tank morph)

Ferious Roar - Grants major savagery for 20s to caster on kill (spc)
Rousing Roar - (Fear Removed) Additionally adds 200WD to up to 12 allies. (Tank)

Piercing Howl - Knockdown replaced by Major Fracture and Major Breach
Howl of Despair - Feeding Frenzy buffs 12 allies within 10m of the werewolf (Tanking Buffs)
Howl of Agony - Deals increased enemies who are currently under any form of CC. (DPS spammable)

Infectious Claws - Higher damage to make up for loss of backbar
Claws of Anguish - No change
Claws of Life - No change

--

Pursuit - No change

Devour - No change

Blood Rage - Increases your critical rating every time you take damage for 5s, stacking 5 times.

Blood Moon - No Change

Savage Strength - Increases block % by 4/8%, increases WD by 9/18% while in werewolf form

Call of the Pack - Reduce the cost of stamina abilities by 4% per transformed werewolf in your group, to a maximum of 16%.

--
Other changes:

Un-transformed werewolves take additional damage from poisons and fighter's guild abilities

Koolio

Jamini wrote: »

Every werewolf build video I've seen has been one guy surfing a full raid of twelve or more and bursting down one person at a time with at least three others. There are no wolf 1vX, there are no good wolf 1v1, small play, or siege videos.

That enough should go to show how very *** awful werewolf is.

https://youtu.be/KKzZIEPwaN8

IlCanis_LupuslI

Prothwata wrote: »

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

a experienced ww with the right setup can create havoc in pvp and should not be sniffed at. But the Werwolf is imo one of the most hard builds to master with all its flaws.

I agree here that an experienced werewolf player with the right build can be strong in the right situation. But using said gear in human form is limiting your potential.

The werewolf is a selfish ultimate/form and adds very little to the group play dynamic. This is why you see experienced or veteran players shy away from wolf play.

Werewolves have no way to keep each any other players alive. Even a ganking nightblade can use vigor, and can heal allies.

Let me put out some negitives:

Their heal is calculated from the wrong stats

They can't stealth

They can't mount

They can't heal eachother

They can't activate synergies

They can't resurrect allies

They can't put down siege

They can't remove snares/or any negative attacks

They have no reliable ability to pull night blades from stealth

Their abilities are some of the most expensive in the game

They are weak to poison and fighters guild abilities

The ultimate when leveled costs 300 ultimate. (One reason it shouldn't be free)?

Heavy attack returns 4k stamina... That's with the 100% return passive 25% heavy armor passive.

Their aoe damage is sub par / their single target damage is sub par

You loose half of your passives and half of the passive you gain are there to keep you in form


Now despite all these negatives I still enjoy playing the werewolf... maybe it is because I enjoy a challenge, or building outside the meta, but I think we can all agree werewolf is not where it needs to be.

As a experienced Werwolf player at least my build
Very good self heals(13k average)
-High single target damage(4k dot
damage per second, 4-5k LA, up to 15k
HoA crit)
-Permanent major defile uptime easily achievable(Claws of anguish )
-Very tanky(i absorbed in 10 seconds= 3
Ice comets, 2 DboS , EotS permanent On
the ground)
-Very reliable hard cc
-Gives whole group major brutality
-Gets aggro in PvP (gets focused hard I
use the to the advantage of the group)
-effektive unlimited substain(2.7k stam regen , 1.8k magica reg in heavy armor)

Chrlynsch

Jamini wrote: »

How to make wolf viable:

---

Werewolf Transformation - Cost reduced to 200 ultimate
Pack Leader - Cost reduced to 150 ultimate
Berserker - Cost reduced to 150 ultimate

Brutal Pounce - No change (Stam DPS morph)
Feral Pounce - Heals caster, Taunts, No minimum range, Health Scaling (Tank morph)

Hircine's Rage - Heal Scales from stamina (DPS morph)
Hircine's Fortitude - No change (Tank morph)

Ferious Roar - Grants major savagery for 20s to caster on kill (spc)
Rousing Roar - (Fear Removed) Additionally adds 200WD to up to 12 allies. (Tank)

Piercing Howl - Knockdown replaced by Major Fracture and Major Breach
Howl of Despair - Feeding Frenzy buffs 12 allies within 10m of the werewolf (Tanking Buffs)
Howl of Agony - Deals increased enemies who are currently under any form of CC. (DPS spammable)

Infectious Claws - Higher damage to make up for loss of backbar
Claws of Anguish - No change
Claws of Life - No change

--

Pursuit - No change

Devour - No change

Blood Rage - Increases your critical rating every time you take damage for 5s, stacking 5 times.

Blood Moon - No Change

Savage Strength - Increases block % by 4/8%, increases WD by 9/18% while in werewolf form

Call of the Pack - Reduce the cost of stamina abilities by 4% per transformed werewolf in your group, to a maximum of 16%.

--
Other changes:

Un-transformed werewolves take additional damage from poisons and fighter's guild abilities

I'm guessing you removed the timer from this version?

geonsocal

some of my favorite sets for werewolf:

Selene Set
(1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
(2 items) When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Velidreth Set
(1 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
(2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. This effect can occur once every 9 seconds.

Viper's Sting Set
(2 items) Adds 672 Weapon Critical
(3 items) Adds 965 Max Stamina
(4 items) Adds 672 Weapon Critical
(5 items) Your Melee Attacks deal 6720 Poison damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Black Rose Set
(2 items) Adds 1064 Max Health
(3 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
(4 items) Adds 967 Magicka
(5 items) Increases the Magicka and Stamina restoration benefit from the Constitution Passive by 40% and increases Weapon and Spell Damage by 154.

any one have some sets they love to get dressed up in when they head out to cyrodiil for a bite out on the town?

Koolio

geonsocal wrote: »

some of my favorite sets for werewolf:

Selene Set
(1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
(2 items) When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Velidreth Set
(1 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
(2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. This effect can occur once every 9 seconds.

Viper's Sting Set
(2 items) Adds 672 Weapon Critical
(3 items) Adds 965 Max Stamina
(4 items) Adds 672 Weapon Critical
(5 items) Your Melee Attacks deal 6720 Poison damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Black Rose Set
(2 items) Adds 1064 Max Health
(3 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
(4 items) Adds 967 Magicka
(5 items) Increases the Magicka and Stamina restoration benefit from the Constitution Passive by 40% and increases Weapon and Spell Damage by 154.

any one have some sets they love to get dressed up in when they head out to cyrodiil for a bite out on the town?

Currently Heavy Shacklebreaker Bone Pirate Engine Guardian. Great stats. Good sustain. Decent heals.

Chrlynsch

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Prothwata wrote: »

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

a experienced ww with the right setup can create havoc in pvp and should not be sniffed at. But the Werwolf is imo one of the most hard builds to master with all its flaws.

I agree here that an experienced werewolf player with the right build can be strong in the right situation. But using said gear in human form is limiting your potential.

The werewolf is a selfish ultimate/form and adds very little to the group play dynamic. This is why you see experienced or veteran players shy away from wolf play.

Werewolves have no way to keep each any other players alive. Even a ganking nightblade can use vigor, and can heal allies.

Let me put out some negitives:

Their heal is calculated from the wrong stats

They can't stealth

They can't mount

They can't heal eachother

They can't activate synergies

They can't resurrect allies

They can't put down siege

They can't remove snares/or any negative attacks

They have no reliable ability to pull night blades from stealth

Their abilities are some of the most expensive in the game

They are weak to poison and fighters guild abilities

The ultimate when leveled costs 300 ultimate. (One reason it shouldn't be free)?

Heavy attack returns 4k stamina... That's with the 100% return passive 25% heavy armor passive.

Their aoe damage is sub par / their single target damage is sub par

You loose half of your passives and half of the passive you gain are there to keep you in form


Now despite all these negatives I still enjoy playing the werewolf... maybe it is because I enjoy a challenge, or building outside the meta, but I think we can all agree werewolf is not where it needs to be.

As a experienced Werwolf player at least my build
Very good self heals(13k average)
-High single target damage(4k dot
damage per second, 4-5k LA, up to 15k
HoA crit)
-Permanent major defile uptime easily achievable(Claws of anguish )
-Very tanky(i absorbed in 10 seconds= 3
Ice comets, 2 DboS , EotS permanent On
the ground)
-Very reliable hard cc
-Gives whole group major brutality
-Gets aggro in PvP (gets focused hard I
use the to the advantage of the group)
-effektive unlimited substain(2.7k stam regen , 1.8k magica reg in heavy armor)

What stamina player isn't packing their own major brutality? Also only effects those within your area of effect fear.

What gear are you packing to get these stats?

TheStealthDude

I would prefer that the heal remain magicka. You can build to make it very strong and since WW's have below average sustain, another stamina skill would be horrendous. Right now there a lot of viable PvP builds.

Devour definitely needs to have a resource sustain component. It should at least give back some stamina, on top of increasing the WW timer.